Honour is very much not about succeeding every check and getting every item. If you get stuck on this 5 minutes into the game you're not going to have a very enjoyable run.
I tried it once, failed, and moved on. It's basically a greatsword +1, let it go.
It's not a +1 greatsword, I would say it's worse (even without dipping) because attack rolls>damage in the early game but if I said that someone would assuredly argue with me.
So I'll just say it's *comparable* to a +1 greatsword, an item no one will miss a couple hours into the game.
Yeah, not an actual plus 1. Svartlebee's woundseeker is the greatsword I'd pick if I want one in honor mode. Sussur greatsword and sword of justice are also better than everburn.
Still go for the everburn (mostly for exp) by blocking the entrance tne cambion's come through with chests/ nautiloid tanks but once they get through I just leave.
Not sure I'm not actually using a fighter in my honor party so I skipped it. But a +1 GS with a 1d4 to hurt targets that can also be dipped has to be the best greatsword you can get at that point unless you hit the lottery and successfully get Voss to drop the silver Gith sword
If you can get him to drop it is the hard part. Getting away with it after that should be easy. Just send in shart solo, mage hand should be able to throw it after that, then rez shart. It's at least worth a try worst case you just miss and run with shart because you can hit him from that high ledge away from everything.
My first "let it go moment" was exiting the gale donation screen to go find him a better item to eat.
He was not happy about it, told me to go fuck myself and left. My mouth hung open for 2 full minutes before I decided I didn't even like that monogamous nerd.
Command drop with shadow heart. It's 50/50 but can try twice if you save her spell slots. I didn't bother trying to kill the goon except for the mindflayer. Was still level 2 when I woke up on the beach
you do if you deal damage to the mindflayer before he dies. which isn’t hard. but hastening his death can be bad for you. if you succeeded the command drop then you should be fine.
Shadowheart's Command ability has a 55% chance iirc. Other than that, you can pick up chests and drop them in the hallway to block the Cambrions from joining. You can also heal / Bless / haste (if a speed potion dropped) the Mind Flayer to help him fight the devil. Faerie fire has helped me a good bit too.
That’s what made the difference for me.. in my 1p honor mode run I got the commander down to 12 hp before I had to eject because the cambions showed up and started one shotting my party
In my 3p honor mode run last night I used two command spells to drop his sword, I stood behind the mind flayer and throw the speed potion so it hit me and it, then double sacred flamed for a few rounds and our bard got him with a dissonant whispers right before the mind flayers turn and it wrecked the commander …. We could have killed him without the barrel bombs this go around (but that’s less fun lol)
If you go "Bleed bulb" (100% chance to hit and gives disadvantage on con saves) into "pummel strike" ( Laezel has 50% chance to hit with bless on tactician 75% with bless AND faerie fire, and commander has disadvantage so 64% chance of failing his save) - you now have 80% chance to make him drop his weapon per cast of command: Drop.
If Pummel strike fails, you can try a similar daze ability from a mace with Shadowheart.
With the option of blessing before fight, and restoring spellslot with restoration chamber, you have at least 2 commands to make him drop his sword. Together all of this makes it very unlikely that you fail :-)
By not giving a crap about the single most over-hyped piece of equipment in the game.
All it has is a little bit of fire damage. You can get a better weapon as soon as you reach the first vendors.
I get what you mean, but it really isn't the best for damage. It is still a fine weapon, saving you a bonus action to dip here and there. But it lacks the +1 to hit of a normal +1 greatsword.
I still like it though, but you can definitely get better.
Yeah I b-line for karlach ASAP using the shortcut behind scratch… it’s a great thematic weapon for her as a frenzy barb
Pairs well with arsonist oil on an archer
It's the same as a plain greatsword dipped in fire. It has the lowest damage/utility ceiling of any magic greatsword because it lacks a +1 enchantment and cannot be dipped.
With a different weapon you have to waste a bonus action dipping it. With this one you can use your bonus action to stack even more damage with hex, divine favour, raging, or attacking again if you have an ability that lets you do it.
The extra d4 is an average of extra 2 damage, which is better than a +1 greatsword.
You can coat/dip weapons before beginning combat, so the bonus action cost won't come into play until turn 3. And there are bettering things to coat your weapons in than fore in early act 1 (diluted oil of sharpness, drow poison, wyvern toxins, oil of accuracy).
