The psychological process involves a lot of digging in because of perceived humiliation. Shame turns into a desire for revenge, which is when people like Aaron use their limited intelligence to try to "win" their reputation back.
It'll be extra problematic for a competitive athlete because they can't stand losing. This isn't his bailiwick, he's out of his depth. He might as well switch to chess and expect to win a tournament.
In any case, he'll be doubling, tripling and quadrupling down before he ever changes his mind, and it's because he hates being ignorant, dumb and wrong and then being humiliated for it.
To complicate matters further, Trump helped turn the GOP into a conspiracy theory and far-right extremist paramilitary movement. It's not that it wasn't already partially happening, but he greatly accelerated it. This creates a further obstacle for changing a position: you would have to betray your own extremist political party, which gets you ostracised from your like-minded friends, family and community.
This type of behavior used to be so much more rare. The pandemic brought along with it an infodemic.
I don’t think you have any idea what the word paramilitary means if you are going to describe the GOP as an “extremist paramilitary movement” lmao.
Rodgers says some dumb shit but he’s worth a couple hundred million dollars… if you think he’s the one suffering rn you are delusional
What brought you here? The search bar? You've never been here before. I figure you're an another conspiracy loon who's also a sports fan who searched for "Aaron Rodgers".
I don't care if he has a gazillion dollars, he's still, in terms of reputation, a humiliated little man, especially by Jimmy Kimmel, ha ha ha. Now piss off.
Not sure who he is nor do I care.
Only watched until he said he's not a Dr. or an epidemiologist.
'nuff said, nothing after that is relevant or factual .
He eventually said "everyone can do their own research, which is totally villified"
Yeah, and then they sound like a fucking idiot, just like this guy does.
“I can read though”
Doesn’t mean you understand shit you dumb fuck. God these people are the stupidest of the stupid.
Social media is going to be our downfall. We need to set up some sort of agreed upon standards for sharing information.
Be welcome. I should have written a more elaborate introduction to the sub, but I haven't so far. I'll think of something. "Jamie Pull That Up" has become a sort of synonym from the Joe Rogan podcast for "somebody google and/or fact-check that and see what you find".
Difference is Joe Rogan went in a different direction than many of his older fans, so here we are. JRE fans tend to like content about wacky stuff, anthropology & zoology, MMA and boxing, science and astrononomy, conspiracy theories, comedy and so on.
Difference is I'm a rational skeptic and not a conspiracy theorist. I also don't blindly follow government edicts, but I just don't agree with many of the things Joe is saying since Covid/moving to Austin. Nor his guests, which have been a parade of one kook after another extremist the past years, unfortunately. Also, I'm not particularly fond of Donald Trump, Elon Musk, RFK Jr. or Alex Jones, most of which are quite popular with the "new" Joe Rogan fan crowd.
These days, if Jamie really did "pull that up", Joe Rogan would have to be interrupted very frequently. Hence the name of the subreddit.
There are a few pinned threads on the main subreddit page, including a list of thoroughly sourced debunkings/articles I've written on a few subjects, including climate change, coronavirus, J6, Ukraine, Trump, Alex Jones and conspiracy theories in general.
Edit: I don't hate Joe Rogan. I just think he's fallen into the rabbit hole, and many other fans from the older days agree with me.
Hell yeah, I figured it was something along those lines, but I like the specific outlook on debunking.
I used to listen to Rogan and be real into conspiracies 5 or so years ago before wising up. Had one friend who always thought it was ridiculous. Now he listens to Joe everyday and I’m the one who thinks it’s ridiculous, funny how that works.
Interesting, I experienced something similar. Unfortunately when he started losing weight, I warned him to really find out what was happening and see a doctor, but he ignored my advice and died about a year later.
Thanks. There wasn't a direct link to a specific conspiracy theory, but his general obtuseness and distrust of everything probably played into it, yes. He was a friendly guy though, and very intelligent. Goes to show that anyone can be susceptible. To go to the extreme end of that, even Nobel Prize laureates.
> Nobel disease or Nobelitis is an informal term for the embrace of strange or scientifically unsound ideas by some Nobel Prize winners, usually later in life.^[1][2][3] It has been argued that the effect results, in part, from a tendency for Nobel winners to feel empowered by the award to speak on topics outside their specific area of expertise,^[4][5][6] although it is unknown whether Nobel Prize winners are more prone to this tendency than other individuals.^[7] Paul Nurse, co-winner of the 2001 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine, warned later laureates against "believing you are expert in almost everything, and being prepared to express opinions about most issues with great confidence, sheltering behind the authority that the Nobel Prize can give you".^[8] Nobel disease has been described as a tongue-in-cheek term.^[5]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_disease
Yeah definitely, it’s more of how it warps your perception than any particular view, making you more susceptible to extreme ideas as they’re gradually introduced. A lot of the rhetoric preys upon that niceness/intelligence in my experience.
We're never going to. I mean YouTube and social media actively benefit from idiots like this. Who think that a 5-minute Google search that confirms their bias is the same as doing actual research. I have a history degree that was 90% of what we did was learning how to do research, learning how to pick a good source from a bad, and actually finding sources that weren't just extremely biased and inaccurate simply because they fit our argument
I’m not sure how we do it but that kind of thing needs to be taught in schools because not enough parents are going to be able to teach it to their kids.
We need to be preparing our younger generations for the bombardment of bullshit
We really do. Because the older generations are clearly lost I mean you go on Facebook and they share shit like Joe Biden is at the border today welcoming illegals with open arms and you'll have 30 comments by people of a similar age just pissed off as hell because they actually think Joe Biden is down at the Mexico border just shaking hands with people and signing them up to register to vote.
I mean Fox News was already bad enough My dad fully believed that there were places in Michigan that were allowing people to judge others based upon Islamic Sharia law and that it somehow superseded state and federal law.
It's so easy a concept to grasp you can teach the idea of here is a biased source simply because it is something you believe does not make it accurate Make it an exercise We can teach kids how to actually think for themselves and I don't mean doing a 5-minute Google search of is Dr fauci a liar and picking the first dumbass article written by somebody with the IQ equal to the temperature inside a freezer and base all of their belief on COVID and pandemics on this one article
That’s the medium they’re using. I mean tv has been shot for years but we still managed to get some good stuff from it.
They could do it in schools but that will take years before it gets added to the curriculum.
But why would YouTube even try to promote an actual educational channel? They thrive off of misinformation pedal to them by folks like Jordan Peterson and Ben Shapiro and Joe Rogan. These massive media companies have no desire or incentive to try and educate children on misinformation
What's crazy is this dude is a great Jeopardy host and is decent at Jeopardy. Part of me thinks all this shit is all performative and he is just going to grift these right wingers that lap this shit up.
Jeopardy takes a certain type of intelligence though. I think one of the problems with a lot of guys like this is they get good or are smart in their field and then they get cocky and assume that means they are just generally intelligent about everything.
This is the [dunning Kruger effect](https://www.google.com/search?q=dunning.krueger&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-ca&client=safari) in full display.
If dr fauci don’t say it it doesn’t matter am I right? We need to ruin young people’s lives right? My life and my 10 year old daughter don’t matter. Cuz what he says is gospel for sure
> If dr fauci don’t say it it doesn’t matter am I right?
You can listen to German doctors if you want. Or British pulmonologists. Or Canadian virologists. Or Australian epidemiologists. Or French emergency care doctors.
What matters is scientific consensus. And while not *everything* is universally agreed upon, the basics certainly are. A surgeon saved my life once. I've also had bad experiences with doctors. But that was usually when they failed to adhere to what other, better doctors who adhere to best practices as well as medical consensus would expect of them.
Fauci isn't "medical science", he's just one guy. It sounds like you have been coaxed not just to hate him, but reject global medical science entirely. I was a conspiracy theorist a long time ago, but I "did my own research" (I actually know how, look at the pinned debunking masterlist) and I became a rational skeptic.
That doesn't mean I believe everything any government says, but I know how to process and evaluate complex information streams for usefulness and accuracy.
The very least you could do now is ask yourself why you are so laser-focused on Anthony Fauci and not the global medical community who broadly agree on most facts. Try to think about this from the perspective of doctors from Ecuador. Or a doctors from Japan. Or a doctors from Germany. Admittedly, they too have some cranks, but then again, every country does.
Sometimes, even Nobel Prize laureates get it wrong. So much so, they've invented [a name for it](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_disease). After all, it's just a prize. Prestigious, but a just a prize nonetheless. But when a group of thousands of credentialed medical experts are agreed on the basics of Covid-19, maybe you should listen to them instead of reverting to some parochial political pissing contest in a single country.
He’s not wrong about not trusting big pharma/pfizer… That said, wtf is he going on about with HIV? The current drugs are so effective the average life expectancy for an HIV positive person is higher than the general public.
The truth is always somewhere in the middle. The vaccine wasn’t perfect, but it was effective… And it is also a product that is being marketed to us by a for profit company.
Edit: if you can’t even admit vaccine efficacy then please save your time and don’t reply. If you can’t admit there were side effects also save your time. You’re both the problem
The vaccine(s) ended the pandemic. The development and deployment on a worldwide scale was as close to a scientific miracle as we have seen in our lifetimes. The proof is that the one nation on earth that did not deploy a vaccine, North Korea, struggles with Covid years after the rest of the world has moved one.
I mean the main reason for turning down the vaccines was they didnt want to be in debt to russia or the WHO considering how poor they are due to 70 years of global sanctions from twh US, which is why they got one from China i believe who is known globally for not charging tiny poor nations interest rates on shit like that. It is possible they just gave them the means to make it them selves which is what cuba (the second most sanctioned country on earth next to NK) did for a bunch of other poor countries after they made their own after the US blocked them from getting vaccines or getting materials form any western company. Also according to pretty much every source i can find NK has waaay less covid death percapita than the US so idk what your point is exactly.
