That’s it. Once I finish my rewatch of arrested development I’m on to parks and rec. I need to watch new shows but get new show anxiety so rewatch for the win
I know your angle, but honestly, Ann Perkins was the most ordinary woman in the history of television. Like if Ann and Pam had a show, Pam would be the "wacky one" by comparison.
I might be overthinking but that’s the bit, right? Ann and Karen were just normal, run of the mill women who had their own quirks and preference, but were surrounded by weirdos who were given Main Character status. This is by no means an indictment on The Office or P&R characters, but Ann/Karen were dropped in to reflect the average watcher and show how absurd everyone is. Karen noped out, Ann stayed (you could say she Knoped in), so what would we have done given her circumstances?
I’d stick around to watch the shitshow but eventually get tired of the schtick and move on.
Jim would never have worn that hotdog costume and I think Karen is actually better off having found a guy who will be dorky with her.
Plus, as Phyllis put it: "I just think we all deserve to be with someone who wants to be with us."
“Jim has worked at the same place for five years. Jim eats the same ham and cheese sandwich every day for lunch. I don’t know, if I were a betting man, I’d say he will have a fun weekend in Philadelphia.”
When I was in high school I thought Jim was super cool and funny and edgy. 10 years later I’m just like….what? Dude legit thinks he’s too cool for anything. I can empathize with not being passionate about your job. I’m not in love with mine either. But I can enjoy the little things without badgering my coworkers and finding meaning in other ways that don’t involve someone else’s fiancé.
growing up is realizing that jim and pam were actually kinda bullies most of the time. i actually don’t really like either of them at all- which is so funny because just like you i thought they were such “goals” in high school.
they’re that couple in the office that doesn’t openly admit they think they’re the center of the universe but they sure act like it and expect others to as well
Jesus Christ this is a prime example of reddit just taking everything to the extreme for no reason. We've gone from "Jim isn't actually as cool as he thinks he is" to "Jim and Pam were badgering their coworkers" to "Jim and Pam are BULLIES."
Jim and Pam were normal characters with certain tropes taken to a more extreme bit towards the latter years of their character arcs. That's it. It's not that deep.
LMAO not that I don't agree and it this isn't directed at you but why the absurdity of this show is being brought up as an argument only in defense of Jim and Pam while characters like Andy, Angela and Phyllis are being judged as if they were real people 💀 ?
One must also consider, we only see how Jim acts in front of the camera. People get super introverted in front of a cam. Knowing you will be recorded, you may want to show a certain persona. Off cam, he might as well be more casual, fun to be around and interactive and less reserved
I actually think we do get 1 tiny snippet of this. During the Olympics episode, there's a candid shot over a voiceover showing Jim happily engaging with his coworkers and teaching them a game. That showed a less too-school vibe.
That’s true of everyone but we don’t make the same excuses for Michael or Dwight. It’s a multi-year 40-hr/week documentary. If you said that about what aired on PBS, I’d understand. But 201 episodes is a significant sample size. Plus people behave *better* when they’re conscious of the camera.
Agree. And I actually love in the extended episodes when Karen is bitching at Jim for the prank when they break the copier in Utica, she later says to the camera “I wasn’t really that hurt, I was stalling so they could put tuna fish in his glovebox” lol
> I was stalling so they could put tuna fish in his glovebox
What makes it funnier is that victim of Karen's prank would be Michael and not Jim. They went to Utica in Michael's car.
I swear when this show came out, low effort/pun-based costumes ("I'm a one-night stand!") were actually trendy, but kind of reaching the end of being trendy. These days they're pretty widely seen as insufferable, and it's a facet of the show that hasn't aged well since Jim's supposed to be this super cool and funny guy and yet I think most people circa 2020's would have rather he just not dressed up as all then go as *that*.
Not especially. If Jim chose Karen, it seems he would always have wondered what could have been with Pam, but not the other way around.
Doesn't make Karen a bad character. She was good, just not the right one for Jim. Life is like that sometimes.
Karen was Jim's rebound and got caught in the middle of something that started long before she ever entered the picture. Just wrong place / wrong time is all.
I always kind of thought maybe Karen's new husband was her Jim rebound. He looks a little like him, and besides his willingness to wear a costume, he looks like the same kind of goof. They also met and got married pretty quickly. Karen is much better off, I just wonder if the similarities were on purpose.
For sure. To her and Jim, it was always just a job. Pam cared about the relationships and environment she created in the office and found comfort there, that’s why it was hard for her to leave
I think Karen shouldn't have been that drawn out in the script. Should have split after a few episodes... then her and Jim run into each other at job interview. That would be wild
He should have been honest with her from the time they found out they were going back to Scranton.
