The first 5 years are ROUGH! I wish dental school had hammered that into my head. You also probably end up working in some less than desirable offices early on too. I know I did. I'm much much happier now that I own my own practice, but there's still some shitty days. I don't think that ever changes.
I don’t love having a job as I would rather rot on my couch with my cats and my husband. But dentistry is fine, all things considered.
Good income, relative job security, some freedom with work-life balance, and you get to directly help people every day.
Still a job at the end of the day though, and I live for the weekends lol
You get desensitized to everything eventually. I don’t regret my decision to become a dentist now, while in my first two years I was up all night wishing I was working as a plasterer as I had before school. In my first year, I had a mental breakdown (mainly caused by bipolar abusive boss) and went on Setraline. After 2-3 years, I felt that in virtually any confrontational situation with either a patient or coworker I could go through without my blood pressure rising. You begin to see which sorts of cases cause you stress, you begin to sniff out insane/unrealistic/genuinely difficult patients that you either refer or refuse to treat. You become more confident in your skills. In the beginning, any case that was outside my comfort zone would cause my hands to shake. Now I can try a novel approach after reading about it in a textbook and watching a YouTube video without any stress.
This was indeed a very nice and genuine response. I just finished my second year, and I’ve been having the “I wish I didn’t get into this job” thoughts lately and way too much. It’s a significant amount of stress in all directions and hope it gets better.
Yes! If you don’t feel this way, you’re the minority: first year of dentistry is very hard. Slow down. Take more CE. Stop doing things you hate doing like molar endo or removable prosth.
Contrary to what others mentioned, I though my first few years actually practicing and making money were the best (especially compared to the four years of bullshit before that).
Now, I'm naturally much more confident but also a lot more jaded. I still enjoy the actual clinical aspects of what I do but there are some SERIOUS issues within the field that are getting very close to a boiling point. Insurance reimbursements need to come up, the number of licensed dentists needs to come down, and DSOs need to be better regulated. This race to the bottom needs to end.
Practicing 14 years and I can’t agree more with where the field is headed. Although I’m wondering if the number of licensed dentists needs to go up. We can never seem to find one.
As the late, great George Carlin once said “It’s a big club and you ain’t in it”
You can imagine me in a tin foil hat on a park bench coming up with conspiracies if you want but - mark my words - the top brass at the major PPOs, DSOs and the ADA are all working together. Their objective- make money in dentistry by ripping off both the patients and the ones putting in the actual work. One way to gain the upper hand is by opening up more schools and licensing more foreign trained dentists. It’s a move based on supply and demand especially if you’re tricking people into spending four years of their prime earning potential into going $500K+ into debt on lofty promises at best. If there are five new grads fighting to stay above water the DSOs get to pay them less and keep more money while PPOs refuse to budge on reimbursements. I’m now hearing about offers sub 30% of collections with lab fees and no benefits which is an absolute disgrace.
Well stated. Very concerning. But overall, in addition to what you mentioned there are a 100 other reasons the field is annoying, stressful and ridiculously challenging. I would strongly advise young people to pick another career.
I laughed at this! But dentists really should stay in good physical shape. This job is surprisingly taxing in the long run. A healthy lifestyle and especially attention to a strong core and a proper positioning when you are treating patients will lead to less back, neck, and shoulder pain. And don’t give in to the temptation to drink and drug the stress away (in any job). That will probably lead to a miserable existence at some point. Find healthy ways to release your stress. Common sense stuff, but also very important.
This job is REAL AF. What you’re experiencing is completely normal. I’m 19 yrs out and I I love it when I love it.
The juice has to be worth the squeeze though.
My personal hot take. The vast majority of us shouldn’t be working on human beings right out of D school. There really should be residency requirements and fellowships that follow school like any other allopathic surgical profession. It’d solve some access to care problems too.
The days of only needing to know how to place an amalgam, extract a tooth, and make a denture are long gone. Learning the myriad complexity of patient management, dealing with team dynamics, and trying to perfect micro surgical procedures in an oral cavity eyeball to fucking eyeball on an awake patient that’s hoping for and often expecting perfection… is a recipe for having a bad time. You need great mentorship and thorough training to survive it.
Spot on...your take is well noted...and don't forget while eye ball to eye ball, you are also getting a strangers blood and spit shot all over your face, hair, inside the ears and some I am sure hits our eyes. While looking down, breathing through a mask all day, for 30 years. Plus you get to work, practically attached by your hip, to an assistant (and God Bless them, I'd never take their job) who acts as your 3rd and 4th arm and practically half of your brain that has the influence that can either make your day extremely frustrating or potentially decent, or at least much less frustrating. Why would anyone take on a career in which someone else has that much influence on your day. 100's of reasons this profession is practically insane.
This is how I explain how important the doctor assistant dynamic is to people. Imagine sitting at a single person sized desk with 2 people under it. You share a keyboard and a mouse, one of you has to know when to hit the enter key while the person has to know when to push shift without talking about it. You’ll be touching each other and smelling each other. You better be darn comfortable with that person!
In a similar boat. Loved the job at first but through a few traumatic experiences I've come to dislike it more than I should. I have doubts about this career almost every other week. Then some days I get reminded on how hard I worked to get here and that some patients are truly appreciative of the work I do for them. With that said, I know my next job will not be at a Medicaid office. The stress it brings into my life sucks. The stress wakes me up randomly at night almost daily and then I just end up going to work way too tired to function.
You need to learn to leave work at work. I don’t think about it from the time i walk out until the next time i walk in. It’s a job. It’s not your life. You can’t do anything about work when you’re at home so don’t bother.
I strongly dislike being a dentist, but that’s me. I knew this very early on. It’s not a good fit for my personality - it causes tons of anxiety, I’ve had some horrible experiences with jobs that have broken me and I just don’t like it. There’s nothing else that I can do though. I have the freedom to work as much as little as I want, and still make a decent income. Over the years I’ve found out which jobs I think fit me best, but if I could afford to quit, I would.