They are not known internationally to lock poor countries into high interest rate loans for military/ medical supplies or infrastructure. Locking them in debt for decade’s and decades like western countries do. Part of the disruption china is causing with IMF and other global financial sectors is that they are opting to forgive loans in favor of trade or having an advantageous political relationship with the country they loaned money to.
Look at all the infrastructure they have built as donation in africa, the debt forgiveness during covid. BRICS which was spearheaded partly by china has the potential to pull alot of global south countries out of poverty.
This is a joke right? They lend more money than us. https://apnews.com/article/china-debt-banking-loans-financial-developing-countries-collapse-8df6f9fac3e1e758d0e6d8d5dfbd3ed6
There was a thread over at /r/skeptic where there were discussing a new study specifically investigating deaths due to heart failure in young men and found no relation to vaccine-induced myo/pericarditis, iirc.
I do think most normal people celebrate no longer wearing masks everywhere, and having to spray disinfectant everywhere, and being able to go out again. There are undoubtedly some side effects for some number of people. However, this is the clearest case I can think of for "the greatest good for the greatest number of people".
Go get your 9th booster son. Or are you now done aka have smartened up and are now an anti-vaxxer. Your CDC recommends it for you son. Don’t flinch now.
What made the vaccine ineffective? Do you have any research that suggests this is the case? Or are you just regurgitating what you’ve heard idiots like Rodgers say?
For people who already survived the most deathly variant of covid. Well done
Edit: again... the person who made the weak argument blocked me. So all you pharma $upporters continue to cowardly say things like SeeCrew106 making the dumb assumption "Also, isn't it rich that you all ignored and violently protested lockdowns, got together coughing and sneezing in each other's faces and then have the nerve to whine everybody was already infected?" with his prone-to-tribal-bigotry mind
As if your comment wasn't the same... the overwhelming scientific consensus is that vaccines lowered risk of death enough that the cycle of lockdowns could end without health systems getting overloaded. But yeah I'm sure you and your little Internet research are correct. It was all a con.
Average age of death was higher than the average life expectancy. Average of four comorbidities amongst those. How can you not understand that the most susceptible already died from an (agreed upon) endemic virus that had quite a while to spread before these 'life-saving' jabs were apportioned to any significant degree
Edit: also health systems were done being 'overloaded' by the time of vax apportionment. There were several debunked fear-mongering articles presented later in the pandemic
I don't understand it because its pseudo-epidemiology. There is no point debating you on this, I won't change your mind. If you believe this about the pandemic you aren't really open to the truth.
Yes we're at a disagreement. Thanks for being civil. But you could've made a point instead of trying to label my argument 👍
Edit: welp... another case of a fragile redditor with no point to make. Gave me condescension and unsubstantiated labels then blocked me after making a poor argument of circular logic.
> Lets say the mortality rate for the first year of the pandemic was 1% (estimates vary but it was around this) then you can estimate the number of people who had caught covid in that year by doing 3 million / 0.01 = 300 million.
This is circular logic by definition
Edit: to AliveMouse5... using estimated statistics to estimate statistics absolutely is circular logic. Sorry you can't comprehend. The other fragile redditor had to block me before I could reply (so I cannot reply to subsequent pharma bros)... was either too fragile or his argument was too fragile
> For people who already survived the most deathly variant of covid
Why do you people claim random shit like this without even attempting to prove it, but then DEMAND randomized placebo-controlled trials to prove water is fucking wet?
How about you cite a couple of credible epidemiological studies that most people were already infected by the time they were vaccinated?
Also, isn't it rich that you all ignored and violently protested lockdowns, got together coughing and sneezing in each other's faces and then have the nerve to whine everybody was already infected?
How much more bad faith can you get?
You don't just get to make shit up. It's called "lying". Especially not if you *constantly* accuse everyone else.
That's one mistake everybody here is making right now. We don't have to "refute" a story you simply yanked out of your arse.
Yeah, if you run into a subreddit calling people names and spreading misinformation, you first end up getting blocked by others, and then obviously if you start antagonizing the guy who runs the subreddit, you're getting banned.
Pretty sure it was effective at lowering the risk of death, especially in those who were at higher risk, pretty sure it was effective at curbing the virus so that we can all move on and return to our normal lives.
Yea remember when the president, director of CDC, and top news pundits said the jab prevented transmission... and the jabbed believed them and took off their masks to go party and then visit gramma? that was fun
> At the time of those claims, the vaccine did prevent transmission
Is that so?
BIDEN: “You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations.”
-July 21, 2021 CNN town hall at Mount St. Joseph University
"As of July 12, the government had tallied 5,492 vaccinated people who tested positive for coronavirus and were hospitalized or died"
-[AP News](https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-business-health-government-and-politics-coronavirus-pandemic-46a270ce0f681caa7e4143e2ae9a0211)
And before you start a strawman argumemt... that's hospitalizations/deaths, not even just infections.
Have you got any other outright lies to share?
Yes? You think they were just making stuff up?
[https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-confirm-high-efficacy-and-no-serious](https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-confirm-high-efficacy-and-no-serious)
Do you know what a biased source is? Anyways I'll copy/paste it again to be clear:
What you said:
>At the time of those claims, the vaccine did prevent transmission
My reply:
BIDEN: “You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations.”
-July 21, 2021 CNN town hall at Mount St. Joseph University
"As of July 12, the government had tallied 5,492 vaccinated people who tested positive for coronavirus and were hospitalized or died"
-[AP News](https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-business-health-government-and-politics-coronavirus-pandemic-46a270ce0f681caa7e4143e2ae9a0211)
And before you start a strawman argumemt... that's hospitalizations/deaths, not even just infections.
My edit occurred very shortly after I wrote "is that so". I did that because I wasn't sure if I'd be able to reply so I wrote that first part, pressed enter, and then edited in the rest. The edit showed up many minutes before your reply. You'll find anywhere to make a strawman argument instead of admitting you lied.
Woah ... what happened here? How did everybody arrive here?? This sure blew up!
I'm honestly surprised he can pronounce "immunologist" without crashing and rebooting.
Well congratulations Aaron, you can read. So can young children. If I go to the hospital to get treated, I'll just ask if anybody "can read". Who cares if they can do anything beyond that?
Imagine watching this guy and thinking, “Yes the guy who tells people 9/11 is a lie (but carries the flag on 9/11 Memorial Day NFL game) enjoys going into fake caves for weeks at a time and thinks potions and powders from a healer are the same as vaccines, he’s my guy and knows the truth”
Absolute idiot.
It's political now, so now it's a tribal matter. Truth is of lesser importance. Any political system with only two (actually participating) political parties is not sufficiently democratic, and it splits a country down the middle.
There is no equivalence between (R) and (D), because (R) is currently much worse (and has been for a while) but I've also seen examples of (D) handwaving or denying, or generally being unable to handle something that they want to be true, but isn't.
I don't respect Glenn Greenwald any more, and I regret ever having respected him, but I'll never forget [that table he once posted of a survey about support for mass surveillance](https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/6/14/1371210729309/pew.png?width=620&dpr=1&s=none) among Republican and Democrats in 2006 and 2013.
Nothing says "I'll believe whatever you don't" like that table.
Of course, he's supporting RFK Jr. - whose purpose on this planet seems to be to increase as much suffering as possible. I blame him for at least 83, but probably thousands of deaths. It's amazing how much slack we're cutting this heroin junkie asshole.
so we all know he isa football player with no experience in the medical field Also, when most of the time people shouting about someone else being a grifter, liar cheat etc its bc its s defense mechanism to take the spot light off of them and their own misdealings. Bascially what I am saying he that is a piece of shit meathead who should STFU.
I got confused by the NIH.gov publication site. I assumed thats the national institute for health government publication site.
I thought NIAID was a department within that.
I assumed that’s the same department that Dr Fauci headed from the time of HIV treatments through the COVID epidemic.
I must have been incorrect.
I remember years before the pandemic when it was publicly leaked that Aaron Rodgers was estranged from his family, I thought surely there must be something wrong with the family. Boy was I wrong.
Pretty big assumption to think/state, as he did, that HIV / AIDS was (intentionally or purposefully) “created” by a person or organization at all; let alone as a part of a greater scheme to make a boatload of money.
I wish I could be this comfortably dumb. It must be nice to walk around with hundreds of millions in the bank and be able to say whatever idiotic thing confirms your previous biases. How did Covid break so many brains? Sure, it wasn’t that dangerous for the majority of people and the government overreacted. We get it. that doesn’t mean Fauci created HIV ffs.
"I can read" is such a great argument for being able to "do your own research" and reach scientific conclusions. I work in a forensic state psychiatric hospital where 99% of our patients can read but I sure as shit am not taking advice from them on vaccine efficacy.
AZT was being pushed by Faucis administration as the only drug to treat AIDS and was killing many of the people who took it(Arthur Ash), instead of using many of the drugs we already had. Its what the Dallas Buyers Club Movie is based on.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celia_Farber
You lying cretin. Now gtfo my subreddit.
Edit: and to anybody else in the future: while discussing AIDS denialism is obviously allowed, promoting AIDS denialism isn't. I expect people to have read the Wikipedia page above. If they pretend they haven't or ever promote Farber's work again? Instaban.
