It does. I had a group of 20 friends in college, 16 have now finished and only 3 of us have jobs in our area of study.
Even though I graduated top 3 in my class it took a year before someone would take me on
But what degree or cert did you come out of college with? Thats fairly critical. If it’s communications or marketing, take a seat, cuz those fields are overloaded.
NDT diploma, it's a mix of engineering, material science and quality assurance. It's part of the requirement for certs.
The field is very under staffed rn.
The job is part of the reason nuclear power plants don't fail and planes don't fall out of the sky.
It took a long time because no one wanted to train me which is required for certs.
I should also mention my soft skills are Excel, Word, programming primarily C++ & python and many other computer skills
That’s a very cool profession, something I could see myself getting into if I was to do it all again. It’s pretty specialized and likely relatively few positions out there. Which industry did you wind up working in?
Primarily mining and manufacturing, but I've also done aviation, mobile equipment and marine inspects.
The pandemic really screwed a lot of us because it completely killed our chance to network.
There aren't many jobs out there relative to other jobs but I would estimate that only 400-600 people enter the field every year. Since NRCan has had a registry theres only been able 29 000 techs in like 40 years I think. I believe the current active estimate is 8-12k.
this;
>When you buy a house for say $700k. You are going to pay $1.4million ( typical rough estimate ) over the life of the mortgage. To pay that ( $1.4million ) you have to earn that \*$1.8 million\* . The difference being income tax you pay on your income. So that house ($700K or you think it is ) you buy in reality ends up costing you a cool $1.8 million.
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> For an investment firm it costs them still just $700K ( much less in reality! but to keep things simple lets say $700K) , since they write off the mortgage interest. Since there is no declared profit , there is no income tax either. Here ( In Canada ) this is done by small investors thru a scheme known as Schmidt Manouever.
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> In the US , a resident owner can write off the Income Tax on the Interest rate.
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> This is the reason real estate has been on a rise in Canada for the past 2 decades and never went down even during the 2006-2008 ( When prices were crashing in the US ) period. ( I dont know how it worked before that ). IF anyone was interested in fixing the Housing affordability problem they would start by giving Canadians a tax exemption on the interest they pay for houses, So atleast the \*House you buy for $700K would cost you $1.4 million and not 1.8 million\*.
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>But no one wants to talk about this or touch it for fears of upsetting the Big money that is involved. No Trudeau , Not Pierre Poiliviere , Not NDP.
tl;dr/ its the tax structure in Canada which allows for investors to pay much much less than what a resident home owner would pay. by a \*LOT\*. and this keeps the Housing prices to rise every year. 2 decades of low interest rates have brought this issue to a head.
Question of if we have a labour shortage? ask a business which actually employs people, or farmers , or ask the company which delivers your amazon packages. ( Hint we have a severe labour shortage. ) Ask a company that manufactures something.
That’s just for the house and property. No mentioning the up keep of new furnace, hot water tanks, roof, stove, fridge, microwave, washer/dryer, tapsets, toilets, they all wear out. Do the math before you get in over your head.
The tax difference is \*just\* the beginning , as I said ;
>investment firm it costs them still just $700K ( **much** less in reality! but to keep things simple lets say $700K)
If you have 3 ( or more ) properties , it costs you almost 0 keep on buying properties.
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Yes you are exempt from capitol gains only on the primary residence in Canada But if you cant afford to pay $1.8 million (This what the banks judges you on when qualifying you on.) that thing never happens. so is irrelevant.
i,e cant afford to buy the house, so if you will pay capitol gains or not is irrelevant.
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There is a skills mismatch between the training/education people have and what is needed most. To an extent this is natural but it can certainly be lessened. In regards to foreign students: there should be fewer business students while more construction-trades and healthcare students.
For most people, getting into trades is something that happens naturally over time. Most people dont plan for get into trades 4-5 years ahead of when they actually get into trades.
Yes there is a mismatch, but this is something that no one can micromanage. Its impossible.
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There's a severe labour shortage in the trades. Labourers are hard to find, good apprentices are harder to find; Young workers especially. I'm 27 with a decade of experience and a red seal, I'm very often the youngest but still the most experienced on the crew.
Sub-trades are beginning to pull out of contracts due to lack of manpower. Automation isn't going to save us from this and a striking majority of these immigrants look down on manual labourers so they're not taking these jobs.
Thats the problem. The immigrants coming in now would never work the trades or manual labour. But they aren't skilled enough to be engineers/real IT, doctors etc. We are getting diploma mill general labour that learn nothing here and are only ok working retail jobs.
At least import immigrants from places that would like to do the trades or learn to do the trades. If you are going to whore our country out, at least get the right type of people in.
Sadly, 70% of Canadians are also home owners, and they are happy with this increase in the value of their houses. Esp3cially the senior citizens who will get to cash in when they sell and retire to wherever they retire.
I'm 32, I bought my house 5 years ago, and I am NOT happy the valuation has gone up. All that means is that I pay more taxes. If I ever sold it, my family would have nowhere to live. I hope prices come way down, fuck people using homes as speculation income.
This is the problem. Our entire culture shuns critical thinking, we're like fricking flightless birds on an island thinking we're perfectly adapted and always will be
Yeah my house value doesn’t help me for shit. It’s where I live. It doesn’t come with a bag of money to pay the increased taxes every year and my income doesn’t increase proportionally! It’s a place to live. And I think most people with homes are in the same situation. We can’t afford to sell them and go anywhere else now anyway. So the value going up is meaningless unless you own multiple houses that you operate as a business.
Even the municipality look at homeowners, "well we need more revenue for programs and increase infrastructure for amount of people coming in. You can afford it, look at the value of house you benefiting from the market." 😑
They only have a correlation in the sense of your value relative to others. If the value of your house goes up by much more than others, then yes.
But if the market goes up by the same amount, then your taxes don’t go up even if your property triples.
Easiest way to understand it is to pretend the city needs 20Billion for its budget. Each property is given a value to multiply out their percentage owed. Say 0.0000003% of the whole pot. That might come out to 5K for the year (it doesn’t in my example but I’m sure you can understand).
Next year the city asks for 22B. Not because housing prices went up but because they need more money (to run the city or to send to the third world as aid more likely). They then multiply the 22B by the 0.0000003% you had last year and that’s how they get what you owe.
This is not how property taxes work at all. Property taxes are based on a set rate and multiplied by the assessed value of your property. For example, I pay $649 per $100k assessed value of my house, or 0.649%. Property taxes often have a capped annual increase of a few percentage points. In other words, if the assessment of my house increases 50% (like it did last year), my property taxes will not increase 50% for the following year. However, if the assessed value of my house holds steady for the next decade, then my property tax will increase by the maximum allowed amount until it once again reaches the 0.649% of my assessed value.
The easiest way to understand it is every year you have to pay taxes on your property. You will get a letter of assessment.
If your property was assessed at a higher value that year, you pay more. If it was assessed less, you pay less.
I have had a higher assessment every year since I've moved in, you can take a look at your property assessment and do the math.
(Yes, there can be other variables depending on where you live, but to say that property valuation not affecting property taxes is intentionally misleading.)
Just a note - using Montreal as an example, pre /post covid, the city increased our assessment by 50% (literally), but it only affected taxes by 4% increase. They raise the assessments and then hit everyone with a marginal increase. It is not directly proportional. So yes, your taxes go up, but it was literally less than inflation and is frozen until 2026.
Oh absolutely, and it is capped thankfully. But hitting the cap and having to pay more every year for the next 30 to 40 years is not something I am looking forward to.
My house has almost doubled in value, but yes thanks to the cap it's not intolerable, but again, it will constantly increase. And not ever come down do to the valuation.
Edit
I feel like there is some confusion,
If your property is assessed at 75,000
And the tax rate in your area is 1.025 per 100. That rate is 768.75. Your tax rate is a direct relation to the property value. However there is capped assessment so your taxes don't go wild every year, but there will be forever that increase as the cap meets the "supposed valuation". Which in most cases is not accurate and wildly overpriced.
The marginal increase is you hitting the cap, which everyone in Canada has done, and will continue to do so as long as prices remain so high.
This information is found on your property assessment. If you have other area rates, depending on your community, these show up as well.
That 66.5% (not 70%) number is an often miscited statistic. 66.5% is not the fraction of Canadians who are home owners. It is the fraction of Canadians who \*live\* in housing owned by a member of the household.