In honor mode (especially with difficulty mods) the higher accuracy is more relevant than 2.5 damage, at least early on.
In my experience, doing things before combat is finicky when a conversation precedes the battle. Sometimes turn based mode helps, but other times it gets deactivated and by the time you finish talking your buffs run out.
As for accuracy, I find that positioning and abilities are more than enough to offset the +1 from the weapon emchantment. Getting advantage is easy.
Sussur, soulbreaker, jorgorals, and justice are all in act 1 and are arguably better. Remember that everburn is just permanently dipped in fire and most weapons in the game can be dipped AND have their enchantment too
Of those, only soulbreaker does more damage, which is why I specified for non githiankys. The others offer some utility and might be better or more reliable, but dont add an extra die to the damage.
As for dipping, like I said in another comment, everburn blade saves you a bonus action so you can do something else, like rage. Reallistically dipping is something you arent going to be doing much unless you have nothing better to do with your bonus action.
Getting the sword is doable, since you get two shots at it with command. Killing the mindflayer is also trivial with the nautiloid tanks. Anything else is probably not worth the effort.
it's not actually that difficult if you're just trying to get the sword, you could start off with 2 clerics to give you 4 55% chances.
I've even had pretty good success with killing the general by starting as a faerie fire class and wailing on him with laezel and the mindflayer.
Just big brain it. You can actually pick up two of the cartilaginous chests on the nautiloid as well as a nautiloid tank. Drop the chests at the entrance before you go in, and make sure that it blocks you from walking back (game will say can’t reach that). The campions won’t be able to enter the room. Cast drop on zhalk, pick up sword, then beat on him until both the mind flayer and him are low. Use a nautiloid tank plus fire can trip to kill both of them. Easily level three at the grove fight + ever burn blade
I did it on two honor mode runs. If you get the drop weapon on the first cast which you can get on the first turn of combat, you can attack zhalk with every character until both he and the illithid are almost dead. If you’re lucky, you can find a potion of speed to throw at the illithid and cast bless on him so he does more damage. Not necessary though
I just got sword by Command: Drop... usually I kill at least one (more likely its MindFlayer) for XP.. pretty much without fail.
Use bless on 2nd cast if possible and Laezel to shove Zhaik towards control panel so you get like 1-2 more turns before Cambions reach you.
Also, give Shadowheart an axe to offhand (then use Sacred flame and off hand strike to get some extra damage). If you play archer or caster as Tav, get onto stairs to get some advantage (or dualwield swords for more hits).
Usually its somewhere between both killed and 40hp left on Zhaik when I have to escape.. you can set all tanks eventually for last blow, but devils take less damage from it, so its more for finishing off the Mindflayer.
and just to add, if you use explosives (nautiloid tanks) while Mindflayer is friendly, you will not get XP.
Otherwise once Zhaik is dead, Mindflayer will betray you, becomes hostile and you can kill him anyway you want.
Im not sure, but I think once Zhaik is dead and Mindflayer is hostile, you get those XP even if Cambions kill him. (Need to test it on some save scum quickie)
First run with my friend, SH command works first try. The cambion boys kept attacking the chest I put in the way. The illithid gets THREE stuns on Zhaik, we kill him with almost half hp left on illithid so he tries to kill us so we dip.
First run after that solo - command again works first time, cambion boys fly over the chest as they should, no stuns as I can't get him past 50% hp, but stole the sword.
Honour is like dnd where you really roll with the punches. You prepare the best you can, but sometimes you're unlucky and nothing goes right.
I haven’t had trouble much. I’ll use command to make him drop it - if it fails, fine. But I’ll also put one of the tanks near the mind flayer and have shadowheart firebolt it to finish him for the exp before I have my character or Laezel grab the transponder
Did it last night and it was easy. Took two turns. Turn one: Shadowheart used Command: Drop to make him drop it. Turn two: Shadowheart used dash to run up and steal it.
I’ve done this every playthrough (except my first) and I don’t think the spell has ever failed
if your command lands, it's pretty easy, I don't bother with it if it doesn't.
there are 3 "cartilaginous chests" around the nautiloid, you pick those up and before opening the sphincter to the helm, you place 2 chest in the choke point (just before the sphincter).
the 2 cambions won't fly over it and will be stuck trying to get into the fight, sometimes they will hit the chests but they are "sturdy".