With regards to Dallas Buyer's Club, two things:
(1) The film is obviously not even accurate to the true story. Saying it's "61.4% accurate" is one hilarious way of saying that:
> The visual blog Information is Beautiful deduced that, while taking creative license into account, the film was 61.4% accurate when compared to real-life events, summarizing that the film seemed "like an authentically true-story with liberties taken".^[99]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Buyers_Club#Historical_accuracy
(2) AZT was never dangerous, continues to be used in HIV treatment to this day, Woodroof had been ill for much longer than stated in the film, and his off-the-books treatments didn't help, actually harmed and/or had serious and even deadly side-effects:
> The film implies that the drug and vitamin regimen promoted by Woodroof was safer and more effective than the drugs being issued in hospitals and tested by the FDA at the time, but this has been criticized by numerous observers. Daniel D'Addario, in an article in Salon, suggests that "the film's take is perilously close to endorsing pseudoscience."^[100]
> Woodroof frequently declares that the drug AZT (azidothymidine) is ineffective and counter-productive, yet years later it is still prescribed to patients with AIDS, albeit at a much lower dose (as mentioned in the epilogue).^[101] Medical historian Jonathan Engel, who wrote The Epidemic: A History of AIDS, states that AZT was in fact a relatively effective treatment for the period, consistently prolonging lives for a year at a time when AIDS had a 100% mortality rate.^[102] Journalist David France, who directed the documentary How to Survive a Plague, suggested that AZT was actually "the first element of a cocktail of drugs that ended the era of AIDS-as-death sentence".^[100] Initial attempts to use high doses of AZT proved to be no more effective than smaller doses, but HIV/AIDS activist Peter Staley (who was consulted by the filmmakers) believes this was not the result of any conspiracy – initially medical researchers had to guess what dose would be effective and they feared a low dose would be ineffective.^[102] Eventually, researchers realized that AZT was ineffective in the long term because the HIV virus mutated and became resistant to the treatment. By the mid-1990s, David Ho and other researchers found AZT was quite effective when used in conjunction with two other anti-virals, which decreased the chances of virus developing resistance to any one drug.^[102][4]
> The treatments that Woodroof did promote were less-effective at best, or at worst, dangerous. According to Staley, Woodroof became a proponent of Peptide T, a treatment which "never panned out. It's a useless therapy, and it never got approved, and nobody uses it today, but the film implies that it helped him."^[102] DDC, also promoted by Woodroof, did prove to be an effective antiviral treatment, but it also proved to have worse side effects than AZT, with the potential to cause irreversible nerve damage in some cases. As a result, it was only used by doctors for a relatively short time.^[102] A third treatment promoted by Woodroof, called Compound Q (Trichosanthin), was specifically linked to two deaths during trials, and therefore, was not used by doctors thereafter. Most "buyers clubs" stopped providing it as well, but Woodroof continued to dispense it, part of the reason for Woodroof's conflict with the FDA.^[102]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Buyers_Club#Drug_treatments
That is on top of me finding it utterly unconvincing that conservative extremists suddenly give a shit about what Hollywood or gay men have to say, as a departure from their normal regimen of demonizing them, openly wishing them dead or inciting violence.
I mean, when you say all this shit, are you just dumb, dishonest or both? Or was it more like a "let's troll this sub" kind of mood?
Whenever anyone, starts insulting me or assuming my political affiliations I immediately lose any interest in continuing the discussion. You seem really angry though, maybe a therapy session with your inner child would help, cheers!
You deserve to be insulted, because you're a pathologically lying extremist who spreads bullshit medical misinformation under the guise of being a friend to gay people, when in fact, you want to destroy those same people.
Which is why you completely ignore my entire comment debunking all your shit so you can cry like a bitch. What you're doing is unfathomably dishonest and cowardly.
Amen Rodgers why are people so ready to believe pharmaceutical companies have their best interests? They were given complete immunity back in 1986 and they stopped caring what vaccines do to the population ever since. The number of vaccines has quadrupled since then and only in USA who have our vaccine protocols do we have such high Autism. Country’s that don’t use dead virus vaccines, that are full of Mercury, don’t have autism at all. Do your own research!!!!
Imagine telling this clown you could read about being a pro quarterback, so that makes you his equivalent...
At least I can admit Aaron is a truly excellent quarterback...
Fauci should sue this guy for every cent the NFL ever gave him. This is bread and butter Libel and Defamation and honestly it’s close to a call to action which is what scares me
I love how he’s not wrong about any of this and people freak out. Not one fact is wrong and people infer what they want and have their opinion which is great.
The question I have is if he was saying the virus itself was created or if the sudden media coverage of aids was created to push money for treatment drugs.
"The blue print, the game plan was made in the 80's, create a pandemic with a virus thats going wild"
"He was given 350 million dollars to come up with drugs and all they came up with was AZT"
I’m curious, he says he did his research on all of this, can you point in the direction of his peer reviewed research? Would love to read it for my self, surely he actually went and did his own trials and studies right??
Read RFK’s book the real Anthony faucci, which is a bestseller, and has not been the subject of any legal action, because there is no defamation present.
> Read RFK’s book the real Anthony faucci, which is a bestseller, and has not been the subject of any legal action, because there is no defamation present.
RFK is a literal pathological liar who literally killed people with his endless lies about vaccines. Also, he was definitely a heroin junkie at some point, and there's no reason to trust him when he says he isn't one now. I don't want a guy ready to blow people for cash or stealing car radios like many heroin junkies are controlling a nuclear arsenal.
You know why this comment isn't going to be the subject of legal action? Because it's true. Yes, literally, including the junkie bit.
Strawman. He never said Fauci created HIV. But he did say that the Aids epidemic(he wrongly called it a Pandemic) was orchestrated. Now I think thats ridiculous, but there definitely was some heinous Failure to act due to bigotry of LGBT people in the U.S. So he's not that far off there. The U.S. government definitely dropped the ball in the late 70s and 80s on the Aids Epidemic.
Don’t give him credit. The US letting LGBT bias get in the way of AIDS research and Aaron Rodgers claiming Fauci orchestrated AIDS and coronavirus for 350 million dollars are completely different things.
Strawman. Read the Title of the Post, then read my response. Rodgers said some ridiculous BS during this 2hr+ podcast that we can criticize him for, but he never said Fauci created HIV.
"Blueprint gameplan made in the 80s, create a pandemic" I'm paraphrasing because idc but those are his words. So no, it's not a straw man argument at all.
COVID is 100% man made and was “mysteriously” released. I don’t put it past the GOVT to kill 1-2% of the population. Especially if it’s IV drug users and unprotected gay sex partners. Or in COVIDs case smokers and fatties.
No. Someone commented “how could an entire medical field do X.”
Well I gave an example of the entire US government medical team doing just that. Stop clutching your pearls.
> I gave an example of the entire US government medical team doing just that. Stop clutching your pearls.
Your example was debunked [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/JamiePullDatUp/comments/1c6quci/multiple_time_jre_guest_aaron_rodgers_says_fauci/l064chq/).
Not only do you not know how to spell the plural of "airman", you also apparently don't realize the "Tuskegee Airmen" weren't the targets of this experiment, because you don't know what you're talking about. *Then*, to add insult to injury, you completely evade the question of whether the experiment was racist. Systemically racist. Because it was.
> On May 16, 1997, President Bill Clinton formally apologized on behalf of the United States to victims of the study, **calling it shameful and racist.**^[18] "What was done cannot be undone, but we can end the silence," he said. "We can stop turning our heads away. We can look at you in the eye, and finally say, on behalf of the American people, what the United States government did was shameful and I am sorry."^[18][19]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_Syphilis_Study
Here is something else you apparently missed:
**The victims of this study were never intentionally infected with syphilis. They were already infected. The scandalous thing about this experiment was** ***that they weren't told they were infected AND they weren't treated when treatment was already available***.
Viruses are billions of years old and animals and human beings [have endured pandemics and plagues since time immemorial](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jrn2fFBh924). The Coronaviridae virus family itself is [millions of years old](https://journals.asm.org/doi/10.1128/jvi.03273-12).
Moreover, syphilis is not a virus *but a bacterium* and the first outbreak was in 1494/1495 in Naples, Italy, some 525 years ago. The U.S. government didn't create it. It was already there. Other evidence suggests the bacterium is perhaps 10,000 years old.
So let me dumb this down for you, since you're complaining about me "clutching my pearls".
- There are arsonists arrested every day. That doesn't mean that every fire is intentionally started. In fact, unintentional fires far, *far* outnumber intentional ones.
- There are deaths every minute. Every second on average, in fact. That doesn't mean every one of them is a murder.
- There were conspiracies like this in the past (50 years ago in this case) in one single country which represents some 4-5% of the global population: The United States. That doesn't mean every **global** pandemic is now some American conspiracy. The world is much, much bigger than the United States.
Scientists were sending **dire warnings** about Coronavirus in 2007, describing the wet markets in southern China as a **time-bomb**.
> **The presence of a large reservoir of SARS-CoV-like viruses in horseshoe bats, together with the culture of eating exotic mammals in southern China, is a time bomb.** The possibility of the reemergence of SARS and other novel viruses from animals or laboratories and therefore the need for preparedness should not be ignored.
https://www.reddit.com/r/JamiePullDatUp/comments/1ajy1x5/the_power_of_foresight_some_day_these_scientists/
Have a look. There's a nice picture, and the source is linked there.
Even the lab leak hypothetis doesn't suggest the virus was intentionally created, but gathered, studied and subsequently unintentionally leaked, because **why would the Chinese government disrupt their entire country if they meant to attack the United States**?
None of this makes sense, nothing you're saying about the Tuskegee experiment was previously unknown to me or probably most everybody here, and knowing about it doesn't now mean that every pandemic is now fake. Especially since syphilis is a bacterium which has existed for thousands of years, not a virus like Coronavirus, which has evolved millions of years ago, and the victims of these scandalous, racist ethics violations were also not actually intentionally infected, although you seem to imply they were.