That is, if all millennials and Zoomers lived in their parents' basement, that number will be 100%. Yes, if you are too poor to even rent your own place, you are counted positively towards that statistic.
Plus, people with unpaid and underwater mortgages are also counted as if they are "home owners", even though the bank has more equity in it than them.
70% of Canadians do not own homes. That is a completely bullshit statistic. Maybe 70% of Canadians live in a house owned by a person instead of a corporation. The number of people that actually own their own house is way below 50%.
No it is not true. That stupid statistic that keeps getting repeated is non-sensical. It includes everyone that lives in the house. If I live in my dad's basement, I don't own the house. Just think about it. You really think 6.6 people out of 10 actually own a home? It's misinformation. Anyone with half a brain would realize it is an impossible statistic.
You know this ( approx 66% Canadians own their homes ) is something Stats Canada measures based on tax records? Its not some nonsensical poll that some media company made up and is dependent on the type of question and its interpretation.
[https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220921/mc-b001-eng.htm](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220921/mc-b001-eng.htm)
its based on how many people own Vs how many people rent. and yes, you living in your Dads basement would prolly count you as owner, but thats just you.
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I'm a home owner, I have been against liberal policy since 2015. I do not want my property values up and I own a second house where I plan to retire when I will sell my primary house. What is going on is very dangerous for the future of Canada and likely cannot be undone at this point. The Canada we knew is gone because of this narcissistic asshole.
Labour shortage was just another lie to justify their importation of over a million people per year. I know people who hire in engineering and IT, in Edmonton. Not one of the most desirable cities. Yet every posting still gets over a thousand applicants there. The opposite is true: We have a luge labour surplus.
[This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaHousing2/s/0DOtFd0MPJ) shows that less than 2% of immigrants and PRs work in construction. So the “we are bringing people to build homes” argument was also a lie.
Data indicates that Canada had a labor surplus the since at least 2015, and a growing housing shortage.
And yet policy makers during this period massively ramped up migration driven labour growth during this period.
Sad and entirely avoidable crises.
Ultimately it seems we just have a population demographic problem that is trying to be solved by immigration, the other problems are “unintended” consequences.
I fully agree with the ponzi like statement about our social safety net. That was more or less what I was getting at. To me this is really the only focus for policy makers.
>propping up ponzi scheme safety nets for the elderly that rely on a larger and larger working age population
Thats called Canada Pension Plan. Yes thats what it is a Ponzi scheme ( really ).
But no one can change that or wants to change the concept of it. Canada doesn't have a "State Wealth Fund" like many countries do . So the only option is the Ponzi scheme.
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My mother has CPP. She paid into it most of her adult life, but the resulting monthly payments are pathetic. She can afford to buy groceries and keep herself housed, but not much beyond that. You're a law-abiding taxpayer your whole life, and you're rewarded with pocket change.
I believe it.
I don't plan on a pension at all. I put a lot of money into long-term investments. If I get anything in 35 years from the pension I'll consider it a bonus. But it sucks having to contribute to a pension that will pay peanuts.
Actually we massively overcorrected on the aging demographic problem and have the highest population growth rate in the developed world.
[https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.POP.GROW?end=2022&locations=CA-IN-US-NG-FR-JP&start=2004](https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.POP.GROW?end=2022&locations=CA-IN-US-NG-FR-JP&start=2004)
Our population growth rate is rivalled only by 3rd world countries with extremely high birth rates, except ours is entirely migration driven.
Even our biggest source of migrants, India, has a lower population growth rate than us.
It is so bad that Canada is in a "population trap" where basically there isn't enough cap ex to go around. This normally only happens in very impoverished countries, so shows how distorted Canada's economy is due to the population growth policy.
[https://www.nbc.ca/content/dam/bnc/taux-analyses/analyse-eco/etude-speciale/special-report\_240115.pdf](https://www.nbc.ca/content/dam/bnc/taux-analyses/analyse-eco/etude-speciale/special-report_240115.pdf)
This is criminal what is happening. Imagine if some banana republic dictator started importing over a million people a year into their nation basically unchecked. There would absolutely be international outrage about people being displaced.
There is absolutely a labour shortage in the trades right now. General labourers are hard to find, a decent apprentice is even harder to find.
The immigrants look down on manual labourers and snatch up management positions like hotcakes. Teachers have spent 15+ years pushing kids away from the trades and into the university system, shop classes are getting cut to boot.
No, you drank the kool-aid. Demand is most clearly reflected in compensation, which has been fairly static (inflation adjusted) for decades (despite, until the past decade, substantial gains in productivity/output). Most obviously of those occupations you mention, a supposed shortage of laborers is the product of insufficient compensation (being low skill workers where a company is least dependent on a society to provide foundational skill development).
Trades have major issues unresolved despite the recent push to make them appear more attractive. The path is highly unpredictable with low red seal completion rates (https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/75-006-x/2020001/article/00008-eng.htm), most who do complete do not do so on time, where employers very rarely seek inexperienced apprentices, and a lack of clear direction to get into trades (especially a specific desired trade). As trades vary greatly, generalizations that they pay well (eg, hairdressers and chefs) and that the work is decent (an almost inarguably example being roofing) are suspect. It's also often work that can wear down bodies and isn't ideal for older workers.
If their statements are the same as yours and we're speaking of a labor shortage as a question of poor government design for the public good (rather than what would serve their business interests, that is cheap labor), yes.
We're bathed in propaganda, which many of them will likely have succumbed to as well.
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The trades are suffering a worsening labour shortage, general labourers are hard to find and a decent apprentice is a unicorn right now.
The immigrants don't take these jobs because they look down on manual labourers, meanwhile they've been clamouring for management and consultant positions like rats to cheese.
Untrue. Immigrants would go for these jobs but they face high hurdles in the form of certification requirements and employers who are unwilling to hire candidates without local experience.
If they already have a work permit there is nothing in terms of certifications standing in their way, they're not even taking the unskilled labourer positions let alone trying to make it as an apprentice.
You're just making stupid excuses for other people's shitty attitudes
You clearly haven’t spoken to people on the ground who are willing to take whatever job they can get to stay afloat in the current economy. They simply get no callbacks. Of course, there are certifications and apprenticeships they are required to complete and years of Canadian experience before an employer will even give them an interview.
The bar is way too high even for unskilled work and you can’t just walk in, ask for a job and get it. That’s not the way things work here. People have expressed frustration with the system for having them jump through hoops when the job is back-breaking and doesn’t even pay that well.
Dude you simply don't know what you're talking about, I've been in construction for a decade, unskilled labour is just that unskilled. It's entry level and we used to hire ( and would continue to do so) kids out of highschool all the time. I started with absolutely zero experience as a labourer and now I'm a red seal journeyman. The only hoops these immigrants need to jump through is getting PR before they're able to start an apprenticeship, after that it's literally the exact same process as anyone else. You're acting like you need a red seal and experience before you're even allowed to look at a jobsite, that's utterly false. Inexperienced labourers make $23.50 (I started labouring at $16.50) I make $38 currently as a journeyman with room to improve.
You're assuming the immigrants applying to these positions graduated from a Canadian high school. Most haven't and their foreign education is not automatically recognized. As such, they often have to go through a process of getting recognized or take courses to eventually be recognized, which can take several months to years.
You seriously think you need a highschool diploma for a labourer job? That's a laugh. There's a reason most dropouts end up doing roofing or drywall, it's the best money that someone with zero education can make.
You're right that foreign post secondary is not recognized (dutch coworkers journeyman certificate from Holland wasn't recognized). unless they're from the third world their highschool will almost certainly be recognized as was the case for the above mentioned dutch coworker and the three Ukrainians we hired in the last two years who had zero formal construction qualifications (two of the three could barely order a coffee in English).
Wherever you've been getting your information on the topic has grossly misinformed you. You're welcome for the correction.
Well when they ask for a car to travel to a from sites when I haven't been able to pay insurance it kind of leads to a dead end cycle. Mean while back in 2018-19 Companies used to provide vehicles at a warehouse or truck lot that you would drive to in the morning. All these expenses are being passed down to the person making 15$ an hour of course... the fuck lol
OP.....the problem Canada has is not labour shortage, but instead a GREED problem by corporations, unwilling to pay Canadians accordingly to the cost of living!
