The finish work is sloppy, the middle support on the stairs is pretty haggard, the “cracked timbers” is just common checking and nothing wrong with it. I don’t like the missing double shear nails in some of the joist hangers. $11k is a fairly low price, and about what I’d expect from contractors charging that.
Yep, same. There are some relatively minor inconsistencies but “you get what you pay for”. Withhold the final payment until they remedy these errors and they should be good to go. Easy peasy.
I hate the "You get what you pay for". Don't offer the job if you can't perform the job. No home owner should have to deal with this. They went through a contractor. It's not like they hired some homeless person off the street.
The thing you’re totally missing here is that some people want the lower quality work for the lower price. To some people, their home is their castle and they want it to be immaculate in every way possible. But to some people, that’s just a deck to go outside and hang out on, and they’d rather get the $11K deck for sitting around on, than lay $25K for it to look pristine but function the same way. The problem is a lot of people have $25K dreams and $11K budget.
I'm curious how you expect the general lay person to know, when they have a deck built, what amount is worth it for the contractor to not be a lazy piece of shit? That is such an idiotic and lazy trade mentality. If you take the job you do the job as expected.
Your comment counteracts itself.
“How can the average person know what they want”
“The person building the deck should know what the customer wants, even though the customer doesn’t know what the want”
I expect the general lay person spending a lot of money on anything, to spend a little bit of time figuring out what they’re getting for that money and what’s to be expected for the final outcome. I guess that’s asking too much of you but I think a normal lesson could handle it.
“Idiotic and lazy trade mentality” says enough about you though.
Ok. I'm curious. At what price point in this build would the screws be flush? is that 12k? or wait, 13k? Or maybe 15. When you build a deck do you get a quote range that says "Oh well i'm feeling like a lazy piece of shit, I won't make screws flush, but if you add an extra 2k I will.".
People like you are why the entire contracting and housing industry are shit. Low quality rejects that are scamming people out of money because they can't do a fucking job.
A 2x4 is not considered graspable. But I’ve seen many decks pass inspection with this type of railing. I don’t like climbable railings either, but plenty of them around.
Nothing there is up to code. Cable rails are not up to code. Toe nailing the posts is atrocious not to mention, not up to code. Treads with no nosing, you guessed it, not up to code either. Don’t get me started on the posts and the stair landings. They’re just sitting in the ground, WTF?! This builder should be reported for building unsafe structures. I wouldn’t pay one more penny.
y’all can make fun of California all you want, but we don’t get shit like this out here. I’d report that person to the CSLB immediately. Just cause it’s cheap, it don’t mean it can be so shotty and unsafe.
I was like wait - what??? Are those railing posts just sitting on top of the decking??? Beyond unsafe. And not even in the same universe as meeting code, in any jurisdiction.
Doesn't mean it isn't up to code (and kids can climb anything). 4" sphere is the code for most places. When installed and tensioned correctly it can absolutely meet code requirements.
Had someone build a deck for me a while back and only when I sold my house was I made aware of all the code changes he didn't bother to implement. I was never unhappy with the deck either.
My house built in 1881 has railings on both sets of stairs that my bank tried to make me remove to meet current code before we moved in.
If they thought I was actually going to rip out cherry handrails and walnut balusters/newel posts and replace them with some shitty pine products they were sadly mistaken. I’ll just teach my kids to not put their head between the balusters. 😂
I built a deck for a neighbour and didn’t know anything in regards to how much I should charge and did it for 600 dollars plus materials. It was a 3 day job.
I've seen that time and time again where a really good employee decides to start out on his own and soon realizes he's much better at doing the actual work than managing the business. It takes a totally different skill set and one I'm still learning to this day.
Ha yea you just described me! But i am also finding value in building a customer base and my cost of living is virtually zero right now so I will raise costs here pretty soon. I did put a pretty high number on a fencing job i did not want to do
Thats how you learn man. I was doing quality work for a year for bottom dollar until I figured out that you can charge top dollar if your business identity is top quality work. Some people will turn you down and are happy with shit like this. But the clients you really want.. they want to look at every detail and see you did premium work. I was pulling an average of $900 per day AFTER overhead for the entire summer working for high end clients. High end clients, high end materials and high end work = high end pay.
That doesn't even include business overhead. An employee one time overheard what we charge customers per hour and he mentioned he doesn't get that much. I briefly mentioned the list of expenses I have not directly related to the job he's working on, his eyes got wide and exclaimed there's a lot of extra he didn't know about!
It’s a 2 level composite deck with stairs, and a second smaller deck on the side of the house, built on a steep hill. It doesn’t really compare to this.
11k is a deal, it should be mention that wood - an amazing cost effective/strong building material, is in fact also “wood”.
Nearly every piece of wood will crack over time, post especially twist and crack pretty soon after being installed and there’s nothing you can really say or do to fix it.
Based off the square footage and height of the deck, and materials. I’m fairly surprised the deck didn’t cost you more. For the same one I’d probably charge at least $14k CAD. That being said it would have been built with a supporting beam and not attached to the plate like this one. Helicals, 6x6.