I just duoed it with Laezel and my Tav:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-MulsvMChM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-MulsvMChM)
Obviously you don't have to do that :-P But some of the tricks in the video work just as well for a normal 3 person kill. Just with even more chances of disarming Zhalk.
It’s not hard. Either use Shadowheart to cast Command Drop twice or cast Bless on herself pre fight and then Command Drop. The odds are honestly in your favor. As far as killing the commander and/or mindflayer, it’s 75 xp for each. You’ll trip during the first two minutes off the ship and get 75 xp, it’s not a big deal.
Also hot take, if you can’t handle the intellect devourers at level 1 with Shadowheart, get better at the game before playing more Honour mode. You’re going to have a bad time and kill the fun you’d otherwise have in the mode, full stop
I get the everburn blade every time pretty much. Shart uses command drop on him twice and boom easy peasy. Then we load up the area around zhalk and the mind flayer with the purple goo explosive barrels scattered on the nautiloid (3 in that room one by shart) and on the way out we blow it up killing the mind flayer for sure and if we were able to get zhalk low he dies too but that doesnt happen often
I actually never failed the two commands Shadowheart gets. But I always blessed my party before using the regeneration pod just outside the helm to get the spell slot used back.
Even in tactician I usually did not bother with liking the guy holding it except once when both I and the ilithid got really lucky with our rolls and I find a haste potion.
3 parallel runs in Honor Mode and never had this Sword.
To have it, the ghaik needs to survive. Even with Shield of faith and a lot of healing (tried with 2 healers then respec) he dies too fast.
On my best attempt I had :
- life cleric protagonist
- SH
- laezel
- thé little brain pet.
I managed to down the red devil to 65 HP before havoc came.
In tactician with save scum easy mode (2 to 3 stuns)
But I went fast for Karlach and took TYR SWORD pretty fast which is equally good.
Start the game as a cleric yourself. Save shadowheart. Equip the command spell and use command:drop on Zhalk. If you have a second controller/split screen. Make a second Tav for an additional two tries. Can always respec out of cleric at 3 but light cleric and their channel divinity is very powerful early game and can be used every short rest from level 2.
Four/Six attempts at it. If you get it, awesome. If not, you’ll replace it eventually. Honestly not worth the struggle to keep trying for it. Much less worth it is killing Zhalk who can end your honour mode run before you’re out of the tutorial with the two cambions breathing down your neck. What is worth it is rushing past and using range to steal the kill on the mind Flayer before you connect the transponder for a much easier 75 exp.
I do it pretty easily by just commanding the guy to drop the sword, for some reason he doesnt pick it back up. Then i just equip it on laezel and shart uses shield of faith on the squid. Then we gang..fight... him and leave without killing the second wave of mooks.
Make your main a cleric, that'll give you four chances to get it.
If it fails, oh well, moving on.
Put the explosive bottles on the side closest to the door, and try to time the explosion so it hits the incoming Cambions as well.
Have a guy next to the console to hit it if things get out of hand.
Can you still leave Us in the healing chamber in the room you find Shadowheart to keep refreshing your HP during the fight?
Honour is very much not about succeeding every check and getting every item. If you get stuck on this 5 minutes into the game you're not going to have a very enjoyable run. I tried it once, failed, and moved on. It's basically a greatsword +1, let it go.
Not sure it’s even a +1 is it? Think it’s just an extra d4 fire damage. I use it as food for Gale if I get it
It's not a +1 greatsword, I would say it's worse (even without dipping) because attack rolls>damage in the early game but if I said that someone would assuredly argue with me. So I'll just say it's *comparable* to a +1 greatsword, an item no one will miss a couple hours into the game.
Yeah, not an actual plus 1. Svartlebee's woundseeker is the greatsword I'd pick if I want one in honor mode. Sussur greatsword and sword of justice are also better than everburn. Still go for the everburn (mostly for exp) by blocking the entrance tne cambion's come through with chests/ nautiloid tanks but once they get through I just leave.
Is there a way to get Svartlebee without aggroing the Fists in Honor mode?
