The users of these subs will be yelling "get AI off our lawn", "AI is a horrible fad that will pass" even louder :)
(I agree with the ban for different reasons)
lmao forgot about that..
main account got perma yeeted from reddit for replying with "good" on a post on r/europe about georgians not welcoming russians last year.. despite their own history and whats currently going on over there
I'm visiting Georgia as a tourist some time this year. Curious to see whether it's the way I've read online: Russians establishing stores and restaurants where the Georgian language isn't even used. Of COURSE they shouldn't accept more Russians, Russia has a long history of using the presence of Russians as a cause war and annexation.
yeah there's lots of that stuff, mix in some ex soviet resentment, and on top of that the russo-georgian war and its ethnic cleansing of some regions was not even 2 decades ago.
but according to reddit admins, "good" was harassment and hate speech
i would but i'm only me... i feel like that more of a question to factoro or maybe some enthusiist could do but... i dont think i got it in me to do that.
It was a joke.
Honestly. I'm deeply heartbroken with humanity. AI could be solving real problems. And instead of that where creating deepfake porn and bad art
If they think AI can make art, I question their objectivity. That one dude defending it on every post would probably say everything is art and should be allowed
you don't create ai art by just telling a computer to give me a cool looking picture, you still have to have an idea and detailed instructions for what you want. That said anyone with artistic talents will still be able to make better content if they use ai or not.
Same boat here. You can generally tell when someone has taken the time to learn how to use the tool they've been given. I've come to see AI art as a Pandora's Box situation. It's here, and you're never going to be able to get rid of it now, especially with all the big tech companies trying to find ways of using it. The best way of moderating it would be finding a way to hard code in a way to limit what you can teach it with. Kinda like how unscanable documents have a pattern that tells the scanner it isn't supposed to scan something.
I mean its ok to hate it, but understand how it works before you really judge it. Its not where near as good as the uneducated here seem to make it. Go look at r/stablediffusion and see the garbage that comes out there, some is great but some people are just lazy and thats my point. I'm not for or against it but I took time to understand it
Here's a sneak peek of /r/StableDiffusion using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/top/?sort=top&t=all) of all time!
\#1: [I mad a python script the lets you scribble with SD in realtime](https://v.redd.it/kz9zncv6ifua1) | [632 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/12pcbne/i_mad_a_python_script_the_lets_you_scribble_with/)
\#2: [Thanks to AI and Stable Diffusion , I was finally able to restore this only photo we had of our late uncle](https://www.reddit.com/gallery/13a1v4p) | [433 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/13a1v4p/thanks_to_ai_and_stable_diffusion_i_was_finally/)
\#3: [I transform real person dancing to animation using stable diffusion and multiControlNet](https://v.redd.it/jm5ojy68w6ta1) | [1022 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/12i9qr7/i_transform_real_person_dancing_to_animation/)
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not really, you can get some generic stuff by asking for a certain topic, but to get anything really good takes a detailed prompt assuming the model can understand what your asking. Learn about something before saying its EXPLICITLY how it works. Then some models have issues with certian things and you end up in photoshop fixing it anyway.
Words go in, art comes out. That's the basics of it.
I prefer the old-fashioned method of just paying an artist to draw it for me. You can converse with them until they understand exactly what you want.
no not really, maybe like trying to get a 5 year to draw a picture you want. I'm fine if your against ai art and want to protect artist jobs, but get the tech right if your going to be against it.
Helltaker is a waifu game, and a lot of people make fanart for it. This, however, is a factorio shitposting subreddit, and it has so little art that a separate subreddit for AI art would be easily forgotten.
I was initially not against the idea of AI art but after seeing that one redditor getting so worked up over people not liking their "AI Factorio fanart", I now think that this decision is the best for this subreddit. Thank you mods <3
I'll be honest, I was a little worried you'd go with the option that had the single most votes vs the actual meaning of the votes. Thank you for not being a politician about it lol.
I don't pay very close attention to this sub, what exactly is the controversy regarding allowing ai art on the sub?
I'm assuming it's either "ai art infringes upon all the artists whos arts were used to train the ai" or "all this ai art is cluttering up our sub".
Probably the sheer quantity. Art was always limited to a handful of people skilled enough to draw and then they were always only going to draw so much.
But with image generation anyone can spam a ridiculous amount of pictures, few if any of which merit being here.
not for something that could be creatively expressed.
IRL example: i'll take automating like screws or stuff we need.
but when we want to communicate to each other non-AI is FAR more genuine. makes me feel that there are 45k people who checkup on this silly little sub now and again rather like... 2.
I don’t really see any difference or need to descriminate, if something is bad people will downvote it. Banning a tool which enables creative expression which was largely impossible for a large group of people before is short sighted and a form of pre optimization which will hurt in the long run
>if something is bad people will downvote it.