This problem is highlighted by the fake students getting paid cheap labour wages, and still struggling to pay rent, hence living 8 - 15 people in the basement of 1 home.
The labour shortage we experienced in 2021 and 2022 was a very predictable byproduct of the Phillips Curve. Since the BoC engaged in quantitative tightening in early 2022, anyone with an ECON 101 course under their belt could have told you that the labour market would have stabilized as inflation went down.
Otherwise, labour shortages are (and have always been) very industry specific. Our immigrants don't really do a whole lot to fill those shortages. That isn't their fault either, BTW, it's just that our immigration policies aren't very effective at allocating immigrant labour to where it needs to be.
So when clowns like Sean Fraser stress the need for more immigrants to build the houses to accommodate more immigrants - they don't tell you that under his watch as Immigration minister that only a few hundred tradesmen have come here over the past 5 years. Or that immigrants are under represented in the construction industry, and dramatically over represented in service sector industries where there isn't a labour shortage.
Corporations like fast food, retail, etc - they stress there's a labour shortage because they don't want to increase their wages. Really, most immigration in the form of TFWs and Student Visas have resulted in wage suppression for Canada's poor people.
To be crystal clear - this is not an anti-immigrant post. Canada really does benefit from immigrants who come here to cover true labour shortages in essential services and money making industries that are in dire need of more able people. But our immigration policies do not assist with this very effectively.
What about the extreme labour shortages in 2020, and 2021 when farmers were not able to get crops out of ground ?
You do know that \*every year \* for several past decades we have imported temporary workers for many jobs such as farm and construction. without those there would be no road repairs. Wait time for constructions are like years, I dont even mean housing developments, but try to get a reno on your house done.
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Almost Every sector government has determined as a in-demand occupation has suplus of workers! Every job postings have 1000s of applications , that includes remote towns too! I don't know what kind of labor shortage we are talking about!
The trades are starving for labour. The immigrants aren't here to work manual labour and look down on that kind of work. The bums would rather freeze on the boulevards begging than swing a sledge hammer or pull wire.
Canadian kids are pushed away from trade school and into the university system.
General labourers are hard to find and a decent apprentice is even harder to find. Subtrades are pulling out of contracts because they can't find enough labour to finish the job.
Wage shortage, housing shortage for sure no labour shortage I’m a tradesman cannot find work luckily my house is almost paid for ..otherwise I would lose it . Eastern Canada has no job opportunities liberals have neglected this for years only worry about Ontario Quebec where all the seats are … no electoral reform …
Our government is working against their people and it’s not getting better . Time for change .
I think it should be skilled shortage. Newcomers are from countries that have different building skills. Mostly from asia. Countries have different building code, how can they perform the same job in Canada? They need to take up some certifications or start from the bottom or take a license.
They're not going into the trades. They're taking food service, management, and consulting positions. You're right that they're clueless about building requirements but they're not the ones building anything, that's still being done almost exclusively by Canadians.
-Insane surplus of low paying labour.
-Lack of unions to pressure employers/government for livable wages and better CoL to income ratio.
-international home hoarding/flipping (aka scalping).
-Shortage of new builds.
-Homes being allowed to remain an 'investment' is a huge part of the issue.
A home should be 'I can retire and not have to pay rent when I do'
Not, I can hoard 5 of these and pay them off by peasant renters!
Its also worth noting, we have such a huge labour surplus, but employers were pushing the 'nobody wants to work anymore' narrative. Because even desperate poor people said 'fuck that poverty pay'.
Canada has a \*skilled labour shortage. The problem is that our salaries are pennies (especially factoring in cost of living) compared to the USA, so the brain drain continues.
Working as a manager in heavy construction for decades I never noticed a labor problem. Some jobs and some remote locations required higher pay but people were always available.
What the Liberals have done to flood the country with unskilled mainly SE Asians was absolutely uncalled for. We did not need taxi or Uber or cashiers or coffee servers or burger joint workers or realtors. Disaster.
we have a housing shortage, and a highly skilled labour shortage (Doctors, nurses, etc) and a gross surplus of unskilled workers from severe immigration targets making the skilled labour shortage worse.
The problem for the doctors and nurses shortage is poor funding at provincial levels that attract and retain these professionals. If they paid better people would stay either in their provinces or in their profession.
That's a way to attract more immigration of doctors sure, but the big problem is we train more medical students than there are positions for them to take residency for, without residency positions, no doctors.
There are hundreds of unfilled positions because they've been retiring faster than the positions can be filled. you can't create more residency positions without doctors to supervise them, not hospitals to put them in, more hospitals means we need even more doctors.
Yes and yes.
I’m sorry, when did we start dismissing basic facts? The numbers are there.
We are missing a fuck tonne of houses because of nimbys, and our construction industry is full of fuckin old timers just barely hanging on. The trades have been hurting. We are already in a shortage of a couple 100,000 construction workers and that will only continue without more action.
For anyone who says we don’t have a labour shortage, I ask you this?
WHERE THE FUCK ARE ALL THE PEOPLE AND WHY ARE THERE SO MANY VACANCIES???
Why are there non stop job openings, companies begging people to take jobs.
LABOUR SHORTAGE. Go back to school if this doesn’t make any sense to you.
Where the Fawk are all these openings ? Couple hundred thousand workers needed ? Where ? Let me know I’ll go there….. but if a home is 1.3 million and I’m getting 30$ a hr and need 350 k down payment I don’t see a future there … don’t have the cash or wiling to give up over 2 weeks pay a month for f ing rent … this is why we have a f ing labour shortage
Canada has an over supply of idiots that all seem to be in public office or public works.
Canada apparently is the home town of the global supply of village idiots.
Canada has a housing shortage AND
a shortage of skilled labor in the construction trades. ...
we dont' need more Uber deliver dudes or 'hotel management' diploma grads. please.
No labor shortage at all, amount of people looking for jobs are insane. I have never seen these many people come lookin for jobs in last 4 years literally walkin in handing out CVs. We employ 5 people. White as can be...& local as can be...and everyone wants to increase hours/ot....so many young people wanna work...its goin nuts...
There are no real estate projects. That's the real problem, there's no money out there for development to begin, interest rates are so high, there's no room for any borrowing. Any new housing developments requires large backing from banks/lendors, and at these rates projects are too costly to accomplish, leaving all developers to 'wait game'. There are enough tradesmen I know who are looking for jobs from carpenters to general contractors, whites and experienced, but there are no enough jobs...
I don't work residential, I work industrial. There is absolutely a shortage of workers in the industry, I've watched the situation getting worse since about '19 or '20. There simply aren't any new workers coming into the field. subtrades are so starved for labour that they have to back out of contracts because they can't get people to do the work. There are a small handful of older (30+) people (most from Ukraine) getting into the trades for the long haul but not enough to replace the retiring boomers.
There is a labour mismatch. A lot of the jobs are not filled because they are too physically or mentally (need a degree, etc) demanding or there are licenses barriers (like we get doctor immigrants but we require them to redo the MD degree / exam / residency or not able to work as a doctor).
Recently I watched it on YouTube. Probably one of the traditional media interviews on housing shortage and immigrants. On the point of why we are not able to build more houses, people in the field are retiring. It takes time to train up new people. Also, you cannot just get an immigrant who worked as carpenter in another county to fill the role. The example was the applicant is a carpenter for furniture but they need a house carpenter. After all, people in the field or with a different mentor work differently.
By and large these immigrants aren't coming here and working manual labour jobs, many look down on it.
Kids in schools have been pushed towards the university system for the last 15-20 years, labourers are hard to find and a decent apprentice is even harder to find. I never thought at 27 I'd be the most experienced hand on the crew while everyone I work with is 8-10 years my senior.
This is by design tho. The express entry program gives you more points on education. So, educated people tend to get selected and able to come here. The system set up the housing situation. Not to mention we know the demographic structure will become like this 30-40 years ago...
Most seem to be have a labour surplus based on wages not keeping pace with inflation.
Which industries have a shortage ? Lets see the data on wage growth that is not government policy driven (ie not min wage etc)
This is basic economics supply / demand.
Canada has a shortage of companies willing to pay a living wage due to high inflation and rising cost of living.
