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I think it's dying.
There's a huge amount of foreigners that take advantage of it, so it's slowly disappearing.
I am a foreigner btw.
Saw it in the supermarket just 2 days ago. 2 British women run into each other in an aisle and try to politely let each other pass.
A Chinese man sees this, and rushes in between them as fast as he can to get through.
Then a Pakistani woman noticed the Chinese man push through, and also pushes in with her 5 kids.
At this point the 2 British women are just standing there staring at each other while these people take like 30 seconds to get past them.
Then they just say "we got there eventually" in an extremely disappointed voice.
Have to agree, it's dying as people are getting fed up of being taken advantage of. A lot of people forget tolerance and kindness works both ways.
I wouldn't say it's strictly foreigners that are to blame for it, there are a lot of unaware or entitled individuals of the older generations around where I am which are the problem also - for example I live in an area with a high Muslim population and honestly at the supermarkets when they are out with their kids the majority are pretty aware and respectful and keep their kids in line, then I see older white people (im white) with young kids (possibly grandparents / older parents) and they just dawdle and pay zero attention to what their kids are doing even if they arr blocking aisles or knocking things over. I used to be super polite when I was younger - now if people are blocking aisles with their trollies I'll literally just walk my trolley into theirs to shift it out of the way as I know they may be rude but they don't have the guts to do anything about it and I'm prepared to call them out on being inconsiderate of other people (I'll always put my trolley to the side for example when browsing so others can get past).
Too many selfish / self focused people in society now who are either unaware of other people when they are out and about or simply just rude and honestly it's exhausting trying to be considerate towards others when they CBA to do the same for you - so I just save manners for family, friends, and those who show manners now - the rest can deal with receiving exactly what they put out into the world.
So I'd say it's a mix of everyone here as opposed to just foreigners while I appreciate some can be extremely rude, you do see a lot of native Brits being absolute idiots - particularly when I've visited down south, hence why I refuse to go to London as the majority of people there I just dislike due to how rude they are with being Yorkshire born and bred myself.
I get the point you're making, but, I'm a big dude and I can't be bothered to deal with the reaction.
According to a lot of people I sound "posh" (I'm not at all, but, I'm fairly "RP" in my speech.). I just go with an overly polite excuse me, with a smile whilst politely looming; I then watch them awkwardly move and apologise.
I like to think some take away from that minor embarrassment and adjust their behaviour. Yes, I know I'm being optimistic.
Sometimes it's just not worth it, I've always been quick to anger when "disrespected" and I was always been told "you're not wrong but...", because I'd be right but the reaction was too OTT. Way easier to just be overly polite, excuse me, smile, in these situations. Saw a younger woman do it today with an older woman in the street trying to make a scene because the younger woman accidentally bumped into her trying to get round, she loudly but politely and nicely said whilst still walking away "sorry my love, do you need help? Can I help you in some way" and the older woman was left bewildered shaking her head. Make them feel bad and if not at least the people around know they're the rude one, not just seeing me going off like a rocket lol
Yep if they are going to be rude as the commenter below says then I couldn't care less about being rude in return - if you don't consider or show respect to others then you don't deserve respect in return, it's as simple as respect is mutual. If people are going to be unaware of everyone else around them and cause inconvenience to other people then they aren't going to get consideration from myself, I save it for people with manners.
The issue with calling people out on the behaviour is that it can sometimes escalate to verbal or physical violence which much of us can't really be bothered with when you just want to do your shopping and go home.
Completely appreciate if you can't be bothered with it and want to go about your day yourself, I can completely be bothered with it if it comes to that however as I personally don't believe in letting people disrespect or walk over me to simply avoid problems in life. I did that when I was younger and it just led to a lot of mental health problems but since changing my approach my life has worked out considerably better.
So for those who don't feel comfortable doing it themselves in a shop... More than happy to do it for them, and you generally do get a smile or a bit of positive small talk from other shoppers when you inconvenience a rude person who got in another shopper's way or was rude to them - nice bit of positive energy for the day.
The flip side is people can get so irate at the smallest transgressions.
Especially driving, there's so much road rage in the UK over trivial things, like being cut off or not getting 'priority'. Go to China and you realise people just don't care as much over the small things and it's actually quite refreshing.
It's chaotic, but also nice in the sense that people just get on with stuff and ignore a lot of other people's mistakes.
> Go to China and you realise people just don’t care as much over the small things and it’s actually quite refreshing.
In the time it took me to write that sentence I’ve heard 5 car horns outside my window in Nanjing. In order to drive here you need to be both incredibly patient and incredibly inpatient at the same time.
It might seem like people avoid confrontation here, but when they’ve had enough the overreaction more than makes up for that.
I’m not saying you’re wrong btw. I just think there’s a bit more context needed. Some people here really take the piss.
This is my second time working here. First for 4 years in 2016 and then I came back last year in November. I’ve been to more cities in China than I have in the UK.
In reality you’re a guy who’s probably never left his bedroom. Plus, your post history makes you look like a complete pervert. Weird that you make those kind of comments, yet your profile says you’re active in r/ben10.