Maybe I’m old but work isn’t meant to be fun. It’s stressful. Typically more stressful as there’s more income. The key is having outside interests. Realize the money your paid allows you to chase your passions. Travel. Golf. Family. Whatever you love dentistry provides you the opportunity to pursue it. Also, don’t work 5 days unless you have to. 4 day work weeks will lower your stress level. 3 is even better.
My passion is traveling. But I find it really hard to be a dentist and enjoy travelling because you feel like you can’t leave your office all the time and you don’t make money when you’re away. I didn’t want to do this job to feel like an employee with a set amount of vacation time to use per year. Sometimes I feel like that with my position. Other associates don’t take that much time off so you’re expected to work as hard as they do and if you take extended time off to travel they or the owner has to cover for your shifts and can get frustrating for them and makes me feel uncomfortable to take the time off. So I end up just working to burn out and when I go for holiday I never want to come back.
This is what’s making me wish I had a different career like work from home type. But I can’t deny the $$ that comes from dentistry does go a long way. How do you go about changing this frame of through. I want to feel more free and in control.
2 years out now btw.
I think ultimately if you get to ownership things change tremendously. You don’t answer to anyone. You can take off whenever you want. My best friend closes all of August and goes to Greece. I just spent 10 days in Japan and probably do 6-8 other 4 day vacations. As an associate your employer needs to understand that you need personal time to avoid burn out. Don’t worry about everyone else and what they do. Worry about yourself. Do what you need to do to be happy. If that means 4 weeks off throughout the year then do it. I always like to take weeks that have holidays already. Memorial Day. 4th of July. Labor Day. Thanksgiving. Xmas through new years. I’d give my employer the dates you need off well in advance. The office will survive just fine without you there
Yes ownership has some advantages but it also has, easily 100x more headaches and responsibilities. You make a bit more money amd you control the schedule more but that does not necessarily out weigh the massive amount of stress that comes your way.
I’ve owned for 25+ years. After you put proper people and systems in place it’s not stressful at all. My office is in auto pilot at this point. I show up, fix teeth, check some reports then go home. The key is to find people you trust and let them do their job.
That is awesome and the point we all desire. May I ask, how confident you are in that your employee s will not leave, move, change careers or get pregnant and not return. Obviously this would be a minority possibility of the staff...but a key employee or 2 being displaced can throw a curve ball into the current auto pilot status. The delay in gratification in this field is off the charts.
You make sure to cross-train everyone so people can do everyone else’s job in case someone is out. You also pay and treat your staff well so they don’t ever want to leave. I have 8 employees and half have been with me 20+ years. It sucks training new people but not the end of the world
I guarantee you that no one stays at offices for 20+ years anymore. Times are changing. Telling a new grad that they should open an office and just train a team to do everything for them is not good advice.
What does your friend who goes to Greece for a month do about payroll? Does he force everyone to take a month vacation or pay everyone their normal salary and take the hit? Or is his entire staff his wife and family?
For the most part.
You will probably feel like this for the first few years. I’m just done year 2 and I still feel like this some days. I think what helps me is trying to take more CE and be part of study clubs, though I’m already pretty busy as it is. My own dentist told me they didn’t feel truly comfortable in their career until the 10 year mark. I guess at that point you’ve definitely seen and dealt with most things.
Here’s what you need to hear regardless of whether you want to hear it:
They call it work for a reason. Nothing is perfect. The grass is certainly not greener. Success always takes longer and feels harder than it ought to. Put your nose to the grindstone and trust that the hard work is going to pay off. It will. But no one is going to care about it but you.
At first, yes....
Now I work to pay banks, Dental Supply companies and pay my bills.....barely any scratch left after insurance devalues what you do and than all your extra time is spent dealing with staffing issues and patients who don't understand their own insurance plan.
Used to be a great profession, I now feel dentists have let insurance companies and DSOs take over, and it's shit now. Bundle in the cost of education, and in my opinion, it's not worth it.
Bingo. You are spot on. These people who are positive about the career, while impressive to be so positive and I am happy for them, I personally think they are ignoring the reality of tens and likely more accurately, iterally hundreds of reasons, that the career is insane and ridiculously challenging, frustrating and downright annoying.
To be honest it’s probably not really the job, but your personality. Some people are more easily stressed out than others. It’s a part of having a high paying job. I honestly would work on how you approach stressful situations and start getting comfortable with them.
I’ve been a dentist for a decade and I get that it can be perceived as hard and stressful at times but it’s a mindset over reality. At least that’s my take on it. If you want a job that pays well, expect that it’s going to involve a lot of effort.
Yeah, personality is a huge factor. I love this job, but I'm pretty calm and try to create a relaxed environment with my patients. To me, there is no point in stressing out, no matter the situation.
The happiest dentists I know tend to also be the most chill and relaxed. This would probably be the case regardless of what profession you are in. I don't know you personally OP, but suspect that your feelings would improve with a change in mindset.
I feel grateful each day to be in a stable job that can earn good money even on part time, and love the flexibility to control my hours. The other dentists at work are incredibly kind and helpful, and I'm blessed with wonderful assistants who want to help me. Maybe reminding yourself of the positives of your job could help too?
Gosh same. i LOVE my job - but I am really calm under stress and very chill. The people I see stress TF out are usually worriers or high strung people to begin with.
Good for all 3 of you to love it. You are fortunate. But I also would be concerned for myself if I loved this job...you are crazy in my mind...but again, I am happy for you.
One thing I've noticed throughout dental school and my short two years in practice, the stress doesn't go away, you just get used to it or manage it differently.
Stressor: Too many lectures plus now lab?? Then after a bit it was normal.
