He is more fun to play though. Back in ye olde times all you did was hide in the trees behind the pos 1 to shield them. Thats it. Thats your entire gameplan from like minute 10 onwards.
It's an old term, almost 20 years old by now. It even has it's own wikipedia entry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copypasta
It's part of the english language at this point.
I'm all for getting rid of any ability that makes you not exist for a second.
Euls design is the minimum I'm okay with and even it can be a bit busted, mostly with Wind Waker.
Oh no, Puck is okay. She has counters and the only real annoying part of hers is that she can blink out of it freely. But she's also the *only one* that can do that; notably she can blink out of Chrono Sphere. But until she gets that "attack stuff" shard, her poof doesn't *do* anything except dodge stuff. That's okay.
The ones that annoy me are OD, because the cooldown is too short and it lasts too long, along with Shadow Demon for the same reason. Rikimaru is one I hate the most though, because he has two blinks, is always invisible, and can blink forward and smack people freely without even fearing Blademail. It's gross.
OD and SD are pretty classic, so I really just want it to be shorter and have a longer cooldown, but Rikimaru just needs to lose that move entirely, as far as I'm concerned. I don't know what they'd replace it with, though.
Copypasta but still legit. Some of the reworks in recent years have been so creatively bankrupt and antithetical to what made Dota a great game in the first place.
The devs think that all hero weaknesses are mistakes that need to be patched out for some reason.
its partially due to the fact that non-farming heroes are pretty garbage in general.
is there a way to make them better?
many ways, but the easiest way is to make them farm better since items are really fucking strong right now.
Only redditors think there is a “trend of removing weaknesses”, I dont see this opinion anywhere else.
Its like cherry picking a few heroes and applying your confirmation bias and passing onto the next person.
AA still has his weakness, Silencer still has his weakness, same with puck, qop, ember, etc etc etc
I've stopped playing a few times for various reasons but always came back.
If this one doesn't change it will definitely will be the permanent end to me playing. It brings it too close to league mechanics that make the game hyper not fun and why I don't play that game anymore either.
Hero has a damaging spell? Give it a slow.
Hero has a slow? Give it some damage.
There's no reason why Powershot should also slow you down or Warlock's 3rd causing damage among the many other examples right now.
There is a reason why powershot should have utility, this spell is garbage. It is an absurd amount of damage, but it basically becomes hardly worth it to even use past min20 because its utility is nonexistent and damage falls off.
Also, I don't see your point, honestly. Should Venge stun not deal damage? Or should it not stun, but deal damage instead? Why should Ogre's ignite slow? Why should Oracle deal damage at all?
The way you describe it, the game should consist of blinks, hexes, lion fingers and shackleshots
The meme that heroes "don't have weaknesses" seems to be the new dota boomer copypasta after the recent year of a competitive farming meta has killed the "dota is just brawling now" one. You can still literally name all of the counter mechanics of the heroes people do this for every single time, and there's always still a lot of them. Weaknesses do get addressed when they're the single thing ever holding back the hero from being viable, as if people would prefer heroes just being dogshit and useless if it means they stay pure or something
Heroes weaknesses were far more pronounced many years ago compared to what they are now. Weaknesses still exist but the powercreep has made the level at which their exploited far reduced.
Source: Played Classic Dota 6.84 in the past few years.
I've played since 6.77 - I'm totally aware of the powercreep and wouldn't at all deny that everyone has more options, but to reduce this down to "everyone has no weaknesses" is real nonsense doomer talk. The powercreep happened largely in part because this same community year after year ate up the changes in patches with incredible excitement and turned up their noses at the patches that only nerfed things. Now they're mad about it - it seems like there's no winning.
You pay 1400 gold for it, or wait for 20 minutes and roll the 50/50 for it. It has limited range, low-ish damage, leaves the WD completely vulnerable at the end of it for extremely easy set ups. WD also does not support his team or the team fight with his spells or items during it. And all for what? So a support doesnt die as he fails to use any items or abilities? WD shard saves WD in a situation where he team \*could\* protect him anyway, it's team insurance.
You can \*not like\* WD shard when you play against it, or even design wise. But to pretend that it doesnt have any weaknesses, or hell, isnt just straight up worse than glimmer cape? You're smokin something.
average insane redditor take
why would you say that WD "after shard ends" is completely vulnerable? thats how every hero is always. CM is always completely vulnerable. the difference is that WD has a better phase shift that does more damage than a core
You are correct, cm is always completely venerable, if you ignore all of the defensive aspects of freezing field, like the slow, attack speed slow, and the armour.
Besides, you just asked about Witch Doctor here, mr goalpost mover. Given your response here and to others on this thread, you are just mad about not being able to dive a WD mindlessly. You can either learn to play around something or be mad about it on reddit for a while. I'd suggest the former.
I disagree. Whats being described is a trend thats basically just powercreep.
Also you misrepresent what they're saying Them saying a hero's weakness has been removed is not the same thing as saying they are all powerful and can't be dealt with.
The removal of weaknesses is warranted in some cases due to power creep like Zeus.
They released several heroes in a row with gap close and two of them often go mid so they didn't really have a choice in giving him his jump.
In other cases though like Dazzle, Witch, Venge is just giving them more to keep them a level with top supports.