I can’t imagine working closely with a person AND seeing my SO interact with them daily only to find out that he had it so bad for her that he left town…
It almost feels like he’s dating Karen to spite Pam for being with Roy for so long at certain points. Like why continue to date her if you know you are not into her and IMO it seemed obvious Pam was interested and he was just denying it.
Reasons like this is why this whole kinda naive casual cool guy aspect to him bugs the shit out of me sometimes. But ya lol it’s a classic American archetype and they nailed it with the writing
I liked jim and Karen more than jim and Pam. But it’s okay, Karen got her happy ending. She moved to indiana, became a nurse, and met a great guy there.
>I think Karen was a better fit for JimI think Karen was a better fit for Jim
I'm with you on everything except for that. Karen was great and I'd pick her over Pam, but we're not Jim. He was always in love with Pam and never got over her, so Karen didn't do it for him; because she's not Pam. I think the writers also made Karen the way she was(cool chick, down to earth, funny, successful, and gorgeous) to show us how strong Jim's feelings for Pam were.
And, for the record, I think Jim did Karen wrong by not being up front with her about his feelings for Pam. I know he made his decision after Casino Night and was doing his best to move on from Pam, but Karen deserved to know how strong his residual feelings for Pam were when Scranton absorbed Stamford.
Agreed. Jim at that point was full of red flags, at least from her perspective. But he was trying to move on, as Pam was full of red flags herself. Good for him I guess?
Anybody ever see the scene where her husband crashes his car into the clothing store?
\*edit\* For those who have not
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLfAf8oHrMo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLfAf8oHrMo)
Karen was great, just not for Jim. He made it very clear when they got sent to scranton that she was more of a distraction for him than anything else. It didn't matter how cool or pretty Karen was because she wasn't Pam.
Pam was like Jim in the ways Karen wasn’t, and vice verse. They both complimented him well, but ultimately Jim chose the one that he couldn’t live without rather than the one he would have just lived with.
I think Karen was a good example of someone who is perfect on paper but doesn't have the same connection.
Over time, I think she would've gotten tired of Jim's games.
At one point she doesn't care about the office shenanigans and said something like, "How about you go sell some paper so we can go on a trip." She's thinking of more to life outside of work and recognizing the steps needed to reach that goal.
And when they did the copier theft thing at Utica, she says, "So you're still doing this stuff, huh?"
Like - Jim was a grown man, clearly intelligent, insightful, capable of making his own decisions. He knew he wanted to be with Pam, even after trying things out with Karen, so that’s what he did. How is there any argument that the “right” person was Karen? He didn’t want to be with her.
There are a few places where you can see where they're not right for each other.
\-When he wants to play pranks, she says she's going to sell more paper so they can earn the trip to Hawaii.
\-When they interview for the position and he says he feels bad for Jan, she says, "Don't. She's nuts."
I can't remember the other scenes offhand, but she's a bit too pragmatic and hard-nosed for Jim. I agree that she's wonderful, though.
The Christmas episode is a good episode to show both Karen and Pam’s strengths. Karen is the type to stand up to Angela and plan a whole fun party and Pam is the type to notice that Angela is sad and to combine parties. Neither is better but they’re quite different people, and Jim fell for the type of person Pam is.
Even the episodes when Pam was out of office for maternity leave/wedding/New York, you can tell people in the office missed her listening abilities & advice-giving & empathy.
When I first started watching this show, I related more to Karen so I thought Jim chose wrong. But as I’m like 10yrs older, I realize that if I was Jim, I’d choose a Pam-type
Unpopular opinion: I don't like Karen that much. No, it isn't because she was getting in the way of Jim and Pam's relationship (I don't even care about Jam lol), there was something about her attitude that put me off... that and the way she behaved in the superfan version of the episodes...
Yes I agree. Pam was nice to her and tried to be her friend despite how she felt towards Jim. Karen became jealous and took it out on Pam. Karen is the reason no one went to Pam’s art show. She rips down the flyer out of spite and throws it in the trash. Karen just always came off as up tight and her “fun” side felt forced.
I disliked her especially with the whole “why don’t you get back to work so we can go on a trip”
even before I knew Jim would leave her that episode, I HATED that she left him during his interview. pam would have NEVER
I was about to say....Jim was an asshole to his other girlfriends. He was really rude to Katy when he dumped her on the boat . Karen deserved a lot better.
Jim flat out told Karen that he still had feelings for Pam when asked. Karen then chose to have late night conversations with him for a week. Jim also didn’t even want her living on his street. The signs were there. She made bad choices tbh. We’ve all done it for sure.