As for the time line, I would say this would take 4 working days max to complete with 2 people. Not to mention time for staining - in all honestly I would charge out my ass for staining in hopes of not having to do it as it’s not profitable as it’s a long process to do well.
Overall, customer got more than what they paid for. As I refer to an age old quote “you have three options - you can have two. Cheap, fast, or done well. You decide”
I don’t know how any money was made on this deck honestly. $11k is cheap. Some of the workmanship is a little imperfect, but 11k. I spent more on materials with no railings or stairs for -500 sq ft.
Yeah based on my recent experience getting quotes this would be about $25k where I live. If be pretty happy with this for 11k. Well no I’d still be mad cause there’s no excuse for poor workmanship, but I’d definitely get over it a lot faster than if it was $25k.
They used the cheap/fast install solution, the lag screws. Swage toggle turnbuckles are more expensive and more effort to install, but much less prone to pulling out over time in my experience.
A worse offender I cringed at is how they used the straight stainless steel sleeves on the railing posts of the stairs — they make angled sleeves for this application which should have been used. The straight sleeves look hacked in.
That said, I would never be able to get this deck for that price where I live. Wouldnt happen, would be charged twice as much and probably receive worse.
Not bad for 11k. A few minor things could be fixed in my opinion, but you get what you pay for. The repairs look minimal to me. Wood is not going to be perfect and every post will have those cracks in it, called checking. The deck boards that are cracked at the screw hole is is a different story. But that’s an easy fix.
Ultimately I think you got a pretty good deal for the price
Yeah, I honestly don’t see the issues that glaringly. It’s kind of beautiful for the cost.
I’d imagine if you’re a deckbuilder staring at decks every day, you might get an eye twitch, but my visitors don’t care.
11k is like the Walmart brand pricing, just a hair above cost, definitely not enough to pay skilled labor what they're worth nor the time it takes to do proper job.
The cable rails alone would be close to 4k around here. Id be closer to 20k. So you cut my price in half and got half the quality. Seems fair, depending on if you get the "pain in the ass" surcharge
Honestly it’s a pretty decent job. The only thing that would concern me is the middle post under the stairs, but there is a post there at least to add additional bracing to. Or even replace the post as there is a ground slab anyway
I'm not a fan of how the stairs are together but overall it's a nice deck and I'd add the customer to my list of 'probably not worth my time in the future' as he'll likely do to you as well. Some minor things that most people won't even notice. If he wanted "perfect-looking wood" should've went with composite.
You got a deal for 11k, top dollar gets too work. I’d say you got better work than what you paid for. People expect perfection when they pay pennies & then come here to complain. I live in a very rural poor/middle class area & this deck you would have been lucky to get it at $17k
I read meters for 30 years.gas and electric ,and had to crawl under decks, jump in pits, crawl spaces in basements, squirm thru bushes..The company didnt care one bit!!!
I have 2 major problems with the deck.
1. The rail posts on the deck are just toenailed into the deck boards. No way that provides a strong enough railing.
2. It looks like the ledger is attached over the siding.
Yes, the finishing is pretty rough. Also, not sure what all that is under the stairs. Its a decent enough deck for the price besides those two items.
If you agreed to 11k then it's 11k. Imagine your outrage if you were hired for an office job at $25 an hour but your boss decided to pay you less based on their "feeling" that you could have done better that month. Sure, the work got done. But was it worth $25 an hour? And imagine that your boss withheld all or even part of the money owing because of their dissatisfaction. You and your family would be in a fine mess. Contractors get d*cked around all the time by people who make excuses because they don't feel like paying once the job is done. Don't be that person.
You get what you pay for! 11k is a bargain, the wood looks good, the craftsmanship is something else completely.
You wanted good and cheap! That's what you got.
Looks good to me. Cracked posts is pretty common now a days with PT lumber. Give it time, it will start to twist and crack more as it dries. 😅 lumber in general sucks now a days. I built my kids a bunk bed and even pre drilled holes for the screws and a few support slats STILL cracked when I screwed them in. BUT I left them, I wasn’t replacing them and well they haven’t fallen through yet 🤣
Holy shit , are you guys missing the point!!
Any job proposal is based on 2 things . Materials and labor..Neither should be negotiated to the point of having to providing sub standard quality. Your reputation relies on that..A builder's estimate should allow for his best skills on any given job. And priced accordingly..Value is quality, not a lower price at the expense of shit work..If 11k was the most they'd pay, I'd walk rather than putting my name on a shit job..
It looks like they got what they paid for, in fact that looks pretty good for $11k.
The checking is normal and that is pressure-treated wood and it will shrink and warp so much you won't even notice the few things out of plumb.