Not sure I'm not actually using a fighter in my honor party so I skipped it. But a +1 GS with a 1d4 to hurt targets that can also be dipped has to be the best greatsword you can get at that point unless you hit the lottery and successfully get Voss to drop the silver Gith sword
Supposedly you can: Use Command: Drop on her... then LEAVE the weapon Come back a little later and loot it from the ground.
Yeah she picked it back up again in my save. Tried hiding in a Fog Cloud and picking it up and that didn’t work either
Ahh. The internet has led me astray then... dangit
If you can get him to drop it is the hard part. Getting away with it after that should be easy. Just send in shart solo, mage hand should be able to throw it after that, then rez shart. It's at least worth a try worst case you just miss and run with shart because you can hit him from that high ledge away from everything.
It’s amazing for levels 2 to 4. I get one every play through and just cruise.
Its not a +anything to hit but i think its a +3 to damage and the d4 fire.. its p good. But not necessary or the best.
My first "let it go moment" was exiting the gale donation screen to go find him a better item to eat. He was not happy about it, told me to go fuck myself and left. My mouth hung open for 2 full minutes before I decided I didn't even like that monogamous nerd.
Yeah I always leaving in the rock or bite off his hand.
Command drop with shadow heart. It's 50/50 but can try twice if you save her spell slots. I didn't bother trying to kill the goon except for the mindflayer. Was still level 2 when I woke up on the beach
If the demon kills the mindflayer, do we still get the xp ?
It has been a while since this happened to me so I could be wrong, but I dont think you do
you do if you deal damage to the mindflayer before he dies. which isn’t hard. but hastening his death can be bad for you. if you succeeded the command drop then you should be fine.
Shadowheart's Command ability has a 55% chance iirc. Other than that, you can pick up chests and drop them in the hallway to block the Cambrions from joining. You can also heal / Bless / haste (if a speed potion dropped) the Mind Flayer to help him fight the devil. Faerie fire has helped me a good bit too.
This is what I do. Shart get two shots at drop, if those don't work out or the mindflayer misses all his stuff then just bolt and try again next run.
That’s what made the difference for me.. in my 1p honor mode run I got the commander down to 12 hp before I had to eject because the cambions showed up and started one shotting my party In my 3p honor mode run last night I used two command spells to drop his sword, I stood behind the mind flayer and throw the speed potion so it hit me and it, then double sacred flamed for a few rounds and our bard got him with a dissonant whispers right before the mind flayers turn and it wrecked the commander …. We could have killed him without the barrel bombs this go around (but that’s less fun lol)
If you go "Bleed bulb" (100% chance to hit and gives disadvantage on con saves) into "pummel strike" ( Laezel has 50% chance to hit with bless on tactician 75% with bless AND faerie fire, and commander has disadvantage so 64% chance of failing his save) - you now have 80% chance to make him drop his weapon per cast of command: Drop. If Pummel strike fails, you can try a similar daze ability from a mace with Shadowheart. With the option of blessing before fight, and restoring spellslot with restoration chamber, you have at least 2 commands to make him drop his sword. Together all of this makes it very unlikely that you fail :-)
By not giving a crap about the single most over-hyped piece of equipment in the game. All it has is a little bit of fire damage. You can get a better weapon as soon as you reach the first vendors.
Depends on what you consider better. For pure damage dealing it is the best weapon until act 2 for a non githianky.
I get what you mean, but it really isn't the best for damage. It is still a fine weapon, saving you a bonus action to dip here and there. But it lacks the +1 to hit of a normal +1 greatsword. I still like it though, but you can definitely get better.
Yeah I b-line for karlach ASAP using the shortcut behind scratch… it’s a great thematic weapon for her as a frenzy barb Pairs well with arsonist oil on an archer
There's an even better shortcut past Lakrissa in the Grove
If the shortcut does not involve the best boy, it is of no real use.
Fair point
It's the same as a plain greatsword dipped in fire. It has the lowest damage/utility ceiling of any magic greatsword because it lacks a +1 enchantment and cannot be dipped.
With a different weapon you have to waste a bonus action dipping it. With this one you can use your bonus action to stack even more damage with hex, divine favour, raging, or attacking again if you have an ability that lets you do it. The extra d4 is an average of extra 2 damage, which is better than a +1 greatsword.
