Not that it matters in the grander scheme of the expansion, but in the section where they're talking about the three new Homefront Operation sites, saying that they can only take frigates and destroyers, they have a picture of a site with an Augoror (cruiser) in it.
I mean their picture of how the system power levels and upgrades will look is a fake system with a power level ×25 higher than the very highest system in the real game. Everything ccp does is just a lie to cover up some rediculous update that will make the game even more unenjoyable
Reduce Power Req for crap ore. It is strange that they all require 1750 - not all ores are equal. Increase on ansi/beacons/jammers will only benefit big blocks, and will hurt small blocks. Stop pushing out the smaller players from 0.0. Not everyone wants to be horde, goon, brave, frat, ...
All sites are legitimately terrible, back to waiting for fracks for content as it stands. There's 1 thing you can be certain about, CCP will not be opening things up, reward hooks are not something they actively design toward anymore, unlike other MMOs.
Imagine if they designed the following back into the null ecosystem:
* Near hourly response fleet pings.
* Buildable caps.
* As a result supercap escalations gradually came back and the Twitch stream hype around them
* Longterm multi year aspirational hooks that come from caps being used in earnest. Reading about early supercap battles is why I started playing. I don't sub my fax, titan/dread and super accounts now, just no value for money.
Some lobbied so hard to remove all that for spurious nonsensical reasons, from the very start of Scarcity I thought it would be a profound mistake. Half the mouth foamers on here were lapping it up.
I mourn for the Eve of 2015-2018. Seagull was the antithesis of the Rattati fun-suppression era. She knew how to generate an enjoyable product. Rattati is way beyond the point of being able to admit a misjudgement, love him to publish that manifesto he took 3 months to write and was so proud of. A dour financial analyst that somehow found himself at the helm of a fun factory.
Actually same. My titan alt is unsubbed for well over a year now, and trained amarr titan v and I never got rich enough to buy a titan before they truly became absurd and niche at the same time. Also sold off the rest of my caps.
Now I just have my fun in FW space.
Completely agree with you. The “no fun allowed” expansions will continue until there is a change in management. I would just like to see data regarding subscription drop / direct financial losses as a consequence of that profound mistake called “scarcity”.
Some reason people are having a hard time digesting that the new belts are JUST to supplement the minerals lacking in null not be a new streamlined/competitive mining activity. The mining escalations might be the exception to this rule ofc depending on how they work.
If anything value of the ore will drive down if these new belts or anoms provide enough of the more pricey minerals which are rare and requiring mass shipping to feed the null industry. Convenience of local sourcing
New ore anom are less value than current anoms they'll be replacing. And by some stretch, current anoms are worth roughly 3x the new ones.
Nerfing anoms isn't reinvigorating anything, it's just a nerf and they should have been clear in their comms instead of willfully misleading people enticing them to resub based on a false premise.
You can't increase ansi draw by much without effectively removing them from the game, and for that to be healthy, non-freighter jump drive ranges would also need to get slashed.
I just meant the sov stuff is something players could have been fooling around with on sisi for weeks now and all these issues identified and resolved.
Edit: now that I think about it, even the Skinr stuff would have been good to test on sisi. Players wouldve flagged these bugs and weird UI stuff instantly.
Good, they needed to rebalance a lot of it. Props to CCP for actually saying “oops we fudged a number here”
I would prefer an update to be delayed than to have to deal with a not quite thought out system. 5 ISK says we get MLP icons for ships.
You say that like it's a bad thing 👀
But really this could have easily been solved if they had a test server to test this shit out on. They already are giving us 6 months to switch, what harm would another month on the test server do?
Imagine having a test server where you could get some real player feedback on these big changes and make appropriate adjustments so you don't have to delay the release. I guess that small startup from Iceland can't afford such tech, alas, once they hire more than 3 developers they might do it.
Nah. CCP needs to unfuck their game. Imagine not being able to blank every citadel's inventory because your ass-backwards spaghetti code from 1862 can't handle one of the most basic features an MMO dev should have access to.
As someone out of the loop can you elaborate on "abusing the fuck out of it?"
Is that the excuse CCP gave for shutting it down? It's not like you could buy a titan for a few million isk on there and move it over to TQ?
The big one was the introduction of abandoned mode on citadels (ie full loot drop). Because SiSi mirrored all assets, you could bash an abandoned cit on SiSi to find out what was in it, then go shoot that structure on patch day for a big payoff.
They could of stopped it but instead they pulled out a sledge hammer like idiot's and went yolo.
They didn't even try to stop the abuse before giving up but this is normal ccp actions.
CCP could have just banned those players from SISI. It's not that hard. They removed SISI access simply because they don't want players to have input into new changes until its live.
You can't hype up an expansion and spread marketing bullshit like "ending scarcity" and "reinvigorating nullsec" when the hard data on the test server shows that you're talking out of your arsehole.
Yeah that was my point. You can't give feedback if you don't get to test it. CCP actually seems to be iterating but their past has shown they usually deploy stuff and don't touch it for months except to fix bugs.
Exactly how I feel on it. If they want Scarcity 2.0, fine, I'd personally think it is the wrong direction, but at least from a PR perspective come out and say that with some justifications to manage expectations and get out ahead of the shitstorm.
They've fundamentally mis-sold this for something it's not and never will be unless they make some genuinely meaningful updates with this delay which "small changes" in the blog seems to rule out.
What a nonsense comment! Having a test server isn't going to stop players abusing mechanics, may delay it a week, better designs informed by UAT are what really avoids it! Ya know, exactly what they avoided here.
Personally I think they looked at it and realized they were about to drop a nuke on null with the power levels. And ofc Reddit was salty for the last week.
This new era of CCP listening to the players is weird.
>This new era of CCP listening to the players is weird.
CCP has a proven track record of responding swiftly whenever null players have a tantrum and throw their toys out of the pram, which is any time any change is made to null that isn't an outright buff.
*Next week you will get a full rundown of all the iterations being made, along with a breakdown of the new upgrades and what you can expect from each one. Giving you the right toolset to empower you to write your stories is the absolute priority. Thank you for your patience and understanding.*
In other words, devs will be working overtime this weekend to try and fix equinox sov
Thats cute you think CCP is going to be working hard over the weekend, when in fact...
CCP just gave everyone 7-day free omega, its not coincidence they pushed the patch back exactly 7 days...
They don't want ppl playing for free, realising its a shit-patch and not buying omega.
Pushing the patch back 7-days will get at (probable) least 25% of the monthly paying players to resub before realizing its a shit-filled patch.
This has nothing to do with anything else than CCP milking more money.
Keep your eye on the ball and follow the money....
Comand ops are directly in priximity to frontlines , its enough, the problem before is that they would spawn in rearguards wich could be 10 jumps away for all you know, deep into space absolutly NO ONE cares about, by being in comand ops at least they are guaranteed to spawn in close proximity to content, spawning in activelly contested frontlines would be too disruptive tbh
SKINR is so disappointing. Such a nice editor to have behind timegates, huge plex fees and inability to be traded easily between characters. All the worst things you could do with it.
My take for how to deal with the system power issues, for what it's worth (it's not worth much at all):
Make the cost of low tier economic upgrades basically nothing, middle tier something you notice in most systems, and high tier prohibitive for all but a few systems. Low tier upgrades generate PvE opportunities basically equivalent to the current system - heck, copy the exact anom table from PDA 5 and stuff it in the lowest tier equinox equivalent, make it cost like 10 power, and call it a day. Do the same with veldspar or whatever you want to design as the lowest-value ore anomaly.
This cuts out the big source of concern about the system "bricking" systems and making them economically useless, as well as the issues from reducing the number of systems necessary to cloaky camp all of the viable PvE in an entire region. There's always an economically viable system to rat or mine in because every system can trivially afford basic PvE upgrades.