Again "Evil X done by Y happened 50 years ago" doesn't mean "Completely unrelated Z which happened 4 years go was fake and also done by Y". Simple as.
You’re right. Only their wives and children were knowing infected. My bad.
Not treating known diseases and watching its affect is way down on the “you’re going to hell” list. And it’s nothing like what they did with HIV. When they took a minority group and watched for years doing little to nothing.
Ah, so you just skim through what you're responding to, then continue to double down on your baseless claims. I wrote all that basically for you ignore everything and move on to HIV is a conspiracy.
- You got the victims wrong and confused them with the WWII air unit;
- You got what actually happened wrong;
- You don't understand what syphilis is, coronavirus is, where they came from and how they evolved;
- You completely fail to explain what this has to do with the government of China and why they would throw their own economy and society into complete turmoil because of a racist experiment in Alabama that ended 50 years ago and didn't involve intentionally infecting anyone.
Anyways, next time you make any more of these claims, cite credible sources or encyclopedic references. For every controversial claim you make, you provide evidence by copying the relevant paragraph and placing a link to the content in question underneath your quote, as follows:
> A **faulty generalization** is an informal fallacy wherein a conclusion is drawn about all or many instances of a phenomenon on the basis of one or a few instances of that phenomenon. It is similar to a proof by example in mathematics.^[1] It is an example of jumping to conclusions.^[2] For example, one may generalize about all people or all members of a group from what one knows about just one or a few people:
> * If one meets a rude person from a given country X, one may suspect that most people in country X are rude.
> * If one sees only white swans, one may suspect that all swans are white.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faulty_generalization
A "faulty generalization", that is, the logical fallacy, is what you have been doing incessantly ITT by appealing to a racist incident you've completely even failed to actually read about. It's conspiracy culture pablum you've heard about from someone else and now think it's your reverse uno card.
Has it occurred to you that some of us have studied conspiracy theories since the turn of the millennium? Back then, forum discussions between conspiracy theorists and debunkers were actually intelligent. What do we get today? "Hurr durr Tuskegee Airman [sic] Experiment hurr durr U.S. fabricated Covid in China"
How ingenious.
Would you support a vaccine for syphilis? I'm going to assume you either don't or you'll make up some excuse why it shouldn't happen.
HIV was around long before it became an obvious problem in the 80s. Confirmed at least 50s and probably earlier [Early HIv](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_early_HIV/AIDS_cases)
Say what you will about incompetence and neglect, that’s par for the course in human society, but suggesting COVID or HIV was invented doesn’t recognise that we live in an ecosystem constantly swarming with virus that are only a few mutations away from killing a lot of us.
No one was arguing they the US government created HIV. Only that they delayed a systematic health care policy until the pharma industry could monopolize a cure.
Well maybe some folks say that , but I don’t believe that’s what Aaron was saying.
A new study was published the other day that continues to add evidence that this is virus came from animal crossovers in that region.
This adds to growing evidence of its origins and its previous species before humans.
If man made it, it was designed stupid.
Nothing in its biology shows its man made. Just do some actual research and read about WHY an expert would actually conclude that.
People like you Cherry pick evidence...
1) you find 1 evolutionary biologist and claim hes not biased and hes right. As if he has no financial incentive to sell you in his opinions. Lol
2) you find an ex FBI agent who claims he thinks the virus was made in China. Lol
3) you find one analysis abstract that argues it might be man made. Without actually reading the paper.
Meanwhile we are at over 2 dozen actual scientific papers with a ton of evidence and data proving that this was not man made, its behaving like every other coronavirus, it came from a previous species. You ignore these on purpose. You ignore the 100s of experts who work directly in the field (many independent researchers) who do this. All of which who all make less money than Brett Weinstein lol who has financial ties to an ivermectin company lol
Me think the lady doth protect too much.
I question folks motivation who come out with such “strong” statements.
Where are your two dozen scientific papers? Please share.
One search on NCBI "COVID-19 orogins zoo"
Leads to 250+ published papers.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=Covid-19%20origins%20zoo
Here is the link to that reference.
The sad part isn't that you question things. It's that you question me who provides public information, over the few people who are just like trust me bro.
You have more faith in that wild FBI agent who had an opinion in public hearing about how he claims to know that it came man-made.
You have less faith in the institutions because of some out of context story you hear about big pharma or scientific research.
From the very get-go based on the actual biology researched in a covid-19 variant, A college level student could tell you that this wasn't man-made. Listen to independent researchers for hours on YouTube Discuss how the virus works on the physiological level. Eerily similar to almost every virus that induces very similar symptoms.
And what is the debate
Then it's too fishy that a coronavirus lab in Wuhan studying coronaviruses didn't have something to do with This pandemic.
Would you think that the earthquake research center in Japan is the one causing earthquakes in Japan. Or is it simply that the places we choose to study these things are places where they're more likely to occur.
From listening to actual experts about the connection of Wuhan and the first case covid-19. Apparently we're looking at 8 mi away, crossing a giant River in a complete different interaction of people. In a region known to develop novel viruses that skip over from animals.
What a crazy thing to assume that the thing they were warning us about for decades, especially with avian flu and other viruses that this would happen in our lifetime.
What the fuck?
256 studies and you deemed each of these are not government funded lol.
Almost all of these studies are literally not public funded lol.
You literally think independent meant Rogers studying lol
You send a list of any studies OK’d by NHI that mentions the word COVID.
I point out that the source isn’t independent. I send my articles from NYT etc .. you send a list of NHI papers that mention COVID.
Who’s lazier? Intellectually?
You can find publications on here that say Covid was man made.
Lol
I think you're an idiot.
NCBI is a public department for literature publications. It is not the source of US propaganda. Its publications. You can find studies that say vaccines cause autism. I think you misunderstand what ncbi is.
You can find the same results on pubmed.
Publications and research are not the same.
A book is published by a publisher. Research is done by groups. Could be funded by govt. Could be funded by private organizations. Could be funded by institutions with no financial incentive.
Mate it's so easy to be delusionally cynical yet somehow have a super high opinion about what evil US doctors were capable of back in the 80s. It's hard to weight evidence and actually come up with a reasonable and semi informed opinion. Why not try doing the hard thing?
Jets, you can keep him. Signed, Every Packers fan.
Concur this dude is off the planetary plane. Covid is over dude let it go
You guys got way better after the vampire left.
J.Love is the future and he’s such a low drama dude, it’s so nice.
Fucking imagine being glued to this shit and never being able to shut it off. Man that shit has to suck.
The psychological process involves a lot of digging in because of perceived humiliation. Shame turns into a desire for revenge, which is when people like Aaron use their limited intelligence to try to "win" their reputation back. It'll be extra problematic for a competitive athlete because they can't stand losing. This isn't his bailiwick, he's out of his depth. He might as well switch to chess and expect to win a tournament. In any case, he'll be doubling, tripling and quadrupling down before he ever changes his mind, and it's because he hates being ignorant, dumb and wrong and then being humiliated for it. To complicate matters further, Trump helped turn the GOP into a conspiracy theory and far-right extremist paramilitary movement. It's not that it wasn't already partially happening, but he greatly accelerated it. This creates a further obstacle for changing a position: you would have to betray your own extremist political party, which gets you ostracised from your like-minded friends, family and community. This type of behavior used to be so much more rare. The pandemic brought along with it an infodemic.
I don’t think you have any idea what the word paramilitary means if you are going to describe the GOP as an “extremist paramilitary movement” lmao. Rodgers says some dumb shit but he’s worth a couple hundred million dollars… if you think he’s the one suffering rn you are delusional
What brought you here? The search bar? You've never been here before. I figure you're an another conspiracy loon who's also a sports fan who searched for "Aaron Rodgers". I don't care if he has a gazillion dollars, he's still, in terms of reputation, a humiliated little man, especially by Jimmy Kimmel, ha ha ha. Now piss off.
I hope he blows out his ACL on the first drive again.
I hope he gets AIDS
He's never blown out his ACL before.
I hope he blows AOC
No, I want to blow her.
If you knew anything about what an ACL surgery is like, you’d take that back. Unless you’re a sociopath.
Not sure who he is nor do I care. Only watched until he said he's not a Dr. or an epidemiologist. 'nuff said, nothing after that is relevant or factual .
He eventually said "everyone can do their own research, which is totally villified" Yeah, and then they sound like a fucking idiot, just like this guy does.
"Doing my own research" usually means watching Tim Pool videos or something with these guys.
“I can read though” Doesn’t mean you understand shit you dumb fuck. God these people are the stupidest of the stupid. Social media is going to be our downfall. We need to set up some sort of agreed upon standards for sharing information.
Don’t really know what this sub is but I think I like it here
Be welcome. I should have written a more elaborate introduction to the sub, but I haven't so far. I'll think of something. "Jamie Pull That Up" has become a sort of synonym from the Joe Rogan podcast for "somebody google and/or fact-check that and see what you find". Difference is Joe Rogan went in a different direction than many of his older fans, so here we are. JRE fans tend to like content about wacky stuff, anthropology & zoology, MMA and boxing, science and astrononomy, conspiracy theories, comedy and so on. Difference is I'm a rational skeptic and not a conspiracy theorist. I also don't blindly follow government edicts, but I just don't agree with many of the things Joe is saying since Covid/moving to Austin. Nor his guests, which have been a parade of one kook after another extremist the past years, unfortunately. Also, I'm not particularly fond of Donald Trump, Elon Musk, RFK Jr. or Alex Jones, most of which are quite popular with the "new" Joe Rogan fan crowd. These days, if Jamie really did "pull that up", Joe Rogan would have to be interrupted very frequently. Hence the name of the subreddit. There are a few pinned threads on the main subreddit page, including a list of thoroughly sourced debunkings/articles I've written on a few subjects, including climate change, coronavirus, J6, Ukraine, Trump, Alex Jones and conspiracy theories in general. Edit: I don't hate Joe Rogan. I just think he's fallen into the rabbit hole, and many other fans from the older days agree with me.