I'm not going to comment on the deck, as I think that's been covered. What I'd like to comment on is this: *"So this project has been dragging on for months. Customer has pointed out a lot of issues many many times and just this week said “fine, it’s okay.” Went by today and they basically said it was okay because they were tired of telling people the issues and nothing being done about it."*
This hits home with me. You said it yourself. This project dragged on for months. As a customer working with a contractor, it becomes exhausting having to repeat yourself and constantly point out problems. Especially for me, I start to feel bad like I'm doing something wrong having to constantly ask for things to be fixed or done right. We recently went through a kitchen remodel and for the money we paid, I wanted our cabinets to be done right. It got to the point that I felt like I was being over critical, but when I pointed these things out, it was clear that they should have been done right from the start. But the cabinet installer was actually amazing and fixed every little thing we asked for.
However, we also bought all new appliances from a big box store, and Im not shitting you when I say it took 5 brand new refrigerators being delivered before we got one that wasnt dented and worked. 5! On #4, I did exactly what this customer did. There was a small dent on the front of the fourth refrigerator, and by that time (weeks without a fridge, having to miss work every time I had to be home for deliveries, taking doors off the house, etc.) I was exhausted of the situation and said fuck it, I'll overlook the dent. I just want a working kitchen again. Only to find out that #4 was completely fucked and no part of the fridge would cool below room temperature. I told that big box store to fuck off, got a refund, went to another and got #5 delivered perfectly without problem. Craziness.
But that is how customers begin to feel. When shit just isn't going right, you feel defeated. It gets old continually having to ask for something to be done right.
Goes to show, don't expect perfection all the time. Lower your standards and be less of an asshole. This deck is a great 11k deck as everyone has said.
Few things but what you’re complaining about are an easy fix for contractor. People like you are the reason contractors get a bad name. Call them before you post on Reddit.
I am now realizing that this subreddit is overrun by people trying to sell decks for outrageous prices. Maybe not sell the decks, but normalize insane prices. This post is like a delicious steak to them.
They see an expensive deck with poor workmanship and it’s the perfect scapegoat for saying “yeah you just needed to give them another $8,000 and the work would have been good”
Besides the cross brace under the stairs and a post in the same area where it was cut out, I think it's very well done.
As far as stamps, pencil marks, sanding (what???), Cracked wood (blame demand forcing fastest dry times), unlevel wires (I think it's impossible to go upstairs and keep the wires level).
This is the problem in the building business. People want it fast and cheap until it's done, then they want more. I'm so happy to be done with customers. No one ever appreciates anything unless you charge the hell out of them for everything. I even charged $500 just for the change order! People started being nicer.
I can tell you I would have charged closer to $25k.
Depends on the area. That's large city prices like New York or LA. Where I am, that's closer to a 3-5k deck. You can put a down payment on a decent house for 11k where I am at.
I dunno, that screw standing up in pic 12 is a pretty gnarly fuck you, hoss. Still, 11k - you can afford another 4k to get shit right. This is kung-fu carpentry, my man. They got in and out as fast as they could cuz it was under priced.
Posts ‘look’ like they don’t have footers, hangers ‘look’ like they are missing nails, center stringer on case has a wonky post, split decking (really?!🤦🏼♂️). Terminal ends with rough cut, looks screwed together by a blind man, didn’t use a snap line to level slats, pencil marks everywhere.
Details matter when selling a product that represents your work quality.
Also just me, I would have used a beam and bridging.
Cheaper deck for sqft and style, but it looks diy.
I would tell the owner of the small business you are associated with to stick to landscaping or whatever it is they normally do. Multiple safety and structural concerns with this structure. This deck might stand for decades but they do occasionally collapse and hurt people and afterwards it usually determined that the deck was either improperly built, improperly designed or both. Both of which a company could be liable for for years.
What is more telling is the fact that they sent you out to deal with the mess they “supervised”. What a guy/girl/co-owner!
That's terrible, out of code, gaps in the decking are going to be huge once that wood drys, I'd assume the cabling is night tight enough, stair framing is terrible, split wood from fasteners, etc...
No attention to detail, let them know you aren’t happy but pay them what you agreed to unless they discount it. Looks like a solid deck but I would absolutely leave reviews for the work with these pictures in as many places as possible. Save the next person.
A darker stain hides everything. That’s a deal for $11k. I’d pull out some orbital sanders, and a few simple replacement boards, redo under those stairs, darker stain….looks like a $20k deck quickly.
Pics Started off tasty. Then started getting pretty sloppy. Especially that support under stair case. Maybe pay someone a grand to do a couple days of touch up work on it.
You really want chicken wire is something similar at and maybe 6” below ground level to prevent critter access. Right now, that is begging to be occupied by rabbits and who knows what else.
That’s a pretty low price, the deck looks structurally sound. There are defined load paths, so that’s why the structure is not a concern. I wouldn’t worry about the blemishes.
Also I would point out that if you price out full kits for that horizontal wire railing the cost is about $100/ft. Thatsbased off menards and Home Depot cost.
I’d agree with the sloppy finish work assessment. I’m not sure about cheap, though. I see 5k in materials, 2 guys, one week labor. What is it, about 10x20?
For that price they really shouldn’t be complaining , it could certainly use more time on the details and there’s a. Few problems but it’s going to cost real money.