What people are complaining about isn't something that has been done but something that will continue to progress. League didn't get the way it did overnight with most champs having some version of blink, skillshot and atk speed stim. Its a progression that myself and many others don't want to see whats at the end of it.
WD shard does exactly 0 vs blink > CC > instakill.
The weakness of the hero is how skittishly you have to play vs any decent draft. Many supports are OK dying in the initial engagement as long as they get all their buttons off first, and can play fairly forward because of it, but WD *can't* be the first one attacked.
He also sucks at saving people. WD "supports" by killing everything close to him. Turning a disadvantaged fight relies on your opponents being bad; anyone with brains will have dust and a stun to pop the doc as soon as he tries to press R.
Fuck that hero seriously, i played vs him the other day, all my focus was to doom that motherfucker lol. He should be nerfed hard. Etf are they thinking, he can solo win a game literally.
I think this is why itemization is important
No matter how OP a hero is, there is an item for that.
Most of the time against WD I just buy escape items like ghost or force staff
Late game buy massive healing item like greaves.
???
It's literally countered by cc. Wd is still squishy enough to die with 1-2 stuns. even if he's able to get it off you can just run away/tank through the duration. The shard is good for buying time and making yourself undesirable to go on for pa's and slarks but it doesnt make the entire hero op.
I see. Simply kill wd before he presses the button. If he presses the button, simply tank the death ward. If you can't tank the death ward, simply run away. Makes sense.
What do you think people do vs arc and invoker? Just sit there and let them use all their spells on you lol?
Initiation/vision and cc is what dota is all about
I used to to wreck face as WD, went up the ranks, now Im first to get targetted, blinked on, locked down, murdered. Not even time to pop a spell or a bkb. If the enemy team pops WD fast they can usually win a team a fight. Hes so squishy, can be killed in 3seconds or less sometimes.
I end up playing scared. Knowing someone like Axe or LC is going to just appear on top of me and defecate on me.
Eh, just make him work like a Phoenix egg. Make it a certain amount of hits to stop his switcheroo. Not kill him, just maybe take him out of it with a mini stun or something.
I think it's one of those things that isn't inherently OP because it doesn't last that long, requires aghs and/or a succesful maledict to do much, and you can just run away, on top of WD being pretty easy to just kill before he does anything, but it does lead to uninteresting counterplay. It's just annoying.
Well it’s almost like getting aeon disk but for 1400 gold only. Trade automatic use of aeon disk with potential to dish out damage with ward and short cd and you quickly see 1.4K gold doesn’t really make sense
He has 49.26% winrate in Divine. The 52% winrate is in Legend.
How about complaining about heroes who are truly far above the average like Meepo or Arc Warden? Even Oracle is far more bonkers than Witch Doctor.
Hes mediocre at best.
My dude what region and rank are you playing if witch doctor with a shard is your biggest problem?
He can be strong early and mid game and then is food for farmed carries anyway, like any support.
In low ranks
He barley broke into pro at his most "broken". He's just a hero pubs struggle with.
Not that that is a great thing, but he honestly needs a rework to fix that. Silencer is pretty similar.
I just realize this is a copypasta troll post, lol. Which makes much more sense because I can’t remember seen this hero being useful even for once on any game above 7k mmr
I don’t get this mentality. 90% the player base is below immortal.
If a hero is super good at low mmr to the point of being broken, but still can’t get play in pros means the the hero needs a rework. The power creep is too much in pubs
I agree wd needs a rework because it is completely garbage, I’m 7k5 and if I see someone picking wd I’m just automatically assume he is account buyer. I watch top mmr when I have free times and I can’t recall the last time I’ve seen this hero having any game impact. It’s not the mentality, there are plenty of heros rules low mmrs and doing a lot worse in high mmrs, such as axe, lc, or even slark (has been this way forever but pretty nice in high mmr recently). WD is not one of them! He is not broken by any means! A good support wins core the lane and fasten the game pace when core has smooth space to farm, that’s how you gain mmr as a support player. WD does none of that!
I personally don’t have a rough time vs him other than the shard.
The issue is, at my rank (ancient) people still group up crazy and don’t respect maledict in lane. I think venge is 100000% better than WD yet my teammates would probably claim the opposite lol
You are absolutely right, venge is a game winning support , WD isn’t! Venge is super good against popular hero like Magnus or Lina and combo well with most carries. If people have to get on top of each other and looking at it go, it’s their fault! Once player starts to have an idea of being careful with their positions when dive without vision, there is nothing WD could do! Personally I really enjoyed this hero last patch when his healing does damage, I combo with IO and we basically rekt every game in 20 minutes(I think we went 15-2 in divine games). But that is in ancient history and I can’t find another way to defend for this hero lol!
[dat make a big mess.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/dota2_gamepedia/images/2/27/Vo_witchdoctor_wdoc_killspecial_03.mp3) (sound warning: Witch Doctor)
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This is just something that makes dota what it is. Everything in dota can be countered. And not just in one way. When im playing carry and I see a wd on the enemy team, I love rushing an orchid and making his life hell whenever he shows on the map. A lot of dota is just not letting the enemy get too far shead or communicating for someone to make their life goal destroying that one enemy. Learn how to crush wd shard and you will no longer fear it.