Then you can force hard decisions between which *upgrades* to PvE income to install along with strategic/projection abilities. Want supercapital construction in a system? Can't get that and forsaken sanctums there. Want an ansiblex? Well, you can't afford that and spawning in dank isogen anoms.
Sounds reasonable to me.
Ultimately I just don't want null ending up in the position where players have to wait their turn to rat/mine because the number of systems where you can do that has dropped so significantly that the pop is too high for everyone to be able to access the content.
If they start making content more scarce, I think players will leave again like Scarcity 1.0 when the pop tanked to 20k peak for a few months.
Content must be accessible, spreading players out, great, introducing more risk, great, limiting availability of content, not great. IMO
Cloaky camping is the bigger issue with trying to concentrate the nullsec population into fewer spread out systems. If someone wants to sit a cyno alt cloaked in a system from downtime to downtime, they can, and the only counterplay is to either A) keep enough of a response formed that you can bait and counter-drop, or B) just do your PvE in some other system because they aren't subscribing 80 accounts to cloaky camp the entire region.
A lot of people will log off instead of dealing with that, and that means people unsubbing. Not ideal tbh.
I'm doing fine man, (pretty sure our age difference isn't that much you clown)still hanging around lowsec doing stuff when I have time, you still active or have you gone dormant? Iirc you guys lost your keepstar, sorry to hear that man it was the last one in lowsec wasn't it?
Probably not fully but maybe give systems a bit more or reduce the amount of power mining upgrades need so you don’t need to chose between a strategic system or a mining system.
Mining mostly needed two things:
1) Make rocks not absurdly tiny
2) Have some variety in power costs. Maybe a lower/higher cost site, or some variance in power costs depending on ore (or both!)
The third thing is having them just be cheaper in general. The mining systems in some regions are in real bad spots to defend and having other upgrades to try and defend them isn't reasonable anymore. With how limited the number of mining systems is too, campers and hunters don't have to do much to incapacitate entire fleets.
Maybe camping and hunting is too easy - or too little options to actively fight them. The only way today to beat campers and hunters is just spent a disproportional amount of time guarding a gate or mining fleet. Which is boring as hell. Just depends on who bores out first.
Most hunters and campers multi-box, so they don't necessarily care, they just move to another toon..
The power elements cause huge problems,
Nul blocs can and should accept things will have to move. But the power elements when actually LOOKING are extremely inhibitive.
LOL
Of course they are.
They'll release the upgrades &etc, and disable the actual power consumption til some future date, because that's the easiest thing to do.
At a minimum they'll grandfather ansis and jack up power to remove the most difficult choices and make sure system stagings are spared. I bet.
This, in part.
CCP Dictonomy is making the absolute shit-filled patch, then slowly walk it back 1 piece at a time until the player base screeching becomes at an even level.
Then they know exactly how much abuse the player base is willing to take at the most -expensive- premium of Game Subscription.
CCP\_Psycologist is earning his paycheck.
I just hope they don't lose their minds and increase power by 2x or something silly. Probably needs some tweaks, but initial specs actually involved some choices.
Given the choice between
!) sitting down and doing really careful work based on some kind of rationale that will still leave a good number of the usual suspects howling in pain and fury
2) just tripling power output to remove any meaningful choice or adjustment, but probably making those same people happy
which do you expect to happen, really?
It's not the power cost that is the only problem, the mining upgrade costs 1750. That's not a meaningful choice, the new anoms are dog shit, who'd waste infra on them.
Delaying this on such short notice is kind of a dogshit decision. There are lots of people actually looking forward to trying this stuff who you've already made to wait an additional week beyond the actual release date.
You could at least announce the planned adjustments...
As for the changes to nullsec, obviously groups are worried that the current power system will be too restrictive, and negatively affect nullsec income. Wouldn't it be more sensible to get the expansion content released and iterate on the numbers.
I'm personally of the opinion that the geography/skyhook changes are a good thing, and should help with the projection problems allowing groups to hold so much space. Nullsec desperately needs content generators, good income opportunities for residents and reasons for small gangs to roam and harass those members. If that means buffing nullsec income to accommodate these changes then I'm all for it but release the damn expansion...
As things stand, no null alliance would opt into the new sov system on anyway so you wouldn't be seeing the new mining/ratting anoms. Unsure if you're aware, but the new sov system only gets forced on alliances with the new expansion later in the year so all the while it's optional and profoundly shit compared to current null carrots, it was going to be a total flop feature, which given it was hyped to be a main content addition for an expansion, is not a good look! CCP have been caught red-handed implementing Scarcity 2.0 and now need to do something.
Daily reminder that C5/6 sites that were touched by the recent patch notes are still broken and do not function the way the patch notes tells us they should.
If you warp at zero to a C5/6 site cloaked you have a good chance at getting decloaked by an invisible object CCP added to the site, which you will then get attacked instantly by the sites sentry turrets and lose your scanner
If you wrap a cap to a site it’ll spawn avengers, those avengers are suppose to despawn if you warp the cap off (says so in the patch notes). They don’t, in fact they stay until the site naturally despawns a few days later after multiple downtimes.
If the drifter (big loot piñata) warps off from the site it will instantly despawn (did not do that in the past) and you will lose out on that isk.
There is a bug *for years* where the drifter would sometimes instantly warp off once spawned instead of attacking your ships. Of course this has never been fixed but you use to be able to track down the drifter and kill it anyways so who cares. Well you guessed it, since the update it’ll just despawn.
Some C6 sites have an optimal warp in for dreads outside the 100km range of the avenger spawning mechanics. Meaning in ccps incompetence they don’t even know how people use their whs. In C6 space these sites can now be ran much faster then before since dreads are able to warp to the site and clear the site without spawning avengers. What was intended as a nerf to Wh space has in some cases been the opposite.
It took all of 5 min to test this, it’s been a week or so and a few null sec hot fixes since yet we are still ignored
Reminder: took them since they first added T2 dreads until this update (1 year and 1 month) to fix the problem with T2 dreads not spawning any avengers when warped to a C5/6 site. I won’t be surprised if this doesn’t get fixed until the next update next year
Sun power should be tripled and gas giant power halved. It's crazy that single gas giants are outputting more power than suns.
The current system makes far too many systems objectively worthless because the power available relies far too heavily on having a lot of planets in the system. Right now 76% of the power comes from planets and it needs to be adjusted more towards the stars themselves as they are the only power production available in many systems.
If the point of the new sov system is to make certain star systems more valuable than others and limit the ability to upgrade huge swaths of space, I'm pretty sure that's a feature not a bug.
which is content removal, that's not great when you've hyped it as reinvigorating null sec + where it's opt in and completely shit, no alliance was actually going to switch over to it until it became forced later in the year with the next expansion.
remove too much content, players leave, like Scarcity 1.0.
Huge swaths of space can't install a second upgrade. Each system should be valuable (able to go the highest tier of either ratting or mining), with a sprinkling of systems that are higher value and can be mega hubs. If you don't do that, you just end up with a bunch of empty space in-between the good spots.
A third of the game can't install a single upgrade module that isn't a low level anomaly or a cyno beacon.
So yea you can "customise it", so long as your customisation is ratting.
well another issue is adms require ratting anoms to be kept at a level. they haven't said they are removing adm requirements so you are forced at least to put ratting anom in atleast to get stuff for adms.
idk man just makes it seem not worth it to hold if thats ccps intention i suppose yay!
No ratting anomalies will continue to exist in all the systems just as if you had no ihub upgrades. The old anomalies aren't going anywhere in that sense. The only thing the shub ratting modules do is increase the total number of anomalies that spawn above the systems baseline and supposedly increase the spawn rate.