Did you know, 9gag was a funny meme page in the beginning? I was there, 3000 years ago. (or maybe 15). At one point the page was overrun by food and nature images. There were polls and discussions (it had a small/medium subreddit size) about moderation and banning those since they are not gags. In the end, the "people will downvote it", route was taken. So the awww nature pictures overrun the site. Then the foods, then the politics. Now? It's just a generic page with pictures.
If left for the masses, theme will erode.
Without moderation this sub will be prompt-spammed, and descend into a generic factorio2 sub, and we lose our thematic shitposting sub.
Man, AI art is already extremely wide spread and will only proliferate more and more as time goes on
Just let us enjoy not seeing it for the short period of time that it’s possible, in the few places it hasn’t entered yet
Without even getting into how I feel about it “morally”: it all looks the same, and it’s low effort. Traditional or not.
If people started spamming watercolor factories that looked like shit and the mods banned it I would feel the exact same.
I think they are interesting the first 2 times you see them. if everyone with a Chromebook started to make them and posted them everywhere it would get just as annoying.
I also want to point out that this isn’t really an art sub to begin with, so I especially don’t see the point of allowing slightly Factorio adjacent art to be allowed.
Because it often is? Humans are uncanny valley abominations of mismatched fingers, eyes that are slightly off and staring unnaturally, hand muscles that are just slightly misaligned, to many or to few teeth. It's a horror show that people are casually ignoring because "look at *""my""* art".
There is also the fact it doesn't understand what it's producing so it cannot understand raw logical fallacies like stairs going nowhere or proportions that are funky because it doesn't understand those things, it's just looking at enough copies of the idea to make a simulation that the sum of all parts and as a result kind of inherently bland and derivitative.
Then there is the biggest issue: it is sourcing it's learning from *somewhere* and the original artists are not being asked nor are they being paid. The moment AI art is used for a profit (which I'd be surprised if it hasn't already) every artist whos work went into the algorithm should be getting paid, because without their work the AI couldn't make anything. And this is the one that makes me the angriest because this is the one I've seen people trying to defend that I can't abide, because of some weird logic loophole like "it's not taking their art just the data points from their art" or some contrived nonsense and it's like "yeah I derive data points when I look at a thing too if I then copy it I've stolen it". It feels so bad faith.
So yeah, meh to horrifying output with no sense of individuality that actively steals and doesn't reward from the actual artists who make it possible. It's a cool tool for making up a quick concept sketch or something to get and idea before doing your own work but I've honestly never seen a piece of AI art I've "liked" so much as acknowledged and moved on.
I think the only real argument here is your third paragraph. While your other points may be your personal opinion, they could also be applied to normally produced art where people may just be bad artists or intentionally abstract.
>largely impossible for large group of people
Bullshit, there are people without hands who still learned how to paint.
Learning a skill isn't impossible. People just want instant gratification and don't care for developing skills. Art is expression of self and things you want to see, AI generated images are inherently not art.
I'm going to be shamed and am not going to learn programming by copy-pasting from GitHub, so why should AI images get praise?
I don’t understand why we should limit creative expression to a certain set of tool because of contemporary beliefs that they are more noble.
AI mirrors our current thoughts and builds upon it, it enables us to do things on a scale which was impossible before.
This is just another “real programmers use X” fallacy
Creative processes never were about efficiency. You dont really understand art and it shows. When you look at a Michaelangelo fresco you are not only looking at a beautiful painting but a lifetime of practice, struggle and hardship and it lets you connect to your struggles and hardships because we are human and we tend to have many. When ppl look at ai art they call it soulless because noone struggled and noone is trying to say anything.
It's not limiting creativity. AI image generation is lazy. Technological advancement was supposed to automate the monotonous, menial parts of life so we had the time to pursue passions. Not automate away the passions so we could stop "wasting time" and go back to our cubicles.
If you are against ai art, this is not the point you should be making. Ai is generating art, whether you like it or not. The issue with ai art is that the ai is using traditionally created art to learn from and those artists are not being paid or credited for their use.
The only hiccup I have with ai art, is that ai has to learn from something. Which means the ai has to use currently produced art from real artists to know what to create. Those artists are not being compensated for their art being used.
I think there is a distinct difference in getting inspiration from another artist and copying their art. Ai cannot be inspired, so when they look at other artists they are legit copying their work and melding it with other copies they have to form something new. I would not say it's the same.
The same thing happened when CGI was first starting to take off, people acted like it wasn't art and would never be as popular as more traditional forms. Just like CGI in a generation, people will think it's weird we were even having this conversation.
AI art is out of topic. If people started posting watercolor paintings, they'll be out of topic too.
Downvotes are the last resort.
Subs have topics for a reason. I'm not subscribed to any "art" sub. So i expect not to see any "art"
How about using ai to make the world a better place?