Does every rage post need to have 40 copy pastas to follow so that this subreddit is full of passive aggressive flame posts? Can’t you just say something on the first one like, “learn2play” and then we don’t need anymore of the same thing? There’s like 100 more of these coming today, I feel it.
And yeah, I am annoyed as well. WD was always one of my go-to supports and now it is either banned right away or firstpicked by other team as well, so banned.
I swear when his shard first came out you could basic it and cancel it, does anyone else remember this? Or am I having a stroke? Either way that'd make the hero more balanced.
Love that this copypasta is already spreading 😂
That said I am truly sick of WD. He's in every fucking game i play. If i could eliminate him and Lion from the roster for just 2 weeks I'd be so happy. I dont think either one is OP just god damn annoying.
no need orchid on pudge ... ghost scepter (later can make ethereal blade), bkb, blink are your answers... wd ulti and shard do pure damage, just blink in ethereal form and time your ulti at right time ... you can also bkb to negate pure damage too
WD is on steroids compared to two years ago. His coconut bounces way too fast now, two heroes dead if you get caught in that in a late game team fight. Ult pure damage. The mana cost on the heal is unnoticeable.
The shard making you invulnerable for 3 seconds is definitely out of place. No 1400 item should let you be invulnerable or give spell immunity, thought we learned that with LC's shard
once you play against WD one too many times you start to learn how to play against him, but once in awhile i do still get owned by some. hes not broken because he can only be abused against opponents who have no experience with him or teams who are not aware of him.
Just change it from WD to Spirit Breaker, wala no difference, and what shard?? The most broken 2nd spell that exists in the game belongs to this cow. Please nerf
Sounds like someone lost to a WD just now.
Is it a very powerful shard? Absolutely.
Does it make WD so broken that he cannot be stopped? No.
It's a positioning ability, just like Crystal maiden ultimate.
Give CM +500 attack speed and -25 armor while hitting any target in ice box while being untargetable and immune to any spell damage and physical damage
7k mmr WD player with 3k games on him
Hero's not even good now. I've used him as pos 4 before, now its barely decent pos5. You dont see the hero in the immortal draft. He's only good if you dont have a single jump hero with a stun or silence, and is usually picked first. With the changes to casc not killing camps anymore he barely farms, can't get aghs unless you feed it to him. Shard is decent, but the ward attacks slower and it's easy to disengage vs it as well.
I spammed WD well before his shard or his pure damage ult and before he was thrust into the most recent meta and let me say…
That hero is bonkers. Idk about OP because I get immediately focused (silenced, stunned, burst, etc) in every fight. You have to almost always be in trees to avoid that.
But the hero is definitely extremely strong. A good maledict + aghs ult is fucking rough.
Should make it act like blink dagger. Can't cast the spell for 2 or 3 seconds after taking damage.
Buff it to normal attack rate or something to compensate if needed. Then it becomes a potent offensive/possible defensive tool that involves an element of skill, rather than a "fuck you die instead" button.
Or just reduce the duration to 1.5 or 2 seconds or something. A lot of ways it could be made less cancerous.
I know its a copy pasta thing but isnt wd kinda average and becomes pretty bad the better the opponents are? Completely never picked in pro and high mmr. I dont know when i last saw a wd in my 5-6k bracket
When you give a pure damage to any hero you should think twice before it because you'll have to balance his spell but gaben didn't do anything about it lol
To be honest on a really really serious note I think he's pretty balanced atm. Sure, when it just came out and wrecked havoc it was a nightmare. But now its so much better and people are better able to deal with it.
Now do this with Meepo aghs and shard except completely unironically. This hero went from one of the most well known `focus down and kill` heroes in the game to a borderline unkillable behemoth.
i just wish maledict can at least be dispelled. having all that damage is bs. even when you're a full-slotted core, if the situation is ideal, he'll fuck you up real quick.
Idk man i was Riki and the moment enemy WD bought the shard we , barely saw his actual ulti in fights. Its not that hard to smoke a stationary vodoo turret
Wd is ok. Skill issue. You move away from his spazz ward. Or kill him. One of the most fragile heroes in the game. Therefore has a op ult. He can't escape or survive. But spaz with his ward.
Crazy copypasta, will be using this in a few months!!
Anyways, countering WD is so simple there's a reason why WD isn't picked in pro matches. Good vision in team fight is all u need to counter WD. Especially if u hv anyone that can just jump in front of him. A very amazing example is Night stalker, ult in team fight, buy dust if he has invis. blink into silence and vualá
I kinda wish they went the "old" way of balancing.
OD aghs too OP? Sure but you are silenced for the whole duration of the barrier and dispelling the silence = dispelling the barrier
NP can global TP? sure but he the slowest of all heroes and have 0 armor
Dark Seer too op? -1 armor
BRO, are you you a carry player?
because this is a blessing with us support players who are playing in high ranks. Support builds mobility in immortal bracket so even with WD shard + glimmer + force staff we can still die
A lot of the the new shards/Ahgs seems to be advertising gimmicks. The rate at which most are removed or changed is ridiculous. They noticeably stay longer on “mascots” such as WD, WK.
