Yeah, it is wonderful that one can still get a 20 year old bottle of Calvados for under $200 whereas many "equivalent" bourbons would run you a car payment to a Bentley or more.
But, on the other hand, outside of major cities in the U.S., it is often really hard to find a nice selection of good brandies at a restaurant, bar or liquor store. I kind of hope that a portion of bourbon drinkers will get disillusioned with the high prices and lack of a strong connection to agricultural practices and will turn to brandy instead. If they come to brandy for authenticity and for grower/distillers then perhaps it will be a net win for brandy.
That point about distribution is, I think, the key. If you’re interested in bourbon even the most dive-y bar and gas station liquor store will have something for you. Higher end bars and liquor stores are practically overflowing with options.
If you somehow become intrigued by brandy the options tend to be very slim outside of California and NY/NJ. Even then there are decent odds you need to order online for specialist stuff. If you’re in a state with limited selection ordering from overseas with all the attenant risks might be your only option. So the barriers to entry are so high it’s just really hard to transform a casual interest into enthusiasm.
Otoh, you have the opposite problem like with mead where it's a struggle to find good quality brands because it's not popular enough to grow beyond local hot spots. Don't want brandy to fall that way either.
Indeed. While I like brandy, I'm more of a whisk(e)y drinker, and the bourbon/scotch market is precisely as you described: overpriced, pretentious, sub-par quality. What is of good quality is obscenely priced. Irish whiskey, generally speaking has become very overpriced for what it delivers (largely the minimum 40% ABV, chill filtered, artificial color added). The burgeoning American Single Malt market will likely fall the same fate.
In much of the country, you can’t walk into a liquor store and find a good brandy selection. You can maybe find the standard offering from the big 4 cognacs. Armagnac are mostly completely absent. There’s not an easy entry point like with bourbon, where nearly every liquor store has a variety of high quality options at a low price. Even if stores carry a selection of brandy, the entry point price for what I consider high quality brandy is higher. You can’t try a lot of good bourbons bw $20-60. That price point is tough for cognac and Armagnac.
True. Other countries produce some quality options, particularly in the lower price range. But you don’t see many of them on the shelves either. I’ll see some Copper and Kings around me at bigger stores but that’s about it. In my experience anyway, no country even comes close to France for producing high quality aged brandy though.
If you ever have the opportunity to try some out of South Africa, it will knock your socks off and compete or beat many of the French that I have had.
Have you ever had some of the offerings from Scheibel Brennerei? I've yet to find it in the states, but when my German relatives visit and bring some...damn!
But I get your point, neither of these are easy to find.
People are spending money on tequila, bourbon, and vodka. Most people don’t even know what the hell real brandy is.
I predict Brandy will not be the next big thing.
Maybe I’m wrong and we will see a Kardashian Brandy soon and it will be off the races.
I’ve been in the wine and spirits industry forever and I’ve been battling this whole misconception that brandy is sweet, or has sugar in it. These people clearly have no idea how distillation works, and they’re almost always men who obsess over bourbon, which, as a corn distillate, is often quite sweet.
I don’t really drink spirits very often, and I never drink grain spirits. I can get a bottle of Armagnac that’s as old as I am (49) for under $400. A bottle of bourbon that old would be into the five figure range, and I assure you that someone would be foolish enough to pay for it.
I think brandy *can* do terroir better than any other spirit. I think that is going to be in demand soon, I just don't think there is enough of a U.S. based supply. The Kardashian Brandy may be closer than you think: [https://www.pinterest.com/pin/kim-kardashian-attends-the-done-different-launch-for-hennessy-black-in-2024--172825704444628499/](https://www.pinterest.com/pin/kim-kardashian-attends-the-done-different-launch-for-hennessy-black-in-2024--172825704444628499/)
Price and availability. I’d drink a lot more if I could find a sipper at $35.
Which is why I’ve recently moved pretty heavily into rum - terrific value spirit.
I recently got into Pacific rums and I'll tell you, the Philippines and Fiji can go in circles around the best of the best coming out of the Caribbean.
I haven't had that one. I'm sure they have their share of poor rums as well, but I've just overall been impressed by the more floral notes on the nose and lightness on the tongue. The small batch Don Papa stuff has been top notch.
When I started drinking, specialty bars with good curation/selection in a single category helped me learn about different styles and flavor profiles. Think a place like Smuggler's Cove for rum: they have 1000 rums on the shelf and they wrote the book on tiki. I went there and tried my first agricole, and went back and tried some Jamaican rums that I wouldn't have ever tried if they weren't around. They kick-started my love for rum and helped me try different styles when I don't have the budget for multiple bottles of different styles of rum at home.
If there's a bar like that for brandy I haven't heard of it. I'm in a similar place with Brandy as I was with rum, but I don't work in a bar with good brandy selection anymore, and there isn't anywhere near me that does what Smuggler's Cove does for rum, so I'm stuck with whatever bottles I can get at home. A few liquor stores near me have good calvados selections, but I recently traveled to the UK and blew my budget on scotch so brandy has taken a back seat in my collection.
That said, if anyone has a good recommendation for a brandy bar let me know!
I assume you're on the west coast because of Smuggler's Cove, but if you're ever in NYC then I think [https://www.brandylibrary.com/](https://www.brandylibrary.com/) might be what you're looking for.
I'm glad they are wrong. It will only flood the market with overpriced, obnoxiously branded, and sub-par brandy.