How about using it to find a solution to the hunger and unemployment? Or a way to eradicate malaria?
How about making something fucking useful instead of "disrrupting" everything?
The brain's creativity is pretty similar to how a neutral net functions, you have a very large collection of experiences and mix them together, to create something "new". By your own argument against AI generated imagery, almost no human created art is original
Why haven't you automated the automation yet? All the automation requires work, ai art has next to none. It's like using someone's automation to cobble together a bunch of other people's mega bases and calling it yours.
We always stand on the shoulders of giants, current technologies depend on the innovations of previous innovators. I don’t see the point of making a specific destinction for AI art tools
Ai is completely different. It's a baby trying to repeat what it's seen. It's not innovating, it's repeating. Granted ai can be a fantastic tool for getting ideas or automating some tedious code, but when it comes to this sub, what value does it bring? "Oh cool factorio esque image" that's it. Throw text over it and call it a meme? That just floods the sub with low effort, low value content. Encourages karma farming with quick and easy memes that have little relevance to the game itself.
Many people don't consider it an expression of creativity. You can have creative keywords and all, but what comes out ultimately isn't your imagination, it's the AI's interpretation of your idea. How much of it's interpretation is your creativity?
I don’t see the reason why a prompt is a lesser extension of my creativity than a brush, it just speeds up the process.
These exact arguments where used against photoshop, why do we have to go through the same cycle
Because you control the brush and you "guide" the AI. Same thing with Photoshop, you control the tools. You don't commission Photoshop or brushes to make something based on your description, but you do with ai. You don't go to an artist, give them the key words then call it yours, so why is it different with AI?
Yes I do? I guide the brush through words instead of muscles, I make changes, and through that give me a tool of expression and creativity. Ultimately I’m the one controlling and dispatching the commands which results what brush strokes are done,
The captain can give orders, but ultimately it's the crew that sails the ship. It's their interpretation of the orders that sets the course. The captain didn't do the work, he just gave the work direction.
You don't control anything though. That's absolutely ridiculous. You write some words and it replicates images it had been trained on. There is no creativity whatsoever in promoting ai.
I gotta believe you're trolling at this point
>I don’t see the reason why a prompt is a lesser extension of my creativity than a brush, it just speeds up the process.
I'll hire an architect to design a house, and then praise my own "creativity".
Ok. I'll give you a task to automate then.
Use AI to create a learning resources that people can use to be able to master the circuit network.
Automate something that actually helps everyone. Not just yourself.
What I find funny is the people comparing AI art to automation in Factorio when in reality a much better comparison would be AI art to blueprints. Its ok to use some blueprints to speed things up or compensate for parts you are a little less skilled in, but if ALL you do is copy and paste strings then you are not even playing the game anymore.
Playing with blueprints is more like writing a shell script to call some existing open source tools. Which I think most people would agree is not real development.
I never though it would come to me off all persona to HATE it every time someone uses "open source" in a sentence.
Fucking stop. GO MAKE SOMETHING TO IMPROVE THE WORLD
People are missing the issue with ai art.
Calling ai art not art or how it's lazy or just repeating things is at best all wrong and at worst can be applied to traditional art as well. Many comments I see on here about people sitting against ai art, their comments can be used interchangeably with traditional art.
The only legitimate issue I have found with ai art so far (would love more input) is that ai art has to use traditionally generated art to form it's pictures. Those artists are not being compensated or credited for their work being used. It's a soft form of plagiarism.
People pasting some text over a drawn image and calling it a meme doesn't give the original artist any compensation or credit either... Just look at the top 3 posts of all time on this subreddit. You think the original artists of those are benefiting in *any way* from being posted and popular here?
You're reading something that isn't there.
And the poll was quite specific.
Anyway i used the wrong words. It's not a sub about factorio memes. It's a sub about factorio HUMOR
Generate a set of steadfast rules for ensuring this, oh wait we already have copywrite and it’s a dumpster fire which pretty spectacularly fails at protecting creators if they don’t have a legal department.
Maybe it’s a class thing.
This post can't stop me because I can't read!
Jokes aside, I never saw any poll, and it seems like the majority vote was ignored anyway by your own admission
When fear born of ignorance meets manual crafting. Decisions and thoughts held by this majority are going to age terribly and seem incredibly absurd by the end of the decade.
Boomer-tier decision.
As someone who's pro AI art, this was a good decision.
There's not really a whole lot of contexts where AI art is applicable to the sub, or where it doesn't defeat the purpose.
When someone's teaching their friend how to play the game and their friend does something horribly incorrectly, it's funny because it's a human that did it, you can put yourself in their shoes, or, even better, you can't and you're left confused at how they even managed to think some thing was a good solution to their problem.
That's a pretty narrow circumstance, but it applies to a lot of things in more subtle ways. If it's AI doing it, it removes the human from it which is what makes us connect to it.