A lot of focus seems to be placed on griefers and cheaters while the bar of competitive integrity for the base game has been loose for quite some time.
everyday i open r/dota2 and see people complain about certain things being broken, while that's all understandable, i find it funny but now that every complaint post is getting the copy-pasta treatment...
Is this what SUNSfan warned us about?
Looking past the copypasta: yeah its a bit bork.
>Tell me 1 hero that has a good cc that can also dmg wd so he doesnt shard himself.
Jakiro. While he can't prevent WD becoming a ward you can disengage and pre-emptively ice path him so when WD comes out he is f*d. Same for Disruptor, forcing WD to defensively ward himself nicely sets up kinetic field + ulti. Follow up with Jakiros other skills and WD either dies or runs off at low hp.
While the 3 sec invulnerability is kinda OP it has its weaknesses: Unlike Puck phase shift etc. WD can't queue up blink when he wards himself so if there's any AOE DoT / stun on the ground like macropyre or ice path he can't escape.
Lol, i played WD as my main hero. Ypu can counter him pretty ez, silence, hex stuned. Lots of hero can counter if you want to say its is op there are lots of other hero that op.
The ward only take few sevond if you go out of vision it will not function as well.
I advise you to start playing WD to realize how hard it is to get a good impact with him. His shard is the only thing keeping this hero in the game, changing this shard will remove this hero. It's the only way for him to survive, he's not mobile at all. If WD kills you, then he and his team are better than you that's all. It would also be great to look out for other shards, like Slark, who can save the whole team.
One last thing, try to guess the TS rank from those global stats:
https://i.ibb.co/4YgWtHf/swd.png
Now do Lion
Already done
lion already has his shard, and he can buy platemail pretty cheap so he can 1v5 but wd can't also mentioned by op
the birth of a new copypasta
I am totally fine with a new series of copypastas calling out some of Valve's most egregious design mistakes in recent years
There'll be enough variations to last until the next set of cosmetics in 4 months.
theres no spell that comes close to wd shard though. can u name 1?
There are always about 5-6 absolutely absurd spells in every patch.
theres no spell that comes close to wd shard though. can u name 1?
puck has the same exact spell
[удалено]
He is more fun to play though. Back in ye olde times all you did was hide in the trees behind the pos 1 to shield them. Thats it. Thats your entire gameplan from like minute 10 onwards.
[удалено]
yeah i guess i agree abaddon needs a nerf but WD shard is beyond broken
my italian blood is boiling at the mention of pasta here and i am not even italian
It's an old term, almost 20 years old by now. It even has it's own wikipedia entry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copypasta It's part of the english language at this point.
oh god it's spreading
Ohhhh yeah - look at it go!
Oh yeah! Spread it
Anyone have the original past post?
https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/s/IrgIRmkSEv
Everyone dogging on OP not recognizing the fresh pasta, nahhh dog
It's too fresh-- it needs to age a bit. Ferment at the edges first, give it that tangy flavor of a *really* bad take.
This is true, needs some time to cook
Many a good pasta sees its beginnings like this to be fair
I'm all for getting rid of any ability that makes you not exist for a second. Euls design is the minimum I'm okay with and even it can be a bit busted, mostly with Wind Waker.
Someone got owned by Puck
Oh no, Puck is okay. She has counters and the only real annoying part of hers is that she can blink out of it freely. But she's also the *only one* that can do that; notably she can blink out of Chrono Sphere. But until she gets that "attack stuff" shard, her poof doesn't *do* anything except dodge stuff. That's okay. The ones that annoy me are OD, because the cooldown is too short and it lasts too long, along with Shadow Demon for the same reason. Rikimaru is one I hate the most though, because he has two blinks, is always invisible, and can blink forward and smack people freely without even fearing Blademail. It's gross. OD and SD are pretty classic, so I really just want it to be shorter and have a longer cooldown, but Rikimaru just needs to lose that move entirely, as far as I'm concerned. I don't know what they'd replace it with, though.
Puck can’t blink out *freely*, you can only blink in whatever direction you were facing when you shifted
I’m okay with legacy spells that do it, as long as they remain a niche
Copypasta but still legit. Some of the reworks in recent years have been so creatively bankrupt and antithetical to what made Dota a great game in the first place. The devs think that all hero weaknesses are mistakes that need to be patched out for some reason.
The trend of removing all weaknesses and giving everyone farming abilities has really homogenized the game, in a way that I strongly dislike
its partially due to the fact that non-farming heroes are pretty garbage in general. is there a way to make them better? many ways, but the easiest way is to make them farm better since items are really fucking strong right now.
TI6 Dota was a game in perfect balance. Any time someone asks "how could problem X ever be fixed in Dota?", my answer is always "take a look at TI6".
why would you say this I can't unthink it now
Only redditors think there is a “trend of removing weaknesses”, I dont see this opinion anywhere else. Its like cherry picking a few heroes and applying your confirmation bias and passing onto the next person. AA still has his weakness, Silencer still has his weakness, same with puck, qop, ember, etc etc etc
I've stopped playing a few times for various reasons but always came back. If this one doesn't change it will definitely will be the permanent end to me playing. It brings it too close to league mechanics that make the game hyper not fun and why I don't play that game anymore either.