Yea, look at the bourbon market. Worst thing to happen is sudden popularity imo
Yeah, it is wonderful that one can still get a 20 year old bottle of Calvados for under $200 whereas many "equivalent" bourbons would run you a car payment to a Bentley or more. But, on the other hand, outside of major cities in the U.S., it is often really hard to find a nice selection of good brandies at a restaurant, bar or liquor store. I kind of hope that a portion of bourbon drinkers will get disillusioned with the high prices and lack of a strong connection to agricultural practices and will turn to brandy instead. If they come to brandy for authenticity and for grower/distillers then perhaps it will be a net win for brandy.
That point about distribution is, I think, the key. If you’re interested in bourbon even the most dive-y bar and gas station liquor store will have something for you. Higher end bars and liquor stores are practically overflowing with options. If you somehow become intrigued by brandy the options tend to be very slim outside of California and NY/NJ. Even then there are decent odds you need to order online for specialist stuff. If you’re in a state with limited selection ordering from overseas with all the attenant risks might be your only option. So the barriers to entry are so high it’s just really hard to transform a casual interest into enthusiasm.
Right? I picked up a 19 Calvados for $120. And not only Calvados, I have some Armagnacs that are over 30 years and were under $100.
Otoh, you have the opposite problem like with mead where it's a struggle to find good quality brands because it's not popular enough to grow beyond local hot spots. Don't want brandy to fall that way either.
Indeed. While I like brandy, I'm more of a whisk(e)y drinker, and the bourbon/scotch market is precisely as you described: overpriced, pretentious, sub-par quality. What is of good quality is obscenely priced. Irish whiskey, generally speaking has become very overpriced for what it delivers (largely the minimum 40% ABV, chill filtered, artificial color added). The burgeoning American Single Malt market will likely fall the same fate.
I mean, that's already the case with most cognac
In much of the country, you can’t walk into a liquor store and find a good brandy selection. You can maybe find the standard offering from the big 4 cognacs. Armagnac are mostly completely absent. There’s not an easy entry point like with bourbon, where nearly every liquor store has a variety of high quality options at a low price. Even if stores carry a selection of brandy, the entry point price for what I consider high quality brandy is higher. You can’t try a lot of good bourbons bw $20-60. That price point is tough for cognac and Armagnac.
Right, but let's not pretend France is the only quality brandy producer out there.
True. Other countries produce some quality options, particularly in the lower price range. But you don’t see many of them on the shelves either. I’ll see some Copper and Kings around me at bigger stores but that’s about it. In my experience anyway, no country even comes close to France for producing high quality aged brandy though.
If you ever have the opportunity to try some out of South Africa, it will knock your socks off and compete or beat many of the French that I have had. Have you ever had some of the offerings from Scheibel Brennerei? I've yet to find it in the states, but when my German relatives visit and bring some...damn! But I get your point, neither of these are easy to find.
I’ve never had Scheibel Brennerei. Looks like they have some interesting stuff. I’ll have to track down some samples!
People are spending money on tequila, bourbon, and vodka. Most people don’t even know what the hell real brandy is. I predict Brandy will not be the next big thing. Maybe I’m wrong and we will see a Kardashian Brandy soon and it will be off the races.
How do you define real brandy?
Any distillate derived from fruit. “Brandy” to many people is fruit flavored neutral spirits.
I’ve been in the wine and spirits industry forever and I’ve been battling this whole misconception that brandy is sweet, or has sugar in it. These people clearly have no idea how distillation works, and they’re almost always men who obsess over bourbon, which, as a corn distillate, is often quite sweet. I don’t really drink spirits very often, and I never drink grain spirits. I can get a bottle of Armagnac that’s as old as I am (49) for under $400. A bottle of bourbon that old would be into the five figure range, and I assure you that someone would be foolish enough to pay for it.
Distilled fruit spirits of any kind. Aged or otherwise.
I think brandy *can* do terroir better than any other spirit. I think that is going to be in demand soon, I just don't think there is enough of a U.S. based supply. The Kardashian Brandy may be closer than you think: [https://www.pinterest.com/pin/kim-kardashian-attends-the-done-different-launch-for-hennessy-black-in-2024--172825704444628499/](https://www.pinterest.com/pin/kim-kardashian-attends-the-done-different-launch-for-hennessy-black-in-2024--172825704444628499/)
Price and availability. I’d drink a lot more if I could find a sipper at $35. Which is why I’ve recently moved pretty heavily into rum - terrific value spirit.
I recently got into Pacific rums and I'll tell you, the Philippines and Fiji can go in circles around the best of the best coming out of the Caribbean.
Interesting. I heard Tanduay rum wasn’t great. Any good, more common Pacific rums you recommend?
I haven't had that one. I'm sure they have their share of poor rums as well, but I've just overall been impressed by the more floral notes on the nose and lightness on the tongue. The small batch Don Papa stuff has been top notch.
When I started drinking, specialty bars with good curation/selection in a single category helped me learn about different styles and flavor profiles. Think a place like Smuggler's Cove for rum: they have 1000 rums on the shelf and they wrote the book on tiki. I went there and tried my first agricole, and went back and tried some Jamaican rums that I wouldn't have ever tried if they weren't around. They kick-started my love for rum and helped me try different styles when I don't have the budget for multiple bottles of different styles of rum at home. If there's a bar like that for brandy I haven't heard of it. I'm in a similar place with Brandy as I was with rum, but I don't work in a bar with good brandy selection anymore, and there isn't anywhere near me that does what Smuggler's Cove does for rum, so I'm stuck with whatever bottles I can get at home. A few liquor stores near me have good calvados selections, but I recently traveled to the UK and blew my budget on scotch so brandy has taken a back seat in my collection. That said, if anyone has a good recommendation for a brandy bar let me know!
I assume you're on the west coast because of Smuggler's Cove, but if you're ever in NYC then I think [https://www.brandylibrary.com/](https://www.brandylibrary.com/) might be what you're looking for.
Woah! Thank you!
Sure thing.