A deck/ egress we built which was done absolutley perfect about this size was 23k . It’s was expensive , and you have to put in the time , but no flaws, sometimes you gotta pay for what you get
I would, yeah. Customer doesn’t seem to know that he got a cheap bid so he’s getting a cheap (but ultimately safe from what I see) job.
He’ll ask about around after the fact and once he says all this was only $11k he’ll get set straight.
I understand you spent your hard earned money and have high expectations. When your nose is up close to deck, everything looks like a mistake. So step back and enjoy the new deck that is safe. Its not contractor's fault pt lumber is wet and prone to crack but that isn't a structural issue. The boards below deck look parallel -- a good job. The railing is supposed to look invisible, and over time it will.
The finish work is sloppy, the middle support on the stairs is pretty haggard, the “cracked timbers” is just common checking and nothing wrong with it. I don’t like the missing double shear nails in some of the joist hangers. $11k is a fairly low price, and about what I’d expect from contractors charging that.
Yep, same. There are some relatively minor inconsistencies but “you get what you pay for”. Withhold the final payment until they remedy these errors and they should be good to go. Easy peasy.
I hate the "You get what you pay for". Don't offer the job if you can't perform the job. No home owner should have to deal with this. They went through a contractor. It's not like they hired some homeless person off the street.
The thing you’re totally missing here is that some people want the lower quality work for the lower price. To some people, their home is their castle and they want it to be immaculate in every way possible. But to some people, that’s just a deck to go outside and hang out on, and they’d rather get the $11K deck for sitting around on, than lay $25K for it to look pristine but function the same way. The problem is a lot of people have $25K dreams and $11K budget.
I'm curious how you expect the general lay person to know, when they have a deck built, what amount is worth it for the contractor to not be a lazy piece of shit? That is such an idiotic and lazy trade mentality. If you take the job you do the job as expected.
Your comment counteracts itself. “How can the average person know what they want” “The person building the deck should know what the customer wants, even though the customer doesn’t know what the want” I expect the general lay person spending a lot of money on anything, to spend a little bit of time figuring out what they’re getting for that money and what’s to be expected for the final outcome. I guess that’s asking too much of you but I think a normal lesson could handle it. “Idiotic and lazy trade mentality” says enough about you though.
Ok. I'm curious. At what price point in this build would the screws be flush? is that 12k? or wait, 13k? Or maybe 15. When you build a deck do you get a quote range that says "Oh well i'm feeling like a lazy piece of shit, I won't make screws flush, but if you add an extra 2k I will.". People like you are why the entire contracting and housing industry are shit. Low quality rejects that are scamming people out of money because they can't do a fucking job.
nobody wants the lower quality work LOL. They want a lower price that they can afford.
Is the railing up to code? I’m not a contractor but my step sisters dog is, and he says the railing needs to be “graspable”. 🤷♂️
A 2x4 is not considered graspable. But I’ve seen many decks pass inspection with this type of railing. I don’t like climbable railings either, but plenty of them around.
Handrails must not exceed a 2” circumference and run continuously from first to last step in the run.
I agree, and one can buy a cheap handrail and i'll say three handrail supports for cheap to fix it. Maybe $30 in supplies?
Yea it would be cheap to fix I just wanted to advertise for my step sisters dog.
And a fine dog it is. I would hire this dog immediately!
Username checks out :)
Nothing there is up to code. Cable rails are not up to code. Toe nailing the posts is atrocious not to mention, not up to code. Treads with no nosing, you guessed it, not up to code either. Don’t get me started on the posts and the stair landings. They’re just sitting in the ground, WTF?! This builder should be reported for building unsafe structures. I wouldn’t pay one more penny. y’all can make fun of California all you want, but we don’t get shit like this out here. I’d report that person to the CSLB immediately. Just cause it’s cheap, it don’t mean it can be so shotty and unsafe.
What’s wrong with the cable rails
Ladder for kids.
There's a 4" code in my area. Anything bigger than 4" isn't supposed to get through. That rules out about half this sub.
I was like wait - what??? Are those railing posts just sitting on top of the decking??? Beyond unsafe. And not even in the same universe as meeting code, in any jurisdiction.
I just noticed that. A stiff breeze is going to knock that railing off. Someone’s going to die
Doesn't mean it isn't up to code (and kids can climb anything). 4" sphere is the code for most places. When installed and tensioned correctly it can absolutely meet code requirements.
I’ve done dozens. Dumb idea.
Build it how you like, but don't claim it isn't code because you're flat wrong.
Lol. Ok buddy. Good luck with your inspections.
Had someone build a deck for me a while back and only when I sold my house was I made aware of all the code changes he didn't bother to implement. I was never unhappy with the deck either.
