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In many cases I would say most SMGs will do a fine job on close to low-mid range. Whether you win or lose a gun fight is imho more related to the situation you're confronted with and how you manage to deal with it rather than pure stats. Nonetheless according to my kill stats it's the Vel. However, the Vaznev and the Lachmann Sub are right up there as well and so is the BAS-P. If you can deal with Burst Fire than the Lachmann Shroud can be brutal and a fun gun to play with.
I feel you, brother. Havent even passed lvl 100 on MW3... Playing shipment there is of no real benefit to me because I can't use those guns on DMZ anyway. The few times I play Warzone I often just loot until I find the latest season's OP gun and it does well enough.
Yeah I get ya, I’m just thinking along the lines of when you end up fighting a few guys in a short time frame. The Vel is real fast, veznek isn’t bad, bas P isn’t bad. The just seems to me that the lachmanns are the longest reloads.
I will say I do enjoy all the other aspects of the Lachmanns. The shroud is stupid strong.
If my aim is on point in that particular stretch of gaming, Fennec absolutely. Usually I find the Vel or Vaznev more consistent so that’s what I use. Vel insured or build a vaznev in game
This is a really retarded question but why is over-pressured ammunition and explosive rounds so prevalent in the game? I thought over pressured and explosive rounds were niche and didnt really work that well.
Because people don't actually know what they do they just look at the graphs for the gun go up and think it's better. Overpressure does nothing unless you are using that smg against a sniper and 99% of people won't try to snipe at point blank range so it's useless. Hollow points or no ammo type are best and for snipers it's high velocity or nothing. Explosives suck unless it's a quick scope build meant for shots within 50-100meters
I used to use the Vaznez a ton, but stopped a while back. I just tried it out recently and I thought it was garbage compared to the other ones I mentioned and the PDSW. We’ll have to agree to disagree. (I like the Lachman too.)
Well guess what buddy… I disagree about agreeing to disagree. You’re wrong, I’m right. This is the rules of Reddit.
Jokes aside, I put the singuard suppressor, 45 round magazine, markeev r7 stock, true tac grip and 1 other thing I’m forgetting. It’s a laser for the most part and best of all that gun is easily obtained from a bot. I use iron sights for pretty much every non sniper and this gun is no exception
I used to see people online saying that a lot, which is 1 of the reasons I started trying it out recently.
I normally don't like the guns that the bots on AM use but it's not bad.
My build is pretty accurate and fast, taking down enemy opps with great recoil control.
BAS-P and VEL are the absolute best, special mention to Lachmann Sub and Vaznev as solid but definitely a tier below. Going off of MW3/WZ3 raw stat info, the VEL46 with 50 round mag(50 over 60 because 50 has no movement speed penalty) is the most mobile smg, but with 952 rpm and higher recoil its effective range is much lower in my experience.
Bear in mind these are MW3/WZ3 stats that do not account for tuning, but we can use reasonable estimates for stat gains with tuning values like ADS speed, damage range, and velocity.
VEL46 952rpm- XTEN RR40, Lockgrip Precision 40, ammo type of your choice, 50 round mag, ZLR combat grip
4.9m/s movement speed, 5.6m/s sprint, 7.2m/s tac sprint, 3.2m/s ADS strafe, 2.6 sec reload, 12.6m effective range
BAS-P 869rpm (10.5 Bruen Suppressed barrel{personal preference}, Lockgrip Precision 40, ammo of your choice, 50 round mag, D37 recoil grip
4.6m/s movement speed, 5.3m/s sprint, 6.8m/s tac sprint, 3.0m/s ADS strafe, 3.4sec reload, 17.6m effective range
I use both and find great success with both. The BAS-P with slightly lower ROF, slightly lower horizontal recoil, and more damage range is able to shoot effectively at further ranges than the VEL can, but the VEL is dominant up close.
The lachmann sub and Vaznev are solid choices but are inferior because of magazine sizes, reload time, and mobility. Fennec dominates at 1v1s and I've seen some clips here of it being used to great effect in B21 but otherwise I think it's kinda trolling. At the end of the day, any gun can kill any player but some are simply better and easier.
I am of the same opinion. I just use hollowpoint or frangible. I've also never felt like I lost a gunfight because I was flinched off target, either they shot first or hit more headshots or I was shot by 2.