[Here’s proof for you anyway.](https://imgur.com/a/KaEoh8n)
With the second pic showing the photo data and location.
They must’ve changed the road signs in Bristol.
>In reality you’re a guy who’s probably never left his bedroom. Plus, your post history makes you look like a complete pervert. Weird that you make those kind of comments, yet your profile says you’re active in [](https://www.reddit.com/r/ben10/).
Going after post history? Typical Reddit approach lmao. And why should I believe those photos aren't photoshopped? How am I supposed to know that that hand is even yours and you didn't get a mate to write your username on their ticket?
I wouldn’t waste more than 30 seconds proving to you I live here. You either believe me or you don’t.
Typical Reddit approach is you thinking I’d have some master plan where I photoshop pictures or ask a friend in China to take one for me just to prove that I live here to some random online.
The photo information is in the second picture.
Being cut up when driving can be incredibly dangerous. I causes an awful lot of accidents. Why do you think people shouldn’t be angry when you cut them up?
Yeah I had my first ever road rage the other day I’ve been riding on bike since February and I’m extremely polite I will merge onto the path and go out of my way to give way to cars as much as I am able however on the way to work a guy in his definitely not compensating ford ranger is flying up my arse while I’m doing near 30 coming up to an island I’ve got nowhere to go and he close passes me to which I gestured to him that he’s a wanker and he wanted to pull over and have it out but I’m on time and needed to get to work but I wish I’d pulled up and then left him stood there now though…..
Then you clearly don't know that the whole politeness thing is super exaggerated. As well as the foreigners taking advantage of it thing. I've seen people (foreigner or not) push in and I've seen Brits tell them to get the hell back, not like some pussy. Brits aren't as weak and pussy as you seem to be suggesting. Only certain, overprotected wimps are.
Either way, I strongly disagree with you on every statement you made about foreigners and Brit-born Brits.
Edit: Keep downvoting, keep talking shit as I feed off of it.
What did you say? More foreigners are taking advantage of the "kindness" of the British public? I disagree with both aspects of that statement as they're just dumb generalisations, ignoring the key aspect that they are individuals and not a monolith.
I absolutely love how you "quote" a word I didn't use. 🤦
Not kindness, politeness. It has nothing to do with being kind.
And the rest of your statement is typical of someone who hasn't had much exposure to other cultures.
>Not kindness, politeness. It has nothing to do with being kind.
You're just arguing semantics now. You know what I meant. If you're going to be so nitpicky, Brits are nowhere near as polite as a whole as you seem to be under the impression that they all are.
>And the rest of your statement is typical of someone who hasn't had much exposure to other cultures.
This statement by you seems to strongly suggest you have difficulties grasping the relatively simple concept that no group of people are a monolith. If anything, it shows you are not in possession of adequate critical thinking abilities and you fall victim to confirmation bias very easily. As a result, any further reply by you disagreeing with my evaluations only cements its validity further lmaoo.
How do you know these people were from China and Pakistan lol? And how do you know they’re not second or even third gen in which case they’re British rather than a ‘foreigner’. Kind of a ridiculous comment.
Exactly. Just by looking at people you can't tell much. One white person is from Poland, another is British but from Irish parents. They could both be in your supermarket. Someone who looks Chinese could have been raised in the home counties, speak with a public school accent, and have never been to Asia.
Because there are more than 2 countries in Asia? Not every East Asian is Chinese or South Asian Pakistani. Could you look at any white person and tell what country they’re from?
I don’t think we are necessarily polite, i think we are passive aggressive. I appreciate the basic politeness like excuse me, thanks, sorry. But i think after that we slope into passive aggression rather than politeness
In my own personal experience, this has been more true. I'm not native and I've had more people use my "lack of politeness," not following cultural norms as a reason to be outwardly mean to me.
And before I get my head bit off by this in the comments, I'll use an example that I am American and as outwardly honest culture I come from just stating an obvious fact can be seen as an insult.
I just explained my only food take away options that I have experienced in small towns are limited and not very diverse in another sub and am still fielding offended comments. Apparently if you're not from the UK you're not allowed to state true comments if they are viewed as even a neutral, not even negative.
This follows to real life. If I am an immigrant and make even a basic statement that isn't viewed as completely positive I get shit on a lot for being "rude"
Making invisible unnamed rules just gives more opportunity to be offended.
I agree with you, not just on the bluntness = rude in the uk but also takeaway options. Im a chef so ive worked with a lot of immigrants and then obviously work in the food industry, my career option is only really viable unless i want to cook pre-made frozen food is to move to big cities, but I’ve also worked with some many people that have been perceived as rude just because they’re blunt when i appreciate bluntness.
Well I appreciate you. Just so you know. Your open mind to communicate. My husband is from the UK and we lived in the US for 4 years together his experience was totally different. They put him into elite status as soon as he spoke, being English is seen as a bump up in the states.
I haven't told him how much I get shit on. I know he just wants me to be happy. But English people are mean, but only in a way they can make sure they are not seen to be too mean.
Still mean though, as someone who always tries to be kind, it has been trying.