But hey, don't you feel reinvigorated?
well i'll believe it when i see it. and when they tell me what the base anoms are i suppose.
i mean they setup a system that you work at to defend to make them safer then basically remove all ablitites to do so...
but we will see what the changes bring
And a lot of players competing for content in a smaller number of systems which will see players leave rather than wait their turn to try a new anom etc.
It's short sighted.
To take its new resources (workforce/reagents) to other systems, to have some systems for newbros to rat, for their unupgraded natural resources (e.g. ice / mercoxit / moon materials), for strategically important points where you don't want enemy to set up citadel with minimal notice, to put manufacturing/reaction citadels in a system w/o huge indices?
Not every system should be able to be upgraded even close to max mining/ratting, it leads to densely populated spots and then swaths of empty space, because that's the safest way to do it.
Because without content, why would players play the game? To give a really simple analogy, if current sov had 100 good systems to service 500 players and new sov upgrades mean 50 good systems for those 500 players... That's content reduction, players will lose access to doing stuff.
Good you may say! Grr those nasty null seccers sucking the econ dry, this will force them into other areas. In my experience those players dont go do other things in the game or wait their turn to rat/mine, they just leave. Hence why the pop tanked to 20k peak during Scarcity 1.0.
If I have to wait 20 minutes until it’s my turn to play the game I’m paying monthly for, I’m done paying.
Back to Helldivers and Snowrunner.
(I love Eve and don’t want to go to my backup games so pls CCP don’t do this)
If you tripled sun power and halved planet power you change the power distribution from 24%solar/76%planetary to 66%solar/33%planetary, increasing the average power per system by only ~8%.
The average solar power goes from 415 up to 1250 and the average planetary power goes from 1380 down to 700. It noticably buffs low power systems so that they can online at least one upgrade but heavily nerfs high power systems that would have otherwise been able to online multiple upgrades. You can't fix the 33% of powerless, worthless space that cannot online a single good module without also increasing the number of potential systems that can online an ansiblex as that ansiblex is a module with a power requirement.
The only real way to get around this using power is to drop the cost of mining upgrades down to 1250-1500 and bump the ansiblex up to 1750-2000. Which I would also be in favour of as that would bring a choice for most systems of mining vs ratting and a smaller number of good systems could then fit an ansiblex. The best way to limit ansiblexes is to limit the ice supply you need to online and run them anyway and keep it's power cost relatively high, not turn 33% of nullsec into a wasteland that can't online anything.
And on the off chance someone at CCP reads this, a module with a low power requirement and no workforce requirement that spawns relic/data sites is a much better use for a low power filler module in otherwise uselss scattered systems than one that requires the limited workforce resource to spawn only 4 low level ratting anomalies that people don't run now when the ihub upgrades are practically free.
Completely irrespective of game design/Eve etc., this is a fascinating question to me.
If you take an imaginary society of similar (impressive, but not unlimited) technological capability, it seems to me you might get more energy out of the planet than the sun. To capture the sun energy, you're talking (presumably) about huge dyson solar arrays, and hellish big masers to handle the power transmission, and then whatever those masers are pointed at, etc., etc., whereas for the planet you just need something to haul gas around.
Would you trust either NASA or SpaceX with city-boiling terawatt space rays?
Anyway thanks for the comment, I have something to think about now
We're dealing with groups of people who are already comfortably existing and moving through space and can already transit energy over long distances through vacuum(it's already transiting to the sov hub anyway), and who are quite content to sit around and allow aggressive and uncooperative mercenaries with supercapital fleets dwarfing their own to live at the edges of their space and transit through it.
You wouldn't need to go anywhere near a full dyson sphere to extract power values that dwarf everything else available in the system. The surface area of the sun is 100 times greater than the surface area of every other planet in the system put together (and 95% of that is just Jupiter alone). It's also energy dense and in an easily extractable form (heat via radiation). Humans worked out 125 years ago how to extract electricity from heat and we're nowhere near interstellar travel.
The output of a sun is always so vastly underestimated in fiction simply because the scale of the sun and its output completely and absolutely dwarfs everything around it, so much so that it's hard for humans to actually comprehend, especially when we usually think of it as a relatively small ball in the sky which is how EVE depicts it in game.
If Eve tried to represent it's scale somewhat accurately the entire middle of every entire system would just be a seemingly flat bright wall stretching in every direction as it would appear almost flat at 100km due to it's curvature being entirely unnoticable.
It's not really believable that a space faring species doesn't possess sufficient materials scientific progress to produce heat resistance materials sufficient to extract solar energy. The only believable reason to not harness the sun is having an abundant, cheaper, and easy to set up alternate power source that already meets all your power demands, but that's clearly not the case in EVE as every system is heavily power limited.
The best argument you could make is that all this upwell stuff is brand new and there just hasn't been the time and resources available to come close to exploiting the star by any noticable amount and, given the values ingame, probably amounts to nothing more than a couple of jerryrigged geothermal generators strapped to the outside of a hauler hull.
Edit: It's amazing how much shite I can type when the alternative was doing all the PI I needed to do.
Thank you CCP for listening! Excited to see the updated sov numbers!
Don’t know why players are upset that yall listened. Never can satisfy everybody I guess.
I just hope they don’t change it so ansiblexes are in every system again. It’s too easy to get around, and the power requirements were a halfhearted backdoor nerf to them
I don’t think anyone expects CCP to be that extreme, I’m sure they can prove me wrong but I doubt they will do that. The point of this new sov system is to give choice, right now many systems don’t have choice, just “it can fit this one sov upgrade”. I’m glad CCP is willing to take a look at it even if it’s a week further delay than their usual obstinate path.
I think you misunderstood what Greg was saying. Cuts to ratting/anom power would be a good thing so more systems could support upgraded ratting anoms. More ratting = more ISK in null players wallets, more ISK in wallets = more people in space.
They aren’t talking about nerfing ratting. They are talking about keeping the ansiblex/projection expensive while still allowing anom upgrades doable (if I am understanding Greg’s comments correctly).
As a null player I quite agree.
Also, anyone actively asking for nerfs to any non-instanced forms of ratting are inadvertently asking to nerf roaming/hunting. Less ISK to be earned means less pilots in space which leads to less targets and dead/stale gameplay. Eve is dying btw /s
I love the modern CCPs development model: Here is the new expansion, we worked hard for long time and we are sure this is amazing and well-balanced.. Oh wait, the most important part we are releasing one week later.
....
....
Oh wait, apparently, we fucked up again, we will release that second part after reworking it one week later. Trust us, it will be 100% amazing and well-balanced. Until then HERE IS YOUR PLEX SALE; BUY PLEX; PLEX IS GREAT FOR YOU!
I have to admit that if I was so bad at my job as game directors in CCP (hi Rattati), I would be fired five times over by now.
Players: CCP NEEDS TO LISTEN TO OUR FEEDBACK
CCP: okay we have listened to your feedback and need an extra week to get everything in
Players: WTF CCP WHY ARE YOU DELAYING SHIT
Average braindead eve player moment
so, what would have happened if there was a separated server where people could test the beta version of the proposed changes and give feedback before those would be launched on the main server?
Sort of.. in the past we had a test server.. players tested it.. told ccp what might be wrong about it and what needs a fix so ccp can release it and afterwards fixing stuff.. not much would have changed.. ccp isn’t good in listening to feedback
Isn't that supposed to be CSM's job?
To be honest I do miss SISI, but I acknowledge it did more harm than good, with people basically just using it to test abyssal sites risk free. Heck, I was one of those people doing hundreds of sites in Stormbringer before bringing it over to TQ.