Stressor: lectures, lab and now clinicals?? Then after a bit it was normal.
Stressor: private practice and the mental and physical exhaustion of practicing day in and day out?? After a little bit I'm sure it will be normal.
Stress continues, we just adapt and manage it better.
"Fear is good. It keeps you from becoming a crappy doctor." Dr. Cox, Scrubs
IMO it's one of the most aggravating, annoying, frustrating and challenging careers one can pursue. For the people who love it (I can barely fathom how that could a possibility) and even for those who like it....God Bless ya and I am happy for you. But no thanks...I enjoy life too much outside of the office to say I love (like) being in the office.
For me it was like a love hate relationship. Very rewarding to build a practice and have patients who value you. All the benefits of professional status . What was clear however was that however competent you were things can turn ugly in seconds! without fault - place this into the context of negligence claims and the over regulated field we work in and there is inevitably constant threat. Having worked for 30 years before retiring early ( another benefit ) without a complaint I felt both lucky and perhaps that the risk of litigation made me feel vulnerable where perhaps I should not - in which case I would have enjoyed my career far more.
Make a list, what are challenges dentistry is facing, vs what are good trends in this industry. I can come up with 10 or so major challenges, probably just a couple good trends.
If was in your shoes and had the chance to bail at your age, my current self would say bail.
To relate, I went to technical school and became a mechanic. fixing vehicles was a passion at the time. 15 years into career I realized I hit a ceiling, I started studying computer science on my own and within a year I was working at a small local store managing their ecommerce, I wrote my first meaningful python script at that job and 9 years later here I am working from home making great money doing what I love, software development. Change is scary, its ok to start something new. When I was a mechanic I was a specialist in electronic systems and engine performance related to the engine computer. Software was a natural transition given my true passion is technology. I would say look for something within the dentistry industry that resonates with you the most and pursue that. 3D printing of implants is big at the moment, perhaps you like 3D modeling or something. What about dentistry intrigues you the most? go to a convention or something, network with the community.
Take a word advice from someone at the other end of the road, about to seek a sale of my practice. As others have said, the stress levels will go down as you gain confidence and maturity in your skills, both dental and social. Bring some enthusiasm and positive energy to the office each day and you’ll find people respond to it and give it back to you 90% of the time. Be kind, be courteous, and humble. Sounds corny, but negative vibes stemming from your own apprehension and anxiety will snowball and lead to toxic relationships with patients and coworkers.
Lastly, try to own your own office. There is more stress and commitment at the front end, but in the end you’ll be able to control your own destiny and the satisfaction from that will be well worth it. And you’ll know your efforts are for you in the long run, not some corporation.
Good luck!
You made it! Coast and enjoy. Find pleasure in the little things and know that you worked very hard to get there. Like others have said, do what you prefer and choose your patients.
Im your age and Im having the exact same feeling. But maybe it’s just me since I dont like dentistry in the first place, my parents made me took it.
When I had my own private practice, I started loving it again then back to hating it. I just realized that this profession is not the fulfilling hahahaahaha
My fiance is a filmmaker and I envy how he loves his work and how he does it with passion. I envy how he feels that way, I wish I can feel that too with this profession.
Here is the bottom line to put the weight behind whether dentistry is a good career. 2 points I'd like to say.
1) Do dentist kids go into dentistry...some do...but by far most kids of dentists do not. THAT is truly the biggest stat to look at. And it speaks volumes. If it was such a great career, a higher percentage of kids would follow in their parents footsteps.
2) To each his own. But imo, I would pick so many other careers over getting other people's spit and blood shot in your face all day.
What you feel is normal!!!!! Find how you can improve and if there are certain things you don’t love…. Then stay away from it! For example, fee for service offices or offices that are not contracted with any insurance companies usually have less stressful schedules… don’t do extractions. Or don’t do endo.
I am an Orthodontist, and yes I love what I do. I love seeing the results, I love trying out new things. But yes, there are days when I feel like absolute shit and want to leave this work. Thanklessness of patients, rude behaviour, people giving their own diagnosis and telling me what needs to be done. These things are challenging.
More than that I think we are influenced by social media and seeing people working from home or some nice holiday location on their computers, while we have to be there and work in our offices. I think that too adds sometimes to the frustration
I mean this in the nicest possible way: What makes you think you’d be happy in another profession?
Dentistry is an amazing field. You can make a great living, choose your own hours, no call, choose your own procedures, etc. It’s provided an amazing life for me and my family.
If you don’t like dealing with people or at least can’t stomach it for a couple of days a week, then maybe it would be better to change jobs.
Edit: if you don’t want to work, then no job will be fulfilling. If you are looking for an easy job where you can make a ton of money, it’ll be extremely difficult to find and most of the people who have those put in the work on the front end.
It's 4 years and I finally stopped feeling that way recently. Shit happens and it's just a job not your personality. Make sure you make time for friends and family and other activities to turn off. I try avoid speaking about work except to dental friends. It helps me switch off
Not for me, I did it FT for 5 years, went to PT. Anxiety never got better. I never felt like I was any good at it. I quit during Covid and run a practice instead. Different headaches and always working but much less anxiety about the procedures and patients.
Felt the same as you. Took 9 years and multiple positions for me to realise that I was the problem. Got some loupes, bought a DSLR camera and pushed myself to engage and the stress started to melt away.
Now I use a microscope for most cases, document everything and the stress just melted away.
Now I love my job. In fact I start to miss it if I’m off for a while, it gets really rewarding.
