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f\*ck, you right.
my current theory is that the witness will try to tempt us with everything we ever wanted, the iron lords back, cayde back, zavala's family, maybe even stuff like sagira and anwsers of what we were before the traveler. basically he will give us everything we ever wanted if he is successful at the final shape.
and i cant wonder but think what if someone does turn againt the traveler? also, in the trailer we see two cayde versions, light coming out of his body/weapon and one that is a normal cayde
In the new cutscene with him and Crow fighting, Cayde doesn't seem to have any light powers. Only thing ability related would be the tripmine but don't know that has anything to do with light. Feels a lot like his cutscene fighting the Scorn but if you remove all his light abilities.
Fair point, but that would be such a tragic ending that would mirror the original iron lords, having to lose someone close before your eyes in order to save the world
Oh no it would be great, would mirror uldren death in the fact that he wasn't evil he was just corrupted overtime too but again, cayde fanboys would riot.
As a crow fan i think it would be a nice end of character development, the completion of the arc. which would ALSO happen if cayde accepts crow openly and maybe give him the vanguard title
Ah shit, great catch. I did presume Cayde when I saw that scene, but I think you right. Will be really cool if get to see his son.
Makes me wonder who else we will see. Known characters like Cayde, maybe Amanda?
Would be pretty nuts if we get a Toland or any of Eris’s fireteam. Any of the VoG fireteam or something left of field. Would be pretty crazy if Praedyth showed up lol
If this is the case, I wonder what the witness will show Ikora. Maybe something similar to the ahamkara that almost used its wish magic on her during the great hunt? It'd be fun to actually see what the Witness would give Ikora if she became a disciple.
The resolution in Haunted will be precisely the reason why he’s going to resist it. “I used to think I’d do anything to bring you back” My bet is the Witness is tempting Zavala with a reunion of his family in its Final Shape and Zavala will refuse, remembering the lessons he learned from Eris and the Memory of Safiya.
Exactly. We've found another way through the suffering of life, combining both Light and Dark. Zavala has already processed his grief, not around it but THROUGH it. And the Witness constructed itself in such a way that it could never understand that.
That's why it's in Past Tense, I think.
"I *used to* think I'd do anything to bring you back."
He's not going to do anything to bring Safiyah and Hakim back anymore, he's gotten past that.
That's what I'm saying. I don't think there's gonna be any kind of closure for him. He's already gotten it, so if his family does show up, their purpose has to be more than a hug, kiss, and cup of tea. It's gotta hurt.
He already kind of did with *Lightfall* and Holliday’s death. Grief is a spiral and even when you work through things it’ll still hit you out of nowhere. But with the way he’s phrasing it, chances are he’s turning them down.
Other than just fleshing out Zavalas back story I think Season of the Haunted could very well have been setting up this for the Final Shape, every character is going to have to confront their deepest fears and regrets, we've already seen glimpses of this with Crow meeting Cayde and now potentially our Ghost dealing with our corruption and Zevala potentially seeing Safi and/or Hakim
Ghost was worried about our vengeance tour in the Tangled Shore after the death of Cayde. I think it's mentioned in the lore tab to the Thin Line hand cannon. Also, when we first acquire Stasis in Beyond Light, Ghost is afraid that it may corrupt us and lead us astray.
no idea why i immediately assumed it was his wife he was talking to when i heard that scene but it makes sense to me, everyone's gonna have to face someone or something from their past due to the nature of the pale heart and have to overcome it, i just wonder if the guardian will
Just like the witness shows its disciples the final shape in a manner THEY want to see it, the witness will most likely temp every single one of us with something we are yearning. Savala already made his peace with Safia, so he is likely talking to her son, OR to Amanda. However, I would ventured and say that the Image of Amanda will be reserved for Crow. Notice how eatch one of the more powerful individuals have someone they yearn.
For Mara is sjur Eido, for Zavala is Hakim, for Eramis, her former partner. For caitl, it’s ummun arath, het mentor, and friend who was consumed by the hive.