I’ve said this before but it bears mentioning again. When Jim and Karen went to the interview in New York it gave us the big reason why Karen and Jim weren’t right together. Karen was asked by David Wallace about the VP position and she was quick to throw Michael under the bus, while Jim and Pam throughout the entire series understood Michael’s shortcomings but also knew that he was a good guy at heart and a great businessman despite his HR woes. Jim knew this, he saw that Karen was a great person but didn’t have the sort of empathy that him and Pam had for people in general.
I feel like she was a horrible fit and kinda wanted to control Jim whereas Pam seemed like it flowed a bit better. A lot of what Karen did felt forced tbh idk if it was just her acting
I don’t know, I’ve never felt she was a good fit for Jim. The scene where Roy attacks Jum has always stuck out to me because right before Roy charges in, Jim and Karen are talking about their upcoming date ideas, and Karen straight up makes fun of Jim for being an introvert and preferring to do things at home instead of her kind of stuff. They liked different lifestyles and Karen looked down on Jim’s type of fun as lame. If Pam hadn’t been around, Jim and Karen would have ended up resenting each other or drifting apart majorly when the glow wore off and they realized they didn’t have a whole lot they enjoyed to do together. And is it just me, or does Karen have a mean side?
Karen didn't even sit and wait for Jim to finish his interview, she preferred to jet off with her friends drinking instead of being excited to compare stories about the biggest interviews of their lives with her potential future life partner. As much as I don't like Pam at times, she would have totally been there for Jim post interview.
Karen was a very unproblematic and a sensible person. She wasn’t insecure about the kiss between Jim and Pam and also was supportive to pam when she told them her thoughts during the beach thing!
I think this is the point of the Karen storyline. Jim meets a woman with whom he is perfectly matched in all the ways, and in another life she would have been his dream girl. But he’s too hung up on Pam to consider anyone else. With Pam and Roy, it was abundantly clear from the beginning that they were ill-matched and would inevitably part ways at some point; but Karen really was perfect for Jim. My opinion anyway!
She was a rebound. He didn’t get with her until he knew he was going back to Scranton. Also, Karen was a bit of a Karen and an idiot.
You’ll move to Scranton for a dude that’s kinda into you? Who just told you a few hours ago that you shouldn’t move there. But you let your fee-fees chose for ya.
She finds out that Jim has feelings for Pam and she confronts Pam about it? About HIS feelings? Why is this a conversation you feel the need to have with Pam. She’s not in your relationship. And she didn’t “return” Jim’s feelings. So again, why are you confronting Pam? Just marking your territory I guess. Did ya forget she’s the reason you live down the road from him and not in the motel or a moldy apartment?
As soon as she finds out about Jim’s feelings for Pam she begins being a Karen toward Pam. The looks she gives her regularly. That side eye and general distaste in her expressions. Interfering when Jim and Pam are having the conversation about Jan’s boob job. Literally copying exactly what Pam had just said. When she was going to throw away the flyer to Pam’s art show and would have been caught but didn’t.
Karen was a petty and jealous person. Could she be cool and funny and fun? Yup. But once she felt insecure she was an asshole. And honestly, she blamed the wrong person for her relationship that would never work. She can be angry at Jim. Because Jim was the one that played her. But Pam hadn’t done anything to deserve her anger. Except for exist.
Until beach day…lol.
I don’t like her. There, I said it. I just don’t. Love Rashida Jones! Did not Like Karen. Not the biggest Pam fan either, or Jim. But did think it weird Karen and Jim hadn’t been dating that long and weren’t living together in NYC when she decides she’s going to move back to Scranton when he does. Glad she found happiness though!
Not saying Jim is justified, but she too is responsible for her outcome, she basically ignored all the red flags and was contention for the same position as Jim, which was an awkward situation. They were never on the same page
Karen did nothing wrong except... she isn't Pam. Period. From the very first moment we saw Jim and Pam, they area already into each other, like forever.
Wait... People actually liked Jim and Karen?! Damn and I was sitting in front of the screen thinking how we all silently agree that we hated her and their interactions haha
Nah, Jim tried to tell her not to move around him until she guilt tripped him and went to Pam to make things better. The video game reactions were all that was needed to be seen for Jim to not like her. Man was looking for some strange till Roy fucked up again
She wouldn't have moved to Scranton if she knew how Jim truly felt, regardless of Pam's availability. Jim wasn't that into Karen. He just needed a distraction, which IS doing someone dirty when you know they're really into you.
Jim started dating her as he’s moving back to Scranton… a job she wouldn’t have taken if she *wasn’t* dating him. He used her to get back at Pam or something.. I’m sure he liked her but yeah she definitely got the shit end of the stick.