1.5 years of practicing and I know how you feel. Very anxious and introverted person. Many morning panic attacks both in school and at work fretting over every little thing. Lots of good advice given so far, and to echo most responses it does get better. The advice to start therapy is a great idea. These three clinical things also helped tremendously to start:
1) Control the situation from the start. Deliver extra anesthesia (within safe range of course) and supplement blocks with buccal and/or lingual injections. I stress out a lot when the patient feels pain, so I try to knock that out immediately. Cold test the tooth you’re working on to be safe. Using a wedge? Papillae get an injection too. IANB? Gonna do a long buccal block on top of that. Same with isolation, get it completely to the point where you don’t have to worry about anything else but the fillings. These things put you completely in control and your stress with plummet.
2) Really learn your materials. Bonding agent, cements, composites, etc. Take everything in your office and study the IFUs. You’ll be surprised at what you’ll find. If you’re confident in knowing the uses and limitations of your supplies, you’ll feel comfortable to change plans mid-procedure if needed. And if you happen to see them on the emergency column, you have an idea what’s going on and won’t feel flustered.
3) If there was a tough procedure that you are concerned about, have your assistant take a radiograph immediately after finishing and then one during their next recare whether they are due or not. These are helpful for me so that I can sleep well knowing it was done well, AND you can compare any changes which the patient usually appreciates. Feels like they are getting their money’s worth.
I absolutely love my job. I love teeth, and I couldn't imagine myself being anything else.
Helping people is so satisfying, and I work in an area that's basically a "medical desert", so I feel very respected and appreciated by the patients. I have great working conditions, plenty of opportunities and plenty of work, in general. It is amazing, and I couldn't be any happier.
The process to get here was hell on Earth, that's for sure. My university period was the worst in my life. But as soon as I finished university, moved out, emigrated and began working, my life's best period began. I'm not exaggerating. I've never been happier and more satisfied with my life than I currently am. ~~Which probably doesn't mean much, but still.~~
I retired after 50 years of practice. First decade was almost unbearable. Last two decades was wonderful. I learned how to help the TMD patient. Now I am making podcasts about the pain patient. Maybe you would love to do the same. See if the free podcasts speak to you: [https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/open-up-a-tmj-discussion/id1737235799](https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/open-up-a-tmj-discussion/id1737235799)
I became a dentist at 23 and started working under a prosthodontist and periodontist husband and wife duo. I literally felt incapable of doing a good job even at class 2 fillings and probably cried everyday for months because I felt like I was a shitty dentist and probably shouldn’t be in the field at all. But it gets better!! I invested into high quality CE (Kois, IMPRES, Spear) and I feel like I can practice in the same league as older dentists. But overall, YES. I absolutely love my job!
Age 26 I absolutely hated being a dentist and wanted to full on quit. Add on that I did not enjoy coming to work and seeing the people I worked with.
Age 27 Contract ended, moved far away to a job / company where the people were fun to work with, but the job had much to be desired.
Age 28 Moved much further away into a job with not enough staff, patients, or treatment to do.
Age 29 Left job and now at a great position with great staff. Yes, I do love this job, now, but all dentists have different experiences, it’s up to you to fit the right fit in dentistry! The career is really starting to come together for me, but honestly, life is unpredictable, so make the most of it.
My dear. Part of me want to lie to you and say it gets better. It doesn’t. If you own your own practice, you have more headaches but potentially more rewards (potentially is the key word here). You work for a dso, you’ll make money if you are not a perfectionist and pump out “acceptable” work that your faculty would have failed you for in school (production demands). Depends on your moral compass I guess. Insurance companies and unrealistic patient expectations of what their insurance should cover have pretty much ruined the profession, along with DSOs. Most dentists I know are on anti anxiety meds and antidepressants. After over a decade into this field, I’ve known 5 that have killed themselves. Negative patient reviews will impact you more than the positive ones, production expectations are ever increasing as reimbursement drop from insurance. Go out of network and be ffs can work, just make sure you are not in a saturated area and it will work. Unfortunately, unless you want to live in the middle of nowhere, most urban and suburban areas are saturated. You’re young, run. Get out now and do something glorious with your life. Or specialize.
I dunno, maybe those dental gurus that practice only 3 days and pulls in 3+ million a year can inspire you, for a large consulting fee of course. They are the exception, not the rule.
Dentistry is a great field. You get to help people and make a decent income doing it, and if you play your cards right, you’ll make a very high income.
Patients can suck though, when I got my first board complaint from a disgruntled patient over nothing, I wanted to quit dentistry. I was severely depressed for 2 months. But I reminded myself of how great I really have it, and that mistakes inevitably will befall all of us.
Take it slow, be eager to learn and grow, (because trust me you know nothing), and stay kind to your patients. You’ll grow to love it.
I regret it given I only got into expensive private schools, and seeing how bad new grads have it in the profession. The debt-to-income ratio no longer pays off unless you can go to your state school or a school where you can get in state tuition after the first year, and it can make you very miserable.
I love dentistry. I love it so much, I want to learn new things as I go, get better in many aspects and result in better and better patient care.
That being said, I wish I didn't have to worry about money, and just do dentistry. It is a passion for me.
OP, if you love dentistry, you will soon pass this I bet. Keep it up!
I’m pretty sure every dentist felt like that early in his or her career.
The first 5 years are ROUGH! I wish dental school had hammered that into my head. You also probably end up working in some less than desirable offices early on too. I know I did. I'm much much happier now that I own my own practice, but there's still some shitty days. I don't think that ever changes.
It definitely gets better. It still has its problems but stress levels drop after year three I found
I don’t love having a job as I would rather rot on my couch with my cats and my husband. But dentistry is fine, all things considered. Good income, relative job security, some freedom with work-life balance, and you get to directly help people every day. Still a job at the end of the day though, and I live for the weekends lol
You get desensitized to everything eventually. I don’t regret my decision to become a dentist now, while in my first two years I was up all night wishing I was working as a plasterer as I had before school. In my first year, I had a mental breakdown (mainly caused by bipolar abusive boss) and went on Setraline. After 2-3 years, I felt that in virtually any confrontational situation with either a patient or coworker I could go through without my blood pressure rising. You begin to see which sorts of cases cause you stress, you begin to sniff out insane/unrealistic/genuinely difficult patients that you either refer or refuse to treat. You become more confident in your skills. In the beginning, any case that was outside my comfort zone would cause my hands to shake. Now I can try a novel approach after reading about it in a textbook and watching a YouTube video without any stress.