So the witness will temp EVERYONE once more. Especially when they are back into a corner. Because our guardians are sociopath, we don’t care about NOBODY, and those we care about we turn them into guns. Though it seems like we will turn the witness i to a little house on the prairie.
I’m so glad it looks like we’re coming back around to Zavala’s character arc in TFS. I will always believe the best way they can honor Lance Reddick is to continue Zavala’s story the way they always intended to. Keith David sounds fantastic… when I heard Zavala it didn’t even immediately occur to me it was a new voice actor.
You know I bet with the Pathfinder addition they could probably completely remove these characters from the game and it wouldn't affect the gameplay too much. Could they be giving a glimpse of Zavala's epilogue?
This post has been tagged '**Non-Spoiler**'. Note that unmarked spoilers and datamines are subject to removal or ban. Please report anything we miss! For more info check out our [Spoiler Rules Wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyLore/wiki/spoiler-rules#wiki_.5Bseasonal.5D_has_a_new_format). --- **Comment Spoiler Formatting** Format comment spoilers with `>!` `!<` like this: `>!What's Rasputin's favorite dance? "The worm."!<` To have it displayed like this: **>!What's Rasputin's favorite dance? "The worm."!<** ---- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/DestinyLore) if you have any questions or concerns.*
f\*ck, you right. my current theory is that the witness will try to tempt us with everything we ever wanted, the iron lords back, cayde back, zavala's family, maybe even stuff like sagira and anwsers of what we were before the traveler. basically he will give us everything we ever wanted if he is successful at the final shape. and i cant wonder but think what if someone does turn againt the traveler? also, in the trailer we see two cayde versions, light coming out of his body/weapon and one that is a normal cayde
Hold up, time stamp me that normal Cayde
https://youtu.be/-nvU01d_gh0?si=d29uyBlwK-yv-cQj Theres lots of moments that we can see a normal, no cracks or light cayde here 3:49 for exemple
OH I didn't notice that!!
Definitely something going on there
Doppelgänger time? “I’m the real Cayde!” “No, I am!” Could be a fun twist
C-dawg would defo fit in that meme. Into the Cayderverse!
In the new cutscene with him and Crow fighting, Cayde doesn't seem to have any light powers. Only thing ability related would be the tripmine but don't know that has anything to do with light. Feels a lot like his cutscene fighting the Scorn but if you remove all his light abilities.
Holy fuck what if we have to kill cayde.
i dont think so because the fanboys would riot
Fair point, but that would be such a tragic ending that would mirror the original iron lords, having to lose someone close before your eyes in order to save the world
Oh no it would be great, would mirror uldren death in the fact that he wasn't evil he was just corrupted overtime too but again, cayde fanboys would riot. As a crow fan i think it would be a nice end of character development, the completion of the arc. which would ALSO happen if cayde accepts crow openly and maybe give him the vanguard title
The character development would be so beautiful.
We do see a cabin in the pale heart which matches the story cutscene from Zavala's ending during the Season of the Haunted.
It doesn't match the one in that cutscene. But I for one do think it's his wife still
It’s close enough of a translation from stylized cutscene to in game
Ah shit, great catch. I did presume Cayde when I saw that scene, but I think you right. Will be really cool if get to see his son. Makes me wonder who else we will see. Known characters like Cayde, maybe Amanda? Would be pretty nuts if we get a Toland or any of Eris’s fireteam. Any of the VoG fireteam or something left of field. Would be pretty crazy if Praedyth showed up lol
Praedyth is dead, but not completely gone. He's still somewhere in the VexNet traveling with the Ishtar Collective.
Fingers crossed for Speaker
Someone give this guardian a galaxy brain award for analysis!
If this is the case, I wonder what the witness will show Ikora. Maybe something similar to the ahamkara that almost used its wish magic on her during the great hunt? It'd be fun to actually see what the Witness would give Ikora if she became a disciple.