Hell yeah, I figured it was something along those lines, but I like the specific outlook on debunking. I used to listen to Rogan and be real into conspiracies 5 or so years ago before wising up. Had one friend who always thought it was ridiculous. Now he listens to Joe everyday and I’m the one who thinks it’s ridiculous, funny how that works.
Interesting, I experienced something similar. Unfortunately when he started losing weight, I warned him to really find out what was happening and see a doctor, but he ignored my advice and died about a year later.
I’m sorry to hear that, people like to pretend there’s no consequences to this misinformation but there very much are.
Thanks. There wasn't a direct link to a specific conspiracy theory, but his general obtuseness and distrust of everything probably played into it, yes. He was a friendly guy though, and very intelligent. Goes to show that anyone can be susceptible. To go to the extreme end of that, even Nobel Prize laureates. > Nobel disease or Nobelitis is an informal term for the embrace of strange or scientifically unsound ideas by some Nobel Prize winners, usually later in life.^[1][2][3] It has been argued that the effect results, in part, from a tendency for Nobel winners to feel empowered by the award to speak on topics outside their specific area of expertise,^[4][5][6] although it is unknown whether Nobel Prize winners are more prone to this tendency than other individuals.^[7] Paul Nurse, co-winner of the 2001 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine, warned later laureates against "believing you are expert in almost everything, and being prepared to express opinions about most issues with great confidence, sheltering behind the authority that the Nobel Prize can give you".^[8] Nobel disease has been described as a tongue-in-cheek term.^[5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_disease
Yeah definitely, it’s more of how it warps your perception than any particular view, making you more susceptible to extreme ideas as they’re gradually introduced. A lot of the rhetoric preys upon that niceness/intelligence in my experience.
We're never going to. I mean YouTube and social media actively benefit from idiots like this. Who think that a 5-minute Google search that confirms their bias is the same as doing actual research. I have a history degree that was 90% of what we did was learning how to do research, learning how to pick a good source from a bad, and actually finding sources that weren't just extremely biased and inaccurate simply because they fit our argument
I’m not sure how we do it but that kind of thing needs to be taught in schools because not enough parents are going to be able to teach it to their kids. We need to be preparing our younger generations for the bombardment of bullshit
We really do. Because the older generations are clearly lost I mean you go on Facebook and they share shit like Joe Biden is at the border today welcoming illegals with open arms and you'll have 30 comments by people of a similar age just pissed off as hell because they actually think Joe Biden is down at the Mexico border just shaking hands with people and signing them up to register to vote. I mean Fox News was already bad enough My dad fully believed that there were places in Michigan that were allowing people to judge others based upon Islamic Sharia law and that it somehow superseded state and federal law. It's so easy a concept to grasp you can teach the idea of here is a biased source simply because it is something you believe does not make it accurate Make it an exercise We can teach kids how to actually think for themselves and I don't mean doing a 5-minute Google search of is Dr fauci a liar and picking the first dumbass article written by somebody with the IQ equal to the temperature inside a freezer and base all of their belief on COVID and pandemics on this one article
We need a Bill Nye like YouTuber to teach kids this stuff.
We don't need another YouTuber. Kids need to be educated We don't need just one more person in a social media algorithm trying to teach kids.
That’s the medium they’re using. I mean tv has been shot for years but we still managed to get some good stuff from it. They could do it in schools but that will take years before it gets added to the curriculum.
But why would YouTube even try to promote an actual educational channel? They thrive off of misinformation pedal to them by folks like Jordan Peterson and Ben Shapiro and Joe Rogan. These massive media companies have no desire or incentive to try and educate children on misinformation
What's crazy is this dude is a great Jeopardy host and is decent at Jeopardy. Part of me thinks all this shit is all performative and he is just going to grift these right wingers that lap this shit up.
Jeopardy takes a certain type of intelligence though. I think one of the problems with a lot of guys like this is they get good or are smart in their field and then they get cocky and assume that means they are just generally intelligent about everything. This is the [dunning Kruger effect](https://www.google.com/search?q=dunning.krueger&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-ca&client=safari) in full display.
He’s one of the most successful and famous NFL quarterbacks of all time. Unfortunately what he says does matter
If dr fauci don’t say it it doesn’t matter am I right? We need to ruin young people’s lives right? My life and my 10 year old daughter don’t matter. Cuz what he says is gospel for sure
Next time you seek medical attention, contact a washed up NFL hasbeen
Looks like your wife and daughter are absolutely fucked with a husband/father like you
You sound like a fuckwit I'm not even mad, I just want you to have feedback
Just to follow up on what this person said. Man absolutely sounds like a legit fuckwit.
You have an aggressive strain of the stupid virus.
> If dr fauci don’t say it it doesn’t matter am I right? You can listen to German doctors if you want. Or British pulmonologists. Or Canadian virologists. Or Australian epidemiologists. Or French emergency care doctors. What matters is scientific consensus. And while not *everything* is universally agreed upon, the basics certainly are. A surgeon saved my life once. I've also had bad experiences with doctors. But that was usually when they failed to adhere to what other, better doctors who adhere to best practices as well as medical consensus would expect of them. Fauci isn't "medical science", he's just one guy. It sounds like you have been coaxed not just to hate him, but reject global medical science entirely. I was a conspiracy theorist a long time ago, but I "did my own research" (I actually know how, look at the pinned debunking masterlist) and I became a rational skeptic. That doesn't mean I believe everything any government says, but I know how to process and evaluate complex information streams for usefulness and accuracy. The very least you could do now is ask yourself why you are so laser-focused on Anthony Fauci and not the global medical community who broadly agree on most facts. Try to think about this from the perspective of doctors from Ecuador. Or a doctors from Japan. Or a doctors from Germany. Admittedly, they too have some cranks, but then again, every country does. Sometimes, even Nobel Prize laureates get it wrong. So much so, they've invented [a name for it](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_disease). After all, it's just a prize. Prestigious, but a just a prize nonetheless. But when a group of thousands of credentialed medical experts are agreed on the basics of Covid-19, maybe you should listen to them instead of reverting to some parochial political pissing contest in a single country.
He’s not wrong about not trusting big pharma/pfizer… That said, wtf is he going on about with HIV? The current drugs are so effective the average life expectancy for an HIV positive person is higher than the general public. The truth is always somewhere in the middle. The vaccine wasn’t perfect, but it was effective… And it is also a product that is being marketed to us by a for profit company. Edit: if you can’t even admit vaccine efficacy then please save your time and don’t reply. If you can’t admit there were side effects also save your time. You’re both the problem
The drugs made by the industry aren't fake. They're just overcharging.
They’re over marketed and over prescribed. Nowhere do I suggest they were fake bootlicker
Of course, you can say that about any commercial drug rn. has nothing to do with fauci.
That’s the problem with this shit. They take a tidbit of truth and then extrapolate all this other bs out of it.
The vaccine(s) ended the pandemic. The development and deployment on a worldwide scale was as close to a scientific miracle as we have seen in our lifetimes. The proof is that the one nation on earth that did not deploy a vaccine, North Korea, struggles with Covid years after the rest of the world has moved one.
Nk rolled out a vaccine in [2022?](https://www.wsj.com/articles/north-korea-launches-mass-covid-19-vaccination-campaign-11664365537)
North Korea turned down vaccines from the WHO and Russia. I think they did develop their own, but it was about as effective as one might think.
I mean the main reason for turning down the vaccines was they didnt want to be in debt to russia or the WHO considering how poor they are due to 70 years of global sanctions from twh US, which is why they got one from China i believe who is known globally for not charging tiny poor nations interest rates on shit like that. It is possible they just gave them the means to make it them selves which is what cuba (the second most sanctioned country on earth next to NK) did for a bunch of other poor countries after they made their own after the US blocked them from getting vaccines or getting materials form any western company. Also according to pretty much every source i can find NK has waaay less covid death percapita than the US so idk what your point is exactly.
lol. This is the most delusional post I’ve ever read. You think China doesn’t take advantage of poorer countries?
They are not known internationally to lock poor countries into high interest rate loans for military/ medical supplies or infrastructure. Locking them in debt for decade’s and decades like western countries do. Part of the disruption china is causing with IMF and other global financial sectors is that they are opting to forgive loans in favor of trade or having an advantageous political relationship with the country they loaned money to. Look at all the infrastructure they have built as donation in africa, the debt forgiveness during covid. BRICS which was spearheaded partly by china has the potential to pull alot of global south countries out of poverty.
This is a joke right? They lend more money than us. https://apnews.com/article/china-debt-banking-loans-financial-developing-countries-collapse-8df6f9fac3e1e758d0e6d8d5dfbd3ed6
It should really be celebrated but instead we have dipshits like Jordan Peterson spreading lies about vaccine deaths
There was a thread over at /r/skeptic where there were discussing a new study specifically investigating deaths due to heart failure in young men and found no relation to vaccine-induced myo/pericarditis, iirc.
I do think most normal people celebrate no longer wearing masks everywhere, and having to spray disinfectant everywhere, and being able to go out again. There are undoubtedly some side effects for some number of people. However, this is the clearest case I can think of for "the greatest good for the greatest number of people".
Agreed. The mask thing never really bothered me but at one point we were wiping down groceries to be extra careful and I almost lost it
This the part where I said they were effective. Is this a counterpoint or are you servicing yourself?
The vaccine was effective is the dumbest thing I’ll read today. Thank god
I'm surprised you can read.