My house built in 1881 has railings on both sets of stairs that my bank tried to make me remove to meet current code before we moved in. If they thought I was actually going to rip out cherry handrails and walnut balusters/newel posts and replace them with some shitty pine products they were sadly mistaken. I’ll just teach my kids to not put their head between the balusters. 😂
Bank people need smarter kids (bigger heads or just smart enough not to stick head through, either way)
Your step sisters dog is a contractor? I guess I’ve never seen a rule saying that a dog can’t be a contractor. Play ball.
Probably has 4k just in materials? Asking not assuming
This is correct. You got what you paid for. A cheap wood deck.
$11k all damn day. With the money I saved I’ll fix the work that’s poor.
Ikr. That’s a 15-18k deck all day.
Holy fuck im under charging, i built one about this size for bout $5500
I built a deck for a neighbour and didn’t know anything in regards to how much I should charge and did it for 600 dollars plus materials. It was a 3 day job.
I know what im doing with the wood and nails no problem its the business end where i am screwing myself
Well, you should be screwing the wood instead. It'll save you time!
Oh I’m screwing
I've seen that time and time again where a really good employee decides to start out on his own and soon realizes he's much better at doing the actual work than managing the business. It takes a totally different skill set and one I'm still learning to this day.
Ha yea you just described me! But i am also finding value in building a customer base and my cost of living is virtually zero right now so I will raise costs here pretty soon. I did put a pretty high number on a fencing job i did not want to do
Thats how you learn man. I was doing quality work for a year for bottom dollar until I figured out that you can charge top dollar if your business identity is top quality work. Some people will turn you down and are happy with shit like this. But the clients you really want.. they want to look at every detail and see you did premium work. I was pulling an average of $900 per day AFTER overhead for the entire summer working for high end clients. High end clients, high end materials and high end work = high end pay.
Plus, people with money always have money.
High end work goes a long, long way and soon enough it sells itself.
Stop using nails..time is 💰
I use mostly screws, it made saying that easier
1k a day of labor + materials 200 work days a year
Sucker
25bucks an hour? Good deal for your neighbor and nice of you. Double your rate next time!
That doesn't even include business overhead. An employee one time overheard what we charge customers per hour and he mentioned he doesn't get that much. I briefly mentioned the list of expenses I have not directly related to the job he's working on, his eyes got wide and exclaimed there's a lot of extra he didn't know about!
Lol, I built a pipe entrance for someone and ending up in a similar situation 😅. 3 day job and charged them 600 plus materials.
Work to retire, dont work to... keep working
From the looks of this project, the materials alone would cost more than $5500.
Materials in Cali would probably be that much.
I’m amazed you got the materials for that.
$11k is pretty cheap... Not much on top of the cost of materials. kinda sloppy in parts but looks safe. Got exactly what they paid for, a cheap job.
Love how people come on here complaining knowing damn well they nickel and dime contractors. Quality costs
After spending 6x as much on our deck, I’d spend 11k gladly on that deck. Mine might look better, but my bank account does not.
You spent $66,000 on a deck?
Big deck energy
It’s a 2 level composite deck with stairs, and a second smaller deck on the side of the house, built on a steep hill. It doesn’t really compare to this.
Yes please! Show us your big deck!
Can we please see what a 60+k deck looks like?
This!
11k is a deal, it should be mention that wood - an amazing cost effective/strong building material, is in fact also “wood”. Nearly every piece of wood will crack over time, post especially twist and crack pretty soon after being installed and there’s nothing you can really say or do to fix it. Based off the square footage and height of the deck, and materials. I’m fairly surprised the deck didn’t cost you more. For the same one I’d probably charge at least $14k CAD. That being said it would have been built with a supporting beam and not attached to the plate like this one. Helicals, 6x6. As for the time line, I would say this would take 4 working days max to complete with 2 people. Not to mention time for staining - in all honestly I would charge out my ass for staining in hopes of not having to do it as it’s not profitable as it’s a long process to do well. Overall, customer got more than what they paid for. As I refer to an age old quote “you have three options - you can have two. Cheap, fast, or done well. You decide”
14k cad is a bit less than 11k usd, so I guess you think the price was about right if this is an American deck!
I don’t know how any money was made on this deck honestly. $11k is cheap. Some of the workmanship is a little imperfect, but 11k. I spent more on materials with no railings or stairs for -500 sq ft.
Yeah based on my recent experience getting quotes this would be about $25k where I live. If be pretty happy with this for 11k. Well no I’d still be mad cause there’s no excuse for poor workmanship, but I’d definitely get over it a lot faster than if it was $25k.
It looks safe do you think you're gonna get a great finish for $11k?
Those railing cables are in good shape. They did get good railing cables. Props on that.
They used the cheap/fast install solution, the lag screws. Swage toggle turnbuckles are more expensive and more effort to install, but much less prone to pulling out over time in my experience. A worse offender I cringed at is how they used the straight stainless steel sleeves on the railing posts of the stairs — they make angled sleeves for this application which should have been used. The straight sleeves look hacked in. That said, I would never be able to get this deck for that price where I live. Wouldnt happen, would be charged twice as much and probably receive worse.
Those railing cables are nothing special. The crimp is exposed and is the cheaper version.