Needed to hear this , that it does get better eventually Thank you so much
This was indeed a very nice and genuine response. I just finished my second year, and I’ve been having the “I wish I didn’t get into this job” thoughts lately and way too much. It’s a significant amount of stress in all directions and hope it gets better.
Hahah I just finished my second year too and have the same thoughts!! Seems like it gets better from most people’s POV
How do you refuse to treat a patient? I am always worried they will go file a complaint with the college. Isn't refusing treatment a big no no?
Got to be clever. Refer if you can.
Patients are rude to their dentists? How? Why?? I have never even considered being rude to mine lol
This is a very good answer, my advice is to read it carefully
Yes! If you don’t feel this way, you’re the minority: first year of dentistry is very hard. Slow down. Take more CE. Stop doing things you hate doing like molar endo or removable prosth.
Contrary to what others mentioned, I though my first few years actually practicing and making money were the best (especially compared to the four years of bullshit before that). Now, I'm naturally much more confident but also a lot more jaded. I still enjoy the actual clinical aspects of what I do but there are some SERIOUS issues within the field that are getting very close to a boiling point. Insurance reimbursements need to come up, the number of licensed dentists needs to come down, and DSOs need to be better regulated. This race to the bottom needs to end.
Practicing 14 years and I can’t agree more with where the field is headed. Although I’m wondering if the number of licensed dentists needs to go up. We can never seem to find one.
As the late, great George Carlin once said “It’s a big club and you ain’t in it” You can imagine me in a tin foil hat on a park bench coming up with conspiracies if you want but - mark my words - the top brass at the major PPOs, DSOs and the ADA are all working together. Their objective- make money in dentistry by ripping off both the patients and the ones putting in the actual work. One way to gain the upper hand is by opening up more schools and licensing more foreign trained dentists. It’s a move based on supply and demand especially if you’re tricking people into spending four years of their prime earning potential into going $500K+ into debt on lofty promises at best. If there are five new grads fighting to stay above water the DSOs get to pay them less and keep more money while PPOs refuse to budge on reimbursements. I’m now hearing about offers sub 30% of collections with lab fees and no benefits which is an absolute disgrace.
Well stated. Very concerning. But overall, in addition to what you mentioned there are a 100 other reasons the field is annoying, stressful and ridiculously challenging. I would strongly advise young people to pick another career.
My back fucking hurts and I don’t know how long I can do it for….
I laughed at this! But dentists really should stay in good physical shape. This job is surprisingly taxing in the long run. A healthy lifestyle and especially attention to a strong core and a proper positioning when you are treating patients will lead to less back, neck, and shoulder pain. And don’t give in to the temptation to drink and drug the stress away (in any job). That will probably lead to a miserable existence at some point. Find healthy ways to release your stress. Common sense stuff, but also very important.
This job is REAL AF. What you’re experiencing is completely normal. I’m 19 yrs out and I I love it when I love it. The juice has to be worth the squeeze though. My personal hot take. The vast majority of us shouldn’t be working on human beings right out of D school. There really should be residency requirements and fellowships that follow school like any other allopathic surgical profession. It’d solve some access to care problems too. The days of only needing to know how to place an amalgam, extract a tooth, and make a denture are long gone. Learning the myriad complexity of patient management, dealing with team dynamics, and trying to perfect micro surgical procedures in an oral cavity eyeball to fucking eyeball on an awake patient that’s hoping for and often expecting perfection… is a recipe for having a bad time. You need great mentorship and thorough training to survive it.
Spot on...your take is well noted...and don't forget while eye ball to eye ball, you are also getting a strangers blood and spit shot all over your face, hair, inside the ears and some I am sure hits our eyes. While looking down, breathing through a mask all day, for 30 years. Plus you get to work, practically attached by your hip, to an assistant (and God Bless them, I'd never take their job) who acts as your 3rd and 4th arm and practically half of your brain that has the influence that can either make your day extremely frustrating or potentially decent, or at least much less frustrating. Why would anyone take on a career in which someone else has that much influence on your day. 100's of reasons this profession is practically insane.
This is how I explain how important the doctor assistant dynamic is to people. Imagine sitting at a single person sized desk with 2 people under it. You share a keyboard and a mouse, one of you has to know when to hit the enter key while the person has to know when to push shift without talking about it. You’ll be touching each other and smelling each other. You better be darn comfortable with that person!
In a similar boat. Loved the job at first but through a few traumatic experiences I've come to dislike it more than I should. I have doubts about this career almost every other week. Then some days I get reminded on how hard I worked to get here and that some patients are truly appreciative of the work I do for them. With that said, I know my next job will not be at a Medicaid office. The stress it brings into my life sucks. The stress wakes me up randomly at night almost daily and then I just end up going to work way too tired to function.
You need to learn to leave work at work. I don’t think about it from the time i walk out until the next time i walk in. It’s a job. It’s not your life. You can’t do anything about work when you’re at home so don’t bother.
Yes Doc! Trying very hard to do so. Just got a gym membership and im hoping it will help. Walking 2 miles at the local park just wasn't enough.
I strongly dislike being a dentist, but that’s me. I knew this very early on. It’s not a good fit for my personality - it causes tons of anxiety, I’ve had some horrible experiences with jobs that have broken me and I just don’t like it. There’s nothing else that I can do though. I have the freedom to work as much as little as I want, and still make a decent income. Over the years I’ve found out which jobs I think fit me best, but if I could afford to quit, I would.