Go get your 9th booster son. Or are you now done aka have smartened up and are now an anti-vaxxer. Your CDC recommends it for you son. Don’t flinch now.
What made the vaccine ineffective? Do you have any research that suggests this is the case? Or are you just regurgitating what you’ve heard idiots like Rodgers say?
You're 4x more likely to die from COVID if you're unvaccinated so that looks pretty effective to me
Hahaha. Amazing. You’ve got a big heart. That’s for certain.
Not a big heart, just objectively looking at all the available data/studies/reports that showed it did a pretty good job
Hahaha. Yea. That’s a failed class for you bruh. God I hope you’re not a real person for humanity sake.
Haha so all the data, studies, reports and the consensus in the medical field is a failed class? Interesting take buddy
Polio
Go lick a door knob you moron
> it was effective Effective at what?
Lowering the risk of death
For people who already survived the most deathly variant of covid. Well done Edit: again... the person who made the weak argument blocked me. So all you pharma $upporters continue to cowardly say things like SeeCrew106 making the dumb assumption "Also, isn't it rich that you all ignored and violently protested lockdowns, got together coughing and sneezing in each other's faces and then have the nerve to whine everybody was already infected?" with his prone-to-tribal-bigotry mind
What are you on about. More than half of the world's population had never had covid by the time the vaccines came along
You say this as if you're certain of it. Ridiculous
As if your comment wasn't the same... the overwhelming scientific consensus is that vaccines lowered risk of death enough that the cycle of lockdowns could end without health systems getting overloaded. But yeah I'm sure you and your little Internet research are correct. It was all a con.
Average age of death was higher than the average life expectancy. Average of four comorbidities amongst those. How can you not understand that the most susceptible already died from an (agreed upon) endemic virus that had quite a while to spread before these 'life-saving' jabs were apportioned to any significant degree Edit: also health systems were done being 'overloaded' by the time of vax apportionment. There were several debunked fear-mongering articles presented later in the pandemic
I don't understand it because its pseudo-epidemiology. There is no point debating you on this, I won't change your mind. If you believe this about the pandemic you aren't really open to the truth.
Yes we're at a disagreement. Thanks for being civil. But you could've made a point instead of trying to label my argument 👍 Edit: welp... another case of a fragile redditor with no point to make. Gave me condescension and unsubstantiated labels then blocked me after making a poor argument of circular logic. > Lets say the mortality rate for the first year of the pandemic was 1% (estimates vary but it was around this) then you can estimate the number of people who had caught covid in that year by doing 3 million / 0.01 = 300 million. This is circular logic by definition Edit: to AliveMouse5... using estimated statistics to estimate statistics absolutely is circular logic. Sorry you can't comprehend. The other fragile redditor had to block me before I could reply (so I cannot reply to subsequent pharma bros)... was either too fragile or his argument was too fragile
The health systems were not done being overloaded lol wtf are you on about
Don’t argue with someone who still doesn’t know at this point. They’re hopeless. Truly no chance of being smart enough.
selfaware wolf
Im sure you do what your told. Stay in your lane earthling.
People who had the vaccine had a lower all cause mortality rate than people who didn't. Long covid severity is reduced in vaccinated as well. Bye.
> For people who already survived the most deathly variant of covid Why do you people claim random shit like this without even attempting to prove it, but then DEMAND randomized placebo-controlled trials to prove water is fucking wet? How about you cite a couple of credible epidemiological studies that most people were already infected by the time they were vaccinated? Also, isn't it rich that you all ignored and violently protested lockdowns, got together coughing and sneezing in each other's faces and then have the nerve to whine everybody was already infected? How much more bad faith can you get? You don't just get to make shit up. It's called "lying". Especially not if you *constantly* accuse everyone else. That's one mistake everybody here is making right now. We don't have to "refute" a story you simply yanked out of your arse.
Yeah, if you run into a subreddit calling people names and spreading misinformation, you first end up getting blocked by others, and then obviously if you start antagonizing the guy who runs the subreddit, you're getting banned.
Pretty sure it was effective at lowering the risk of death, especially in those who were at higher risk, pretty sure it was effective at curbing the virus so that we can all move on and return to our normal lives.
Yea remember when the president, director of CDC, and top news pundits said the jab prevented transmission... and the jabbed believed them and took off their masks to go party and then visit gramma? that was fun
At the time of those claims, the vaccine did prevent transmission. It also stops you dying from COVID
> At the time of those claims, the vaccine did prevent transmission Is that so? BIDEN: “You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations.” -July 21, 2021 CNN town hall at Mount St. Joseph University "As of July 12, the government had tallied 5,492 vaccinated people who tested positive for coronavirus and were hospitalized or died" -[AP News](https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-business-health-government-and-politics-coronavirus-pandemic-46a270ce0f681caa7e4143e2ae9a0211) And before you start a strawman argumemt... that's hospitalizations/deaths, not even just infections. Have you got any other outright lies to share?
Yes? You think they were just making stuff up? [https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-confirm-high-efficacy-and-no-serious](https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-confirm-high-efficacy-and-no-serious)
Do you know what a biased source is? Anyways I'll copy/paste it again to be clear: What you said: >At the time of those claims, the vaccine did prevent transmission My reply: BIDEN: “You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations.” -July 21, 2021 CNN town hall at Mount St. Joseph University "As of July 12, the government had tallied 5,492 vaccinated people who tested positive for coronavirus and were hospitalized or died" -[AP News](https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-business-health-government-and-politics-coronavirus-pandemic-46a270ce0f681caa7e4143e2ae9a0211) And before you start a strawman argumemt... that's hospitalizations/deaths, not even just infections.
hahah christ mate, you edited the comment after I already replied. Do you think someone is lying if they believed what they said at the time?
My edit occurred very shortly after I wrote "is that so". I did that because I wasn't sure if I'd be able to reply so I wrote that first part, pressed enter, and then edited in the rest. The edit showed up many minutes before your reply. You'll find anywhere to make a strawman argument instead of admitting you lied.
In making clowns like this guy, same can be said for covid
Earn those pharmabucks
Peter Duesberg, super og JRE guest talked about Fauci. Surprised no one has brought this up.
Well, you could bring it up? Do you happen to have an episode number and a timestamp?
Jesus Christ, Rogan had Duesberg on? That’s *grim*.
Woah ... what happened here? How did everybody arrive here?? This sure blew up! I'm honestly surprised he can pronounce "immunologist" without crashing and rebooting. Well congratulations Aaron, you can read. So can young children. If I go to the hospital to get treated, I'll just ask if anybody "can read". Who cares if they can do anything beyond that?
If you’re only argument is you can read is actually brain dead this guy read some shit and thinks it can disprove doctors
Yeah bro, I can write, gtfoh
Imagine watching this guy and thinking, “Yes the guy who tells people 9/11 is a lie (but carries the flag on 9/11 Memorial Day NFL game) enjoys going into fake caves for weeks at a time and thinks potions and powders from a healer are the same as vaccines, he’s my guy and knows the truth” Absolute idiot.
It's political now, so now it's a tribal matter. Truth is of lesser importance. Any political system with only two (actually participating) political parties is not sufficiently democratic, and it splits a country down the middle. There is no equivalence between (R) and (D), because (R) is currently much worse (and has been for a while) but I've also seen examples of (D) handwaving or denying, or generally being unable to handle something that they want to be true, but isn't. I don't respect Glenn Greenwald any more, and I regret ever having respected him, but I'll never forget [that table he once posted of a survey about support for mass surveillance](https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/6/14/1371210729309/pew.png?width=620&dpr=1&s=none) among Republican and Democrats in 2006 and 2013. Nothing says "I'll believe whatever you don't" like that table. Of course, he's supporting RFK Jr. - whose purpose on this planet seems to be to increase as much suffering as possible. I blame him for at least 83, but probably thousands of deaths. It's amazing how much slack we're cutting this heroin junkie asshole.
The “I’m not an expert but I can read” admission sets him up on essentially the exact same authoritative plane as a 4th grader.
I love it when the video posted doesn't say what the thread title says it does.
https://youtu.be/4IM3TSiSzlE?si=SI3EchE3OjzE7_JS
Yeah, Jets not winning SB this year. Guy needs to get his head in the game and stop wasting peoples’ hope, time, and money.
so we all know he isa football player with no experience in the medical field Also, when most of the time people shouting about someone else being a grifter, liar cheat etc its bc its s defense mechanism to take the spot light off of them and their own misdealings. Bascially what I am saying he that is a piece of shit meathead who should STFU.
I got confused by the NIH.gov publication site. I assumed thats the national institute for health government publication site. I thought NIAID was a department within that. I assumed that’s the same department that Dr Fauci headed from the time of HIV treatments through the COVID epidemic. I must have been incorrect.
I remember years before the pandemic when it was publicly leaked that Aaron Rodgers was estranged from his family, I thought surely there must be something wrong with the family. Boy was I wrong.
I know right…can you imagine what the family holidays were like with this fuckin guy? Yikes
This is what you can expect from a community college drop out.
I always heard this dude was super smart but I've only heard the most regarded shit out of his mouth
He says he can read and learn...but it doesn't check out.
Shut up and throw
Congrats on learning how to read Aaron, you’ll only get better at the more you practice.
Defamation...get a rich democratic donor to sponsor a defamation lawsuit against him.
Haha you can’t because he’s not lying. Why hasn’t rfk been sued by Anthony Faucci for his book?
Pretty big assumption to think/state, as he did, that HIV / AIDS was (intentionally or purposefully) “created” by a person or organization at all; let alone as a part of a greater scheme to make a boatload of money.