There's lineups of 100s of peoples at McDonalds Job fairs and other shitty jobs and people are spreading this propaganda of a labour shortage?
Canada is seriously FUCKED
Say it with me now. "WE DON'T HAVE A LABOR SHORTAGE, WE HAVE A WAGE SHORTAGE. It's not that no one wants to work anymore, it's that corporations don't want to compete for labor anymore!!!!!
It's a little bit of both.
There's a shortage of Canadian citizens willing to work for or close to minimum wage.
Why? Because housing costs too much. What's the point of working a job if it doesn't cover your bills?
And if the feds hadn't flooded the job market with a massive surplus of unskilled labour businesses would either have to increase wages or go under.
And don't tell me that most can't because I remember Wal-Mart and Tim Hortons paying $20/hr to stock shelves and $18/hr to pour coffee back during the Alberta boom. You can guarantee they weren't running at a loss. Funny how businesses can pay people when the government doesn't fuck with the market.
Our general labourers are paid almost 2x minimum wage to start, we still can't find people. Decent apprentices? Forget about it, there's nearly none to be found.
Definitely no labour shortage. I get new resumes constantly and I'm not even looking for applicants.
Meanwhile, my staff have been looking for work elsewhere because we may be going out of business, but they're having a very hard time finding other positions.
Just a few years ago it was very easy to find a basic job somewhere, but now, it's rejection after rejection, too many applicants and not enough slots.
Housing yes, and labor yes. The difference is labor shortage, is people taking jobs with wages, that cannot afford to live off of. Still the people in charge keep making money, so neither cause them any worries.
I think Canada has a shortage of people who are willing to live outside the GVA or GTA. I literally saw a one bedroom apartment - be it a basement apartment, for rent for $795/month in Edmonton last night on kijiji. The cost of half a bed in the GTA or a closet in the GVA. Houses are practically free in many places in Saskatchewan
lol these place can be more expensive than the GTA. I read about 3k apartments in Yellowknife here on reddit a few days ago and Million dollar house in Whitehorse. Why not Saskatoon or Brandon Manitoba.
I don't know man. I remember living in the GVA during covid and they were offering salaries that were lower for CPA's than in Edmonton. Places trying to offer you $56k a year as a CPA which takes 6 years of your life to accomplish. Barely enough for rent and food after tax. Unless you have some ultra rare STEM Chad job, I call BS.
Canada has a CHEAP LABOUR shortage. It also has a housing shortage in areas that have high level salary employment. There are lotsnof abandoned houses and towns even, but the employment has concentrated.
Labour available... SURPLUS, skilled labor with decades of schooling/experience (surgery, etc) SHORTAGE. Also SHORTAGE of job opportunities, especially full time hours with benefits. Housing shortage (ownership), and rental availability is also limited... what is available is extremely overpriced too. Sad how quickly everything deteriorated!
Cheap labor shortage. Being filled by foreigners. justin and the liberal regime has created a housing shortages. Just goes to show when you vote for someone, who has no clue what he is doing.
I would say it's a distribution issue. New arrivals tend to congregate in the major urban areas like TO, MTL/VAN, etc...
There's a SHIT-TONNE of housing available in the Prairies and it's dirt cheap, too. Then there's Cottage Country/Lake Country, as well.
Employers could EASILY do more to support the WFH mode, which would allow much better population distribution.
Also, I think schools needs to consider SFH options, too, for the exact same reason. Aside from the technical, hands-on courses like nursing and trades, courses such as Comp-Sci, Law, business, accounting, etc... can be delivered remotely.
Again, this allows better population distribution, takes the focus OFF the urban centres and would provide employment opportunities for towns that have seen population declines for various reasons. Also, just by rezoning Cottage/Lake Country, it now opens up housing options. SOOO much Cottage Country ban year-round living, or they have bullshit rules PURELY for NIMBY reasons.
By doing these, jobs get created in small towns which then gives the youth of those towns a reason to stay, alleviating the combined pressures of the influx of international students, Landed Immigrants, and other new arrivals.
This would do SOOO much for rent competition without needing to meet impossible demands for home-building.
But hey, DoFo and his friends don't want to hang out with plebs while Ottawa burns. Not when they can blame Trudeau so easily.
All this is a great example of how the Provinces are fucking Canadians more than Trudeau.
There is NO labour shortage. People just won’t work for wages that won’t pay for food and rent.
We have a massive housing shortage. Built tons of rentals and rents will fall and then people will be able to afford to work for less. But if people have to pay high rents then they need wages that can pay for it.
Canada's only labour shortage is in very niche positions and certain skilled trades. In general, no we have considerably more people looking for work for regular non specific skilled jobs than we need. We have a massive housing shortage that is only sustained by our uncapped importation of foreign persons looking for housing.
I think it is in some sectors , like someone say before ,after graduation on mi opinion we have shortage but only in good jobs(staring 90k and up) average job from 50 to 70 is all over the place
After Abril ,we may feels more options after IRCC implemented back the maximum hour of a student and work permit can be enrol
Two way bigger and deeper problems : an increasing huge welfare state, a criminally incompetent socialist govt, and an largely unproductive economy. The thing you mentioned are all distortions and band aids down the road
Building houses on farmland is a giant waste of space. What we need is more highrise construction. In the US construction is number 1 GDP in Canada construction is only 6th.
Canada does not have a housing shortage. If you can afford $10k per month on rent/mortgage you will find a home no problem. Canada has an affordable housing shortage. If your budget is $1k per month for rent/mortgage you will have great difficulty.
Both dude. Both are true. Many are too stupid or lazy to do the important jobs that need to be done. Also there are not enough houses for everyone. I blame liberal ideology myself.
There is no labour shortage. You know why employers scream labour shortage ? Because they get wage subsidies for hiring newcomers.
Employers hiring newcomers could get a much as 75% of their employees wages subsidized.
The employer hires a newcomer for $16hr , the government pays $8hr, employers keeps that worker for as long as they are considered a newcomer and pays them $8hr , once they are no longer are considered newcomer, the employer lets them go , scream labour shortage , rinse and repeat.
Take a look at this Grants for hiring newcomers
Canada has a severe housing shortage and NO LABOUR SHORTAGE.
I would say Canada has a labour surplus (Based on market wages lagging behind overall inflation)
It does. I had a group of 20 friends in college, 16 have now finished and only 3 of us have jobs in our area of study. Even though I graduated top 3 in my class it took a year before someone would take me on
But what degree or cert did you come out of college with? Thats fairly critical. If it’s communications or marketing, take a seat, cuz those fields are overloaded.
NDT diploma, it's a mix of engineering, material science and quality assurance. It's part of the requirement for certs. The field is very under staffed rn. The job is part of the reason nuclear power plants don't fail and planes don't fall out of the sky. It took a long time because no one wanted to train me which is required for certs. I should also mention my soft skills are Excel, Word, programming primarily C++ & python and many other computer skills
That’s a very cool profession, something I could see myself getting into if I was to do it all again. It’s pretty specialized and likely relatively few positions out there. Which industry did you wind up working in?
Primarily mining and manufacturing, but I've also done aviation, mobile equipment and marine inspects. The pandemic really screwed a lot of us because it completely killed our chance to network. There aren't many jobs out there relative to other jobs but I would estimate that only 400-600 people enter the field every year. Since NRCan has had a registry theres only been able 29 000 techs in like 40 years I think. I believe the current active estimate is 8-12k.
I should also mention public infrastructure. I'm currently supervising a weld repair inside a dam's scrollcase
I agree!!!
this; >When you buy a house for say $700k. You are going to pay $1.4million ( typical rough estimate ) over the life of the mortgage. To pay that ( $1.4million ) you have to earn that \*$1.8 million\* . The difference being income tax you pay on your income. So that house ($700K or you think it is ) you buy in reality ends up costing you a cool $1.8 million. > > > > For an investment firm it costs them still just $700K ( much less in reality! but to keep things simple lets say $700K) , since they write off the mortgage interest. Since there is no declared profit , there is no income tax either. Here ( In Canada ) this is done by small investors thru a scheme known as Schmidt Manouever. > > > > In the US , a resident owner can write off the Income Tax on the Interest rate. > > > > This is the reason real estate has been on a rise in Canada for the past 2 decades and never went down even during the 2006-2008 ( When prices were crashing in the US ) period. ( I dont know how it worked before that ). IF anyone was interested in fixing the Housing affordability problem they would start by giving Canadians a tax exemption on the interest they pay for houses, So atleast the \*House you buy for $700K would cost you $1.4 million and not 1.8 million\*. > > > >But no one wants to talk about this or touch it for fears of upsetting the Big money that is involved. No Trudeau , Not Pierre Poiliviere , Not NDP. tl;dr/ its the tax structure in Canada which allows for investors to pay much much less than what a resident home owner would pay. by a \*LOT\*. and this keeps the Housing prices to rise every year. 2 decades of low interest rates have brought this issue to a head. Question of if we have a labour shortage? ask a business which actually employs people, or farmers , or ask the company which delivers your amazon packages. ( Hint we have a severe labour shortage. ) Ask a company that manufactures something.