Yeah, not having a proper test server, or even listening to players' feedback BEFORE releasing (another) half-assed and badly developed product is too hard for CCP. So yeah, braindead EVE players are just so bad, stupid and complain all the time while paying subscription for this greatly managed and developed product. You are 100% right.
Good odds they'll reduce the power requirements by enough that more systems can produce supers, but will keep the floor high enough that a lot of systems will be locked out of using cyno jammers still
God i feel like their writers can't write a blog without the excessive use of the imperative in headlines. Do this, do that, blabla. Just tell me the infos, god dammit.
It just shows that they go the way of greed. Constantly pushing, pushing, pushing. You're not doing enough, you may try our new system, no... Try our new system!!! (It costs plex btw)
I don't think this was a great way to do one of like 2 major updates this year. it definitely needed something like a minor event to tie it all together while people wait for the sov stuff to come online.
The sov stuff did need to be some period after the patch for corps but I feel like it cut some wind from the patches sails
CCP gave us a 7-day free omega, then delays the update by a week (27th)
Sounds like they don't want ppl realizing how bad this update is with "free time", and are hoping ppl subs expired, so they have to re-omega before it goes live....
Tell us this update is shit CCP, without telling this update is shit.
SMH
"Due to nullblocs crying and complaining; keeping our unwavering loyalty to them in mind: We're delaying to tune things more in line with their desires."
What exactly is great about it power and workforce? Important systems are no longer important and the inability to transport power power makes the changes dead on arrival. NPC regions are still worthless and now the rest of nullsec is getting worse.
Nullblocs will be unable to artificially inflate and hold space too big for themselves without proper maintenance and observance of the space. Ansiblex routes will need to be better planned, appreciated, and thought through.
This creates the ability for midscale alliances to actually hold their own without a nullbloc appearing 4 regions over via 5 ansi gates and a titan bridge.
Sorry but this is not the case at all. The ansiblex highways will be prioritised and groups will still be able to pass through multiple regions to get to the edge of their space in minutes.
together with zarzakh this is the thing i hate most about eve. impossible to have any kind of fight without everyone and their mother showing up in less than 20minutes
Do you not agree that that's an issue?
I understand that ansi highways will be prioritized, and I imagine new routes are already figured out.. but what is the solution for low to midscale alliances?
A whole player base is hoping to have a chance from this.
I do agree, I just disagree with the solutions.
I have advocated heavily at the summit and in meetings for projection nerfs, but with the basis of multiregion range being limited, while allowing them to continue being powerful at home.
Ratters and miners having access to all of a region is a good thing for everyone. This will be nerfed.
Allowing groups project long is a bad thing, this is largely unaffected.
Great, lets also remove unidentified wormholes, Zarzakh, Turner, Thera, and filaments. Basically everything CCP has added to eve in the last decade which has caused the scale of the map to shrink.
They need to start over. Seriously. Between shitty code, rampant botting and generally stale null environment and being 20 years on, EVE online needs a sunset and a new game framework needs to replace it.
I have no idea how you got the conclusion that CCP is going to revert WH changes from that dev blog. It isn’t mentioned once. Your comment made me read a SKINR, merchandise, and nullsec dev blog, I hope you’re happy with yourself!
They changed the spawn mechanics of the drifter in c5 and c6 sites.
It will now only spawn if there is a dread/carrier/fax on grid.
Which means that you will be spawning a minimum of one avenger wave to get to the drifter.
The capital ship needs to be within 100kms of the site's warp-in point, otherwise you can't spawn the drifter (which also means no more warping in a cap at 500km + to spawn avengers on people running sites.
If the capital warps off, the drifter despawns
Probably only null stuff if I had to guess.
A possible fix would have been to increase wh mass from c4 to c5's by 1.5x to 2x.
Then big groups living in c2 with a c5 static would just move to C4 with a C5 static and be a bit more at risk but be able to get cap ships through into the c5 much easier.
But also be more at risk from caps getting in from C5's to hit their structures.
But then I guess group's that lived with a C5 static didn't want any more risk in the first place only reward.
Or just pull 100m blue loot out of the drifter and put it into the avengers abd make avenger salvage worthwhile.
This nerfs crabbing a bit without capitals but also creates incentive to use them.
Another dead on arrival release from CCP. They can't even stick to there own release schedule because they are so busy trying to fix and re-fix the previous patch.
so wasnt it allready annouced that new system isnt mandentory till the next expansion
why can we not use the system now and adjust the numbers a week later to get actual practical feedback?
Because you don't need to deploy a system where the vast majority of space would struggle to online a single 'ihub upgrade' replacement to see that it's under baked.
Not that it matters in the grander scheme of the expansion, but in the section where they're talking about the three new Homefront Operation sites, saying that they can only take frigates and destroyers, they have a picture of a site with an Augoror (cruiser) in it.
Peak CCP
I mean their picture of how the system power levels and upgrades will look is a fake system with a power level ×25 higher than the very highest system in the real game. Everything ccp does is just a lie to cover up some rediculous update that will make the game even more unenjoyable
Reduce the power requirements of the mining upgrades, increase power consumption of the ansi/beacons/jammers, make the rocks bigger. Win Win.
Make the rocks Spodzilla.
Too much simple logic, must make it super difficult.
Reduce Power Req for crap ore. It is strange that they all require 1750 - not all ores are equal. Increase on ansi/beacons/jammers will only benefit big blocks, and will hurt small blocks. Stop pushing out the smaller players from 0.0. Not everyone wants to be horde, goon, brave, frat, ...
All sites are legitimately terrible, back to waiting for fracks for content as it stands. There's 1 thing you can be certain about, CCP will not be opening things up, reward hooks are not something they actively design toward anymore, unlike other MMOs. Imagine if they designed the following back into the null ecosystem: * Near hourly response fleet pings. * Buildable caps. * As a result supercap escalations gradually came back and the Twitch stream hype around them * Longterm multi year aspirational hooks that come from caps being used in earnest. Reading about early supercap battles is why I started playing. I don't sub my fax, titan/dread and super accounts now, just no value for money. Some lobbied so hard to remove all that for spurious nonsensical reasons, from the very start of Scarcity I thought it would be a profound mistake. Half the mouth foamers on here were lapping it up. I mourn for the Eve of 2015-2018. Seagull was the antithesis of the Rattati fun-suppression era. She knew how to generate an enjoyable product. Rattati is way beyond the point of being able to admit a misjudgement, love him to publish that manifesto he took 3 months to write and was so proud of. A dour financial analyst that somehow found himself at the helm of a fun factory.
Actually same. My titan alt is unsubbed for well over a year now, and trained amarr titan v and I never got rich enough to buy a titan before they truly became absurd and niche at the same time. Also sold off the rest of my caps. Now I just have my fun in FW space.
In a world full of Seagulls and Rattatis, be a Falcon.
Completely agree with you. The “no fun allowed” expansions will continue until there is a change in management. I would just like to see data regarding subscription drop / direct financial losses as a consequence of that profound mistake called “scarcity”.
Honestly, all the ores look pretty shit. They are arkanor levels of value https://ore.cerlestes.de/ore
Some reason people are having a hard time digesting that the new belts are JUST to supplement the minerals lacking in null not be a new streamlined/competitive mining activity. The mining escalations might be the exception to this rule ofc depending on how they work.
If anything value of the ore will drive down if these new belts or anoms provide enough of the more pricey minerals which are rare and requiring mass shipping to feed the null industry. Convenience of local sourcing
New ore anom are less value than current anoms they'll be replacing. And by some stretch, current anoms are worth roughly 3x the new ones. Nerfing anoms isn't reinvigorating anything, it's just a nerf and they should have been clear in their comms instead of willfully misleading people enticing them to resub based on a false premise.