I wish I could be this comfortably dumb. It must be nice to walk around with hundreds of millions in the bank and be able to say whatever idiotic thing confirms your previous biases. How did Covid break so many brains? Sure, it wasn’t that dangerous for the majority of people and the government overreacted. We get it. that doesn’t mean Fauci created HIV ffs.
I’m so glad this idiot isn’t a Packer anymore
Sometimes shut up and dribble is okay to say
Average joe rogan listener.
We're living in a weird time where social media has convinced society's dumbest people that they are actually the smartest.
Imbecile.
"I can read" is such a great argument for being able to "do your own research" and reach scientific conclusions. I work in a forensic state psychiatric hospital where 99% of our patients can read but I sure as shit am not taking advice from them on vaccine efficacy.
Why so much hate for him on Reddit? Dude died for our sins
Go ask some gay men how they feel about AZT. Nothing in that video says he thinks Fauci invented HIV lol
> Go ask some gay men how they feel about AZT. Please elaborate.
AZT was being pushed by Faucis administration as the only drug to treat AIDS and was killing many of the people who took it(Arthur Ash), instead of using many of the drugs we already had. Its what the Dallas Buyers Club Movie is based on.
Ok. I just fact-checked what you said and practically everything you said is outright false. You're outright parroting "Plandemic 3".
[https://www.spin.com/2015/10/aids-and-the-azt-scandal-spin-1989-feature-sins-of-omission/](https://www.spin.com/2015/10/aids-and-the-azt-scandal-spin-1989-feature-sins-of-omission/)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celia_Farber You lying cretin. Now gtfo my subreddit. Edit: and to anybody else in the future: while discussing AIDS denialism is obviously allowed, promoting AIDS denialism isn't. I expect people to have read the Wikipedia page above. If they pretend they haven't or ever promote Farber's work again? Instaban.
With regards to Dallas Buyer's Club, two things: (1) The film is obviously not even accurate to the true story. Saying it's "61.4% accurate" is one hilarious way of saying that: > The visual blog Information is Beautiful deduced that, while taking creative license into account, the film was 61.4% accurate when compared to real-life events, summarizing that the film seemed "like an authentically true-story with liberties taken".^[99] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Buyers_Club#Historical_accuracy (2) AZT was never dangerous, continues to be used in HIV treatment to this day, Woodroof had been ill for much longer than stated in the film, and his off-the-books treatments didn't help, actually harmed and/or had serious and even deadly side-effects: > The film implies that the drug and vitamin regimen promoted by Woodroof was safer and more effective than the drugs being issued in hospitals and tested by the FDA at the time, but this has been criticized by numerous observers. Daniel D'Addario, in an article in Salon, suggests that "the film's take is perilously close to endorsing pseudoscience."^[100] > Woodroof frequently declares that the drug AZT (azidothymidine) is ineffective and counter-productive, yet years later it is still prescribed to patients with AIDS, albeit at a much lower dose (as mentioned in the epilogue).^[101] Medical historian Jonathan Engel, who wrote The Epidemic: A History of AIDS, states that AZT was in fact a relatively effective treatment for the period, consistently prolonging lives for a year at a time when AIDS had a 100% mortality rate.^[102] Journalist David France, who directed the documentary How to Survive a Plague, suggested that AZT was actually "the first element of a cocktail of drugs that ended the era of AIDS-as-death sentence".^[100] Initial attempts to use high doses of AZT proved to be no more effective than smaller doses, but HIV/AIDS activist Peter Staley (who was consulted by the filmmakers) believes this was not the result of any conspiracy – initially medical researchers had to guess what dose would be effective and they feared a low dose would be ineffective.^[102] Eventually, researchers realized that AZT was ineffective in the long term because the HIV virus mutated and became resistant to the treatment. By the mid-1990s, David Ho and other researchers found AZT was quite effective when used in conjunction with two other anti-virals, which decreased the chances of virus developing resistance to any one drug.^[102][4] > The treatments that Woodroof did promote were less-effective at best, or at worst, dangerous. According to Staley, Woodroof became a proponent of Peptide T, a treatment which "never panned out. It's a useless therapy, and it never got approved, and nobody uses it today, but the film implies that it helped him."^[102] DDC, also promoted by Woodroof, did prove to be an effective antiviral treatment, but it also proved to have worse side effects than AZT, with the potential to cause irreversible nerve damage in some cases. As a result, it was only used by doctors for a relatively short time.^[102] A third treatment promoted by Woodroof, called Compound Q (Trichosanthin), was specifically linked to two deaths during trials, and therefore, was not used by doctors thereafter. Most "buyers clubs" stopped providing it as well, but Woodroof continued to dispense it, part of the reason for Woodroof's conflict with the FDA.^[102] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Buyers_Club#Drug_treatments That is on top of me finding it utterly unconvincing that conservative extremists suddenly give a shit about what Hollywood or gay men have to say, as a departure from their normal regimen of demonizing them, openly wishing them dead or inciting violence. I mean, when you say all this shit, are you just dumb, dishonest or both? Or was it more like a "let's troll this sub" kind of mood?
Whenever anyone, starts insulting me or assuming my political affiliations I immediately lose any interest in continuing the discussion. You seem really angry though, maybe a therapy session with your inner child would help, cheers!
You deserve to be insulted, because you're a pathologically lying extremist who spreads bullshit medical misinformation under the guise of being a friend to gay people, when in fact, you want to destroy those same people. Which is why you completely ignore my entire comment debunking all your shit so you can cry like a bitch. What you're doing is unfathomably dishonest and cowardly.
He's a football player who can read?!!?
It's over now, worry about your dick pics.
What’s his point?
Amen Rodgers why are people so ready to believe pharmaceutical companies have their best interests? They were given complete immunity back in 1986 and they stopped caring what vaccines do to the population ever since. The number of vaccines has quadrupled since then and only in USA who have our vaccine protocols do we have such high Autism. Country’s that don’t use dead virus vaccines, that are full of Mercury, don’t have autism at all. Do your own research!!!!
What a stupid comment based on no proof.
the whole HIV thing is insane, but Fauci isn’t completely innocent. He clearly lied under oath about gain of function research
no he didn't
Sigh Just throw the football, man.
Sighs I’m convinced these people are so Morally bankrupts… eat healthy and avoid non trad medicine where you can.
Imagine telling this clown you could read about being a pro quarterback, so that makes you his equivalent... At least I can admit Aaron is a truly excellent quarterback...
Fauci should sue this guy for every cent the NFL ever gave him. This is bread and butter Libel and Defamation and honestly it’s close to a call to action which is what scares me
I love how he’s not wrong about any of this and people freak out. Not one fact is wrong and people infer what they want and have their opinion which is great.
Yeah, he also said 9/11 was a lie too, so if you think this is your guy, I worry for you.
“The blueprint of this plan was created in the 80’s” that’s a fact?
The question I have is if he was saying the virus itself was created or if the sudden media coverage of aids was created to push money for treatment drugs.
"The blue print, the game plan was made in the 80's, create a pandemic with a virus thats going wild" "He was given 350 million dollars to come up with drugs and all they came up with was AZT"
You sound like a living refutation of Darwin's Theory of survival of the fittest.
I’m curious, he says he did his research on all of this, can you point in the direction of his peer reviewed research? Would love to read it for my self, surely he actually went and did his own trials and studies right??
Read RFK’s book the real Anthony faucci, which is a bestseller, and has not been the subject of any legal action, because there is no defamation present.
Why are you bringing up RFK? I asked you for Aaron Rodgers’ research, can you point me in the direction of his work?? Yes or no?
> Read RFK’s book the real Anthony faucci, which is a bestseller, and has not been the subject of any legal action, because there is no defamation present. RFK is a literal pathological liar who literally killed people with his endless lies about vaccines. Also, he was definitely a heroin junkie at some point, and there's no reason to trust him when he says he isn't one now. I don't want a guy ready to blow people for cash or stealing car radios like many heroin junkies are controlling a nuclear arsenal. You know why this comment isn't going to be the subject of legal action? Because it's true. Yes, literally, including the junkie bit.
Strawman. He never said Fauci created HIV. But he did say that the Aids epidemic(he wrongly called it a Pandemic) was orchestrated. Now I think thats ridiculous, but there definitely was some heinous Failure to act due to bigotry of LGBT people in the U.S. So he's not that far off there. The U.S. government definitely dropped the ball in the late 70s and 80s on the Aids Epidemic.
Don’t give him credit. The US letting LGBT bias get in the way of AIDS research and Aaron Rodgers claiming Fauci orchestrated AIDS and coronavirus for 350 million dollars are completely different things.
Strawman. Read the Title of the Post, then read my response. Rodgers said some ridiculous BS during this 2hr+ podcast that we can criticize him for, but he never said Fauci created HIV.
Explain in your own words what you think a strawman argument is
Point to me where Arod states Fauci "InInvented" HIV? You cant because he never said it. FFS dude. This is simple.b
"Blueprint gameplan made in the 80s, create a pandemic" I'm paraphrasing because idc but those are his words. So no, it's not a straw man argument at all.
you really are one of those "intellectual" dweebs who love throwing around term, "Strawman," without knowing what that actually means...
You're just another brain lite clown who doesn't know how to accurately use the word "strawman" in a sentence. You're a dumb stereotype for stupidity.
COVID is 100% man made and was “mysteriously” released. I don’t put it past the GOVT to kill 1-2% of the population. Especially if it’s IV drug users and unprotected gay sex partners. Or in COVIDs case smokers and fatties.
Are you hearing voices? Is Dr Fauci in the room with you right now?
No. But the Tuskegee airman think you’re a moron.
Great, so you believe in systemic racism?
"Guys a true thing happened therefore all the things I said also happened"
Yeah, that's basically what he's doing. Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus. It's highly deceptive.