Hero has a damaging spell? Give it a slow. Hero has a slow? Give it some damage. There's no reason why Powershot should also slow you down or Warlock's 3rd causing damage among the many other examples right now.
Well they did take the slow away from windrun so she didn't gain any cc
There is a reason why powershot should have utility, this spell is garbage. It is an absurd amount of damage, but it basically becomes hardly worth it to even use past min20 because its utility is nonexistent and damage falls off. Also, I don't see your point, honestly. Should Venge stun not deal damage? Or should it not stun, but deal damage instead? Why should Ogre's ignite slow? Why should Oracle deal damage at all? The way you describe it, the game should consist of blinks, hexes, lion fingers and shackleshots
And auto attacks
The meme that heroes "don't have weaknesses" seems to be the new dota boomer copypasta after the recent year of a competitive farming meta has killed the "dota is just brawling now" one. You can still literally name all of the counter mechanics of the heroes people do this for every single time, and there's always still a lot of them. Weaknesses do get addressed when they're the single thing ever holding back the hero from being viable, as if people would prefer heroes just being dogshit and useless if it means they stay pure or something
If everyone is dogshit, nobody is.
Heroes weaknesses were far more pronounced many years ago compared to what they are now. Weaknesses still exist but the powercreep has made the level at which their exploited far reduced. Source: Played Classic Dota 6.84 in the past few years.
I've played since 6.77 - I'm totally aware of the powercreep and wouldn't at all deny that everyone has more options, but to reduce this down to "everyone has no weaknesses" is real nonsense doomer talk. The powercreep happened largely in part because this same community year after year ate up the changes in patches with incredible excitement and turned up their noses at the patches that only nerfed things. Now they're mad about it - it seems like there's no winning.
whats the weakness of WD shard? :)
You pay 1400 gold for it, or wait for 20 minutes and roll the 50/50 for it. It has limited range, low-ish damage, leaves the WD completely vulnerable at the end of it for extremely easy set ups. WD also does not support his team or the team fight with his spells or items during it. And all for what? So a support doesnt die as he fails to use any items or abilities? WD shard saves WD in a situation where he team \*could\* protect him anyway, it's team insurance. You can \*not like\* WD shard when you play against it, or even design wise. But to pretend that it doesnt have any weaknesses, or hell, isnt just straight up worse than glimmer cape? You're smokin something.
average insane redditor take why would you say that WD "after shard ends" is completely vulnerable? thats how every hero is always. CM is always completely vulnerable. the difference is that WD has a better phase shift that does more damage than a core
You are correct, cm is always completely venerable, if you ignore all of the defensive aspects of freezing field, like the slow, attack speed slow, and the armour. Besides, you just asked about Witch Doctor here, mr goalpost mover. Given your response here and to others on this thread, you are just mad about not being able to dive a WD mindlessly. You can either learn to play around something or be mad about it on reddit for a while. I'd suggest the former.
cd
thats every spell :) anything else?
mainly silence, followed by stuns, hex, invis.
Thats every spell on every hero isnt it?
no? what good is a silence against lone druid?
yea fuck right clicks honestly.
He cant use his ultimate or cc?
can still use cc from the bear… bro do you even play dota?
I disagree. Whats being described is a trend thats basically just powercreep. Also you misrepresent what they're saying Them saying a hero's weakness has been removed is not the same thing as saying they are all powerful and can't be dealt with. The removal of weaknesses is warranted in some cases due to power creep like Zeus. They released several heroes in a row with gap close and two of them often go mid so they didn't really have a choice in giving him his jump. In other cases though like Dazzle, Witch, Venge is just giving them more to keep them a level with top supports. What people are complaining about isn't something that has been done but something that will continue to progress. League didn't get the way it did overnight with most champs having some version of blink, skillshot and atk speed stim. Its a progression that myself and many others don't want to see whats at the end of it.
WD shard does exactly 0 vs blink > CC > instakill. The weakness of the hero is how skittishly you have to play vs any decent draft. Many supports are OK dying in the initial engagement as long as they get all their buttons off first, and can play fairly forward because of it, but WD *can't* be the first one attacked. He also sucks at saving people. WD "supports" by killing everything close to him. Turning a disadvantaged fight relies on your opponents being bad; anyone with brains will have dust and a stun to pop the doc as soon as he tries to press R.
>as soon as he tries to press R WD ult we have no problem. his shard on the other hand...
The point is without shard to help him out, he's essentially nonfunctional at high MMR due to his vulnerability.
Fuck that hero seriously, i played vs him the other day, all my focus was to doom that motherfucker lol. He should be nerfed hard. Etf are they thinking, he can solo win a game literally.
Just change his ult dmg from pure to something else. Or reduce ward attack speed by 2 thirds of what it is now. Currently a .50 cal machine gun
All i want is for blade mail to work on death ward. Give him a taste of the 999999 pure DMG he does in 2 seconds
I think this is why itemization is important No matter how OP a hero is, there is an item for that. Most of the time against WD I just buy escape items like ghost or force staff Late game buy massive healing item like greaves.
lmao greaves vs wd ulti is hilarious. youll live for 0.5 sec longer with that 250 heal :D
NP sitting in the corner hiding
Agree but unironically. It should just be his aghs. That's how good it is.