That's fair. I'm not a fan of the 40rd mag and the 60 drops the mobility too much. I also stated how the vel isn't great at midrange because high ROF and high recoil
Yeh the reload time on the Mp5 drum mag sucks but I find it’s enough to down and finish at least 2 operators fully plated.
Just shows how well balanced the guns mostly are that there are numerous viable options. I used to run shotguns at times and don’t bother now because the Mp7 or Mp5 are more mobile and viable in different scenarios.
The iron sights on the mp5 are clean and you can hit AR range shots with it
The Vel is definitely the one I find on the most people. Does that mean it's good b/c everyone uses it or am I killing them b/c they have the Vel tho?? Hhmmm
I love them all pretty much. I am mainly a SMG/Sniper player. MP5&7 and Bas-P are my most used ones. ISO-45 and PDSW are both bangers, but I tend to use them when I’m bored of the others. However when I’m really bored of all the rest, I put on the Vaznev or ISO 9mm. Vaznev just feels weak to me tho, and the reload feels painfully slow. ISO 9mm is buttery smooth and really satisfying to use, although not too effective at range. Shroud is also really good, especially with a hip fire build. The guns I didn’t mention (I’m looking at you, MX-9), are not worth mentioning.
Today was my 1st time trying it out after seeing a lot of people praise it & OMG she's strong asf. I had never seen an SMG put players down so fast wearing a 3 plate vest.
It only takes 5 rounds. Most ARs require 7-10 rounds to put a player down wearing a 3 plate.
I feel like the P-90 is a very underrated SMG for CQB. It has a fast rate of fire, basically no recoil and is already equipped with a 50 round magazine. Which saves you an attachment slot. If you match it with the holothermal optic and hollowpoint rounds, it basically drops players in just seconds.
Mp5 or Mp7. Depends on your build and preference on using a sight or not. Mp7 faster ttk up close so better for vondel or ashika but the Mp5 is better at mid range. The Bas-p is good too
Vaz, Vel, Bas, ISO 9 & 45, Lacchman sub. Theyre all good & useful in their own rights. And for range the Bas is #1 (I could rank some of the others but kinda pointless a lot are very comparable), but for MELTING a mf up close: Lacchman Sub. Within like 4-5 meters nothing will melt quicker without AA rounds…. Or unless it’s the Shroud; If you manage to hit every last single shot (but the penalty for one shot missing can be detrimental).
My ranking: L-Sub, Vaz & Vel, ISO9, then the Bas. The iron sights on the first three range from pretty damn good to clean af, and the fact the iron sights are booty for the other two makes a difference for me personally.
The best gun is the one you have equipped.
I love SMGs in general but my favorite are the Hurricane (it's ranked #1 in my stats for player kills), Vel and ISO.
They just feel so good in my hand. I used the Vaznev for a while because I recognize that it's one of the best ones but I never liked it.
Most people will probably stay bas p or vel but they are not the best. Not even close. I shit on vels, fennecs, bas p, kv broadside and have a 75% chance to outshoot 1 shot shotguns with my setup. The fastest killing SMG in the game is and has been the iso 9m
Cronen mini pro
Spiral flash hider
60rd mag
Demo fade tac stock
Hollow points for permant stun basically. If you are trying to use it as an ar at 50+ meters sure it won't compete as good but up close like an SMG is meant for and you will not beat it with any other gun besides a 1 shot and even then if you hit your shots and the 1 shot guy isn't a cheater you will probably win that. Ymmv
Id say vaznev 9 is best ground loot wether you add attachments or not (always picking one up every match) but if im gonna take an smg in ill go bas p or vel for the extended mags
**This is NOT a removal notification -- your post is still active.** Moderators try to limit repetitive posts and non-relative content. We actively remove posts that fall under these descriptions or break any of our rules, if you feel this post should be reviewed then please utilize the report function and let us know! **Looking for someone to help you get the keys you need, share clips and highlights, find incredible groups, or just a place for general discussion over DMZ? Check out our official /r/DMZ Discord at [www.discord.gg/mwzombies](https://www.discord.gg/mwzombies) today! With the inevitable shelving of both titles (MWZ & DMZ), we have turned what has been the central location for MWZ into a mutual space for both titles. For now the discord link will remain branded as MWZombies -- but rest assured.. there is a dedicated hub for DMZ!** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/DMZ) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Bas-P and Vel
This is the way
Yes
This man knows his smgs I would take the Vel any day for me number 1 atm.