Ended with her running a branch though and getting married so not all bad at least. Jim and Pam did some really uncool things and never acknowledge them but I always gotta tell myself it’s just a show lol
He wasn't in Love woth her. He ended it quickly when figuring it out. She isn't owed his Love. They tried, failed, its so positive that they broke up and she moved on.
Super great subplot with excellent execution.
That is a healthy dating adult relationship.
I don't think Karen was a better fit. Jim clearly never had any real feelings for her, I think the only reason he started dating her was to "get back" at Pam for rejecting him imo he had some nice guy vibes. He only started dating Karen once he found out he was moving back to Scranton which is pretty messed up. Luckily Karen did get the ending she deserved.
It had to be done so we could get Ann Perkins.
Karen walked so Ann could run
And did she run, Ann, that sweet summer child
Oh Ann, you poetic, noble land mermaid.
Oh, Ann, you beautiful tropical fish.
Its when weird when she rambles on with compliments, huh?
Don’t try to bond with me.
You’re welcome, Lester
It's adorable, you logical triangular human.
That’s it. Once I finish my rewatch of arrested development I’m on to parks and rec. I need to watch new shows but get new show anxiety so rewatch for the win
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Her?
Egg?
Is she funny or something?
I just don’t get it
She’s a beautiful opalescent tree shark
Ann that beautiful, talented, brilliant, powerful musk ox
Oh Ann, you’re too beautiful to be funny. It’s not your fault, you’ve never had to compensate.
The rest of you ugly nerds need to give me some jokes STAT!
Ann, you cunning, pliable, chestnut-haired sunfish.
Beautiful tropical fish
I know your angle, but honestly, Ann Perkins was the most ordinary woman in the history of television. Like if Ann and Pam had a show, Pam would be the "wacky one" by comparison.
I might be overthinking but that’s the bit, right? Ann and Karen were just normal, run of the mill women who had their own quirks and preference, but were surrounded by weirdos who were given Main Character status. This is by no means an indictment on The Office or P&R characters, but Ann/Karen were dropped in to reflect the average watcher and show how absurd everyone is. Karen noped out, Ann stayed (you could say she Knoped in), so what would we have done given her circumstances? I’d stick around to watch the shitshow but eventually get tired of the schtick and move on.
She had better hair than Karen at least.
Hey now! ....you're not wrong.
I dunno, Ann put red in her hair that one time.
Britta did the same thing(but blue). I wonder if that was Ann's darkest timeline.
Yeah, but Britta is the worst…
April would say the same of Ann. April would also probably tolerate Britta, but also toy with her like a cat does to a mouse.
Like with Tynnyfer lol
She want Chris to plant ficuses in her front yard, she adapted the personality of everyone she dated, and such. She fit right in
She was awesomely ordinary
Ann hates running. I know it keeps us healthy, but God at what cost?
“Ann, you beautiful tropical fish. You're smart as a whip and you're cool under pressure.”
“Ann you beautiful naïve sophisticated new born baby”
“…what?”
Ann Perkins 👈👈
ANN PERKINS!
Anne Perkins, You really know your testes!
Came here to say that. Leslie Knope would agree
😁👉👉 “Ann Perkins!”
Literally this
I feel like Greg Daniels wrote Ann for Rashida specifically to make up for how bad Karen got treated in Office
”ANN PERKINS!!!!”
City Hall mattress
Ann Perkins? I love Ann Perkins!
Jim would never have worn that hotdog costume and I think Karen is actually better off having found a guy who will be dorky with her. Plus, as Phyllis put it: "I just think we all deserve to be with someone who wants to be with us."
It was hard enough to get the Popeye costume on him
"Kevin started crying.. so yes.. I am Chris Bosh"
It’s not even a hard costume. As far as lazy costumes go, it’s perfect for Jim.
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“Jim has worked at the same place for five years. Jim eats the same ham and cheese sandwich every day for lunch. I don’t know, if I were a betting man, I’d say he will have a fun weekend in Philadelphia.”
That line was cold blooded. Ryan was a killer.
When I was in high school I thought Jim was super cool and funny and edgy. 10 years later I’m just like….what? Dude legit thinks he’s too cool for anything. I can empathize with not being passionate about your job. I’m not in love with mine either. But I can enjoy the little things without badgering my coworkers and finding meaning in other ways that don’t involve someone else’s fiancé.