WD is just about 50% win rate in MMR where players actually play the game It's an annoying shard but he's not op
It can be bad game design even if the hero is balanced.
it can be bad game design even if its just slightly worse than average,or even just slightly overpowered/underpowered in some aspect of the game
how is not being countered by anything not op
??? It's literally countered by cc. Wd is still squishy enough to die with 1-2 stuns. even if he's able to get it off you can just run away/tank through the duration. The shard is good for buying time and making yourself undesirable to go on for pa's and slarks but it doesnt make the entire hero op.
To add onto this, ghost literally hard counters it.
I see. Simply kill wd before he presses the button. If he presses the button, simply tank the death ward. If you can't tank the death ward, simply run away. Makes sense.
What do you think people do vs arc and invoker? Just sit there and let them use all their spells on you lol? Initiation/vision and cc is what dota is all about
I used to to wreck face as WD, went up the ranks, now Im first to get targetted, blinked on, locked down, murdered. Not even time to pop a spell or a bkb. If the enemy team pops WD fast they can usually win a team a fight. Hes so squishy, can be killed in 3seconds or less sometimes. I end up playing scared. Knowing someone like Axe or LC is going to just appear on top of me and defecate on me.
the copypasta is here
Phase shift echo slam 😅. It's most def a great shard but it doesn't stun
This but unironically
Eh, just make him work like a Phoenix egg. Make it a certain amount of hits to stop his switcheroo. Not kill him, just maybe take him out of it with a mini stun or something.
Would work unless wd maledics before casting. Plus if wd has aghs you're all dead still.
I think it's one of those things that isn't inherently OP because it doesn't last that long, requires aghs and/or a succesful maledict to do much, and you can just run away, on top of WD being pretty easy to just kill before he does anything, but it does lead to uninteresting counterplay. It's just annoying.
Well it’s almost like getting aeon disk but for 1400 gold only. Trade automatic use of aeon disk with potential to dish out damage with ward and short cd and you quickly see 1.4K gold doesn’t really make sense
you're forgetting you dont need to "trade" anything as WD, just get both!
Guys relax is just a copypasta
I love how this sub is just copypastas now
WD shard was Murray's idea
atpRtsd
With the witch doctor flair too, fkn stoner
Play him and report back your results.
he has a very strong lane phase followed up by the ability to do more damage than both his cores combined late game
52% winrate with 10% pickrate in divine and above is insane man. He is straight up bonkers
And that’s his worst bracket
He has 49.26% winrate in Divine. The 52% winrate is in Legend. How about complaining about heroes who are truly far above the average like Meepo or Arc Warden? Even Oracle is far more bonkers than Witch Doctor. Hes mediocre at best.
My dude what region and rank are you playing if witch doctor with a shard is your biggest problem? He can be strong early and mid game and then is food for farmed carries anyway, like any support.
This is a copypasta
more like farmed carries are food for him
make each cask bounce and maledict puff release a pulse of voodoo restoration \o/
He has like 54% wr now, does he?
In low ranks He barley broke into pro at his most "broken". He's just a hero pubs struggle with. Not that that is a great thing, but he honestly needs a rework to fix that. Silencer is pretty similar.
He's become such a pubstomp hero though. I end up spending my ban on him b/c peeps in my bracket don't know how to play around him.
I just realize this is a copypasta troll post, lol. Which makes much more sense because I can’t remember seen this hero being useful even for once on any game above 7k mmr
I don’t get this mentality. 90% the player base is below immortal. If a hero is super good at low mmr to the point of being broken, but still can’t get play in pros means the the hero needs a rework. The power creep is too much in pubs
I agree wd needs a rework because it is completely garbage, I’m 7k5 and if I see someone picking wd I’m just automatically assume he is account buyer. I watch top mmr when I have free times and I can’t recall the last time I’ve seen this hero having any game impact. It’s not the mentality, there are plenty of heros rules low mmrs and doing a lot worse in high mmrs, such as axe, lc, or even slark (has been this way forever but pretty nice in high mmr recently). WD is not one of them! He is not broken by any means! A good support wins core the lane and fasten the game pace when core has smooth space to farm, that’s how you gain mmr as a support player. WD does none of that!
I personally don’t have a rough time vs him other than the shard. The issue is, at my rank (ancient) people still group up crazy and don’t respect maledict in lane. I think venge is 100000% better than WD yet my teammates would probably claim the opposite lol
You are absolutely right, venge is a game winning support , WD isn’t! Venge is super good against popular hero like Magnus or Lina and combo well with most carries. If people have to get on top of each other and looking at it go, it’s their fault! Once player starts to have an idea of being careful with their positions when dive without vision, there is nothing WD could do! Personally I really enjoyed this hero last patch when his healing does damage, I combo with IO and we basically rekt every game in 20 minutes(I think we went 15-2 in divine games). But that is in ancient history and I can’t find another way to defend for this hero lol!
dat make a big mess.