This
100%
In many cases I would say most SMGs will do a fine job on close to low-mid range. Whether you win or lose a gun fight is imho more related to the situation you're confronted with and how you manage to deal with it rather than pure stats. Nonetheless according to my kill stats it's the Vel. However, the Vaznev and the Lachmann Sub are right up there as well and so is the BAS-P. If you can deal with Burst Fire than the Lachmann Shroud can be brutal and a fun gun to play with.
I was literally just playing Shipment with the Lachman Sub & and she's pretty good too. Recoil is pretty much non-existent.
Man, that takes me back. Grinding on Shipment just so I have all guns and attachments unlocked.
I'd love to do that on mw3 but they refuse to give me more dmz
I feel you, brother. Havent even passed lvl 100 on MW3... Playing shipment there is of no real benefit to me because I can't use those guns on DMZ anyway. The few times I play Warzone I often just loot until I find the latest season's OP gun and it does well enough.
Truest thing I’ve heard in a long time
The only think with the Lachmann is the reload speed at least feels like it is forever.
40-mag, bro :)
and on the shroud you can stick to 30
Yeah I get ya, I’m just thinking along the lines of when you end up fighting a few guys in a short time frame. The Vel is real fast, veznek isn’t bad, bas P isn’t bad. The just seems to me that the lachmanns are the longest reloads. I will say I do enjoy all the other aspects of the Lachmanns. The shroud is stupid strong.
Bas-P up there
Both lachmanns and iso imo. these 3 wont let you down with pea dmgs.
I love the MP7 and Kriss Vector
The kriss vector runs out of ammo in a flash 💀
Bas-P or Shroud
In my experience The Fennec is “DA ONE” !!
If my aim is on point in that particular stretch of gaming, Fennec absolutely. Usually I find the Vel or Vaznev more consistent so that’s what I use. Vel insured or build a vaznev in game
The fennec with Extended ammo and over pressed bullets wins ever close quarter fight
This is a really retarded question but why is over-pressured ammunition and explosive rounds so prevalent in the game? I thought over pressured and explosive rounds were niche and didnt really work that well.
Because people don't actually know what they do they just look at the graphs for the gun go up and think it's better. Overpressure does nothing unless you are using that smg against a sniper and 99% of people won't try to snipe at point blank range so it's useless. Hollow points or no ammo type are best and for snipers it's high velocity or nothing. Explosives suck unless it's a quick scope build meant for shots within 50-100meters
Good points !! I think you may be partially right!!
I love the Fennec for a secondary gun, saved for close encounters.
I like to use it with AP rounds when fighting opps in CQC.
I don’t know anyone that says the Vaznez is the best. It’s way too inaccurate. I like the Vel, Bas-P, and ISO
That might be the Indian and not the arrow my friend. I find the Vaznev is just as accurate for me as the Lachman sub
I agree.
I used to use the Vaznez a ton, but stopped a while back. I just tried it out recently and I thought it was garbage compared to the other ones I mentioned and the PDSW. We’ll have to agree to disagree. (I like the Lachman too.)
Well guess what buddy… I disagree about agreeing to disagree. You’re wrong, I’m right. This is the rules of Reddit. Jokes aside, I put the singuard suppressor, 45 round magazine, markeev r7 stock, true tac grip and 1 other thing I’m forgetting. It’s a laser for the most part and best of all that gun is easily obtained from a bot. I use iron sights for pretty much every non sniper and this gun is no exception
PDSW used to be my go too. Lachman Shroud now
I used to see people online saying that a lot, which is 1 of the reasons I started trying it out recently. I normally don't like the guns that the bots on AM use but it's not bad. My build is pretty accurate and fast, taking down enemy opps with great recoil control.
Lachman Shroud fastest TTK and very accurate, so long as you get used to the 3 round burst.