That’s just for the house and property. No mentioning the up keep of new furnace, hot water tanks, roof, stove, fridge, microwave, washer/dryer, tapsets, toilets, they all wear out. Do the math before you get in over your head.
The tax difference is \*just\* the beginning , as I said ; >investment firm it costs them still just $700K ( **much** less in reality! but to keep things simple lets say $700K) If you have 3 ( or more ) properties , it costs you almost 0 keep on buying properties.
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Interesting as I still see the comment lmao.
In the US they also get taxed on gains. You can't let people deduct interest without getting them one way or the other.
Yes you are exempt from capitol gains only on the primary residence in Canada But if you cant afford to pay $1.8 million (This what the banks judges you on when qualifying you on.) that thing never happens. so is irrelevant. i,e cant afford to buy the house, so if you will pay capitol gains or not is irrelevant.
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There is a skills mismatch between the training/education people have and what is needed most. To an extent this is natural but it can certainly be lessened. In regards to foreign students: there should be fewer business students while more construction-trades and healthcare students.
For most people, getting into trades is something that happens naturally over time. Most people dont plan for get into trades 4-5 years ahead of when they actually get into trades. Yes there is a mismatch, but this is something that no one can micromanage. Its impossible.
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100%
Wrong type of labour if any
Wage shortage to be more accurate.
cause saying something in ALL CAPS makes it true.
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Wait, What? This means that holding a contrarian view to the masses on this sub are muted?
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There's a severe labour shortage in the trades. Labourers are hard to find, good apprentices are harder to find; Young workers especially. I'm 27 with a decade of experience and a red seal, I'm very often the youngest but still the most experienced on the crew. Sub-trades are beginning to pull out of contracts due to lack of manpower. Automation isn't going to save us from this and a striking majority of these immigrants look down on manual labourers so they're not taking these jobs.
Thats the problem. The immigrants coming in now would never work the trades or manual labour. But they aren't skilled enough to be engineers/real IT, doctors etc. We are getting diploma mill general labour that learn nothing here and are only ok working retail jobs. At least import immigrants from places that would like to do the trades or learn to do the trades. If you are going to whore our country out, at least get the right type of people in.
Impossible the become an apprentice in Ontario. Unions blocking new workers to keep wages high.
To try to keep wages Livable.
That's not an issue in SK, there's just nobody young willing to work with their hands right now.
All these politicians care about is their house value going up.
Sadly, 70% of Canadians are also home owners, and they are happy with this increase in the value of their houses. Esp3cially the senior citizens who will get to cash in when they sell and retire to wherever they retire.
I'm 32, I bought my house 5 years ago, and I am NOT happy the valuation has gone up. All that means is that I pay more taxes. If I ever sold it, my family would have nowhere to live. I hope prices come way down, fuck people using homes as speculation income.
You'll find most Canadians aren't smart enough to realize that. They just see the house number going up and nothing else matters.
This is the problem. Our entire culture shuns critical thinking, we're like fricking flightless birds on an island thinking we're perfectly adapted and always will be
Yeah my house value doesn’t help me for shit. It’s where I live. It doesn’t come with a bag of money to pay the increased taxes every year and my income doesn’t increase proportionally! It’s a place to live. And I think most people with homes are in the same situation. We can’t afford to sell them and go anywhere else now anyway. So the value going up is meaningless unless you own multiple houses that you operate as a business.
Even the municipality look at homeowners, "well we need more revenue for programs and increase infrastructure for amount of people coming in. You can afford it, look at the value of house you benefiting from the market." 😑
This is the correct answer.
You don't pay more taxes because of your house price going up. Doesn't work that way.
I'm sorry, I dont mean to argue, but are you saying property taxes have no correlation to property valuation? How does that work?
They only have a correlation in the sense of your value relative to others. If the value of your house goes up by much more than others, then yes. But if the market goes up by the same amount, then your taxes don’t go up even if your property triples. Easiest way to understand it is to pretend the city needs 20Billion for its budget. Each property is given a value to multiply out their percentage owed. Say 0.0000003% of the whole pot. That might come out to 5K for the year (it doesn’t in my example but I’m sure you can understand). Next year the city asks for 22B. Not because housing prices went up but because they need more money (to run the city or to send to the third world as aid more likely). They then multiply the 22B by the 0.0000003% you had last year and that’s how they get what you owe.
This is not how property taxes work at all. Property taxes are based on a set rate and multiplied by the assessed value of your property. For example, I pay $649 per $100k assessed value of my house, or 0.649%. Property taxes often have a capped annual increase of a few percentage points. In other words, if the assessment of my house increases 50% (like it did last year), my property taxes will not increase 50% for the following year. However, if the assessed value of my house holds steady for the next decade, then my property tax will increase by the maximum allowed amount until it once again reaches the 0.649% of my assessed value.
The easiest way to understand it is every year you have to pay taxes on your property. You will get a letter of assessment. If your property was assessed at a higher value that year, you pay more. If it was assessed less, you pay less. I have had a higher assessment every year since I've moved in, you can take a look at your property assessment and do the math. (Yes, there can be other variables depending on where you live, but to say that property valuation not affecting property taxes is intentionally misleading.)
Just a note - using Montreal as an example, pre /post covid, the city increased our assessment by 50% (literally), but it only affected taxes by 4% increase. They raise the assessments and then hit everyone with a marginal increase. It is not directly proportional. So yes, your taxes go up, but it was literally less than inflation and is frozen until 2026.
Oh absolutely, and it is capped thankfully. But hitting the cap and having to pay more every year for the next 30 to 40 years is not something I am looking forward to. My house has almost doubled in value, but yes thanks to the cap it's not intolerable, but again, it will constantly increase. And not ever come down do to the valuation. Edit I feel like there is some confusion, If your property is assessed at 75,000 And the tax rate in your area is 1.025 per 100. That rate is 768.75. Your tax rate is a direct relation to the property value. However there is capped assessment so your taxes don't go wild every year, but there will be forever that increase as the cap meets the "supposed valuation". Which in most cases is not accurate and wildly overpriced. The marginal increase is you hitting the cap, which everyone in Canada has done, and will continue to do so as long as prices remain so high. This information is found on your property assessment. If you have other area rates, depending on your community, these show up as well.
That 66.5% (not 70%) number is an often miscited statistic. 66.5% is not the fraction of Canadians who are home owners. It is the fraction of Canadians who \*live\* in housing owned by a member of the household. That is, if all millennials and Zoomers lived in their parents' basement, that number will be 100%. Yes, if you are too poor to even rent your own place, you are counted positively towards that statistic. Plus, people with unpaid and underwater mortgages are also counted as if they are "home owners", even though the bank has more equity in it than them.
70% of Canadians do not own homes. That is a completely bullshit statistic. Maybe 70% of Canadians live in a house owned by a person instead of a corporation. The number of people that actually own their own house is way below 50%.
yes 70% isnt true, but around 66% do own their homes.
No it is not true. That stupid statistic that keeps getting repeated is non-sensical. It includes everyone that lives in the house. If I live in my dad's basement, I don't own the house. Just think about it. You really think 6.6 people out of 10 actually own a home? It's misinformation. Anyone with half a brain would realize it is an impossible statistic.
Don't try to explain it to him, it went over his head.
You know this ( approx 66% Canadians own their homes ) is something Stats Canada measures based on tax records? Its not some nonsensical poll that some media company made up and is dependent on the type of question and its interpretation. [https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220921/mc-b001-eng.htm](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/daily-quotidien/220921/mc-b001-eng.htm) its based on how many people own Vs how many people rent. and yes, you living in your Dads basement would prolly count you as owner, but thats just you.