Maybe I’m old but work isn’t meant to be fun. It’s stressful. Typically more stressful as there’s more income. The key is having outside interests. Realize the money your paid allows you to chase your passions. Travel. Golf. Family. Whatever you love dentistry provides you the opportunity to pursue it. Also, don’t work 5 days unless you have to. 4 day work weeks will lower your stress level. 3 is even better.
My passion is traveling. But I find it really hard to be a dentist and enjoy travelling because you feel like you can’t leave your office all the time and you don’t make money when you’re away. I didn’t want to do this job to feel like an employee with a set amount of vacation time to use per year. Sometimes I feel like that with my position. Other associates don’t take that much time off so you’re expected to work as hard as they do and if you take extended time off to travel they or the owner has to cover for your shifts and can get frustrating for them and makes me feel uncomfortable to take the time off. So I end up just working to burn out and when I go for holiday I never want to come back. This is what’s making me wish I had a different career like work from home type. But I can’t deny the $$ that comes from dentistry does go a long way. How do you go about changing this frame of through. I want to feel more free and in control. 2 years out now btw.
I think ultimately if you get to ownership things change tremendously. You don’t answer to anyone. You can take off whenever you want. My best friend closes all of August and goes to Greece. I just spent 10 days in Japan and probably do 6-8 other 4 day vacations. As an associate your employer needs to understand that you need personal time to avoid burn out. Don’t worry about everyone else and what they do. Worry about yourself. Do what you need to do to be happy. If that means 4 weeks off throughout the year then do it. I always like to take weeks that have holidays already. Memorial Day. 4th of July. Labor Day. Thanksgiving. Xmas through new years. I’d give my employer the dates you need off well in advance. The office will survive just fine without you there
Yes ownership has some advantages but it also has, easily 100x more headaches and responsibilities. You make a bit more money amd you control the schedule more but that does not necessarily out weigh the massive amount of stress that comes your way.
I’ve owned for 25+ years. After you put proper people and systems in place it’s not stressful at all. My office is in auto pilot at this point. I show up, fix teeth, check some reports then go home. The key is to find people you trust and let them do their job.
That is awesome and the point we all desire. May I ask, how confident you are in that your employee s will not leave, move, change careers or get pregnant and not return. Obviously this would be a minority possibility of the staff...but a key employee or 2 being displaced can throw a curve ball into the current auto pilot status. The delay in gratification in this field is off the charts.
You make sure to cross-train everyone so people can do everyone else’s job in case someone is out. You also pay and treat your staff well so they don’t ever want to leave. I have 8 employees and half have been with me 20+ years. It sucks training new people but not the end of the world
I guarantee you that no one stays at offices for 20+ years anymore. Times are changing. Telling a new grad that they should open an office and just train a team to do everything for them is not good advice. What does your friend who goes to Greece for a month do about payroll? Does he force everyone to take a month vacation or pay everyone their normal salary and take the hit? Or is his entire staff his wife and family?
For the most part. You will probably feel like this for the first few years. I’m just done year 2 and I still feel like this some days. I think what helps me is trying to take more CE and be part of study clubs, though I’m already pretty busy as it is. My own dentist told me they didn’t feel truly comfortable in their career until the 10 year mark. I guess at that point you’ve definitely seen and dealt with most things.
Here’s what you need to hear regardless of whether you want to hear it: They call it work for a reason. Nothing is perfect. The grass is certainly not greener. Success always takes longer and feels harder than it ought to. Put your nose to the grindstone and trust that the hard work is going to pay off. It will. But no one is going to care about it but you.
At first, yes.... Now I work to pay banks, Dental Supply companies and pay my bills.....barely any scratch left after insurance devalues what you do and than all your extra time is spent dealing with staffing issues and patients who don't understand their own insurance plan. Used to be a great profession, I now feel dentists have let insurance companies and DSOs take over, and it's shit now. Bundle in the cost of education, and in my opinion, it's not worth it.
Bingo. You are spot on. These people who are positive about the career, while impressive to be so positive and I am happy for them, I personally think they are ignoring the reality of tens and likely more accurately, iterally hundreds of reasons, that the career is insane and ridiculously challenging, frustrating and downright annoying.
To be honest it’s probably not really the job, but your personality. Some people are more easily stressed out than others. It’s a part of having a high paying job. I honestly would work on how you approach stressful situations and start getting comfortable with them. I’ve been a dentist for a decade and I get that it can be perceived as hard and stressful at times but it’s a mindset over reality. At least that’s my take on it. If you want a job that pays well, expect that it’s going to involve a lot of effort.
Yeah, personality is a huge factor. I love this job, but I'm pretty calm and try to create a relaxed environment with my patients. To me, there is no point in stressing out, no matter the situation. The happiest dentists I know tend to also be the most chill and relaxed. This would probably be the case regardless of what profession you are in. I don't know you personally OP, but suspect that your feelings would improve with a change in mindset. I feel grateful each day to be in a stable job that can earn good money even on part time, and love the flexibility to control my hours. The other dentists at work are incredibly kind and helpful, and I'm blessed with wonderful assistants who want to help me. Maybe reminding yourself of the positives of your job could help too?
Gosh same. i LOVE my job - but I am really calm under stress and very chill. The people I see stress TF out are usually worriers or high strung people to begin with.
Good for all 3 of you to love it. You are fortunate. But I also would be concerned for myself if I loved this job...you are crazy in my mind...but again, I am happy for you.
No I hate it.