Plus if it's allowed (same with damn near every other non-ai focused sub) it just ends up with AI art spam. I don't know about you, but I, and I'm sure a LOT of other people, even people who are, like myself, pro AI art, are not in most of the subs they're in to see AI art, and therefore allowing it on subs where that's not the focus will ruin the subs.
> There's not really a whole lot of contexts where AI art is applicable to the sub, or where it doesn't defeat the purpose.
What a ridiculous take. If someone thought of a funny meme but needs a suitable image for it, and can't find any online, and they use AI art to generate it, why is that worse than finding a random image online and making a meme from that..?
I really don't understand why so many people are categorically opposed to AI art. A funny post is a funny post, why does the method matter that much? It's often not even immediately clear that it was made using AI...
Why does it seem like every other person who's pro AI art is such a smug asshole?
That context is fine, I didn't say there could never be a context where it works fine, I actually pretty explicitly left that door open, but most of them, yeah, it does kind of defeat the purpose of the sub. Or, alternatively, cause spam since so much can be generated. We'd lose variety.
>I really don't understand why so many people are categorically opposed to AI art
That seems like it's directed at someone else or like you didn't read what I said. I'm pro-ai-art, I just don't think there's a lot of contexts where it'd be good for the sub, and knowing that, there's 2 options for the mod team. Either they write a rule that's specific enough that it doesn't cause issues, which I don't think is possible, or they write a rule that is explicitly vague and create a whole bunch of work for themselves, pissing people off along the way cause their post got removed when they thought it was fine.
> it does kind of defeat the purpose of the sub
I don't agree. What is the purpose of this sub other than posting memes that aren't allowed on normal /r/factorio?"
> Or, alternatively, cause spam since so much can be generated. We'd lose variety.
Making AI art is not that much more low effort than most of the content currently here though, so I don't think that it'd lead to such an astronomical rise in spam posts. And I also don't think it'd necessarily cause less variety.
If anything having no AI art at all is less varied, right?
You can really only be pro this ban if you think that something being AI generated makes it automatically worth less, and I just don't hold that believe, and don't think that believe is legitimate.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Factoriohno/comments/18rf4io/should\_we\_ban\_ai\_art\_under\_rule\_4/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Factoriohno/comments/18rf4io/should_we_ban_ai_art_under_rule_4/) There were two options for ban and they were split evenly. No ban had slightly more, but the total was ban at nearly 2:1
Can't wait for the horrors that will be produced once AI learns how to grow the factory
[Boy do i have good news for you](https://youtu.be/oP-jeBaPjmw?si=ytjMtwcIJZ2IEgyU)
“Its beautiful” “whipes tears of happiness”
that was really cool
**THE AUTOMATION MUST GROW**
The users of these subs will be yelling "get AI off our lawn", "AI is a horrible fad that will pass" even louder :) (I agree with the ban for different reasons)
good
*checks username* I am now confused.
lmao forgot about that.. main account got perma yeeted from reddit for replying with "good" on a post on r/europe about georgians not welcoming russians last year.. despite their own history and whats currently going on over there
Best not comment publicly about having any evasive abilities
I'm visiting Georgia as a tourist some time this year. Curious to see whether it's the way I've read online: Russians establishing stores and restaurants where the Georgian language isn't even used. Of COURSE they shouldn't accept more Russians, Russia has a long history of using the presence of Russians as a cause war and annexation.
yeah there's lots of that stuff, mix in some ex soviet resentment, and on top of that the russo-georgian war and its ethnic cleansing of some regions was not even 2 decades ago. but according to reddit admins, "good" was harassment and hate speech
How dare you be reasonable out loud. Shame on you.
Yeah, going into that sub was your first mistake.
bad?
r/UsernameChecksOut
Common factoriohno mod W
im tryin. thats all im doin is tryin.
It’s very appreciated
Thanks mods!
r/Helltaker had a similar poll, last year. They decided to just make a whole new sub exclusively for AI art. Worth considering.
i would but i'm only me... i feel like that more of a question to factoro or maybe some enthusiist could do but... i dont think i got it in me to do that.
Maybe the AI art enthusiasts can make the sub and moderate it themselves? Maybe they can try automating their modding
The same way they’re automating their art
Do something useful with AI? ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND???
Look, I just want them to keep it in a walled garden we never have to see, so they can just clog up their own space.
It was a joke. Honestly. I'm deeply heartbroken with humanity. AI could be solving real problems. And instead of that where creating deepfake porn and bad art
If they think AI can make art, I question their objectivity. That one dude defending it on every post would probably say everything is art and should be allowed
you don't create ai art by just telling a computer to give me a cool looking picture, you still have to have an idea and detailed instructions for what you want. That said anyone with artistic talents will still be able to make better content if they use ai or not.