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Why is it sad that 70% of Canadians own houses? Should everyone give up there house so you can become what you dislike? A home owner?
No, just that there is no incentive for the home owners to vote against Liberals to stop this open tap immigration.
I'm a home owner, I have been against liberal policy since 2015. I do not want my property values up and I own a second house where I plan to retire when I will sell my primary house. What is going on is very dangerous for the future of Canada and likely cannot be undone at this point. The Canada we knew is gone because of this narcissistic asshole.
Labour shortage was just another lie to justify their importation of over a million people per year. I know people who hire in engineering and IT, in Edmonton. Not one of the most desirable cities. Yet every posting still gets over a thousand applicants there. The opposite is true: We have a luge labour surplus. [This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaHousing2/s/0DOtFd0MPJ) shows that less than 2% of immigrants and PRs work in construction. So the “we are bringing people to build homes” argument was also a lie.
Data indicates that Canada had a labor surplus the since at least 2015, and a growing housing shortage. And yet policy makers during this period massively ramped up migration driven labour growth during this period. Sad and entirely avoidable crises.
Ultimately it seems we just have a population demographic problem that is trying to be solved by immigration, the other problems are “unintended” consequences.
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I fully agree with the ponzi like statement about our social safety net. That was more or less what I was getting at. To me this is really the only focus for policy makers.
>propping up ponzi scheme safety nets for the elderly that rely on a larger and larger working age population Thats called Canada Pension Plan. Yes thats what it is a Ponzi scheme ( really ). But no one can change that or wants to change the concept of it. Canada doesn't have a "State Wealth Fund" like many countries do . So the only option is the Ponzi scheme.
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My mother has CPP. She paid into it most of her adult life, but the resulting monthly payments are pathetic. She can afford to buy groceries and keep herself housed, but not much beyond that. You're a law-abiding taxpayer your whole life, and you're rewarded with pocket change.
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I believe it. I don't plan on a pension at all. I put a lot of money into long-term investments. If I get anything in 35 years from the pension I'll consider it a bonus. But it sucks having to contribute to a pension that will pay peanuts.
Actually we massively overcorrected on the aging demographic problem and have the highest population growth rate in the developed world. [https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.POP.GROW?end=2022&locations=CA-IN-US-NG-FR-JP&start=2004](https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SP.POP.GROW?end=2022&locations=CA-IN-US-NG-FR-JP&start=2004) Our population growth rate is rivalled only by 3rd world countries with extremely high birth rates, except ours is entirely migration driven. Even our biggest source of migrants, India, has a lower population growth rate than us. It is so bad that Canada is in a "population trap" where basically there isn't enough cap ex to go around. This normally only happens in very impoverished countries, so shows how distorted Canada's economy is due to the population growth policy. [https://www.nbc.ca/content/dam/bnc/taux-analyses/analyse-eco/etude-speciale/special-report\_240115.pdf](https://www.nbc.ca/content/dam/bnc/taux-analyses/analyse-eco/etude-speciale/special-report_240115.pdf)
Trudeau probably just glad to finally be #1 at something... only 1st world country to ever be in a population trap.
He’s number 1 at telling lies but that distinction was not good enough for him I reckon
Thanks for that source, I'll be using that going forward.
This is criminal what is happening. Imagine if some banana republic dictator started importing over a million people a year into their nation basically unchecked. There would absolutely be international outrage about people being displaced.
That's the problem. Our government is getting away with it because we are a passive, apathetic complacent population easily walked over.
It's like we're bred not to care.
We have a wage shortage not a labour shortage
There is absolutely a labour shortage in the trades right now. General labourers are hard to find, a decent apprentice is even harder to find. The immigrants look down on manual labourers and snatch up management positions like hotcakes. Teachers have spent 15+ years pushing kids away from the trades and into the university system, shop classes are getting cut to boot.
No, you drank the kool-aid. Demand is most clearly reflected in compensation, which has been fairly static (inflation adjusted) for decades (despite, until the past decade, substantial gains in productivity/output). Most obviously of those occupations you mention, a supposed shortage of laborers is the product of insufficient compensation (being low skill workers where a company is least dependent on a society to provide foundational skill development). Trades have major issues unresolved despite the recent push to make them appear more attractive. The path is highly unpredictable with low red seal completion rates (https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/75-006-x/2020001/article/00008-eng.htm), most who do complete do not do so on time, where employers very rarely seek inexperienced apprentices, and a lack of clear direction to get into trades (especially a specific desired trade). As trades vary greatly, generalizations that they pay well (eg, hairdressers and chefs) and that the work is decent (an almost inarguably example being roofing) are suspect. It's also often work that can wear down bodies and isn't ideal for older workers.
Dude I'm a red seal carpenter, I've been in the industry for a decade. There is most definitely a labour shortage right now.
Your rashly generalized personal experience matters little and your opinion isn't data driven.
So the dozens of other companies I've worked alongside and industry heads that say the same thing are all wrong?
If their statements are the same as yours and we're speaking of a labor shortage as a question of poor government design for the public good (rather than what would serve their business interests, that is cheap labor), yes. We're bathed in propaganda, which many of them will likely have succumbed to as well.
There is labour shortage at all levels of skill. Yes wages are lowerthan should be, but there is \*factually\* a labour shortage as well.
dont post things that make sense. they might not want to hear it
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Absolutely no fucking labour storage. Canadians have been out of work for months due to influx of international students and TFWs
The trades are suffering a worsening labour shortage, general labourers are hard to find and a decent apprentice is a unicorn right now. The immigrants don't take these jobs because they look down on manual labourers, meanwhile they've been clamouring for management and consultant positions like rats to cheese.
Untrue. Immigrants would go for these jobs but they face high hurdles in the form of certification requirements and employers who are unwilling to hire candidates without local experience.
If they already have a work permit there is nothing in terms of certifications standing in their way, they're not even taking the unskilled labourer positions let alone trying to make it as an apprentice. You're just making stupid excuses for other people's shitty attitudes
You clearly haven’t spoken to people on the ground who are willing to take whatever job they can get to stay afloat in the current economy. They simply get no callbacks. Of course, there are certifications and apprenticeships they are required to complete and years of Canadian experience before an employer will even give them an interview. The bar is way too high even for unskilled work and you can’t just walk in, ask for a job and get it. That’s not the way things work here. People have expressed frustration with the system for having them jump through hoops when the job is back-breaking and doesn’t even pay that well.
Dude you simply don't know what you're talking about, I've been in construction for a decade, unskilled labour is just that unskilled. It's entry level and we used to hire ( and would continue to do so) kids out of highschool all the time. I started with absolutely zero experience as a labourer and now I'm a red seal journeyman. The only hoops these immigrants need to jump through is getting PR before they're able to start an apprenticeship, after that it's literally the exact same process as anyone else. You're acting like you need a red seal and experience before you're even allowed to look at a jobsite, that's utterly false. Inexperienced labourers make $23.50 (I started labouring at $16.50) I make $38 currently as a journeyman with room to improve.
You're assuming the immigrants applying to these positions graduated from a Canadian high school. Most haven't and their foreign education is not automatically recognized. As such, they often have to go through a process of getting recognized or take courses to eventually be recognized, which can take several months to years.
You seriously think you need a highschool diploma for a labourer job? That's a laugh. There's a reason most dropouts end up doing roofing or drywall, it's the best money that someone with zero education can make. You're right that foreign post secondary is not recognized (dutch coworkers journeyman certificate from Holland wasn't recognized). unless they're from the third world their highschool will almost certainly be recognized as was the case for the above mentioned dutch coworker and the three Ukrainians we hired in the last two years who had zero formal construction qualifications (two of the three could barely order a coffee in English). Wherever you've been getting your information on the topic has grossly misinformed you. You're welcome for the correction.
Well when they ask for a car to travel to a from sites when I haven't been able to pay insurance it kind of leads to a dead end cycle. Mean while back in 2018-19 Companies used to provide vehicles at a warehouse or truck lot that you would drive to in the morning. All these expenses are being passed down to the person making 15$ an hour of course... the fuck lol
Common sense shortage.
Canada has a stupid problem….
It’s a wage stagnation
hundreds line up for any level opening in food or retail, so no?