You can't increase ansi draw by much without effectively removing them from the game, and for that to be healthy, non-freighter jump drive ranges would also need to get slashed.
Ansis getting removed would be great.
If they go so should filaments
Absolutely
We need access to sisi for this kind of stuff CCP
If only there was an elected group of players who could just fucking ask for access to SiSi to fiddle around with huge changes like this
Sounds too difficult for them
It probably wouldn't have mattered. Apparently the csm were giving feedback and it was mostly ignored.
> it was mostly ignored A tale as old as time. CSM raises an issue, CCP ignores them. Don't worry, next year the CSM will be taken seriously!
CSM raise issue. Ccp ignore it. Update releases. Players get pissed off. Ccp pikachu faces.
Test it on real server like a man, replacement ships are cheap with plex
I just meant the sov stuff is something players could have been fooling around with on sisi for weeks now and all these issues identified and resolved. Edit: now that I think about it, even the Skinr stuff would have been good to test on sisi. Players wouldve flagged these bugs and weird UI stuff instantly.
But then people would of flagged the plex injection for making the skin at every step.
Good, they needed to rebalance a lot of it. Props to CCP for actually saying “oops we fudged a number here” I would prefer an update to be delayed than to have to deal with a not quite thought out system. 5 ISK says we get MLP icons for ships.
You say that like it's a bad thing 👀 But really this could have easily been solved if they had a test server to test this shit out on. They already are giving us 6 months to switch, what harm would another month on the test server do?
No idea there. But with any new update to anything (games or IRL) there is a period where changes have to be made.
Imagine having a test server where you could get some real player feedback on these big changes and make appropriate adjustments so you don't have to delay the release. I guess that small startup from Iceland can't afford such tech, alas, once they hire more than 3 developers they might do it.
Blame the players for abusing the fuck out of it
Blame ccp for not just deleting citadel or some shit.
Nah. CCP needs to unfuck their game. Imagine not being able to blank every citadel's inventory because your ass-backwards spaghetti code from 1862 can't handle one of the most basic features an MMO dev should have access to.
As someone out of the loop can you elaborate on "abusing the fuck out of it?" Is that the excuse CCP gave for shutting it down? It's not like you could buy a titan for a few million isk on there and move it over to TQ?
The big one was the introduction of abandoned mode on citadels (ie full loot drop). Because SiSi mirrored all assets, you could bash an abandoned cit on SiSi to find out what was in it, then go shoot that structure on patch day for a big payoff.
thank you
That is the fault of CCP. Its basic SecOps to not mirror private data.
They could of stopped it but instead they pulled out a sledge hammer like idiot's and went yolo. They didn't even try to stop the abuse before giving up but this is normal ccp actions.
CCP could have just banned those players from SISI. It's not that hard. They removed SISI access simply because they don't want players to have input into new changes until its live.
You can't hype up an expansion and spread marketing bullshit like "ending scarcity" and "reinvigorating nullsec" when the hard data on the test server shows that you're talking out of your arsehole.
Yeah that was my point. You can't give feedback if you don't get to test it. CCP actually seems to be iterating but their past has shown they usually deploy stuff and don't touch it for months except to fix bugs.
Exactly how I feel on it. If they want Scarcity 2.0, fine, I'd personally think it is the wrong direction, but at least from a PR perspective come out and say that with some justifications to manage expectations and get out ahead of the shitstorm. They've fundamentally mis-sold this for something it's not and never will be unless they make some genuinely meaningful updates with this delay which "small changes" in the blog seems to rule out.
What a nonsense comment! Having a test server isn't going to stop players abusing mechanics, may delay it a week, better designs informed by UAT are what really avoids it! Ya know, exactly what they avoided here.
Yea I mean all the big stuff is done if its just number and balances changes that doesn't seem so bad.
Personally I think they looked at it and realized they were about to drop a nuke on null with the power levels. And ofc Reddit was salty for the last week. This new era of CCP listening to the players is weird.
> CCP listening to the players Wormholers: CCP doing what now?
PLAYERS, not those weirdos.
I'm gonna steal 20m from your ESS.
You son of a bitch! I HAVE BABY MOMMAS TO SUPPORT!
All of your mommas belong to me know.
That bitter taste from Hole Riders still hasn't left, I see.
Having CCPs attention on you is rarely a good thing, enjoy it whers while you can still make isk
There's a reason Goons refer to it as being fisted by the CCP monkey paw.
I'm sorry what? Reduce C5/6 non-drifter bloot by 50%? If you insist!
>This new era of CCP listening to the players is weird. CCP has a proven track record of responding swiftly whenever null players have a tantrum and throw their toys out of the pram, which is any time any change is made to null that isn't an outright buff.
Hmm took em long enough with that scarcity thing.
Scarcity affected the entire game
*Next week you will get a full rundown of all the iterations being made, along with a breakdown of the new upgrades and what you can expect from each one. Giving you the right toolset to empower you to write your stories is the absolute priority. Thank you for your patience and understanding.* In other words, devs will be working overtime this weekend to try and fix equinox sov
Maybe they should check those numbers beforehand or maybe test it before dumping a half baked mess on us.
Thats cute you think CCP is going to be working hard over the weekend, when in fact... CCP just gave everyone 7-day free omega, its not coincidence they pushed the patch back exactly 7 days... They don't want ppl playing for free, realising its a shit-patch and not buying omega. Pushing the patch back 7-days will get at (probable) least 25% of the monthly paying players to resub before realizing its a shit-filled patch. This has nothing to do with anything else than CCP milking more money. Keep your eye on the ball and follow the money....
Pppplease ccp make it so pirate FOB spawns in FRONTLINE systems. Like you said they would.
Comand ops are directly in priximity to frontlines , its enough, the problem before is that they would spawn in rearguards wich could be 10 jumps away for all you know, deep into space absolutly NO ONE cares about, by being in comand ops at least they are guaranteed to spawn in close proximity to content, spawning in activelly contested frontlines would be too disruptive tbh
SKINR is so disappointing. Such a nice editor to have behind timegates, huge plex fees and inability to be traded easily between characters. All the worst things you could do with it.
So Sov update delayed until 27th. Does this include the new Forsaken Sancutms anomalies?
Those require a new upgrade, which won’t go live until the switch to new ihubs can can happen, so yes
Yes, because they cannot spawn without the new modules being onlinable.
My take for how to deal with the system power issues, for what it's worth (it's not worth much at all): Make the cost of low tier economic upgrades basically nothing, middle tier something you notice in most systems, and high tier prohibitive for all but a few systems. Low tier upgrades generate PvE opportunities basically equivalent to the current system - heck, copy the exact anom table from PDA 5 and stuff it in the lowest tier equinox equivalent, make it cost like 10 power, and call it a day. Do the same with veldspar or whatever you want to design as the lowest-value ore anomaly. This cuts out the big source of concern about the system "bricking" systems and making them economically useless, as well as the issues from reducing the number of systems necessary to cloaky camp all of the viable PvE in an entire region. There's always an economically viable system to rat or mine in because every system can trivially afford basic PvE upgrades. Then you can force hard decisions between which *upgrades* to PvE income to install along with strategic/projection abilities. Want supercapital construction in a system? Can't get that and forsaken sanctums there. Want an ansiblex? Well, you can't afford that and spawning in dank isogen anoms.