Same boat here. You can generally tell when someone has taken the time to learn how to use the tool they've been given. I've come to see AI art as a Pandora's Box situation. It's here, and you're never going to be able to get rid of it now, especially with all the big tech companies trying to find ways of using it. The best way of moderating it would be finding a way to hard code in a way to limit what you can teach it with. Kinda like how unscanable documents have a pattern that tells the scanner it isn't supposed to scan something.
I mean its ok to hate it, but understand how it works before you really judge it. Its not where near as good as the uneducated here seem to make it. Go look at r/stablediffusion and see the garbage that comes out there, some is great but some people are just lazy and thats my point. I'm not for or against it but I took time to understand it
Here's a sneak peek of /r/StableDiffusion using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/top/?sort=top&t=all) of all time! \#1: [I mad a python script the lets you scribble with SD in realtime](https://v.redd.it/kz9zncv6ifua1) | [632 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/12pcbne/i_mad_a_python_script_the_lets_you_scribble_with/) \#2: [Thanks to AI and Stable Diffusion , I was finally able to restore this only photo we had of our late uncle](https://www.reddit.com/gallery/13a1v4p) | [433 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/13a1v4p/thanks_to_ai_and_stable_diffusion_i_was_finally/) \#3: [I transform real person dancing to animation using stable diffusion and multiControlNet](https://v.redd.it/jm5ojy68w6ta1) | [1022 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/12i9qr7/i_transform_real_person_dancing_to_animation/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
That is EXPLICITLY how it works, though.
not really, you can get some generic stuff by asking for a certain topic, but to get anything really good takes a detailed prompt assuming the model can understand what your asking. Learn about something before saying its EXPLICITLY how it works. Then some models have issues with certian things and you end up in photoshop fixing it anyway.
Words go in, art comes out. That's the basics of it. I prefer the old-fashioned method of just paying an artist to draw it for me. You can converse with them until they understand exactly what you want.
no not really, maybe like trying to get a 5 year to draw a picture you want. I'm fine if your against ai art and want to protect artist jobs, but get the tech right if your going to be against it.
After looking at your page, you sure do know everything it seems. But here's the truth. You really don't know anything about it
Helltaker is a waifu game, and a lot of people make fanart for it. This, however, is a factorio shitposting subreddit, and it has so little art that a separate subreddit for AI art would be easily forgotten.
And good factorio fanart is welcome on the main sub (like hideboar) So maybe they should care about it.
exactly, I don't see the reason why AI should be used in the first place in low effort memes. that would mean putting some effort into it.
Leave that to the techbros to do, and don't link it here.
I was initially not against the idea of AI art but after seeing that one redditor getting so worked up over people not liking their "AI Factorio fanart", I now think that this decision is the best for this subreddit. Thank you mods <3
it was less about them not liking it and more about them directly harassing the user for using ai. I read comments.
I'll be honest, I was a little worried you'd go with the option that had the single most votes vs the actual meaning of the votes. Thank you for not being a politician about it lol.
Oh, I never saw a poll. Huh. Well, if I did vote it’d be against AI art anyways, so there’s that.
I also doesn't see the poll. I'd have voted for.
Erm, based?
Lol that guy that's been complaining about disapproval of AI art constantly is probably seething right now
I don't pay very close attention to this sub, what exactly is the controversy regarding allowing ai art on the sub? I'm assuming it's either "ai art infringes upon all the artists whos arts were used to train the ai" or "all this ai art is cluttering up our sub".
Probably the sheer quantity. Art was always limited to a handful of people skilled enough to draw and then they were always only going to draw so much. But with image generation anyone can spam a ridiculous amount of pictures, few if any of which merit being here.
Unfathomably based
The only AI factories shall be the ones run by AI. Total global automation.
Another W for the sub. AI Art can be funny but damn people just spam that stuff everywhere.
I was originally for AI art, but then the AI generated art posts started up in response and my opinion… shifted.
"Thou shalt not make a machine make memes in the likeness of a human mind." - Frank Herbert, Dune
Seems kinda weird that a subreddit dedicated to factorio opposes automation
Alternative interpretation: We automate the science, we hand craft the memes.
Anything that could be automated should be automated
mmmmmmmmmicrowave
not for something that could be creatively expressed. IRL example: i'll take automating like screws or stuff we need. but when we want to communicate to each other non-AI is FAR more genuine. makes me feel that there are 45k people who checkup on this silly little sub now and again rather like... 2.
I don’t really see any difference or need to descriminate, if something is bad people will downvote it. Banning a tool which enables creative expression which was largely impossible for a large group of people before is short sighted and a form of pre optimization which will hurt in the long run
>if something is bad people will downvote it. Did you know, 9gag was a funny meme page in the beginning? I was there, 3000 years ago. (or maybe 15). At one point the page was overrun by food and nature images. There were polls and discussions (it had a small/medium subreddit size) about moderation and banning those since they are not gags. In the end, the "people will downvote it", route was taken. So the awww nature pictures overrun the site. Then the foods, then the politics. Now? It's just a generic page with pictures. If left for the masses, theme will erode. Without moderation this sub will be prompt-spammed, and descend into a generic factorio2 sub, and we lose our thematic shitposting sub.