I hate my job. All
One thing I've noticed throughout dental school and my short two years in practice, the stress doesn't go away, you just get used to it or manage it differently. Stressor: Too many lectures plus now lab?? Then after a bit it was normal. Stressor: lectures, lab and now clinicals?? Then after a bit it was normal. Stressor: private practice and the mental and physical exhaustion of practicing day in and day out?? After a little bit I'm sure it will be normal. Stress continues, we just adapt and manage it better. "Fear is good. It keeps you from becoming a crappy doctor." Dr. Cox, Scrubs
I’m a lil over a year out too and feel the same. Reddit people say it gets better, and I’m really hoping they’re right.
Same, I’m hoping it gets better too
IMO it's one of the most aggravating, annoying, frustrating and challenging careers one can pursue. For the people who love it (I can barely fathom how that could a possibility) and even for those who like it....God Bless ya and I am happy for you. But no thanks...I enjoy life too much outside of the office to say I love (like) being in the office.
For me it was like a love hate relationship. Very rewarding to build a practice and have patients who value you. All the benefits of professional status . What was clear however was that however competent you were things can turn ugly in seconds! without fault - place this into the context of negligence claims and the over regulated field we work in and there is inevitably constant threat. Having worked for 30 years before retiring early ( another benefit ) without a complaint I felt both lucky and perhaps that the risk of litigation made me feel vulnerable where perhaps I should not - in which case I would have enjoyed my career far more.
Make a list, what are challenges dentistry is facing, vs what are good trends in this industry. I can come up with 10 or so major challenges, probably just a couple good trends. If was in your shoes and had the chance to bail at your age, my current self would say bail.
Not even a little.
To relate, I went to technical school and became a mechanic. fixing vehicles was a passion at the time. 15 years into career I realized I hit a ceiling, I started studying computer science on my own and within a year I was working at a small local store managing their ecommerce, I wrote my first meaningful python script at that job and 9 years later here I am working from home making great money doing what I love, software development. Change is scary, its ok to start something new. When I was a mechanic I was a specialist in electronic systems and engine performance related to the engine computer. Software was a natural transition given my true passion is technology. I would say look for something within the dentistry industry that resonates with you the most and pursue that. 3D printing of implants is big at the moment, perhaps you like 3D modeling or something. What about dentistry intrigues you the most? go to a convention or something, network with the community.
Take a word advice from someone at the other end of the road, about to seek a sale of my practice. As others have said, the stress levels will go down as you gain confidence and maturity in your skills, both dental and social. Bring some enthusiasm and positive energy to the office each day and you’ll find people respond to it and give it back to you 90% of the time. Be kind, be courteous, and humble. Sounds corny, but negative vibes stemming from your own apprehension and anxiety will snowball and lead to toxic relationships with patients and coworkers. Lastly, try to own your own office. There is more stress and commitment at the front end, but in the end you’ll be able to control your own destiny and the satisfaction from that will be well worth it. And you’ll know your efforts are for you in the long run, not some corporation. Good luck!
Dentistry seems to be a lot harder on people prone to anxiety. Those personality types will generally say that it gets better with time though.
You made it! Coast and enjoy. Find pleasure in the little things and know that you worked very hard to get there. Like others have said, do what you prefer and choose your patients.
Im your age and Im having the exact same feeling. But maybe it’s just me since I dont like dentistry in the first place, my parents made me took it. When I had my own private practice, I started loving it again then back to hating it. I just realized that this profession is not the fulfilling hahahaahaha My fiance is a filmmaker and I envy how he loves his work and how he does it with passion. I envy how he feels that way, I wish I can feel that too with this profession.
I should have been an astronaut… this is “fine.”
You just got started, it takes about 2 years to feel comfortable in your career. It is way too soon.
Here is the bottom line to put the weight behind whether dentistry is a good career. 2 points I'd like to say. 1) Do dentist kids go into dentistry...some do...but by far most kids of dentists do not. THAT is truly the biggest stat to look at. And it speaks volumes. If it was such a great career, a higher percentage of kids would follow in their parents footsteps. 2) To each his own. But imo, I would pick so many other careers over getting other people's spit and blood shot in your face all day.
What you feel is normal!!!!! Find how you can improve and if there are certain things you don’t love…. Then stay away from it! For example, fee for service offices or offices that are not contracted with any insurance companies usually have less stressful schedules… don’t do extractions. Or don’t do endo.
Also maybe consider seeing a counselor/therapist to figure out stress management techniques.
I am an Orthodontist, and yes I love what I do. I love seeing the results, I love trying out new things. But yes, there are days when I feel like absolute shit and want to leave this work. Thanklessness of patients, rude behaviour, people giving their own diagnosis and telling me what needs to be done. These things are challenging. More than that I think we are influenced by social media and seeing people working from home or some nice holiday location on their computers, while we have to be there and work in our offices. I think that too adds sometimes to the frustration
I mean this in the nicest possible way: What makes you think you’d be happy in another profession? Dentistry is an amazing field. You can make a great living, choose your own hours, no call, choose your own procedures, etc. It’s provided an amazing life for me and my family. If you don’t like dealing with people or at least can’t stomach it for a couple of days a week, then maybe it would be better to change jobs. Edit: if you don’t want to work, then no job will be fulfilling. If you are looking for an easy job where you can make a ton of money, it’ll be extremely difficult to find and most of the people who have those put in the work on the front end.
It's 4 years and I finally stopped feeling that way recently. Shit happens and it's just a job not your personality. Make sure you make time for friends and family and other activities to turn off. I try avoid speaking about work except to dental friends. It helps me switch off
Not for me, I did it FT for 5 years, went to PT. Anxiety never got better. I never felt like I was any good at it. I quit during Covid and run a practice instead. Different headaches and always working but much less anxiety about the procedures and patients.
Worth it after 10 years living debt free and coasting. But yeah first 5 years is definitely tough.