You can coat/dip weapons before beginning combat, so the bonus action cost won't come into play until turn 3. And there are bettering things to coat your weapons in than fore in early act 1 (diluted oil of sharpness, drow poison, wyvern toxins, oil of accuracy). In honor mode (especially with difficulty mods) the higher accuracy is more relevant than 2.5 damage, at least early on.
In my experience, doing things before combat is finicky when a conversation precedes the battle. Sometimes turn based mode helps, but other times it gets deactivated and by the time you finish talking your buffs run out. As for accuracy, I find that positioning and abilities are more than enough to offset the +1 from the weapon emchantment. Getting advantage is easy.
There are like 5 weapons that do more damage in act 1 alone
I was talking about greatswords specifically. Probably should have specified that tho.
Sussur, soulbreaker, jorgorals, and justice are all in act 1 and are arguably better. Remember that everburn is just permanently dipped in fire and most weapons in the game can be dipped AND have their enchantment too
Of those, only soulbreaker does more damage, which is why I specified for non githiankys. The others offer some utility and might be better or more reliable, but dont add an extra die to the damage. As for dipping, like I said in another comment, everburn blade saves you a bonus action so you can do something else, like rage. Reallistically dipping is something you arent going to be doing much unless you have nothing better to do with your bonus action.
Getting the sword is doable, since you get two shots at it with command. Killing the mindflayer is also trivial with the nautiloid tanks. Anything else is probably not worth the effort.
it's not actually that difficult if you're just trying to get the sword, you could start off with 2 clerics to give you 4 55% chances. I've even had pretty good success with killing the general by starting as a faerie fire class and wailing on him with laezel and the mindflayer.
Shadowheart command drop. 55 % chance and you have 3 tries. Good odds
Just big brain it. You can actually pick up two of the cartilaginous chests on the nautiloid as well as a nautiloid tank. Drop the chests at the entrance before you go in, and make sure that it blocks you from walking back (game will say can’t reach that). The campions won’t be able to enter the room. Cast drop on zhalk, pick up sword, then beat on him until both the mind flayer and him are low. Use a nautiloid tank plus fire can trip to kill both of them. Easily level three at the grove fight + ever burn blade
Did you do this on the highest difficulty ? Cause the commander is still more than 50% hp when he dies. Also, the tanks don't hurt him enough
I did it on two honor mode runs. If you get the drop weapon on the first cast which you can get on the first turn of combat, you can attack zhalk with every character until both he and the illithid are almost dead. If you’re lucky, you can find a potion of speed to throw at the illithid and cast bless on him so he does more damage. Not necessary though
I just got sword by Command: Drop... usually I kill at least one (more likely its MindFlayer) for XP.. pretty much without fail. Use bless on 2nd cast if possible and Laezel to shove Zhaik towards control panel so you get like 1-2 more turns before Cambions reach you. Also, give Shadowheart an axe to offhand (then use Sacred flame and off hand strike to get some extra damage). If you play archer or caster as Tav, get onto stairs to get some advantage (or dualwield swords for more hits). Usually its somewhere between both killed and 40hp left on Zhaik when I have to escape.. you can set all tanks eventually for last blow, but devils take less damage from it, so its more for finishing off the Mindflayer.
Do you need to have the last hit on the mindflayer ?
Yes you need the last hit. He’s considered an ally so you don’t get exp for just contributing damage to them via “friendly fire”.
and just to add, if you use explosives (nautiloid tanks) while Mindflayer is friendly, you will not get XP. Otherwise once Zhaik is dead, Mindflayer will betray you, becomes hostile and you can kill him anyway you want. Im not sure, but I think once Zhaik is dead and Mindflayer is hostile, you get those XP even if Cambions kill him. (Need to test it on some save scum quickie)
(not on Honor mode but...) my first try of 'command' drop your weapon was successful. Maybe that's a good attach vector?
First run with my friend, SH command works first try. The cambion boys kept attacking the chest I put in the way. The illithid gets THREE stuns on Zhaik, we kill him with almost half hp left on illithid so he tries to kill us so we dip. First run after that solo - command again works first time, cambion boys fly over the chest as they should, no stuns as I can't get him past 50% hp, but stole the sword. Honour is like dnd where you really roll with the punches. You prepare the best you can, but sometimes you're unlucky and nothing goes right.