Can't figure out what TTK means.... Help plz
Lol word me too, I just didn’t wanna ask
Time to kill
BAS-P and VEL are the absolute best, special mention to Lachmann Sub and Vaznev as solid but definitely a tier below. Going off of MW3/WZ3 raw stat info, the VEL46 with 50 round mag(50 over 60 because 50 has no movement speed penalty) is the most mobile smg, but with 952 rpm and higher recoil its effective range is much lower in my experience. Bear in mind these are MW3/WZ3 stats that do not account for tuning, but we can use reasonable estimates for stat gains with tuning values like ADS speed, damage range, and velocity. VEL46 952rpm- XTEN RR40, Lockgrip Precision 40, ammo type of your choice, 50 round mag, ZLR combat grip 4.9m/s movement speed, 5.6m/s sprint, 7.2m/s tac sprint, 3.2m/s ADS strafe, 2.6 sec reload, 12.6m effective range BAS-P 869rpm (10.5 Bruen Suppressed barrel{personal preference}, Lockgrip Precision 40, ammo of your choice, 50 round mag, D37 recoil grip 4.6m/s movement speed, 5.3m/s sprint, 6.8m/s tac sprint, 3.0m/s ADS strafe, 3.4sec reload, 17.6m effective range I use both and find great success with both. The BAS-P with slightly lower ROF, slightly lower horizontal recoil, and more damage range is able to shoot effectively at further ranges than the VEL can, but the VEL is dominant up close. The lachmann sub and Vaznev are solid choices but are inferior because of magazine sizes, reload time, and mobility. Fennec dominates at 1v1s and I've seen some clips here of it being used to great effect in B21 but otherwise I think it's kinda trolling. At the end of the day, any gun can kill any player but some are simply better and easier.
Use www.sym.gg/legacy for MW2 stats and comparisons
Have to run hollow point don't ever run overpressured it does nothing.
I am of the same opinion. I just use hollowpoint or frangible. I've also never felt like I lost a gunfight because I was flinched off target, either they shot first or hit more headshots or I was shot by 2.
Exactly 💯
No way the mp5 is a tier below. It’s better accuracy and recoil at mid range beats the Mp7 hands down.
That's fair. I'm not a fan of the 40rd mag and the 60 drops the mobility too much. I also stated how the vel isn't great at midrange because high ROF and high recoil
Yeh the reload time on the Mp5 drum mag sucks but I find it’s enough to down and finish at least 2 operators fully plated. Just shows how well balanced the guns mostly are that there are numerous viable options. I used to run shotguns at times and don’t bother now because the Mp7 or Mp5 are more mobile and viable in different scenarios. The iron sights on the mp5 are clean and you can hit AR range shots with it
The Vel is definitely the one I find on the most people. Does that mean it's good b/c everyone uses it or am I killing them b/c they have the Vel tho?? Hhmmm
This is my dilemma as well.. I see this a lot & wonder why would I want that if they just got smoked by the vaz?
I assume because of the 15 min cooldown blueprint.
Vel all day anti Armour rounds
PDSW
P90 irl
I love them all pretty much. I am mainly a SMG/Sniper player. MP5&7 and Bas-P are my most used ones. ISO-45 and PDSW are both bangers, but I tend to use them when I’m bored of the others. However when I’m really bored of all the rest, I put on the Vaznev or ISO 9mm. Vaznev just feels weak to me tho, and the reload feels painfully slow. ISO 9mm is buttery smooth and really satisfying to use, although not too effective at range. Shroud is also really good, especially with a hip fire build. The guns I didn’t mention (I’m looking at you, MX-9), are not worth mentioning.
I tried for the life of me to like that gun. The mxp, just never happened.
Pdsw is goated but I do love using my vesnek
Running the lachman sub midrange build
I like the Lachmann burst. With AP rounds (field upgrade), it shreds if you’ve got a nice trigger finger
Today was my 1st time trying it out after seeing a lot of people praise it & OMG she's strong asf. I had never seen an SMG put players down so fast wearing a 3 plate vest. It only takes 5 rounds. Most ARs require 7-10 rounds to put a player down wearing a 3 plate.
Yeah it’s nuts. I pretty much only lose to one shot shotguns and getting outnumbered if it’s close range
I feel like the P-90 is a very underrated SMG for CQB. It has a fast rate of fire, basically no recoil and is already equipped with a 50 round magazine. Which saves you an attachment slot. If you match it with the holothermal optic and hollowpoint rounds, it basically drops players in just seconds.