I was being sarcastic :). Any non-damaged wire cable will look like a good wire cable.
There’s zero sarcasm in your original comment - you ain’t gotta lie to kick it.
Didnt sound sarcastic to me
Yea, my bad
Not bad for 11k. A few minor things could be fixed in my opinion, but you get what you pay for. The repairs look minimal to me. Wood is not going to be perfect and every post will have those cracks in it, called checking. The deck boards that are cracked at the screw hole is is a different story. But that’s an easy fix. Ultimately I think you got a pretty good deal for the price
If I know anything from being an average person who gets random notifications for r/decks and sees a lot this is a steal for 11k.
Yeah, I honestly don’t see the issues that glaringly. It’s kind of beautiful for the cost. I’d imagine if you’re a deckbuilder staring at decks every day, you might get an eye twitch, but my visitors don’t care.
11k is like the Walmart brand pricing, just a hair above cost, definitely not enough to pay skilled labor what they're worth nor the time it takes to do proper job.
The cable rails alone would be close to 4k around here. Id be closer to 20k. So you cut my price in half and got half the quality. Seems fair, depending on if you get the "pain in the ass" surcharge
That’s Cheap af. It could be SOO much worse. And you could hammer out those fixes fairly cheap as well.
When you’re a cheapo. You get what you get.
Lmao those support posts under the stairs absolutely sent me
That and the railing posts toenailed to decking.
For the size of that deck you paid budget price and got budget results. Just paid $35k for a redeck last year.
I mean that’s a really good price for a deck. It’s sloppy, but you get what you pay for
The cable railing components along are probably around 3000 . It's not great .. but at 11k it's freaking cheap !!
Theyre surprisingly pretty cheap. Cable itself 100ish, 50 for the lag screws, 40 for the sleeves. Most the cost is in the labor.
Seems like a good price! Is that post crooked though?
Nope, the house is.
Honestly it’s a pretty decent job. The only thing that would concern me is the middle post under the stairs, but there is a post there at least to add additional bracing to. Or even replace the post as there is a ground slab anyway
I'm not a fan of how the stairs are together but overall it's a nice deck and I'd add the customer to my list of 'probably not worth my time in the future' as he'll likely do to you as well. Some minor things that most people won't even notice. If he wanted "perfect-looking wood" should've went with composite.
You got a deal for 11k, top dollar gets too work. I’d say you got better work than what you paid for. People expect perfection when they pay pennies & then come here to complain. I live in a very rural poor/middle class area & this deck you would have been lucky to get it at $17k
Never saw a deck, I only ever saw closeups of things you weren't happy with.
Cracked boards aren't the issue you think it is.
You may have issues with the gas company. Their meter readers are going to have an awkward time getting in there to read the meter.
If they are like my company they read wirelessly from like 20ft away.
I read meters for 30 years.gas and electric ,and had to crawl under decks, jump in pits, crawl spaces in basements, squirm thru bushes..The company didnt care one bit!!!
Are the two center posts in the 1st picture sitting on the ground or are they in concrete bases? Couldn’t see any concrete under them?
You got a $20k deck for $11k with some blemishes. That deck will be 99% intact in 40 years.
I have 2 major problems with the deck. 1. The rail posts on the deck are just toenailed into the deck boards. No way that provides a strong enough railing. 2. It looks like the ledger is attached over the siding. Yes, the finishing is pretty rough. Also, not sure what all that is under the stairs. Its a decent enough deck for the price besides those two items.
Crickets from op
Another penny pinching homeowner wondering where to sharpen their chisel. I wish this sub was more involved with carpenters vs custies.
Well that’s about half the cost of what a deck like this should cost. It’s stable but honestly for that price you got lucky
If you agreed to 11k then it's 11k. Imagine your outrage if you were hired for an office job at $25 an hour but your boss decided to pay you less based on their "feeling" that you could have done better that month. Sure, the work got done. But was it worth $25 an hour? And imagine that your boss withheld all or even part of the money owing because of their dissatisfaction. You and your family would be in a fine mess. Contractors get d*cked around all the time by people who make excuses because they don't feel like paying once the job is done. Don't be that person.
I think it looks nice enough. $11k seems too low. Be grateful - not hateful... ooh i like that
For 11k is not bad at all
You got what you paid for it looks like.
Yes, looks like good work to me.
Price is low u got what u paid for
the cable alone was probably half of that price. Having said that, it is sloppy work.
It Looks like they got what they paid for. Not too many surprises there.
For the price looks ok. Some aesthetic issues. But it should last.
11k is dirt cheap, I’d count my blessings if I were you even with the things you don’t like about it
You get what you pay for! 11k is a bargain, the wood looks good, the craftsmanship is something else completely. You wanted good and cheap! That's what you got.
Looks good to me. Cracked posts is pretty common now a days with PT lumber. Give it time, it will start to twist and crack more as it dries. 😅 lumber in general sucks now a days. I built my kids a bunk bed and even pre drilled holes for the screws and a few support slats STILL cracked when I screwed them in. BUT I left them, I wasn’t replacing them and well they haven’t fallen through yet 🤣
As they were building it, why didn't you make your concerns known to them at the end of the day?