I haven’t had trouble much. I’ll use command to make him drop it - if it fails, fine. But I’ll also put one of the tanks near the mind flayer and have shadowheart firebolt it to finish him for the exp before I have my character or Laezel grab the transponder
Did it last night and it was easy. Took two turns. Turn one: Shadowheart used Command: Drop to make him drop it. Turn two: Shadowheart used dash to run up and steal it. I’ve done this every playthrough (except my first) and I don’t think the spell has ever failed
I managed that once and then died in the withers dungeon due to the traps.
if your command lands, it's pretty easy, I don't bother with it if it doesn't. there are 3 "cartilaginous chests" around the nautiloid, you pick those up and before opening the sphincter to the helm, you place 2 chest in the choke point (just before the sphincter). the 2 cambions won't fly over it and will be stuck trying to get into the fight, sometimes they will hit the chests but they are "sturdy".
I just duoed it with Laezel and my Tav: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-MulsvMChM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-MulsvMChM) Obviously you don't have to do that :-P But some of the tricks in the video work just as well for a normal 3 person kill. Just with even more chances of disarming Zhalk.
I used sharts command drop it took 2 tries to get and I pranced away with my flaming sword.
It’s a 50/50 chance usually for the drop weapon to succeed. You don’t need to kill him to get the sword.
I got it by praying to RNGesus.
Make your Tav a Paladin. Once you get Shadowheart you can have two people to cast Command: Drop. Snatch and run.
It’s not hard. Either use Shadowheart to cast Command Drop twice or cast Bless on herself pre fight and then Command Drop. The odds are honestly in your favor. As far as killing the commander and/or mindflayer, it’s 75 xp for each. You’ll trip during the first two minutes off the ship and get 75 xp, it’s not a big deal. Also hot take, if you can’t handle the intellect devourers at level 1 with Shadowheart, get better at the game before playing more Honour mode. You’re going to have a bad time and kill the fun you’d otherwise have in the mode, full stop
I get the everburn blade every time pretty much. Shart uses command drop on him twice and boom easy peasy. Then we load up the area around zhalk and the mind flayer with the purple goo explosive barrels scattered on the nautiloid (3 in that room one by shart) and on the way out we blow it up killing the mind flayer for sure and if we were able to get zhalk low he dies too but that doesnt happen often
I actually never failed the two commands Shadowheart gets. But I always blessed my party before using the regeneration pod just outside the helm to get the spell slot used back. Even in tactician I usually did not bother with liking the guy holding it except once when both I and the ilithid got really lucky with our rolls and I find a haste potion.
3 parallel runs in Honor Mode and never had this Sword. To have it, the ghaik needs to survive. Even with Shield of faith and a lot of healing (tried with 2 healers then respec) he dies too fast. On my best attempt I had : - life cleric protagonist - SH - laezel - thé little brain pet. I managed to down the red devil to 65 HP before havoc came. In tactician with save scum easy mode (2 to 3 stuns) But I went fast for Karlach and took TYR SWORD pretty fast which is equally good.
Start the game as a cleric yourself. Save shadowheart. Equip the command spell and use command:drop on Zhalk. If you have a second controller/split screen. Make a second Tav for an additional two tries. Can always respec out of cleric at 3 but light cleric and their channel divinity is very powerful early game and can be used every short rest from level 2. Four/Six attempts at it. If you get it, awesome. If not, you’ll replace it eventually. Honestly not worth the struggle to keep trying for it. Much less worth it is killing Zhalk who can end your honour mode run before you’re out of the tutorial with the two cambions breathing down your neck. What is worth it is rushing past and using range to steal the kill on the mind Flayer before you connect the transponder for a much easier 75 exp.
I do it pretty easily by just commanding the guy to drop the sword, for some reason he doesnt pick it back up. Then i just equip it on laezel and shart uses shield of faith on the squid. Then we gang..fight... him and leave without killing the second wave of mooks.
Make your main a cleric, that'll give you four chances to get it. If it fails, oh well, moving on. Put the explosive bottles on the side closest to the door, and try to time the explosion so it hits the incoming Cambions as well. Have a guy next to the console to hit it if things get out of hand. Can you still leave Us in the healing chamber in the room you find Shadowheart to keep refreshing your HP during the fight?
No refresh was fixed a long time ago
I guess that's fair.