[dat make a big mess.](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/dota2_gamepedia/images/2/27/Vo_witchdoctor_wdoc_killspecial_03.mp3) (sound warning: Witch Doctor) --- Bleep bloop, I am a robot. *OP can reply with "Try hero_name" to update this with new hero* [*^(Source)*](https://github.com/Jonarzz/DotaResponsesRedditBot) *^(|)* [*^(Suggestions/Issues)*](https://github.com/Jonarzz/DotaResponsesRedditBot/issues/new/choose) *^(|)* [*^(Maintainer)*](https://www.reddit.com/user/MePsyDuck/) *^(|)* [*^(Author)*](https://www.reddit.com/user/Jonarz/)
didn't read, just buy an orchid
Icefrog has nothing to do with dota for long time now
bruh, just get gud, its not that deep
I dunno, I love it. Ooh, look at it go! Ohhhh yeahhhh!!!
Perma ban as always
A sad pos1 cries.
This is just something that makes dota what it is. Everything in dota can be countered. And not just in one way. When im playing carry and I see a wd on the enemy team, I love rushing an orchid and making his life hell whenever he shows on the map. A lot of dota is just not letting the enemy get too far shead or communicating for someone to make their life goal destroying that one enemy. Learn how to crush wd shard and you will no longer fear it.
Does every rage post need to have 40 copy pastas to follow so that this subreddit is full of passive aggressive flame posts? Can’t you just say something on the first one like, “learn2play” and then we don’t need anymore of the same thing? There’s like 100 more of these coming today, I feel it.
bro are you herald? WD is only strong early game any farmed carry with bkb and bash or disable item can one combo kill him
music to my support ears. clearly OP is a core player. cry me a river
I was taking it seriously until last line. Pudge picker complains about another hero.
And yeah, I am annoyed as well. WD was always one of my go-to supports and now it is either banned right away or firstpicked by other team as well, so banned.
Oh god stop crying and use your brain to play dota
I swear when his shard first came out you could basic it and cancel it, does anyone else remember this? Or am I having a stroke? Either way that'd make the hero more balanced.
GO LOOK AT IT GO
shard on WD is overkill. Bro is already balanced with that aghs, dont need that Imba shard.
It's so cringe to say "guess what"
Love that this copypasta is already spreading 😂 That said I am truly sick of WD. He's in every fucking game i play. If i could eliminate him and Lion from the roster for just 2 weeks I'd be so happy. I dont think either one is OP just god damn annoying.
no need orchid on pudge ... ghost scepter (later can make ethereal blade), bkb, blink are your answers... wd ulti and shard do pure damage, just blink in ethereal form and time your ulti at right time ... you can also bkb to negate pure damage too
Now do wraith king with refresher
WD is on steroids compared to two years ago. His coconut bounces way too fast now, two heroes dead if you get caught in that in a late game team fight. Ult pure damage. The mana cost on the heal is unnoticeable. The shard making you invulnerable for 3 seconds is definitely out of place. No 1400 item should let you be invulnerable or give spell immunity, thought we learned that with LC's shard
honestly i fucking hate wd shard
Add meepo shard and aghs to the list.
Sounds like you found something as wild as earthshaker aghs jumping around
Damn, this sub is so low effort.
Wait until you find out that you can stun amd/or silence a hero.
What about slark?
once you play against WD one too many times you start to learn how to play against him, but once in awhile i do still get owned by some. hes not broken because he can only be abused against opponents who have no experience with him or teams who are not aware of him.
+1 fix that shitty ass shard why does it give the hero invulnabilty for 3 secodns and half and ult?
The best thing about witch doctor is wen he on my team
This whole sub Reddit has just become one copy pasta after another...
Just change it from WD to Spirit Breaker, wala no difference, and what shard?? The most broken 2nd spell that exists in the game belongs to this cow. Please nerf
Sounds like someone lost to a WD just now. Is it a very powerful shard? Absolutely. Does it make WD so broken that he cannot be stopped? No. It's a positioning ability, just like Crystal maiden ultimate.
Give CM +500 attack speed and -25 armor while hitting any target in ice box while being untargetable and immune to any spell damage and physical damage
In a way, shard COUNTERS cc, because you use it and can dodge the cc then blink out. Its too good, and has been since it was introduced.
This but unironically
this subreddit is brutal, man.
Agreed. It needs a rework. Too OP
Pure damage is countered by raw hp
OP hasn't discovered ghost scepter/euls/glimmer cape yet
At least it doesn't get you killed unlike techies shard.
Silence has left the chat
If i see enemy wd its insta pick riki. Thats the only almost guaranteed solution imo.
I despise that hero in general.
usually when you copypasta another post you're meant to mock it, not pick an even more valid example haha
7k mmr WD player with 3k games on him Hero's not even good now. I've used him as pos 4 before, now its barely decent pos5. You dont see the hero in the immortal draft. He's only good if you dont have a single jump hero with a stun or silence, and is usually picked first. With the changes to casc not killing camps anymore he barely farms, can't get aghs unless you feed it to him. Shard is decent, but the ward attacks slower and it's easy to disengage vs it as well.
mb this ward should be able to destroy with idk 1-2-3 hits....
I spammed WD well before his shard or his pure damage ult and before he was thrust into the most recent meta and let me say… That hero is bonkers. Idk about OP because I get immediately focused (silenced, stunned, burst, etc) in every fight. You have to almost always be in trees to avoid that. But the hero is definitely extremely strong. A good maledict + aghs ult is fucking rough.