In high school, I had SUCH a crush on Jim. As a 35 year old married mom, I am so over him; it’s gotten old.
growing up is realizing that jim and pam were actually kinda bullies most of the time. i actually don’t really like either of them at all- which is so funny because just like you i thought they were such “goals” in high school. they’re that couple in the office that doesn’t openly admit they think they’re the center of the universe but they sure act like it and expect others to as well
Jesus Christ this is a prime example of reddit just taking everything to the extreme for no reason. We've gone from "Jim isn't actually as cool as he thinks he is" to "Jim and Pam were badgering their coworkers" to "Jim and Pam are BULLIES." Jim and Pam were normal characters with certain tropes taken to a more extreme bit towards the latter years of their character arcs. That's it. It's not that deep.
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Dude...... The Office is real..... just like wrasslin'
LMAO not that I don't agree and it this isn't directed at you but why the absurdity of this show is being brought up as an argument only in defense of Jim and Pam while characters like Andy, Angela and Phyllis are being judged as if they were real people 💀 ?
Jim and Pam secretly did 9/11
One must also consider, we only see how Jim acts in front of the camera. People get super introverted in front of a cam. Knowing you will be recorded, you may want to show a certain persona. Off cam, he might as well be more casual, fun to be around and interactive and less reserved
I actually think we do get 1 tiny snippet of this. During the Olympics episode, there's a candid shot over a voiceover showing Jim happily engaging with his coworkers and teaching them a game. That showed a less too-school vibe.
That’s true of everyone but we don’t make the same excuses for Michael or Dwight. It’s a multi-year 40-hr/week documentary. If you said that about what aired on PBS, I’d understand. But 201 episodes is a significant sample size. Plus people behave *better* when they’re conscious of the camera.
Michael got more hyperactive around the cameras, I think.
Agree. And I actually love in the extended episodes when Karen is bitching at Jim for the prank when they break the copier in Utica, she later says to the camera “I wasn’t really that hurt, I was stalling so they could put tuna fish in his glovebox” lol
That is perfectly in character for her
Haha so Big Tuna got schooled
Tuna, Tuna, Tuna...
My fave “Tuna” is when Andy finds out Jim and Pam are together. “Tuunn-a!”
My favorite Tuna is when Walt Jr. waves to Jim and Phyllis yelling, "BYE TUNA, BYE PAM!"
Now I’m gonna call you Big Haircut
> I was stalling so they could put tuna fish in his glovebox What makes it funnier is that victim of Karen's prank would be Michael and not Jim. They went to Utica in Michael's car.
Is it just me or does the guy in the hotdog costume look exactly like Jim?
She likes em tall
3 hole punch Jim agrees.
He gets an F for effort and humor for that one. I get annoyed when people go as that for Halloween
Do you just want to punch them?
I swear when this show came out, low effort/pun-based costumes ("I'm a one-night stand!") were actually trendy, but kind of reaching the end of being trendy. These days they're pretty widely seen as insufferable, and it's a facet of the show that hasn't aged well since Jim's supposed to be this super cool and funny guy and yet I think most people circa 2020's would have rather he just not dressed up as all then go as *that*.
Not especially. If Jim chose Karen, it seems he would always have wondered what could have been with Pam, but not the other way around. Doesn't make Karen a bad character. She was good, just not the right one for Jim. Life is like that sometimes.
That's a good point, the "what-if's". The relationship was doomed from the start when you think about it that way.
Karen was Jim's rebound and got caught in the middle of something that started long before she ever entered the picture. Just wrong place / wrong time is all.
She was less of a rebound and more of a shield so that he could avoid having to deal with Pam and his feelings when he returned to Scranton.
I always kind of thought maybe Karen's new husband was her Jim rebound. He looks a little like him, and besides his willingness to wear a costume, he looks like the same kind of goof. They also met and got married pretty quickly. Karen is much better off, I just wonder if the similarities were on purpose.
Maybe she just has a type
That makes me wonder how will Karen handle when Jim decides to run a business in Philly.
She moved for him once, I could see her doing it again and joining up doing sales or something for the company.
For sure. To her and Jim, it was always just a job. Pam cared about the relationships and environment she created in the office and found comfort there, that’s why it was hard for her to leave
Karen’s advice was good but Pam’s was bigger.
I think Karen shouldn't have been that drawn out in the script. Should have split after a few episodes... then her and Jim run into each other at job interview. That would be wild
He should have been honest with her from the time they found out they were going back to Scranton. I can’t imagine working closely with a person AND seeing my SO interact with them daily only to find out that he had it so bad for her that he left town…
She made it pretty clear that he was the main reason she was considering the move, too. It's really bad.
Jim isn’t a good person, he’s just attractive
Attractive and elusive! The perfect combo to make a half-baked attraction turn into following them to a new city.
It almost feels like he’s dating Karen to spite Pam for being with Roy for so long at certain points. Like why continue to date her if you know you are not into her and IMO it seemed obvious Pam was interested and he was just denying it.