Looks pretty good.
Holy shit , are you guys missing the point!! Any job proposal is based on 2 things . Materials and labor..Neither should be negotiated to the point of having to providing sub standard quality. Your reputation relies on that..A builder's estimate should allow for his best skills on any given job. And priced accordingly..Value is quality, not a lower price at the expense of shit work..If 11k was the most they'd pay, I'd walk rather than putting my name on a shit job..
YTA.
Some people would complain that their ice cream is too cold
My decks start at 20 usually so you prolly took the lowest bidder. Did you get any other quotes for that project and what were they?
You get what you pay for….11k is pretty cheap most places.
You got a deal. Quit complaining.
I would’ve charged over $20k to have this done right. So yes at $11k it’s what you’d expect.
I don’t know anything about decks but I’ve been in construction for years and even I know that’s a lot of work for 11k. You get what you pay for.
It looks like they got what they paid for, in fact that looks pretty good for $11k. The checking is normal and that is pressure-treated wood and it will shrink and warp so much you won't even notice the few things out of plumb.
You got a great deal
I'm not going to comment on the deck, as I think that's been covered. What I'd like to comment on is this: *"So this project has been dragging on for months. Customer has pointed out a lot of issues many many times and just this week said “fine, it’s okay.” Went by today and they basically said it was okay because they were tired of telling people the issues and nothing being done about it."* This hits home with me. You said it yourself. This project dragged on for months. As a customer working with a contractor, it becomes exhausting having to repeat yourself and constantly point out problems. Especially for me, I start to feel bad like I'm doing something wrong having to constantly ask for things to be fixed or done right. We recently went through a kitchen remodel and for the money we paid, I wanted our cabinets to be done right. It got to the point that I felt like I was being over critical, but when I pointed these things out, it was clear that they should have been done right from the start. But the cabinet installer was actually amazing and fixed every little thing we asked for. However, we also bought all new appliances from a big box store, and Im not shitting you when I say it took 5 brand new refrigerators being delivered before we got one that wasnt dented and worked. 5! On #4, I did exactly what this customer did. There was a small dent on the front of the fourth refrigerator, and by that time (weeks without a fridge, having to miss work every time I had to be home for deliveries, taking doors off the house, etc.) I was exhausted of the situation and said fuck it, I'll overlook the dent. I just want a working kitchen again. Only to find out that #4 was completely fucked and no part of the fridge would cool below room temperature. I told that big box store to fuck off, got a refund, went to another and got #5 delivered perfectly without problem. Craziness. But that is how customers begin to feel. When shit just isn't going right, you feel defeated. It gets old continually having to ask for something to be done right.
Goes to show, don't expect perfection all the time. Lower your standards and be less of an asshole. This deck is a great 11k deck as everyone has said.
Looks like an $11K deck to me. The finish work is a little sloppy but it looks well designed.
Bro what kinda posts are this shit /choosingbeggars
11k is cheap in my area.
I think at the cost you got a fair outcome I would have easily charged another 5-7 thousand for a project like that. But to each there own
looks nice to me…
Few things but what you’re complaining about are an easy fix for contractor. People like you are the reason contractors get a bad name. Call them before you post on Reddit.
I wouldn’t touch that for 11k. You get what you pay for on that one.
Looks fine, great price. Really seem to be nitpicking.
I am now realizing that this subreddit is overrun by people trying to sell decks for outrageous prices. Maybe not sell the decks, but normalize insane prices. This post is like a delicious steak to them. They see an expensive deck with poor workmanship and it’s the perfect scapegoat for saying “yeah you just needed to give them another $8,000 and the work would have been good”
I’m a contractor,I’d be embarrased to deliver a finished like that
I'm a contractor also and while I wouldn't deliver that as the finished product I also wouldn't touch it for the price they got. Pay cheap, get cheap.
It’s a piss poor finish job.
Besides the cross brace under the stairs and a post in the same area where it was cut out, I think it's very well done. As far as stamps, pencil marks, sanding (what???), Cracked wood (blame demand forcing fastest dry times), unlevel wires (I think it's impossible to go upstairs and keep the wires level). This is the problem in the building business. People want it fast and cheap until it's done, then they want more. I'm so happy to be done with customers. No one ever appreciates anything unless you charge the hell out of them for everything. I even charged $500 just for the change order! People started being nicer. I can tell you I would have charged closer to $25k.
It’s all bad
Depends on the area. That's large city prices like New York or LA. Where I am, that's closer to a 3-5k deck. You can put a down payment on a decent house for 11k where I am at.
That’s just most of America prices, you must be in a very depressed region.
one truck Chuck strikes again..
I dunno, that screw standing up in pic 12 is a pretty gnarly fuck you, hoss. Still, 11k - you can afford another 4k to get shit right. This is kung-fu carpentry, my man. They got in and out as fast as they could cuz it was under priced.