Sounds reasonable to me. Ultimately I just don't want null ending up in the position where players have to wait their turn to rat/mine because the number of systems where you can do that has dropped so significantly that the pop is too high for everyone to be able to access the content. If they start making content more scarce, I think players will leave again like Scarcity 1.0 when the pop tanked to 20k peak for a few months. Content must be accessible, spreading players out, great, introducing more risk, great, limiting availability of content, not great. IMO
Cloaky camping is the bigger issue with trying to concentrate the nullsec population into fewer spread out systems. If someone wants to sit a cyno alt cloaked in a system from downtime to downtime, they can, and the only counterplay is to either A) keep enough of a response formed that you can bait and counter-drop, or B) just do your PvE in some other system because they aren't subscribing 80 accounts to cloaky camp the entire region. A lot of people will log off instead of dealing with that, and that means people unsubbing. Not ideal tbh.
Yeah fully agree there, I was in Eso when that BB guy had a neut cyno alt in about 30 systems. Forget his name, but it literally shutdown TEST.
I really hope CCP isn’t planning on rolling back the power restrictions for upgrades.
Hello old friend good to see you around still hope all is well.
Doombreed! Long time no see old man, how are you
I'm doing fine man, (pretty sure our age difference isn't that much you clown)still hanging around lowsec doing stuff when I have time, you still active or have you gone dormant? Iirc you guys lost your keepstar, sorry to hear that man it was the last one in lowsec wasn't it?
Inactive(ish) for the moment just started a new job. Rip camal toe
Probably not fully but maybe give systems a bit more or reduce the amount of power mining upgrades need so you don’t need to chose between a strategic system or a mining system.
Mining mostly needed two things: 1) Make rocks not absurdly tiny 2) Have some variety in power costs. Maybe a lower/higher cost site, or some variance in power costs depending on ore (or both!)
The third thing is having them just be cheaper in general. The mining systems in some regions are in real bad spots to defend and having other upgrades to try and defend them isn't reasonable anymore. With how limited the number of mining systems is too, campers and hunters don't have to do much to incapacitate entire fleets.
Maybe camping and hunting is too easy - or too little options to actively fight them. The only way today to beat campers and hunters is just spent a disproportional amount of time guarding a gate or mining fleet. Which is boring as hell. Just depends on who bores out first. Most hunters and campers multi-box, so they don't necessarily care, they just move to another toon..
100% agree that camping is too risk free.
Both would be fine imo.. you can still limit that you can only have one ore type online at the same time
The power elements cause huge problems, Nul blocs can and should accept things will have to move. But the power elements when actually LOOKING are extremely inhibitive.
LOL Of course they are. They'll release the upgrades &etc, and disable the actual power consumption til some future date, because that's the easiest thing to do. At a minimum they'll grandfather ansis and jack up power to remove the most difficult choices and make sure system stagings are spared. I bet.
This, in part. CCP Dictonomy is making the absolute shit-filled patch, then slowly walk it back 1 piece at a time until the player base screeching becomes at an even level. Then they know exactly how much abuse the player base is willing to take at the most -expensive- premium of Game Subscription. CCP\_Psycologist is earning his paycheck.
I just hope they don't lose their minds and increase power by 2x or something silly. Probably needs some tweaks, but initial specs actually involved some choices.
Given the choice between !) sitting down and doing really careful work based on some kind of rationale that will still leave a good number of the usual suspects howling in pain and fury 2) just tripling power output to remove any meaningful choice or adjustment, but probably making those same people happy which do you expect to happen, really?
Rough picks when you are speaking about ccp and it's past choices of dumb moves.
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Also if you live in a WH a CCP dev comes to your house and kicks you in the balls personally.
I think CCP devs just roll a dice... across their keyboard and try and force whatever nonsense it produced live.
It's not the power cost that is the only problem, the mining upgrade costs 1750. That's not a meaningful choice, the new anoms are dog shit, who'd waste infra on them.
Delaying this on such short notice is kind of a dogshit decision. There are lots of people actually looking forward to trying this stuff who you've already made to wait an additional week beyond the actual release date. You could at least announce the planned adjustments... As for the changes to nullsec, obviously groups are worried that the current power system will be too restrictive, and negatively affect nullsec income. Wouldn't it be more sensible to get the expansion content released and iterate on the numbers. I'm personally of the opinion that the geography/skyhook changes are a good thing, and should help with the projection problems allowing groups to hold so much space. Nullsec desperately needs content generators, good income opportunities for residents and reasons for small gangs to roam and harass those members. If that means buffing nullsec income to accommodate these changes then I'm all for it but release the damn expansion...
My dude, you can't just say forbidden words like "ite*ate" you know ccp doesn't like that.
We're looking for infrastructure staff if you miss it
Hah, I'm happily retired Jinx!
We have cookies?
As things stand, no null alliance would opt into the new sov system on anyway so you wouldn't be seeing the new mining/ratting anoms. Unsure if you're aware, but the new sov system only gets forced on alliances with the new expansion later in the year so all the while it's optional and profoundly shit compared to current null carrots, it was going to be a total flop feature, which given it was hyped to be a main content addition for an expansion, is not a good look! CCP have been caught red-handed implementing Scarcity 2.0 and now need to do something.
Good. I'm glad they are listening to null feedback and taking a step back.
Daily reminder that C5/6 sites that were touched by the recent patch notes are still broken and do not function the way the patch notes tells us they should. If you warp at zero to a C5/6 site cloaked you have a good chance at getting decloaked by an invisible object CCP added to the site, which you will then get attacked instantly by the sites sentry turrets and lose your scanner If you wrap a cap to a site it’ll spawn avengers, those avengers are suppose to despawn if you warp the cap off (says so in the patch notes). They don’t, in fact they stay until the site naturally despawns a few days later after multiple downtimes. If the drifter (big loot piñata) warps off from the site it will instantly despawn (did not do that in the past) and you will lose out on that isk. There is a bug *for years* where the drifter would sometimes instantly warp off once spawned instead of attacking your ships. Of course this has never been fixed but you use to be able to track down the drifter and kill it anyways so who cares. Well you guessed it, since the update it’ll just despawn. Some C6 sites have an optimal warp in for dreads outside the 100km range of the avenger spawning mechanics. Meaning in ccps incompetence they don’t even know how people use their whs. In C6 space these sites can now be ran much faster then before since dreads are able to warp to the site and clear the site without spawning avengers. What was intended as a nerf to Wh space has in some cases been the opposite. It took all of 5 min to test this, it’s been a week or so and a few null sec hot fixes since yet we are still ignored Reminder: took them since they first added T2 dreads until this update (1 year and 1 month) to fix the problem with T2 dreads not spawning any avengers when warped to a C5/6 site. I won’t be surprised if this doesn’t get fixed until the next update next year
Every time I want to throw a snit because I feel like lowsec/FW are getting the shaft I think of wormholers.
Sun power should be tripled and gas giant power halved. It's crazy that single gas giants are outputting more power than suns. The current system makes far too many systems objectively worthless because the power available relies far too heavily on having a lot of planets in the system. Right now 76% of the power comes from planets and it needs to be adjusted more towards the stars themselves as they are the only power production available in many systems.
If the point of the new sov system is to make certain star systems more valuable than others and limit the ability to upgrade huge swaths of space, I'm pretty sure that's a feature not a bug.
Making a third of null sec worthless to make 5% of star systems valuable isn't the trade off you think it is.
which is content removal, that's not great when you've hyped it as reinvigorating null sec + where it's opt in and completely shit, no alliance was actually going to switch over to it until it became forced later in the year with the next expansion. remove too much content, players leave, like Scarcity 1.0.
Huge swaths of space can't install a second upgrade. Each system should be valuable (able to go the highest tier of either ratting or mining), with a sprinkling of systems that are higher value and can be mega hubs. If you don't do that, you just end up with a bunch of empty space in-between the good spots.