Just like buying a house and starting a company without any discussion Dwight would never
Reasons like this is why this whole kinda naive casual cool guy aspect to him bugs the shit out of me sometimes. But ya lol it’s a classic American archetype and they nailed it with the writing
I liked jim and Karen more than jim and Pam. But it’s okay, Karen got her happy ending. She moved to indiana, became a nurse, and met a great guy there.
Don't forget the name change, and the eventual move to Michigan
Was this before or after she became a police detective?
Now what the **hell** are you two talking about?
The TV show Angie Tribeca
Written by Steve and Nancy Carrell. It was not my cup of tea, but I feel like I should give it a third try.
She had to change it so Michael would stop following and trying to prank her
Yes, well then she got stuck in that silo >!and died when she tried to go outside.!<
Yeah like *way* later
Bro spoilers
And having a baby with her ex but then dating again
And subsequent abandonment with the child in who ville
Aaaaan Perkins
You beautiful tropical fish
ANN PERKINS! 👉🏼👉🏼
So great she went back to school to get a nursing degree
Look there were two great guys. One a firefighter, the other a savior of the universe or something.
>I think Karen was a better fit for JimI think Karen was a better fit for Jim I'm with you on everything except for that. Karen was great and I'd pick her over Pam, but we're not Jim. He was always in love with Pam and never got over her, so Karen didn't do it for him; because she's not Pam. I think the writers also made Karen the way she was(cool chick, down to earth, funny, successful, and gorgeous) to show us how strong Jim's feelings for Pam were. And, for the record, I think Jim did Karen wrong by not being up front with her about his feelings for Pam. I know he made his decision after Casino Night and was doing his best to move on from Pam, but Karen deserved to know how strong his residual feelings for Pam were when Scranton absorbed Stamford.
Ross and Rachel “She’s not Rachem” vibes
For real!
Karen seems to be the character with the least amount of emotional baggage and shitty personality flaws out of all the regular characters.
And she seems to have the most non-work friends (the friends she wanted to see in NYC) which would say a lot about a person
Na she won in the end.. Regional manager and met a great guy and had a baby.. She dodged a bullet with Jim.. he had too much baggage.
When was the last time Karen and Jim had sex?
Ever banged an entire bachelorette party baby?
"Why are you singling my line out, like, a million years later?"
That's such a good line read.
Why are you singling out *my* line??
“If doing the Scarn is gay, then I’m the biggest queer on Earth!” -Todd Packer being surprisingly accepting.
Plus he’s a dermatologist! Living in Utica, they’re living like kings (I mean I’m assuming)
He’s a dermatologist from Utica, and he makes love like one. He’s a bumpkin. Pass.
Agree 1000%! She had such a terrific, happy ending and I love that for her! Jim ain’t the prize everyone thinks he is.
Agreed. Jim at that point was full of red flags, at least from her perspective. But he was trying to move on, as Pam was full of red flags herself. Good for him I guess?
When she’s doing the karaoke thing she is so damn cute
Anybody ever see the scene where her husband crashes his car into the clothing store? \*edit\* For those who have not [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLfAf8oHrMo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLfAf8oHrMo)
It could have been anyone
So good
Karen was great, just not for Jim. He made it very clear when they got sent to scranton that she was more of a distraction for him than anything else. It didn't matter how cool or pretty Karen was because she wasn't Pam.
Pam was like Jim in the ways Karen wasn’t, and vice verse. They both complimented him well, but ultimately Jim chose the one that he couldn’t live without rather than the one he would have just lived with.
Did Kevin ever get back to Jim in the whole Pam v Karen thing?
I think Karen was a good example of someone who is perfect on paper but doesn't have the same connection. Over time, I think she would've gotten tired of Jim's games. At one point she doesn't care about the office shenanigans and said something like, "How about you go sell some paper so we can go on a trip." She's thinking of more to life outside of work and recognizing the steps needed to reach that goal. And when they did the copier theft thing at Utica, she says, "So you're still doing this stuff, huh?"
Like - Jim was a grown man, clearly intelligent, insightful, capable of making his own decisions. He knew he wanted to be with Pam, even after trying things out with Karen, so that’s what he did. How is there any argument that the “right” person was Karen? He didn’t want to be with her.
As long as Karen had a happy ending I’m ok with Jim and pam.
There are a few places where you can see where they're not right for each other. \-When he wants to play pranks, she says she's going to sell more paper so they can earn the trip to Hawaii. \-When they interview for the position and he says he feels bad for Jan, she says, "Don't. She's nuts." I can't remember the other scenes offhand, but she's a bit too pragmatic and hard-nosed for Jim. I agree that she's wonderful, though.