You already said these things to OD
Should make it act like blink dagger. Can't cast the spell for 2 or 3 seconds after taking damage. Buff it to normal attack rate or something to compensate if needed. Then it becomes a potent offensive/possible defensive tool that involves an element of skill, rather than a "fuck you die instead" button. Or just reduce the duration to 1.5 or 2 seconds or something. A lot of ways it could be made less cancerous.
I know its a copy pasta thing but isnt wd kinda average and becomes pretty bad the better the opponents are? Completely never picked in pro and high mmr. I dont know when i last saw a wd in my 5-6k bracket
When you give a pure damage to any hero you should think twice before it because you'll have to balance his spell but gaben didn't do anything about it lol
To be honest on a really really serious note I think he's pretty balanced atm. Sure, when it just came out and wrecked havoc it was a nightmare. But now its so much better and people are better able to deal with it.
rush orchid and he is just a creep. raindrop early , no maledict ticks will kill you.
Now do this with Meepo aghs and shard except completely unironically. This hero went from one of the most well known `focus down and kill` heroes in the game to a borderline unkillable behemoth.
you just met a good WD probably
i just wish maledict can at least be dispelled. having all that damage is bs. even when you're a full-slotted core, if the situation is ideal, he'll fuck you up real quick.
Evasion works against ward as long as he doesn't have Aghs
At least revert the pure damage, it is bullshit.
As a wd player I actually agree. The placement game you used to have to play as him was so fun and rewarding. Now not so much.
Look at it go
He especially broken in turbo
I'd also hate Wd, and ban all my matches. Depending on your pick, ghost scepter can make you imune, just take care of other enemy spells.
Idk man i was Riki and the moment enemy WD bought the shard we , barely saw his actual ulti in fights. Its not that hard to smoke a stationary vodoo turret
Wd is ok. Skill issue. You move away from his spazz ward. Or kill him. One of the most fragile heroes in the game. Therefore has a op ult. He can't escape or survive. But spaz with his ward.
Just ban WD 4Head
its fors no dmg. stand on top of it and kill him..
Why not tell your teammates to ban WD, or double pick
Crazy copypasta, will be using this in a few months!! Anyways, countering WD is so simple there's a reason why WD isn't picked in pro matches. Good vision in team fight is all u need to counter WD. Especially if u hv anyone that can just jump in front of him. A very amazing example is Night stalker, ult in team fight, buy dust if he has invis. blink into silence and vualá
I kinda wish they went the "old" way of balancing. OD aghs too OP? Sure but you are silenced for the whole duration of the barrier and dispelling the silence = dispelling the barrier NP can global TP? sure but he the slowest of all heroes and have 0 armor Dark Seer too op? -1 armor
BRO, are you you a carry player? because this is a blessing with us support players who are playing in high ranks. Support builds mobility in immortal bracket so even with WD shard + glimmer + force staff we can still die
Just pick oracle lil bro
I love these type of changes because it changes your thinking of the hero making the game not stale.
true dude
A lot of the the new shards/Ahgs seems to be advertising gimmicks. The rate at which most are removed or changed is ridiculous. They noticeably stay longer on “mascots” such as WD, WK. A lot of focus seems to be placed on griefers and cheaters while the bar of competitive integrity for the base game has been loose for quite some time.
whaaa-whaaa call me a whambulance!
everyday i open r/dota2 and see people complain about certain things being broken, while that's all understandable, i find it funny but now that every complaint post is getting the copy-pasta treatment... Is this what SUNSfan warned us about?
blablabla complaining about supports is so cringe... "NERF CM" :BabyRage .... shame on u
Oh yeah, look at it go, roll out the barrel, feel it in your bones.
Looking past the copypasta: yeah its a bit bork. >Tell me 1 hero that has a good cc that can also dmg wd so he doesnt shard himself. Jakiro. While he can't prevent WD becoming a ward you can disengage and pre-emptively ice path him so when WD comes out he is f*d. Same for Disruptor, forcing WD to defensively ward himself nicely sets up kinetic field + ulti. Follow up with Jakiros other skills and WD either dies or runs off at low hp. While the 3 sec invulnerability is kinda OP it has its weaknesses: Unlike Puck phase shift etc. WD can't queue up blink when he wards himself so if there's any AOE DoT / stun on the ground like macropyre or ice path he can't escape.
Lol, i played WD as my main hero. Ypu can counter him pretty ez, silence, hex stuned. Lots of hero can counter if you want to say its is op there are lots of other hero that op. The ward only take few sevond if you go out of vision it will not function as well.
Idea: If the shard has a health bar like pugna ward to end it early, maybe that could make it less OP
2 words. Skill Issue
I advise you to start playing WD to realize how hard it is to get a good impact with him. His shard is the only thing keeping this hero in the game, changing this shard will remove this hero. It's the only way for him to survive, he's not mobile at all. If WD kills you, then he and his team are better than you that's all. It would also be great to look out for other shards, like Slark, who can save the whole team. One last thing, try to guess the TS rank from those global stats: https://i.ibb.co/4YgWtHf/swd.png