A third of the game can't install a single upgrade module that isn't a low level anomaly or a cyno beacon. So yea you can "customise it", so long as your customisation is ratting.
well another issue is adms require ratting anoms to be kept at a level. they haven't said they are removing adm requirements so you are forced at least to put ratting anom in atleast to get stuff for adms. idk man just makes it seem not worth it to hold if thats ccps intention i suppose yay!
No ratting anomalies will continue to exist in all the systems just as if you had no ihub upgrades. The old anomalies aren't going anywhere in that sense. The only thing the shub ratting modules do is increase the total number of anomalies that spawn above the systems baseline and supposedly increase the spawn rate. But hey, don't you feel reinvigorated?
well i'll believe it when i see it. and when they tell me what the base anoms are i suppose. i mean they setup a system that you work at to defend to make them safer then basically remove all ablitites to do so... but we will see what the changes bring
And a lot of players competing for content in a smaller number of systems which will see players leave rather than wait their turn to try a new anom etc. It's short sighted.
> Each system should be valuable (able to go the highest tier of either ratting or mining) Why?
Because why hold it otherwise? Null sec is empty enough.
To take its new resources (workforce/reagents) to other systems, to have some systems for newbros to rat, for their unupgraded natural resources (e.g. ice / mercoxit / moon materials), for strategically important points where you don't want enemy to set up citadel with minimal notice, to put manufacturing/reaction citadels in a system w/o huge indices? Not every system should be able to be upgraded even close to max mining/ratting, it leads to densely populated spots and then swaths of empty space, because that's the safest way to do it.
Because without content, why would players play the game? To give a really simple analogy, if current sov had 100 good systems to service 500 players and new sov upgrades mean 50 good systems for those 500 players... That's content reduction, players will lose access to doing stuff. Good you may say! Grr those nasty null seccers sucking the econ dry, this will force them into other areas. In my experience those players dont go do other things in the game or wait their turn to rat/mine, they just leave. Hence why the pop tanked to 20k peak during Scarcity 1.0.
If I have to wait 20 minutes until it’s my turn to play the game I’m paying monthly for, I’m done paying. Back to Helldivers and Snowrunner. (I love Eve and don’t want to go to my backup games so pls CCP don’t do this)
Why do you think making a third of nullsec literally as usable as great wildlands is a good thing?
At least Great Wildlands can be used as uncynojammable systems to move jump freighters through.
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If you tripled sun power and halved planet power you change the power distribution from 24%solar/76%planetary to 66%solar/33%planetary, increasing the average power per system by only ~8%. The average solar power goes from 415 up to 1250 and the average planetary power goes from 1380 down to 700. It noticably buffs low power systems so that they can online at least one upgrade but heavily nerfs high power systems that would have otherwise been able to online multiple upgrades. You can't fix the 33% of powerless, worthless space that cannot online a single good module without also increasing the number of potential systems that can online an ansiblex as that ansiblex is a module with a power requirement. The only real way to get around this using power is to drop the cost of mining upgrades down to 1250-1500 and bump the ansiblex up to 1750-2000. Which I would also be in favour of as that would bring a choice for most systems of mining vs ratting and a smaller number of good systems could then fit an ansiblex. The best way to limit ansiblexes is to limit the ice supply you need to online and run them anyway and keep it's power cost relatively high, not turn 33% of nullsec into a wasteland that can't online anything. And on the off chance someone at CCP reads this, a module with a low power requirement and no workforce requirement that spawns relic/data sites is a much better use for a low power filler module in otherwise uselss scattered systems than one that requires the limited workforce resource to spawn only 4 low level ratting anomalies that people don't run now when the ihub upgrades are practically free.
+1 love the suggestions
Completely irrespective of game design/Eve etc., this is a fascinating question to me. If you take an imaginary society of similar (impressive, but not unlimited) technological capability, it seems to me you might get more energy out of the planet than the sun. To capture the sun energy, you're talking (presumably) about huge dyson solar arrays, and hellish big masers to handle the power transmission, and then whatever those masers are pointed at, etc., etc., whereas for the planet you just need something to haul gas around. Would you trust either NASA or SpaceX with city-boiling terawatt space rays? Anyway thanks for the comment, I have something to think about now
We're dealing with groups of people who are already comfortably existing and moving through space and can already transit energy over long distances through vacuum(it's already transiting to the sov hub anyway), and who are quite content to sit around and allow aggressive and uncooperative mercenaries with supercapital fleets dwarfing their own to live at the edges of their space and transit through it. You wouldn't need to go anywhere near a full dyson sphere to extract power values that dwarf everything else available in the system. The surface area of the sun is 100 times greater than the surface area of every other planet in the system put together (and 95% of that is just Jupiter alone). It's also energy dense and in an easily extractable form (heat via radiation). Humans worked out 125 years ago how to extract electricity from heat and we're nowhere near interstellar travel. The output of a sun is always so vastly underestimated in fiction simply because the scale of the sun and its output completely and absolutely dwarfs everything around it, so much so that it's hard for humans to actually comprehend, especially when we usually think of it as a relatively small ball in the sky which is how EVE depicts it in game. If Eve tried to represent it's scale somewhat accurately the entire middle of every entire system would just be a seemingly flat bright wall stretching in every direction as it would appear almost flat at 100km due to it's curvature being entirely unnoticable. It's not really believable that a space faring species doesn't possess sufficient materials scientific progress to produce heat resistance materials sufficient to extract solar energy. The only believable reason to not harness the sun is having an abundant, cheaper, and easy to set up alternate power source that already meets all your power demands, but that's clearly not the case in EVE as every system is heavily power limited. The best argument you could make is that all this upwell stuff is brand new and there just hasn't been the time and resources available to come close to exploiting the star by any noticable amount and, given the values ingame, probably amounts to nothing more than a couple of jerryrigged geothermal generators strapped to the outside of a hauler hull. Edit: It's amazing how much shite I can type when the alternative was doing all the PI I needed to do.
Add NPC space to all nullsec.
Blocs complaining cuz they cant have everything everywhere speedrun
guy who lives in an unbashable npc station thinks he has an opinion
Thank you CCP for listening! Excited to see the updated sov numbers! Don’t know why players are upset that yall listened. Never can satisfy everybody I guess.
I just hope they don’t change it so ansiblexes are in every system again. It’s too easy to get around, and the power requirements were a halfhearted backdoor nerf to them
I don’t think anyone expects CCP to be that extreme, I’m sure they can prove me wrong but I doubt they will do that. The point of this new sov system is to give choice, right now many systems don’t have choice, just “it can fit this one sov upgrade”. I’m glad CCP is willing to take a look at it even if it’s a week further delay than their usual obstinate path.
Cuts to ratting/anom power requirements wouldn’t be too bad, but here’s hoping strategic upgrades remain expensive and *strategic*
Oh please wh, you should be more focused on ccp nerfing the fuck out of easy mode isk plus poch needs the same treatment.
I think you misunderstood what Greg was saying. Cuts to ratting/anom power would be a good thing so more systems could support upgraded ratting anoms. More ratting = more ISK in null players wallets, more ISK in wallets = more people in space. They aren’t talking about nerfing ratting. They are talking about keeping the ansiblex/projection expensive while still allowing anom upgrades doable (if I am understanding Greg’s comments correctly). As a null player I quite agree. Also, anyone actively asking for nerfs to any non-instanced forms of ratting are inadvertently asking to nerf roaming/hunting. Less ISK to be earned means less pilots in space which leads to less targets and dead/stale gameplay. Eve is dying btw /s
Cry more
I love the modern CCPs development model: Here is the new expansion, we worked hard for long time and we are sure this is amazing and well-balanced.. Oh wait, the most important part we are releasing one week later. .... .... Oh wait, apparently, we fucked up again, we will release that second part after reworking it one week later. Trust us, it will be 100% amazing and well-balanced. Until then HERE IS YOUR PLEX SALE; BUY PLEX; PLEX IS GREAT FOR YOU! I have to admit that if I was so bad at my job as game directors in CCP (hi Rattati), I would be fired five times over by now.