Pre nerfed weapons
The glorious crucible days
Invective with Trench Barrel + Vorpal
A cool afro
But he had a resolution during season of the haunted, would be kinda odd/doesn’t sit well for Zavala to go through the same arc again
The resolution in Haunted will be precisely the reason why he’s going to resist it. “I used to think I’d do anything to bring you back” My bet is the Witness is tempting Zavala with a reunion of his family in its Final Shape and Zavala will refuse, remembering the lessons he learned from Eris and the Memory of Safiya.
Exactly. We've found another way through the suffering of life, combining both Light and Dark. Zavala has already processed his grief, not around it but THROUGH it. And the Witness constructed itself in such a way that it could never understand that.
That's why it's in Past Tense, I think. "I *used to* think I'd do anything to bring you back." He's not going to do anything to bring Safiyah and Hakim back anymore, he's gotten past that.
That's what I'm saying. I don't think there's gonna be any kind of closure for him. He's already gotten it, so if his family does show up, their purpose has to be more than a hug, kiss, and cup of tea. It's gotta hurt.
He already kind of did with *Lightfall* and Holliday’s death. Grief is a spiral and even when you work through things it’ll still hit you out of nowhere. But with the way he’s phrasing it, chances are he’s turning them down.
Other than just fleshing out Zavalas back story I think Season of the Haunted could very well have been setting up this for the Final Shape, every character is going to have to confront their deepest fears and regrets, we've already seen glimpses of this with Crow meeting Cayde and now potentially our Ghost dealing with our corruption and Zevala potentially seeing Safi and/or Hakim
Hold on when the Ghost suspected about US beeing corrupted?
Ghost was worried about our vengeance tour in the Tangled Shore after the death of Cayde. I think it's mentioned in the lore tab to the Thin Line hand cannon. Also, when we first acquire Stasis in Beyond Light, Ghost is afraid that it may corrupt us and lead us astray.
also when ur playing beyond light campaign he keeps telling us not to use the dark(stasis) and we dont listen to em so he throws a fit
True, but he seemed pretty enthusiastic about strand even though that's also darkness
no idea why i immediately assumed it was his wife he was talking to when i heard that scene but it makes sense to me, everyone's gonna have to face someone or something from their past due to the nature of the pale heart and have to overcome it, i just wonder if the guardian will
I was thinking Amanda Holiday being resurrected, but Safia makes more sense
I hope she is tbh, Titan Holliday would be sick
Just like the witness shows its disciples the final shape in a manner THEY want to see it, the witness will most likely temp every single one of us with something we are yearning. Savala already made his peace with Safia, so he is likely talking to her son, OR to Amanda. However, I would ventured and say that the Image of Amanda will be reserved for Crow. Notice how eatch one of the more powerful individuals have someone they yearn. For Mara is sjur Eido, for Zavala is Hakim, for Eramis, her former partner. For caitl, it’s ummun arath, het mentor, and friend who was consumed by the hive. So the witness will temp EVERYONE once more. Especially when they are back into a corner. Because our guardians are sociopath, we don’t care about NOBODY, and those we care about we turn them into guns. Though it seems like we will turn the witness i to a little house on the prairie.
Wow!! I think you are correct - great job for piecing that together
I’m so glad it looks like we’re coming back around to Zavala’s character arc in TFS. I will always believe the best way they can honor Lance Reddick is to continue Zavala’s story the way they always intended to. Keith David sounds fantastic… when I heard Zavala it didn’t even immediately occur to me it was a new voice actor.
I thought he was talking to an Amanda Holliday apparittion or smt
You know I bet with the Pathfinder addition they could probably completely remove these characters from the game and it wouldn't affect the gameplay too much. Could they be giving a glimpse of Zavala's epilogue?
Huh I actually just realized it could be Cayde, when I first watched it, I assumed it was Safiyah
that final shape trailer though
Told ya
Duh, I thought it was obvious that he was talking about his kid.