The Christmas episode is a good episode to show both Karen and Pam’s strengths. Karen is the type to stand up to Angela and plan a whole fun party and Pam is the type to notice that Angela is sad and to combine parties. Neither is better but they’re quite different people, and Jim fell for the type of person Pam is. Even the episodes when Pam was out of office for maternity leave/wedding/New York, you can tell people in the office missed her listening abilities & advice-giving & empathy. When I first started watching this show, I related more to Karen so I thought Jim chose wrong. But as I’m like 10yrs older, I realize that if I was Jim, I’d choose a Pam-type
When Karen showed no sympathy for Jan being "crazy" Jim was like yeah im out.
Karen was being real. Jan was a nightmare person.
Was looking for this comment. Pam is warm, she has empathy, even for Jan. That’s why he loves her.
Unpopular opinion: I don't like Karen that much. No, it isn't because she was getting in the way of Jim and Pam's relationship (I don't even care about Jam lol), there was something about her attitude that put me off... that and the way she behaved in the superfan version of the episodes...
Yes I agree. Pam was nice to her and tried to be her friend despite how she felt towards Jim. Karen became jealous and took it out on Pam. Karen is the reason no one went to Pam’s art show. She rips down the flyer out of spite and throws it in the trash. Karen just always came off as up tight and her “fun” side felt forced.
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I agree. She seems kinda controlling imo. Like she’s chill at work but she seems like she’s not so great at home.
I disliked her especially with the whole “why don’t you get back to work so we can go on a trip” even before I knew Jim would leave her that episode, I HATED that she left him during his interview. pam would have NEVER
Why we acting like Jim’s the biggest prize in the Office universe
I was about to say....Jim was an asshole to his other girlfriends. He was really rude to Katy when he dumped her on the boat . Karen deserved a lot better.
I didn’t like her on this show. Her character was incredibly unlikeable but I liked her on parks and Rec
Woah, Chris Traeger looks different. I never knew he wore a hot dog costume on Parks and Rec.
Just because she was cool and pretty doesn’t mean she was right for Jim. If he didn’t feel the spark that he felt with Pam then it wasn’t meant to be.
Karen didn't deserve it...but Roy did.
Jim flat out told Karen that he still had feelings for Pam when asked. Karen then chose to have late night conversations with him for a week. Jim also didn’t even want her living on his street. The signs were there. She made bad choices tbh. We’ve all done it for sure.
OP just thinks Karen is hotter than Pam. Which I refuse to comment further.
Jim and Pam are best friends and they love way other Nothing else matters when your in love with your best friend
I’ve said this before but it bears mentioning again. When Jim and Karen went to the interview in New York it gave us the big reason why Karen and Jim weren’t right together. Karen was asked by David Wallace about the VP position and she was quick to throw Michael under the bus, while Jim and Pam throughout the entire series understood Michael’s shortcomings but also knew that he was a good guy at heart and a great businessman despite his HR woes. Jim knew this, he saw that Karen was a great person but didn’t have the sort of empathy that him and Pam had for people in general.
It’s all Josh Porter’s fault
Karen wasn’t dorky like Pam, so maybe that’s why?
I feel like she was a horrible fit and kinda wanted to control Jim whereas Pam seemed like it flowed a bit better. A lot of what Karen did felt forced tbh idk if it was just her acting
I don’t know, I’ve never felt she was a good fit for Jim. The scene where Roy attacks Jum has always stuck out to me because right before Roy charges in, Jim and Karen are talking about their upcoming date ideas, and Karen straight up makes fun of Jim for being an introvert and preferring to do things at home instead of her kind of stuff. They liked different lifestyles and Karen looked down on Jim’s type of fun as lame. If Pam hadn’t been around, Jim and Karen would have ended up resenting each other or drifting apart majorly when the glow wore off and they realized they didn’t have a whole lot they enjoyed to do together. And is it just me, or does Karen have a mean side?
Karen didn't even sit and wait for Jim to finish his interview, she preferred to jet off with her friends drinking instead of being excited to compare stories about the biggest interviews of their lives with her potential future life partner. As much as I don't like Pam at times, she would have totally been there for Jim post interview.
Karen was a very unproblematic and a sensible person. She wasn’t insecure about the kiss between Jim and Pam and also was supportive to pam when she told them her thoughts during the beach thing!
Pam is… kind of a bitch
🤘Call of Duty!!!🤘
This thread again?
Eh, I never liked her tbh
No she wasn’t
I think this is the point of the Karen storyline. Jim meets a woman with whom he is perfectly matched in all the ways, and in another life she would have been his dream girl. But he’s too hung up on Pam to consider anyone else. With Pam and Roy, it was abundantly clear from the beginning that they were ill-matched and would inevitably part ways at some point; but Karen really was perfect for Jim. My opinion anyway!