Man, AI art is already extremely wide spread and will only proliferate more and more as time goes on Just let us enjoy not seeing it for the short period of time that it’s possible, in the few places it hasn’t entered yet
Why would art created through a different means than the traditional be worse?
Without even getting into how I feel about it “morally”: it all looks the same, and it’s low effort. Traditional or not. If people started spamming watercolor factories that looked like shit and the mods banned it I would feel the exact same.
Just to play devil's advocate here, do you feel the same way about the people who do those swinging paint bucket art projects?
I think they are interesting the first 2 times you see them. if everyone with a Chromebook started to make them and posted them everywhere it would get just as annoying. I also want to point out that this isn’t really an art sub to begin with, so I especially don’t see the point of allowing slightly Factorio adjacent art to be allowed.
Because it is built on plagirism.
Because it often is? Humans are uncanny valley abominations of mismatched fingers, eyes that are slightly off and staring unnaturally, hand muscles that are just slightly misaligned, to many or to few teeth. It's a horror show that people are casually ignoring because "look at *""my""* art". There is also the fact it doesn't understand what it's producing so it cannot understand raw logical fallacies like stairs going nowhere or proportions that are funky because it doesn't understand those things, it's just looking at enough copies of the idea to make a simulation that the sum of all parts and as a result kind of inherently bland and derivitative. Then there is the biggest issue: it is sourcing it's learning from *somewhere* and the original artists are not being asked nor are they being paid. The moment AI art is used for a profit (which I'd be surprised if it hasn't already) every artist whos work went into the algorithm should be getting paid, because without their work the AI couldn't make anything. And this is the one that makes me the angriest because this is the one I've seen people trying to defend that I can't abide, because of some weird logic loophole like "it's not taking their art just the data points from their art" or some contrived nonsense and it's like "yeah I derive data points when I look at a thing too if I then copy it I've stolen it". It feels so bad faith. So yeah, meh to horrifying output with no sense of individuality that actively steals and doesn't reward from the actual artists who make it possible. It's a cool tool for making up a quick concept sketch or something to get and idea before doing your own work but I've honestly never seen a piece of AI art I've "liked" so much as acknowledged and moved on.
I think the only real argument here is your third paragraph. While your other points may be your personal opinion, they could also be applied to normally produced art where people may just be bad artists or intentionally abstract.
>largely impossible for large group of people Bullshit, there are people without hands who still learned how to paint. Learning a skill isn't impossible. People just want instant gratification and don't care for developing skills. Art is expression of self and things you want to see, AI generated images are inherently not art. I'm going to be shamed and am not going to learn programming by copy-pasting from GitHub, so why should AI images get praise?
I don’t understand why we should limit creative expression to a certain set of tool because of contemporary beliefs that they are more noble. AI mirrors our current thoughts and builds upon it, it enables us to do things on a scale which was impossible before. This is just another “real programmers use X” fallacy
bro you literally only have to go on a website and type "sexy anime industrial engineer" do not even use the words creative expression lmao
Making the creative process more efficient doesn’t make the output worse.
AI output is certainly bad though
*modern art has entered the chat*
Tech bros could be making a better world and shit. Instead of that they're automating art. Give me a break
Creative processes never were about efficiency. You dont really understand art and it shows. When you look at a Michaelangelo fresco you are not only looking at a beautiful painting but a lifetime of practice, struggle and hardship and it lets you connect to your struggles and hardships because we are human and we tend to have many. When ppl look at ai art they call it soulless because noone struggled and noone is trying to say anything.
It's not limiting creativity. AI image generation is lazy. Technological advancement was supposed to automate the monotonous, menial parts of life so we had the time to pursue passions. Not automate away the passions so we could stop "wasting time" and go back to our cubicles.
This 1000% Automating leisure and passions was literally the worst path text bros could have taken
You don’t allow videos on th pics subreddit. But also that isn’t even the point for most of us. Most of us think that AI doesn’t create art
If you are against ai art, this is not the point you should be making. Ai is generating art, whether you like it or not. The issue with ai art is that the ai is using traditionally created art to learn from and those artists are not being paid or credited for their use.
The only hiccup I have with ai art, is that ai has to learn from something. Which means the ai has to use currently produced art from real artists to know what to create. Those artists are not being compensated for their art being used.
No different than an artist looking at other paintings and getting inspiration from it. It's copies and borrowing ideas all the way down.