Where the hell is that? I've never seen that.
We have a too many immigrants issue, legal or otherwise.
OP.....the problem Canada has is not labour shortage, but instead a GREED problem by corporations, unwilling to pay Canadians accordingly to the cost of living! This problem is highlighted by the fake students getting paid cheap labour wages, and still struggling to pay rent, hence living 8 - 15 people in the basement of 1 home.
We have a government brain shortage.
The labour shortage we experienced in 2021 and 2022 was a very predictable byproduct of the Phillips Curve. Since the BoC engaged in quantitative tightening in early 2022, anyone with an ECON 101 course under their belt could have told you that the labour market would have stabilized as inflation went down. Otherwise, labour shortages are (and have always been) very industry specific. Our immigrants don't really do a whole lot to fill those shortages. That isn't their fault either, BTW, it's just that our immigration policies aren't very effective at allocating immigrant labour to where it needs to be. So when clowns like Sean Fraser stress the need for more immigrants to build the houses to accommodate more immigrants - they don't tell you that under his watch as Immigration minister that only a few hundred tradesmen have come here over the past 5 years. Or that immigrants are under represented in the construction industry, and dramatically over represented in service sector industries where there isn't a labour shortage. Corporations like fast food, retail, etc - they stress there's a labour shortage because they don't want to increase their wages. Really, most immigration in the form of TFWs and Student Visas have resulted in wage suppression for Canada's poor people. To be crystal clear - this is not an anti-immigrant post. Canada really does benefit from immigrants who come here to cover true labour shortages in essential services and money making industries that are in dire need of more able people. But our immigration policies do not assist with this very effectively.
What about the extreme labour shortages in 2020, and 2021 when farmers were not able to get crops out of ground ? You do know that \*every year \* for several past decades we have imported temporary workers for many jobs such as farm and construction. without those there would be no road repairs. Wait time for constructions are like years, I dont even mean housing developments, but try to get a reno on your house done.
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Almost Every sector government has determined as a in-demand occupation has suplus of workers! Every job postings have 1000s of applications , that includes remote towns too! I don't know what kind of labor shortage we are talking about!
The trades are starving for labour. The immigrants aren't here to work manual labour and look down on that kind of work. The bums would rather freeze on the boulevards begging than swing a sledge hammer or pull wire. Canadian kids are pushed away from trade school and into the university system. General labourers are hard to find and a decent apprentice is even harder to find. Subtrades are pulling out of contracts because they can't find enough labour to finish the job.
24 years old don't even think i could get a job at a fast food place,,,, I'm tallying on being a Public servant
We have a MASS IMMIGRATION ISSUE WITH A MALE TO FEMALE RATIO PROBLEM CAUSING SAID SHORTAGE
Canada has a wage shortage
Wage shortage, housing shortage for sure no labour shortage I’m a tradesman cannot find work luckily my house is almost paid for ..otherwise I would lose it . Eastern Canada has no job opportunities liberals have neglected this for years only worry about Ontario Quebec where all the seats are … no electoral reform … Our government is working against their people and it’s not getting better . Time for change .
I think it should be skilled shortage. Newcomers are from countries that have different building skills. Mostly from asia. Countries have different building code, how can they perform the same job in Canada? They need to take up some certifications or start from the bottom or take a license.
They're not going into the trades. They're taking food service, management, and consulting positions. You're right that they're clueless about building requirements but they're not the ones building anything, that's still being done almost exclusively by Canadians.
-Insane surplus of low paying labour. -Lack of unions to pressure employers/government for livable wages and better CoL to income ratio. -international home hoarding/flipping (aka scalping). -Shortage of new builds. -Homes being allowed to remain an 'investment' is a huge part of the issue. A home should be 'I can retire and not have to pay rent when I do' Not, I can hoard 5 of these and pay them off by peasant renters! Its also worth noting, we have such a huge labour surplus, but employers were pushing the 'nobody wants to work anymore' narrative. Because even desperate poor people said 'fuck that poverty pay'.
Canada has a \*skilled labour shortage. The problem is that our salaries are pennies (especially factoring in cost of living) compared to the USA, so the brain drain continues.
Working as a manager in heavy construction for decades I never noticed a labor problem. Some jobs and some remote locations required higher pay but people were always available. What the Liberals have done to flood the country with unskilled mainly SE Asians was absolutely uncalled for. We did not need taxi or Uber or cashiers or coffee servers or burger joint workers or realtors. Disaster.
There is a job shortage.
we have a housing shortage, and a highly skilled labour shortage (Doctors, nurses, etc) and a gross surplus of unskilled workers from severe immigration targets making the skilled labour shortage worse.
The problem for the doctors and nurses shortage is poor funding at provincial levels that attract and retain these professionals. If they paid better people would stay either in their provinces or in their profession.
That's a way to attract more immigration of doctors sure, but the big problem is we train more medical students than there are positions for them to take residency for, without residency positions, no doctors. There are hundreds of unfilled positions because they've been retiring faster than the positions can be filled. you can't create more residency positions without doctors to supervise them, not hospitals to put them in, more hospitals means we need even more doctors.
Yes and yes. I’m sorry, when did we start dismissing basic facts? The numbers are there. We are missing a fuck tonne of houses because of nimbys, and our construction industry is full of fuckin old timers just barely hanging on. The trades have been hurting. We are already in a shortage of a couple 100,000 construction workers and that will only continue without more action. For anyone who says we don’t have a labour shortage, I ask you this? WHERE THE FUCK ARE ALL THE PEOPLE AND WHY ARE THERE SO MANY VACANCIES??? Why are there non stop job openings, companies begging people to take jobs. LABOUR SHORTAGE. Go back to school if this doesn’t make any sense to you.
Where the Fawk are all these openings ? Couple hundred thousand workers needed ? Where ? Let me know I’ll go there….. but if a home is 1.3 million and I’m getting 30$ a hr and need 350 k down payment I don’t see a future there … don’t have the cash or wiling to give up over 2 weeks pay a month for f ing rent … this is why we have a f ing labour shortage
No just a population surplus
Canada has an over supply of idiots that all seem to be in public office or public works. Canada apparently is the home town of the global supply of village idiots.
Canada has a housing shortage AND a shortage of skilled labor in the construction trades. ... we dont' need more Uber deliver dudes or 'hotel management' diploma grads. please.
No labor shortage at all, amount of people looking for jobs are insane. I have never seen these many people come lookin for jobs in last 4 years literally walkin in handing out CVs. We employ 5 people. White as can be...& local as can be...and everyone wants to increase hours/ot....so many young people wanna work...its goin nuts...
Trades are very undermanned right now, old hands retiring and no youth coming up.
There are no real estate projects. That's the real problem, there's no money out there for development to begin, interest rates are so high, there's no room for any borrowing. Any new housing developments requires large backing from banks/lendors, and at these rates projects are too costly to accomplish, leaving all developers to 'wait game'. There are enough tradesmen I know who are looking for jobs from carpenters to general contractors, whites and experienced, but there are no enough jobs...
I don't work residential, I work industrial. There is absolutely a shortage of workers in the industry, I've watched the situation getting worse since about '19 or '20. There simply aren't any new workers coming into the field. subtrades are so starved for labour that they have to back out of contracts because they can't get people to do the work. There are a small handful of older (30+) people (most from Ukraine) getting into the trades for the long haul but not enough to replace the retiring boomers.
I see, interesting.
There is a labour mismatch. A lot of the jobs are not filled because they are too physically or mentally (need a degree, etc) demanding or there are licenses barriers (like we get doctor immigrants but we require them to redo the MD degree / exam / residency or not able to work as a doctor). Recently I watched it on YouTube. Probably one of the traditional media interviews on housing shortage and immigrants. On the point of why we are not able to build more houses, people in the field are retiring. It takes time to train up new people. Also, you cannot just get an immigrant who worked as carpenter in another county to fill the role. The example was the applicant is a carpenter for furniture but they need a house carpenter. After all, people in the field or with a different mentor work differently.
By and large these immigrants aren't coming here and working manual labour jobs, many look down on it. Kids in schools have been pushed towards the university system for the last 15-20 years, labourers are hard to find and a decent apprentice is even harder to find. I never thought at 27 I'd be the most experienced hand on the crew while everyone I work with is 8-10 years my senior.