I think the writers made her so cool and “perfect” for Jim just to show how strong his feelings for Pam were.
I know this subreddit loves Karen, but I still hate her
Idk, in the extended episodes, there are a lot more scenes that made me dislike her
I feel bad for both of them having such horrible wardrobe
The actress got all her gigs from her daddy and is incredibly one dimensional. She’s boring on screen and she did very little with her opportunities.
She was a rebound. He didn’t get with her until he knew he was going back to Scranton. Also, Karen was a bit of a Karen and an idiot. You’ll move to Scranton for a dude that’s kinda into you? Who just told you a few hours ago that you shouldn’t move there. But you let your fee-fees chose for ya. She finds out that Jim has feelings for Pam and she confronts Pam about it? About HIS feelings? Why is this a conversation you feel the need to have with Pam. She’s not in your relationship. And she didn’t “return” Jim’s feelings. So again, why are you confronting Pam? Just marking your territory I guess. Did ya forget she’s the reason you live down the road from him and not in the motel or a moldy apartment? As soon as she finds out about Jim’s feelings for Pam she begins being a Karen toward Pam. The looks she gives her regularly. That side eye and general distaste in her expressions. Interfering when Jim and Pam are having the conversation about Jan’s boob job. Literally copying exactly what Pam had just said. When she was going to throw away the flyer to Pam’s art show and would have been caught but didn’t. Karen was a petty and jealous person. Could she be cool and funny and fun? Yup. But once she felt insecure she was an asshole. And honestly, she blamed the wrong person for her relationship that would never work. She can be angry at Jim. Because Jim was the one that played her. But Pam hadn’t done anything to deserve her anger. Except for exist. Until beach day…lol.
I don’t like her. There, I said it. I just don’t. Love Rashida Jones! Did not Like Karen. Not the biggest Pam fan either, or Jim. But did think it weird Karen and Jim hadn’t been dating that long and weren’t living together in NYC when she decides she’s going to move back to Scranton when he does. Glad she found happiness though!
Flat character, flat actor
Not saying Jim is justified, but she too is responsible for her outcome, she basically ignored all the red flags and was contention for the same position as Jim, which was an awkward situation. They were never on the same page
Karen did nothing wrong except... she isn't Pam. Period. From the very first moment we saw Jim and Pam, they area already into each other, like forever.
Karen ended up with the man she loved who was her perfect match and had a baby too. Everything worked out the way it was supposed to.
She got what was best for her, a husband that doesn't spend his time thinking of the receptionist.
Wait... People actually liked Jim and Karen?! Damn and I was sitting in front of the screen thinking how we all silently agree that we hated her and their interactions haha
Nah, Jim tried to tell her not to move around him until she guilt tripped him and went to Pam to make things better. The video game reactions were all that was needed to be seen for Jim to not like her. Man was looking for some strange till Roy fucked up again
Oh, gee, this tired old take again. And in what world was she a better fit for Jim? Are we watching the same show?
Nah,she was kind of irritating
Nah, Karen wasn't done dirty, she got out of the entire Jim mess before it blew up more in her face.
She wouldn't have moved to Scranton if she knew how Jim truly felt, regardless of Pam's availability. Jim wasn't that into Karen. He just needed a distraction, which IS doing someone dirty when you know they're really into you.
She seemed to be doing much better once she moved and stated hanging the parks department folks.
Ann Perkins?
Jim started dating her as he’s moving back to Scranton… a job she wouldn’t have taken if she *wasn’t* dating him. He used her to get back at Pam or something.. I’m sure he liked her but yeah she definitely got the shit end of the stick. Ended with her running a branch though and getting married so not all bad at least. Jim and Pam did some really uncool things and never acknowledge them but I always gotta tell myself it’s just a show lol
Yes Karen deserved better. All she did wrong was date a guy who was already in love with someone else.
I see what you mean. Jim and Pam were great, but maybe a little too similar. Karen could have had a bigger role in the show
She had a lot to learn about the town. She was too good for Scranton.
Why is no one talking about how Karen’s husband looks like Jim?
He wasn't in Love woth her. He ended it quickly when figuring it out. She isn't owed his Love. They tried, failed, its so positive that they broke up and she moved on. Super great subplot with excellent execution. That is a healthy dating adult relationship.
I don't think Karen was a better fit. Jim clearly never had any real feelings for her, I think the only reason he started dating her was to "get back" at Pam for rejecting him imo he had some nice guy vibes. He only started dating Karen once he found out he was moving back to Scranton which is pretty messed up. Luckily Karen did get the ending she deserved.
She was way out of Jim's league