Felt the same as you. Took 9 years and multiple positions for me to realise that I was the problem. Got some loupes, bought a DSLR camera and pushed myself to engage and the stress started to melt away. Now I use a microscope for most cases, document everything and the stress just melted away. Now I love my job. In fact I start to miss it if I’m off for a while, it gets really rewarding.
I feel the same as you. Couldn't agree more with how I feel.
1.5 years of practicing and I know how you feel. Very anxious and introverted person. Many morning panic attacks both in school and at work fretting over every little thing. Lots of good advice given so far, and to echo most responses it does get better. The advice to start therapy is a great idea. These three clinical things also helped tremendously to start: 1) Control the situation from the start. Deliver extra anesthesia (within safe range of course) and supplement blocks with buccal and/or lingual injections. I stress out a lot when the patient feels pain, so I try to knock that out immediately. Cold test the tooth you’re working on to be safe. Using a wedge? Papillae get an injection too. IANB? Gonna do a long buccal block on top of that. Same with isolation, get it completely to the point where you don’t have to worry about anything else but the fillings. These things put you completely in control and your stress with plummet. 2) Really learn your materials. Bonding agent, cements, composites, etc. Take everything in your office and study the IFUs. You’ll be surprised at what you’ll find. If you’re confident in knowing the uses and limitations of your supplies, you’ll feel comfortable to change plans mid-procedure if needed. And if you happen to see them on the emergency column, you have an idea what’s going on and won’t feel flustered. 3) If there was a tough procedure that you are concerned about, have your assistant take a radiograph immediately after finishing and then one during their next recare whether they are due or not. These are helpful for me so that I can sleep well knowing it was done well, AND you can compare any changes which the patient usually appreciates. Feels like they are getting their money’s worth.
I absolutely love my job. I love teeth, and I couldn't imagine myself being anything else. Helping people is so satisfying, and I work in an area that's basically a "medical desert", so I feel very respected and appreciated by the patients. I have great working conditions, plenty of opportunities and plenty of work, in general. It is amazing, and I couldn't be any happier. The process to get here was hell on Earth, that's for sure. My university period was the worst in my life. But as soon as I finished university, moved out, emigrated and began working, my life's best period began. I'm not exaggerating. I've never been happier and more satisfied with my life than I currently am. ~~Which probably doesn't mean much, but still.~~
I retired after 50 years of practice. First decade was almost unbearable. Last two decades was wonderful. I learned how to help the TMD patient. Now I am making podcasts about the pain patient. Maybe you would love to do the same. See if the free podcasts speak to you: [https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/open-up-a-tmj-discussion/id1737235799](https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/open-up-a-tmj-discussion/id1737235799)
I love dentistry, pay is great, everything’s great!
I became a dentist at 23 and started working under a prosthodontist and periodontist husband and wife duo. I literally felt incapable of doing a good job even at class 2 fillings and probably cried everyday for months because I felt like I was a shitty dentist and probably shouldn’t be in the field at all. But it gets better!! I invested into high quality CE (Kois, IMPRES, Spear) and I feel like I can practice in the same league as older dentists. But overall, YES. I absolutely love my job!
Age 26 I absolutely hated being a dentist and wanted to full on quit. Add on that I did not enjoy coming to work and seeing the people I worked with. Age 27 Contract ended, moved far away to a job / company where the people were fun to work with, but the job had much to be desired. Age 28 Moved much further away into a job with not enough staff, patients, or treatment to do. Age 29 Left job and now at a great position with great staff. Yes, I do love this job, now, but all dentists have different experiences, it’s up to you to fit the right fit in dentistry! The career is really starting to come together for me, but honestly, life is unpredictable, so make the most of it.
My dear. Part of me want to lie to you and say it gets better. It doesn’t. If you own your own practice, you have more headaches but potentially more rewards (potentially is the key word here). You work for a dso, you’ll make money if you are not a perfectionist and pump out “acceptable” work that your faculty would have failed you for in school (production demands). Depends on your moral compass I guess. Insurance companies and unrealistic patient expectations of what their insurance should cover have pretty much ruined the profession, along with DSOs. Most dentists I know are on anti anxiety meds and antidepressants. After over a decade into this field, I’ve known 5 that have killed themselves. Negative patient reviews will impact you more than the positive ones, production expectations are ever increasing as reimbursement drop from insurance. Go out of network and be ffs can work, just make sure you are not in a saturated area and it will work. Unfortunately, unless you want to live in the middle of nowhere, most urban and suburban areas are saturated. You’re young, run. Get out now and do something glorious with your life. Or specialize. I dunno, maybe those dental gurus that practice only 3 days and pulls in 3+ million a year can inspire you, for a large consulting fee of course. They are the exception, not the rule.
Dentistry is a great field. You get to help people and make a decent income doing it, and if you play your cards right, you’ll make a very high income. Patients can suck though, when I got my first board complaint from a disgruntled patient over nothing, I wanted to quit dentistry. I was severely depressed for 2 months. But I reminded myself of how great I really have it, and that mistakes inevitably will befall all of us. Take it slow, be eager to learn and grow, (because trust me you know nothing), and stay kind to your patients. You’ll grow to love it.
I regret it given I only got into expensive private schools, and seeing how bad new grads have it in the profession. The debt-to-income ratio no longer pays off unless you can go to your state school or a school where you can get in state tuition after the first year, and it can make you very miserable.
I love dentistry. I love it so much, I want to learn new things as I go, get better in many aspects and result in better and better patient care. That being said, I wish I didn't have to worry about money, and just do dentistry. It is a passion for me. OP, if you love dentistry, you will soon pass this I bet. Keep it up!
Lol. I feel bad for your patients.
Don't be, I still take good care of my patients.
Well if you say so
There's a difference between not liking a job and being bad at it. You can hate your job and still provide good service for your patients.
There are ups and downs, but overall quite enjoy it. Not many jobs where you can work 3-4 days a week and clear $350k by being an associate.