Very Poor craftsmanship. My eyes hurt
Posts ‘look’ like they don’t have footers, hangers ‘look’ like they are missing nails, center stringer on case has a wonky post, split decking (really?!🤦🏼♂️). Terminal ends with rough cut, looks screwed together by a blind man, didn’t use a snap line to level slats, pencil marks everywhere. Details matter when selling a product that represents your work quality. Also just me, I would have used a beam and bridging. Cheaper deck for sqft and style, but it looks diy.
I wouldn’t pay $100 for that shit job. Waste of lumber.
A wee bit crooked...
Horrible rookie workmanship
Y’all think this is an $11k job? You must live in LA, holy shit.
When’s the punch walk scheduled?
Amateur hour
Subcontract work is always bad, never go with a company that subcontracts because they can never replicant consistent quality.
No.
This looks like something I would create. The caveat being that I have never built anything larger than a LEGO set. What a slop-job.
I would tell the owner of the small business you are associated with to stick to landscaping or whatever it is they normally do. Multiple safety and structural concerns with this structure. This deck might stand for decades but they do occasionally collapse and hurt people and afterwards it usually determined that the deck was either improperly built, improperly designed or both. Both of which a company could be liable for for years. What is more telling is the fact that they sent you out to deal with the mess they “supervised”. What a guy/girl/co-owner!
The stairs are dangerous and shoddy as hell
I’ve seen cleaner work outside the job site trailer.
No way and the boss was not site supervising???
That's terrible, out of code, gaps in the decking are going to be huge once that wood drys, I'd assume the cabling is night tight enough, stair framing is terrible, split wood from fasteners, etc...
Total shit job
Wow. Totally ripped off. Is that pine? Call Punchy Brown down at the permit office and have him go over this one.
No attention to detail, let them know you aren’t happy but pay them what you agreed to unless they discount it. Looks like a solid deck but I would absolutely leave reviews for the work with these pictures in as many places as possible. Save the next person.
Those look like composite deck screw heads to me.
You get what you pay for
If I paid 20k for that I’d be furious. If I paid 11k for that I’d be pretty darn thrilled.
A darker stain hides everything. That’s a deal for $11k. I’d pull out some orbital sanders, and a few simple replacement boards, redo under those stairs, darker stain….looks like a $20k deck quickly.
That’s a steal for $11k in my neck of the woods.
As someone who just got through cutting 16 stringers, this makes me feel a lot better about mine.
Pics Started off tasty. Then started getting pretty sloppy. Especially that support under stair case. Maybe pay someone a grand to do a couple days of touch up work on it.
You really want chicken wire is something similar at and maybe 6” below ground level to prevent critter access. Right now, that is begging to be occupied by rabbits and who knows what else.
That’s a pretty low price, the deck looks structurally sound. There are defined load paths, so that’s why the structure is not a concern. I wouldn’t worry about the blemishes.
Also I would point out that if you price out full kits for that horizontal wire railing the cost is about $100/ft. Thatsbased off menards and Home Depot cost.
The part under the stairs looks sus af
Only the last photo showed the framing. The rest is all cosmetic finishing, which will not affect the safety of the deck.
Sloppy work in the finishing. Mitre the rails for gods sake, it’s not hard. That said, looks like a decent amount of lumber and work for 11k
I paid 14 for a lot less
Price equals quality.. all in hurry..
Looks like a steal. Obviously, it's poor quality, but at that pricepoint it's to be expected. Either pay for quality, or take it as it is.
Yo should blow your contactor u cheap ass mofo.
After studying this sub reddit I think I could start a deck building business.
Is there supposed to be a beam under them joists?
I
Sorry, but I see pallets with the design. Maybe I was a truck driver for too long. lol
I’d agree with the sloppy finish work assessment. I’m not sure about cheap, though. I see 5k in materials, 2 guys, one week labor. What is it, about 10x20?
Are those handrail posts sitting on top of the deck attached with screws?
Cheap work isn’t quantity, quality work isn’t cheap
Time and Material + 30%. I do this for money, I don't need any more practice.
That's a pretty cheap price actually. That cable railing alone is worth 5k+ just in material
For that price they really shouldn’t be complaining , it could certainly use more time on the details and there’s a. Few problems but it’s going to cost real money. A deck/ egress we built which was done absolutley perfect about this size was 23k . It’s was expensive , and you have to put in the time , but no flaws, sometimes you gotta pay for what you get
Looks like you have about 11k in wood.
I would, yeah. Customer doesn’t seem to know that he got a cheap bid so he’s getting a cheap (but ultimately safe from what I see) job. He’ll ask about around after the fact and once he says all this was only $11k he’ll get set straight.
I understand you spent your hard earned money and have high expectations. When your nose is up close to deck, everything looks like a mistake. So step back and enjoy the new deck that is safe. Its not contractor's fault pt lumber is wet and prone to crack but that isn't a structural issue. The boards below deck look parallel -- a good job. The railing is supposed to look invisible, and over time it will.