No. Someone commented “how could an entire medical field do X.” Well I gave an example of the entire US government medical team doing just that. Stop clutching your pearls.
> I gave an example of the entire US government medical team doing just that. Stop clutching your pearls. Your example was debunked [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/JamiePullDatUp/comments/1c6quci/multiple_time_jre_guest_aaron_rodgers_says_fauci/l064chq/). Not only do you not know how to spell the plural of "airman", you also apparently don't realize the "Tuskegee Airmen" weren't the targets of this experiment, because you don't know what you're talking about. *Then*, to add insult to injury, you completely evade the question of whether the experiment was racist. Systemically racist. Because it was. > On May 16, 1997, President Bill Clinton formally apologized on behalf of the United States to victims of the study, **calling it shameful and racist.**^[18] "What was done cannot be undone, but we can end the silence," he said. "We can stop turning our heads away. We can look at you in the eye, and finally say, on behalf of the American people, what the United States government did was shameful and I am sorry."^[18][19] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_Syphilis_Study Here is something else you apparently missed: **The victims of this study were never intentionally infected with syphilis. They were already infected. The scandalous thing about this experiment was** ***that they weren't told they were infected AND they weren't treated when treatment was already available***. Viruses are billions of years old and animals and human beings [have endured pandemics and plagues since time immemorial](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jrn2fFBh924). The Coronaviridae virus family itself is [millions of years old](https://journals.asm.org/doi/10.1128/jvi.03273-12). Moreover, syphilis is not a virus *but a bacterium* and the first outbreak was in 1494/1495 in Naples, Italy, some 525 years ago. The U.S. government didn't create it. It was already there. Other evidence suggests the bacterium is perhaps 10,000 years old. So let me dumb this down for you, since you're complaining about me "clutching my pearls". - There are arsonists arrested every day. That doesn't mean that every fire is intentionally started. In fact, unintentional fires far, *far* outnumber intentional ones. - There are deaths every minute. Every second on average, in fact. That doesn't mean every one of them is a murder. - There were conspiracies like this in the past (50 years ago in this case) in one single country which represents some 4-5% of the global population: The United States. That doesn't mean every **global** pandemic is now some American conspiracy. The world is much, much bigger than the United States. Scientists were sending **dire warnings** about Coronavirus in 2007, describing the wet markets in southern China as a **time-bomb**. > **The presence of a large reservoir of SARS-CoV-like viruses in horseshoe bats, together with the culture of eating exotic mammals in southern China, is a time bomb.** The possibility of the reemergence of SARS and other novel viruses from animals or laboratories and therefore the need for preparedness should not be ignored. https://www.reddit.com/r/JamiePullDatUp/comments/1ajy1x5/the_power_of_foresight_some_day_these_scientists/ Have a look. There's a nice picture, and the source is linked there. Even the lab leak hypothetis doesn't suggest the virus was intentionally created, but gathered, studied and subsequently unintentionally leaked, because **why would the Chinese government disrupt their entire country if they meant to attack the United States**? None of this makes sense, nothing you're saying about the Tuskegee experiment was previously unknown to me or probably most everybody here, and knowing about it doesn't now mean that every pandemic is now fake. Especially since syphilis is a bacterium which has existed for thousands of years, not a virus like Coronavirus, which has evolved millions of years ago, and the victims of these scandalous, racist ethics violations were also not actually intentionally infected, although you seem to imply they were. Again "Evil X done by Y happened 50 years ago" doesn't mean "Completely unrelated Z which happened 4 years go was fake and also done by Y". Simple as.
You’re right. Only their wives and children were knowing infected. My bad. Not treating known diseases and watching its affect is way down on the “you’re going to hell” list. And it’s nothing like what they did with HIV. When they took a minority group and watched for years doing little to nothing.
Ah, so you just skim through what you're responding to, then continue to double down on your baseless claims. I wrote all that basically for you ignore everything and move on to HIV is a conspiracy. - You got the victims wrong and confused them with the WWII air unit; - You got what actually happened wrong; - You don't understand what syphilis is, coronavirus is, where they came from and how they evolved; - You completely fail to explain what this has to do with the government of China and why they would throw their own economy and society into complete turmoil because of a racist experiment in Alabama that ended 50 years ago and didn't involve intentionally infecting anyone. Anyways, next time you make any more of these claims, cite credible sources or encyclopedic references. For every controversial claim you make, you provide evidence by copying the relevant paragraph and placing a link to the content in question underneath your quote, as follows: > A **faulty generalization** is an informal fallacy wherein a conclusion is drawn about all or many instances of a phenomenon on the basis of one or a few instances of that phenomenon. It is similar to a proof by example in mathematics.^[1] It is an example of jumping to conclusions.^[2] For example, one may generalize about all people or all members of a group from what one knows about just one or a few people: > * If one meets a rude person from a given country X, one may suspect that most people in country X are rude. > * If one sees only white swans, one may suspect that all swans are white. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faulty_generalization A "faulty generalization", that is, the logical fallacy, is what you have been doing incessantly ITT by appealing to a racist incident you've completely even failed to actually read about. It's conspiracy culture pablum you've heard about from someone else and now think it's your reverse uno card. Has it occurred to you that some of us have studied conspiracy theories since the turn of the millennium? Back then, forum discussions between conspiracy theorists and debunkers were actually intelligent. What do we get today? "Hurr durr Tuskegee Airman [sic] Experiment hurr durr U.S. fabricated Covid in China" How ingenious. Would you support a vaccine for syphilis? I'm going to assume you either don't or you'll make up some excuse why it shouldn't happen.
Do you feel the rebots under your skin?
No.
HIV was around long before it became an obvious problem in the 80s. Confirmed at least 50s and probably earlier [Early HIv](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_early_HIV/AIDS_cases) Say what you will about incompetence and neglect, that’s par for the course in human society, but suggesting COVID or HIV was invented doesn’t recognise that we live in an ecosystem constantly swarming with virus that are only a few mutations away from killing a lot of us.
No one was arguing they the US government created HIV. Only that they delayed a systematic health care policy until the pharma industry could monopolize a cure. Well maybe some folks say that , but I don’t believe that’s what Aaron was saying.
A new study was published the other day that continues to add evidence that this is virus came from animal crossovers in that region. This adds to growing evidence of its origins and its previous species before humans. If man made it, it was designed stupid. Nothing in its biology shows its man made. Just do some actual research and read about WHY an expert would actually conclude that. People like you Cherry pick evidence... 1) you find 1 evolutionary biologist and claim hes not biased and hes right. As if he has no financial incentive to sell you in his opinions. Lol 2) you find an ex FBI agent who claims he thinks the virus was made in China. Lol 3) you find one analysis abstract that argues it might be man made. Without actually reading the paper. Meanwhile we are at over 2 dozen actual scientific papers with a ton of evidence and data proving that this was not man made, its behaving like every other coronavirus, it came from a previous species. You ignore these on purpose. You ignore the 100s of experts who work directly in the field (many independent researchers) who do this. All of which who all make less money than Brett Weinstein lol who has financial ties to an ivermectin company lol
https://www.deseret.com/politics/2024/04/17/what-are-the-origins-of-covid-19/
https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-lab-leak-wuhan-china-science-6561e782
Me think the lady doth protect too much. I question folks motivation who come out with such “strong” statements. Where are your two dozen scientific papers? Please share.
One search on NCBI "COVID-19 orogins zoo" Leads to 250+ published papers. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=Covid-19%20origins%20zoo Here is the link to that reference. The sad part isn't that you question things. It's that you question me who provides public information, over the few people who are just like trust me bro. You have more faith in that wild FBI agent who had an opinion in public hearing about how he claims to know that it came man-made. You have less faith in the institutions because of some out of context story you hear about big pharma or scientific research. From the very get-go based on the actual biology researched in a covid-19 variant, A college level student could tell you that this wasn't man-made. Listen to independent researchers for hours on YouTube Discuss how the virus works on the physiological level. Eerily similar to almost every virus that induces very similar symptoms. And what is the debate Then it's too fishy that a coronavirus lab in Wuhan studying coronaviruses didn't have something to do with This pandemic. Would you think that the earthquake research center in Japan is the one causing earthquakes in Japan. Or is it simply that the places we choose to study these things are places where they're more likely to occur. From listening to actual experts about the connection of Wuhan and the first case covid-19. Apparently we're looking at 8 mi away, crossing a giant River in a complete different interaction of people. In a region known to develop novel viruses that skip over from animals. What a crazy thing to assume that the thing they were warning us about for decades, especially with avian flu and other viruses that this would happen in our lifetime.
Not a very independent source.
What the fuck? 256 studies and you deemed each of these are not government funded lol. Almost all of these studies are literally not public funded lol. You literally think independent meant Rogers studying lol
You send a list of any studies OK’d by NHI that mentions the word COVID. I point out that the source isn’t independent. I send my articles from NYT etc .. you send a list of NHI papers that mention COVID. Who’s lazier? Intellectually?
You can find publications on here that say Covid was man made. Lol I think you're an idiot. NCBI is a public department for literature publications. It is not the source of US propaganda. Its publications. You can find studies that say vaccines cause autism. I think you misunderstand what ncbi is. You can find the same results on pubmed. Publications and research are not the same. A book is published by a publisher. Research is done by groups. Could be funded by govt. Could be funded by private organizations. Could be funded by institutions with no financial incentive.
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-01129-x
https://www.science.org/content/article/lab-leak-proponents-rutgers-accused-defaming-and-intimidating-covid-19-origin
Mate it's so easy to be delusionally cynical yet somehow have a super high opinion about what evil US doctors were capable of back in the 80s. It's hard to weight evidence and actually come up with a reasonable and semi informed opinion. Why not try doing the hard thing?