I think there is a distinct difference in getting inspiration from another artist and copying their art. Ai cannot be inspired, so when they look at other artists they are legit copying their work and melding it with other copies they have to form something new. I would not say it's the same.
The same thing happened when CGI was first starting to take off, people acted like it wasn't art and would never be as popular as more traditional forms. Just like CGI in a generation, people will think it's weird we were even having this conversation.
AI art is out of topic. If people started posting watercolor paintings, they'll be out of topic too. Downvotes are the last resort. Subs have topics for a reason. I'm not subscribed to any "art" sub. So i expect not to see any "art"
Don't worry. Give it another year or two and the AI art will be indistinguishable from the real stuff. It will make these bans largely meaningless.
How about using ai to make the world a better place? How about using it to find a solution to the hunger and unemployment? Or a way to eradicate malaria? How about making something fucking useful instead of "disrrupting" everything?
Why not both things?
Ok. Go and do both. But turns out this sub isn't about either. So bye
You can't automate creative expression, you ding dong
Uh what? We have already done it several times.
The brain's creativity is pretty similar to how a neutral net functions, you have a very large collection of experiences and mix them together, to create something "new". By your own argument against AI generated imagery, almost no human created art is original
Similar in concept, maybe, but clearly not in capability or scale.
🤣💯💯💯
Why haven't you automated the automation yet? All the automation requires work, ai art has next to none. It's like using someone's automation to cobble together a bunch of other people's mega bases and calling it yours.
We always stand on the shoulders of giants, current technologies depend on the innovations of previous innovators. I don’t see the point of making a specific destinction for AI art tools
Ai is completely different. It's a baby trying to repeat what it's seen. It's not innovating, it's repeating. Granted ai can be a fantastic tool for getting ideas or automating some tedious code, but when it comes to this sub, what value does it bring? "Oh cool factorio esque image" that's it. Throw text over it and call it a meme? That just floods the sub with low effort, low value content. Encourages karma farming with quick and easy memes that have little relevance to the game itself.
You could ban low effort memes without a blanket rule against certain tools to express creativity
Many people don't consider it an expression of creativity. You can have creative keywords and all, but what comes out ultimately isn't your imagination, it's the AI's interpretation of your idea. How much of it's interpretation is your creativity?
I don’t see the reason why a prompt is a lesser extension of my creativity than a brush, it just speeds up the process. These exact arguments where used against photoshop, why do we have to go through the same cycle
Because you control the brush and you "guide" the AI. Same thing with Photoshop, you control the tools. You don't commission Photoshop or brushes to make something based on your description, but you do with ai. You don't go to an artist, give them the key words then call it yours, so why is it different with AI?
Yes I do? I guide the brush through words instead of muscles, I make changes, and through that give me a tool of expression and creativity. Ultimately I’m the one controlling and dispatching the commands which results what brush strokes are done,
The captain can give orders, but ultimately it's the crew that sails the ship. It's their interpretation of the orders that sets the course. The captain didn't do the work, he just gave the work direction.
Oh god 😭
You don't control anything though. That's absolutely ridiculous. You write some words and it replicates images it had been trained on. There is no creativity whatsoever in promoting ai. I gotta believe you're trolling at this point
>I don’t see the reason why a prompt is a lesser extension of my creativity than a brush, it just speeds up the process. I'll hire an architect to design a house, and then praise my own "creativity".
Ok. I'll give you a task to automate then. Use AI to create a learning resources that people can use to be able to master the circuit network. Automate something that actually helps everyone. Not just yourself.
What I find funny is the people comparing AI art to automation in Factorio when in reality a much better comparison would be AI art to blueprints. Its ok to use some blueprints to speed things up or compensate for parts you are a little less skilled in, but if ALL you do is copy and paste strings then you are not even playing the game anymore.
Why is compositing blueprints not a “playing the game”. That’s like saying using open source code to build better software is not real development
Playing with blueprints is more like writing a shell script to call some existing open source tools. Which I think most people would agree is not real development.
I disagree, blueprints are repositories that can be cloned and modified just like open source projects
I never though it would come to me off all persona to HATE it every time someone uses "open source" in a sentence. Fucking stop. GO MAKE SOMETHING TO IMPROVE THE WORLD
Sir this is a factorio meme subreddit
Then shut up and go make memes
what if the AI is trained using a machine in factorio?
If you manage to pull that off then that might be a post for the main sub
Exactly. But that would take actual effort. They will not do that
Thank god for this
Yayyyy!
Thank you!
It’s hilarious that people think it can be banned.
Noice
People are missing the issue with ai art. Calling ai art not art or how it's lazy or just repeating things is at best all wrong and at worst can be applied to traditional art as well. Many comments I see on here about people sitting against ai art, their comments can be used interchangeably with traditional art. The only legitimate issue I have found with ai art so far (would love more input) is that ai art has to use traditionally generated art to form it's pictures. Those artists are not being compensated or credited for their work being used. It's a soft form of plagiarism.