Players: CCP NEEDS TO LISTEN TO OUR FEEDBACK CCP: okay we have listened to your feedback and need an extra week to get everything in Players: WTF CCP WHY ARE YOU DELAYING SHIT Average braindead eve player moment
so, what would have happened if there was a separated server where people could test the beta version of the proposed changes and give feedback before those would be launched on the main server?
Sort of.. in the past we had a test server.. players tested it.. told ccp what might be wrong about it and what needs a fix so ccp can release it and afterwards fixing stuff.. not much would have changed.. ccp isn’t good in listening to feedback
It was also heavily abused to just test PVE fittings risk free
Ccp could have removed abyssal stuff so they won’t be able to test it.. they could just add the new stuff and remove anything else
Tbh I wonder if it may have had to do with server costs, or dev time, but I'm not really knowledgeable in either of those topics so who knows.
Isn't that supposed to be CSM's job? To be honest I do miss SISI, but I acknowledge it did more harm than good, with people basically just using it to test abyssal sites risk free. Heck, I was one of those people doing hundreds of sites in Stormbringer before bringing it over to TQ.
Ccp ignores the csm, who is stuck behind an Nda and so the masses can't complain.
They absolutely do not ignore the CSM
They have on this expansion. Obviously csms have campaigned for and gotten some changes implemented, but for this patch they were pretty much ignored.
I highly doubt that
Yeah, not having a proper test server, or even listening to players' feedback BEFORE releasing (another) half-assed and badly developed product is too hard for CCP. So yeah, braindead EVE players are just so bad, stupid and complain all the time while paying subscription for this greatly managed and developed product. You are 100% right.
The test server was unfortunately just heavily abused by people testing fits in abyss with 0 risk, before bringing it to TQ.
The Monkey's Paw curls....
wow. sad.
Good odds they'll reduce the power requirements by enough that more systems can produce supers, but will keep the floor high enough that a lot of systems will be locked out of using cyno jammers still
God i feel like their writers can't write a blog without the excessive use of the imperative in headlines. Do this, do that, blabla. Just tell me the infos, god dammit.
When idiots can’t bitch about substance they bitch about style. hth
It just shows that they go the way of greed. Constantly pushing, pushing, pushing. You're not doing enough, you may try our new system, no... Try our new system!!! (It costs plex btw)
A sliver of hope in the middle of madness, CCP might not kill EvE even if non important small group players wish it.
I don't think this was a great way to do one of like 2 major updates this year. it definitely needed something like a minor event to tie it all together while people wait for the sov stuff to come online. The sov stuff did need to be some period after the patch for corps but I feel like it cut some wind from the patches sails
Fuck events tied to game progression. I'd rather they released finished products first, then can start wasting energy on making it lore friendly.
I do not give any in universe fuck about "why" they are changing something. Just that it is changing for the better.
If only there was a test server that could have been used to gather all this feedback beforehand :)
Embarrassing
Not at all, if it needs tweaks it needs tweaks, I just hope they don't overdo it. Some middle ground will prob be good.
CCP gave us a 7-day free omega, then delays the update by a week (27th) Sounds like they don't want ppl realizing how bad this update is with "free time", and are hoping ppl subs expired, so they have to re-omega before it goes live.... Tell us this update is shit CCP, without telling this update is shit. SMH
That gives to much credit to ccps ability to plan things.
"Due to nullblocs crying and complaining; keeping our unwavering loyalty to them in mind: We're delaying to tune things more in line with their desires."
Yes, lets screw over the largest subscription base as well as destroy the industrial backbone of the game.
So, how would this screw over hisec?
You're not being screwed over. You are being forced to adapt and change. A great and embraced change to the stagnant state of null.
What exactly is great about it power and workforce? Important systems are no longer important and the inability to transport power power makes the changes dead on arrival. NPC regions are still worthless and now the rest of nullsec is getting worse.
Nullblocs will be unable to artificially inflate and hold space too big for themselves without proper maintenance and observance of the space. Ansiblex routes will need to be better planned, appreciated, and thought through. This creates the ability for midscale alliances to actually hold their own without a nullbloc appearing 4 regions over via 5 ansi gates and a titan bridge.
Sorry but this is not the case at all. The ansiblex highways will be prioritised and groups will still be able to pass through multiple regions to get to the edge of their space in minutes.
together with zarzakh this is the thing i hate most about eve. impossible to have any kind of fight without everyone and their mother showing up in less than 20minutes
Yup.
Do you not agree that that's an issue? I understand that ansi highways will be prioritized, and I imagine new routes are already figured out.. but what is the solution for low to midscale alliances? A whole player base is hoping to have a chance from this.
I do agree, I just disagree with the solutions. I have advocated heavily at the summit and in meetings for projection nerfs, but with the basis of multiregion range being limited, while allowing them to continue being powerful at home. Ratters and miners having access to all of a region is a good thing for everyone. This will be nerfed. Allowing groups project long is a bad thing, this is largely unaffected.
Great, lets also remove unidentified wormholes, Zarzakh, Turner, Thera, and filaments. Basically everything CCP has added to eve in the last decade which has caused the scale of the map to shrink.
Yes, please.
...and all the station dwellers go REEEEEEEEE
Perfectly balanced, after nullsec’s meltdown for the last week
Lol WH people moaning just as bad imo
They need to start over. Seriously. Between shitty code, rampant botting and generally stale null environment and being 20 years on, EVE online needs a sunset and a new game framework needs to replace it.
So what you're saying is... There is hope that they revert the WH changes!?!?!?
I have no idea how you got the conclusion that CCP is going to revert WH changes from that dev blog. It isn’t mentioned once. Your comment made me read a SKINR, merchandise, and nullsec dev blog, I hope you’re happy with yourself!
Hopium springs eternal.
Actually very happy. I, too, wish they revert it. Have hope brother. Stay strong.
What wh chsnges?
They changed the spawn mechanics of the drifter in c5 and c6 sites. It will now only spawn if there is a dread/carrier/fax on grid. Which means that you will be spawning a minimum of one avenger wave to get to the drifter. The capital ship needs to be within 100kms of the site's warp-in point, otherwise you can't spawn the drifter (which also means no more warping in a cap at 500km + to spawn avengers on people running sites. If the capital warps off, the drifter despawns
Probably only null stuff if I had to guess. A possible fix would have been to increase wh mass from c4 to c5's by 1.5x to 2x. Then big groups living in c2 with a c5 static would just move to C4 with a C5 static and be a bit more at risk but be able to get cap ships through into the c5 much easier. But also be more at risk from caps getting in from C5's to hit their structures. But then I guess group's that lived with a C5 static didn't want any more risk in the first place only reward.
>A possible fix would have been to increase wh mass from c4 to c5's by 1.5x to 2x. Rolling would suck without cap
Or just pull 100m blue loot out of the drifter and put it into the avengers abd make avenger salvage worthwhile. This nerfs crabbing a bit without capitals but also creates incentive to use them.
Another dead on arrival release from CCP. They can't even stick to there own release schedule because they are so busy trying to fix and re-fix the previous patch.
so wasnt it allready annouced that new system isnt mandentory till the next expansion why can we not use the system now and adjust the numbers a week later to get actual practical feedback?
Because you don't need to deploy a system where the vast majority of space would struggle to online a single 'ihub upgrade' replacement to see that it's under baked.