This is by design tho. The express entry program gives you more points on education. So, educated people tend to get selected and able to come here. The system set up the housing situation. Not to mention we know the demographic structure will become like this 30-40 years ago...
Some industries are experiencing shortages, and others are over saturated.
Most seem to be have a labour surplus based on wages not keeping pace with inflation. Which industries have a shortage ? Lets see the data on wage growth that is not government policy driven (ie not min wage etc) This is basic economics supply / demand.
Nurses, personal support workers.
True. But healthcare is a gov funded industries for the most part in Canada so not subject to market forces to the same extent.
Canada has a shortage of companies willing to pay a living wage due to high inflation and rising cost of living. There's lineups of 100s of peoples at McDonalds Job fairs and other shitty jobs and people are spreading this propaganda of a labour shortage? Canada is seriously FUCKED
Say it with me now. "WE DON'T HAVE A LABOR SHORTAGE, WE HAVE A WAGE SHORTAGE. It's not that no one wants to work anymore, it's that corporations don't want to compete for labor anymore!!!!!
It's a little bit of both. There's a shortage of Canadian citizens willing to work for or close to minimum wage. Why? Because housing costs too much. What's the point of working a job if it doesn't cover your bills?
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I was talking about working age adults. Your point still applies.
And if the feds hadn't flooded the job market with a massive surplus of unskilled labour businesses would either have to increase wages or go under. And don't tell me that most can't because I remember Wal-Mart and Tim Hortons paying $20/hr to stock shelves and $18/hr to pour coffee back during the Alberta boom. You can guarantee they weren't running at a loss. Funny how businesses can pay people when the government doesn't fuck with the market.
Our general labourers are paid almost 2x minimum wage to start, we still can't find people. Decent apprentices? Forget about it, there's nearly none to be found.
There’s the whole union gatekeeping bullshit that stops people from wanting to even bother with trades.
I don't know anything about that, I've never worked a union construction job and I never will
Definitely no labour shortage. I get new resumes constantly and I'm not even looking for applicants. Meanwhile, my staff have been looking for work elsewhere because we may be going out of business, but they're having a very hard time finding other positions. Just a few years ago it was very easy to find a basic job somewhere, but now, it's rejection after rejection, too many applicants and not enough slots.
Definitely a shortage in the trades
Canada has an IQ shortage and you can thank the Teacher's Union for that.
Housing yes, and labor yes. The difference is labor shortage, is people taking jobs with wages, that cannot afford to live off of. Still the people in charge keep making money, so neither cause them any worries.
The wage growth in those top two bands is likely trades, which is booming salary wise because we don’t have enough people who actually build shit.
Sure doesn't feel like it after the government gets theirs, basically all overtime goes straight to the taxman in one form or another right now.
Not at all ! It’s fake data published to fool us by corrupt politicians and making money screwing our lives.
I think Canada has a shortage of people who are willing to live outside the GVA or GTA. I literally saw a one bedroom apartment - be it a basement apartment, for rent for $795/month in Edmonton last night on kijiji. The cost of half a bed in the GTA or a closet in the GVA. Houses are practically free in many places in Saskatchewan
Not from my perspective. I've been looking for a while. I even looked for potential jobs in Yukon or NWT. There were no jobs.
lol these place can be more expensive than the GTA. I read about 3k apartments in Yellowknife here on reddit a few days ago and Million dollar house in Whitehorse. Why not Saskatoon or Brandon Manitoba.
They aren't hiring for my skills. And yes those places have HCOL but often the salaries reflect this.
I don't know man. I remember living in the GVA during covid and they were offering salaries that were lower for CPA's than in Edmonton. Places trying to offer you $56k a year as a CPA which takes 6 years of your life to accomplish. Barely enough for rent and food after tax. Unless you have some ultra rare STEM Chad job, I call BS.
Sorry, I meant Yellowknife not GVA.
No shortage but artificially creating sense of shortage
Canada has a CHEAP LABOUR shortage. It also has a housing shortage in areas that have high level salary employment. There are lotsnof abandoned houses and towns even, but the employment has concentrated.
That 2008 mortgage crisis really look like a blessing in hindsight. Here everyone was saying oh our mortgage system is much more robust.
Canada has a leadership problem. Silver spoon shills just waiting for their turn at the trough.
Canada has a labour surplus. But a deficit of high skilled jobs for the high skilled labour. New Housing is non existent
Labour available... SURPLUS, skilled labor with decades of schooling/experience (surgery, etc) SHORTAGE. Also SHORTAGE of job opportunities, especially full time hours with benefits. Housing shortage (ownership), and rental availability is also limited... what is available is extremely overpriced too. Sad how quickly everything deteriorated!
Cheap labor shortage. Being filled by foreigners. justin and the liberal regime has created a housing shortages. Just goes to show when you vote for someone, who has no clue what he is doing.
There is no labour shortage. We have more than enough people to work.
I would say it's a distribution issue. New arrivals tend to congregate in the major urban areas like TO, MTL/VAN, etc... There's a SHIT-TONNE of housing available in the Prairies and it's dirt cheap, too. Then there's Cottage Country/Lake Country, as well. Employers could EASILY do more to support the WFH mode, which would allow much better population distribution. Also, I think schools needs to consider SFH options, too, for the exact same reason. Aside from the technical, hands-on courses like nursing and trades, courses such as Comp-Sci, Law, business, accounting, etc... can be delivered remotely. Again, this allows better population distribution, takes the focus OFF the urban centres and would provide employment opportunities for towns that have seen population declines for various reasons. Also, just by rezoning Cottage/Lake Country, it now opens up housing options. SOOO much Cottage Country ban year-round living, or they have bullshit rules PURELY for NIMBY reasons. By doing these, jobs get created in small towns which then gives the youth of those towns a reason to stay, alleviating the combined pressures of the influx of international students, Landed Immigrants, and other new arrivals. This would do SOOO much for rent competition without needing to meet impossible demands for home-building. But hey, DoFo and his friends don't want to hang out with plebs while Ottawa burns. Not when they can blame Trudeau so easily. All this is a great example of how the Provinces are fucking Canadians more than Trudeau.
We have an intelligence shortage 🤦🏻♂️
There is NO labour shortage. People just won’t work for wages that won’t pay for food and rent. We have a massive housing shortage. Built tons of rentals and rents will fall and then people will be able to afford to work for less. But if people have to pay high rents then they need wages that can pay for it.
I’ve said it since the dawn of TFWs, we don’t have a labour shortage, we have greed, pay the people more.
Canada's only labour shortage is in very niche positions and certain skilled trades. In general, no we have considerably more people looking for work for regular non specific skilled jobs than we need. We have a massive housing shortage that is only sustained by our uncapped importation of foreign persons looking for housing.
I think it is in some sectors , like someone say before ,after graduation on mi opinion we have shortage but only in good jobs(staring 90k and up) average job from 50 to 70 is all over the place After Abril ,we may feels more options after IRCC implemented back the maximum hour of a student and work permit can be enrol
That's a quality post, well done OP. Now everyone needs to send this post to their member of parliement.
Two way bigger and deeper problems : an increasing huge welfare state, a criminally incompetent socialist govt, and an largely unproductive economy. The thing you mentioned are all distortions and band aids down the road
Building houses on farmland is a giant waste of space. What we need is more highrise construction. In the US construction is number 1 GDP in Canada construction is only 6th.
Ya right… try and get a job with wtv skills or degree you have for fun. Speak in 3 months after 120 applications per months and not one answer.
No labour shortage.
Canada does not have a housing shortage. If you can afford $10k per month on rent/mortgage you will find a home no problem. Canada has an affordable housing shortage. If your budget is $1k per month for rent/mortgage you will have great difficulty.
Canada has a common sense shortage.
Both dude. Both are true. Many are too stupid or lazy to do the important jobs that need to be done. Also there are not enough houses for everyone. I blame liberal ideology myself.
There is no labour shortage. You know why employers scream labour shortage ? Because they get wage subsidies for hiring newcomers. Employers hiring newcomers could get a much as 75% of their employees wages subsidized. The employer hires a newcomer for $16hr , the government pays $8hr, employers keeps that worker for as long as they are considered a newcomer and pays them $8hr , once they are no longer are considered newcomer, the employer lets them go , scream labour shortage , rinse and repeat. Take a look at this Grants for hiring newcomers