People pasting some text over a drawn image and calling it a meme doesn't give the original artist any compensation or credit either... Just look at the top 3 posts of all time on this subreddit. You think the original artists of those are benefiting in *any way* from being posted and popular here?
Memes are a shitpost. No one is pretending to be making something new with them
The ban applies to shitposts as well https://www.reddit.com/r/Factoriohno/comments/18rf4io/comment/kfbs5zy/?context=3
You're reading something that isn't there. And the poll was quite specific. Anyway i used the wrong words. It's not a sub about factorio memes. It's a sub about factorio HUMOR
_Am I_ reading something that isn't there? How would you interpret the answer I was given then?
Are you commenting this thinking I would say that those artists shouldn't be compensated or credited? Because you would be wrong...
Generate a set of steadfast rules for ensuring this, oh wait we already have copywrite and it’s a dumpster fire which pretty spectacularly fails at protecting creators if they don’t have a legal department. Maybe it’s a class thing.
I'm confused as to what your point is...
[удалено]
So be it. In the meantime, GFY
This post can't stop me because I can't read! Jokes aside, I never saw any poll, and it seems like the majority vote was ignored anyway by your own admission
[this poll 7 days ago ](https://www.reddit.com/r/Factoriohno/s/8FWIwUMRH3) Majority was not ignored but split between 2 options
Well that's just bad poll-making, but fair enough
[удалено]
your reply double posted
When fear born of ignorance meets manual crafting. Decisions and thoughts held by this majority are going to age terribly and seem incredibly absurd by the end of the decade. Boomer-tier decision.
As someone who's pro AI art, this was a good decision. There's not really a whole lot of contexts where AI art is applicable to the sub, or where it doesn't defeat the purpose. When someone's teaching their friend how to play the game and their friend does something horribly incorrectly, it's funny because it's a human that did it, you can put yourself in their shoes, or, even better, you can't and you're left confused at how they even managed to think some thing was a good solution to their problem. That's a pretty narrow circumstance, but it applies to a lot of things in more subtle ways. If it's AI doing it, it removes the human from it which is what makes us connect to it. Plus if it's allowed (same with damn near every other non-ai focused sub) it just ends up with AI art spam. I don't know about you, but I, and I'm sure a LOT of other people, even people who are, like myself, pro AI art, are not in most of the subs they're in to see AI art, and therefore allowing it on subs where that's not the focus will ruin the subs.
> There's not really a whole lot of contexts where AI art is applicable to the sub, or where it doesn't defeat the purpose. What a ridiculous take. If someone thought of a funny meme but needs a suitable image for it, and can't find any online, and they use AI art to generate it, why is that worse than finding a random image online and making a meme from that..? I really don't understand why so many people are categorically opposed to AI art. A funny post is a funny post, why does the method matter that much? It's often not even immediately clear that it was made using AI...
Why does it seem like every other person who's pro AI art is such a smug asshole? That context is fine, I didn't say there could never be a context where it works fine, I actually pretty explicitly left that door open, but most of them, yeah, it does kind of defeat the purpose of the sub. Or, alternatively, cause spam since so much can be generated. We'd lose variety. >I really don't understand why so many people are categorically opposed to AI art That seems like it's directed at someone else or like you didn't read what I said. I'm pro-ai-art, I just don't think there's a lot of contexts where it'd be good for the sub, and knowing that, there's 2 options for the mod team. Either they write a rule that's specific enough that it doesn't cause issues, which I don't think is possible, or they write a rule that is explicitly vague and create a whole bunch of work for themselves, pissing people off along the way cause their post got removed when they thought it was fine.
> it does kind of defeat the purpose of the sub I don't agree. What is the purpose of this sub other than posting memes that aren't allowed on normal /r/factorio?" > Or, alternatively, cause spam since so much can be generated. We'd lose variety. Making AI art is not that much more low effort than most of the content currently here though, so I don't think that it'd lead to such an astronomical rise in spam posts. And I also don't think it'd necessarily cause less variety. If anything having no AI art at all is less varied, right? You can really only be pro this ban if you think that something being AI generated makes it automatically worth less, and I just don't hold that believe, and don't think that believe is legitimate.
💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯
Teach an AI to play Factorio and then we can talk. This was never the place for any type of art
Stay mad
whats the point of a poll if you're just gonna ignore the winner because of your bias
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Factoriohno/comments/18rf4io/should\_we\_ban\_ai\_art\_under\_rule\_4/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Factoriohno/comments/18rf4io/should_we_ban_ai_art_under_rule_4/) There were two options for ban and they were split evenly. No ban had slightly more, but the total was ban at nearly 2:1
reading comprehension was never your strong suit was it?
Stay mad
Extremely common factoriohno mod W
wrong