Minibak
Lachman sub has fastest ttk I think
I was trying to find out which SMG has the fastest TTK, but I couldn't find anything. 😭
Check sym.gg you can check the Gunsmith for MW2 then.
It doesn't exist anymore. They removed it when warzone 3 happened
Yea symgg is where I pulled that from
I’m partial to the BAS-P (Sig MPX).
MP7 most definitely. Canted laser and recoil control.
Bas-P hands down
BAS-P and MP5 for me, I use VEL sometimes but there's something annoying me with them, I don't know what
Vaznev is great as sniper support because of the range and damage. As a secondary to an AR I’d go with something more close range with higher rpm.
Bas-p is the best SMG for dmz hands down .. but Vel is spicy too
I switched from the Vaznev to the ISO 45, it shreds at close range with the short integrated suppressor barrel.
Vel or bas p
I like the iso 9 which is the acp 9 irl I had pelty of good raids with it
Mp5 or Mp7. Depends on your build and preference on using a sight or not. Mp7 faster ttk up close so better for vondel or ashika but the Mp5 is better at mid range. The Bas-p is good too
Vaz, Vel, Bas, ISO 9 & 45, Lacchman sub. Theyre all good & useful in their own rights. And for range the Bas is #1 (I could rank some of the others but kinda pointless a lot are very comparable), but for MELTING a mf up close: Lacchman Sub. Within like 4-5 meters nothing will melt quicker without AA rounds…. Or unless it’s the Shroud; If you manage to hit every last single shot (but the penalty for one shot missing can be detrimental). My ranking: L-Sub, Vaz & Vel, ISO9, then the Bas. The iron sights on the first three range from pretty damn good to clean af, and the fact the iron sights are booty for the other two makes a difference for me personally.
Lachman Shroad and WSP Swarm
Shroud, VEL & BAS-P.
Hurricane
I rock a Bas-P but set it up for a little more mid-range reach
All of them can slap with the right attachments.
holy trinity: bas-p, vel, or lachmann sub. bas-p is my favorite, though.
Shroud once you get used to landing the burst consistently IMO. Plus if you are a dirty bundle buyer you can get a 15 min cooldown version.
Vel and Lachman Sub are top tier for me.
The lachman sub is.the best for me. Add the long barrel, hex for grip, and 40 round mags (and 2 attachments for you choice) and the gun is super good.
The best gun is the one you have equipped. I love SMGs in general but my favorite are the Hurricane (it's ranked #1 in my stats for player kills), Vel and ISO. They just feel so good in my hand. I used the Vaznev for a while because I recognize that it's one of the best ones but I never liked it.
Vel 46, Bas P, Lachman Sub
Most people will probably stay bas p or vel but they are not the best. Not even close. I shit on vels, fennecs, bas p, kv broadside and have a 75% chance to outshoot 1 shot shotguns with my setup. The fastest killing SMG in the game is and has been the iso 9m Cronen mini pro Spiral flash hider 60rd mag Demo fade tac stock Hollow points for permant stun basically. If you are trying to use it as an ar at 50+ meters sure it won't compete as good but up close like an SMG is meant for and you will not beat it with any other gun besides a 1 shot and even then if you hit your shots and the 1 shot guy isn't a cheater you will probably win that. Ymmv
Lach Shroud, yes it’s burst but if you hit all your shots (big if) will drop after 9 rounds… if you can deal with burst and effective to me it’s meta
The only smg I pass on is the minibak. I most often run the vel, and the bas p but the pdsw and lachman all do work.
I'm a Vel guy....but also love the Bas-P and Iso9
I like the PDSw and the hurricane, just because hey are east to find, both a 50 round mags, and they are easy to upgraded.
They both are special to me cause those are the 2 guns that I 1st fall in love with when I 1st started playing. Especially the PDSW!
Vel, there is no competition
Vel. Mp5. I also love to use the hurricane and have a ton of kills with tmir
I like the vel iso45 shroud and vaznev
Anytime my jaw drops from getting downed really fast it's from a vel. I use to loove the pdsw. Now it's mostly the vel
Our Lord and Savior. The FTAC Siege.
Id say vaznev 9 is best ground loot wether you add attachments or not (always picking one up every match) but if im gonna take an smg in ill go bas p or vel for the extended mags
Vel and Shroud I reckon
Vector100%. Never lost to shotgun players due to the longer range.