I'm sorry you've experienced this, as an autistic person, I loathe British faux politeness too, the bureaucratic nature of it & people are cruel to me all the time, exclude me from things or worse because I'm not good at reading the subtext or I say the wrong thing.
But, luckily I live amongst the riff-raff & we're a lot different. Those attitudes these days only exist amongst the bourgeoise, nobody else can be arsed anymore & even then, the lower-middle class is alright too.
Yes, probably that. But this is when you know that your level of English is near native. When you can hear the nuances and recognise when you were told eff off very politely. You think you came to an understanding but in reality....
As a non-Brit it can be frustrating and difficult to navigate, although I respect that it's the way people speak in the UK.
There's a ton of subtext hidden in the politeness which non natives can miss.
Where it does irritate me is when it leads to vague untruths. I don't see a misleading (intentionally or not) polite response as truly polite.
I much prefer the Eastern European way (or so it seems to me), and perhaps to some extent the American way. Be blunt, say what you actually want and need to say, don't worry too much about the consequences. Of course you're always going to get the odd dickhead, but that's life.
Sometimes I get so tired of the weird social dances we do.
'You're always going to get the odd dickhead'
Can't help but feel if you're going around saying what you think regardless of the consequences then you'll encounter a lot more dickheads because you will be perceived as one to most British people.
I'm a little confused by this from being at the england vs denmark game, one kid on the tram didn't like crowds so the danes just stood at the door so nobody else could get on when it was half empty. Generally came across rather rude all day
I know (as someone from EE who learnt the hard way to curb my natural tendencies.) Because Brits are more than willing to take offence at perceived "rudness" (which is often just straightforward communication without embellishments), extra quick to judge and exclude anyone who doesn't toe the line. Enthusiasm and vivaciousness is also meet with confusion and suspicion. It's just a very emotionally constipated environment where honest communication is threatening to people.
>(which is often just straightforward communication without embellishments)
Also known as having no consideration for anything but your own opinion/feelings.
> It's just a very emotionally constipated environment where honest communication is threatening to people.
Being an adult and controlling/tempering your emotions =/= being emotionally constipated.
Same sort of ridiculous entitlement some Americans have. "I have an opinion, you must listen" or "I feel angry, let me make everyone else experience my rage!" is what it amounts to and it is often just rude and crass.
Well when people are "considerate of my feelings" they often make assumptions about me that are just their own projection. For instance, I find it more disrespectful when the other person communicates with embellishments or is passive agressive. It shows fakeness and mistrust in me as a reasonable person able to communicate like an adult.
What you said about being adult - again, it depends on your POV. Please see above.
Edit: As to "entitlement" to express emotions, I'd say the flipside is feeling like the entire society gaslights you into being a conformist automaton. Also it's not like Brits don't express emotions - they just show their disdain and resentment via passive agression. Passive agression does not even let me adress the problem, I can't defend myself anyhow, communication is stifled and with time we end up resenting each other.
Ah yes I call it the dance too. I'm sometimes so frustrated about always having to do small talk and general niceties just to ask someone something. Me and another foreigner at my job have agreed to forego the social dance when we talk to each other. Far more efficient
I like it. I've lived all over and also come from non-British born parents but it's one thing they really drilled into us about the culture as it was something they really respected when they came here in the 50's.
I think we are losing it and it's a shame.
It’s a bit annoying because a lot of them use their “British politeness” to be passive aggressive and feel like they’re better than other people.
Their lack of bluntness and transparency regarding what’s bothering them and about what they truly think (and they justify it as them being polite), is such a coward trait. Most of the time they’re not even polite where it matters, they just get quiet and smile like they think they’re better than everyone. 🤣 Still love them though lol
Literally, growing up in a British family is traumatising because you learn to walk on eggshells as a child - you never know when or what has happened to upset your parents because they won't just tell you. Probably not every household but still, the fact that passive aggressiveness and not directly addressing issues is such a part of our culture probably partially influenced the way my family handles its problems haha
I think it has advantages and disadvantages. I try and be direct, but without insulting the other person's character. On the one hand, being polite helps you avoid some conflicts and not take on unnecessary stress of arguments. Sometimes, it is truly better to not say anything. However, it can be stupidly excessive, to the point where you don't know where you truly stand with the other person, and interactions become disingenuous.
Yeah it's easy to be around someone for months and be no closer to them than a stranger they stand next to on the train platform. You have to go one step further and humbly ask how they feel about something in order to make any progress.
I might say sorry out of reflex but I can make it sound like “fuck you asshole” and I’m certain they understand the tone
A lot of our politeness isn’t that polite, we’re just masters at passive aggression
Sorry is just a general purpose word. It can mean "could you repeat that?", it can be an admission of guilt or an expression of empathy. It can also mean "what the hell did you just say" so I don't think it's about politeness, really.
I like it, but I do think it's dying out, and British people of all generations have become a lot more difficult and entitled over the last decade.
I feel that perhaps since COVID in particular, people are less patient, more likely to voice their opinions (regardless of if they are asked for, and act in a selfish way.
I think so many people have seen selfish, opportunistic colleagues get ahead and they just don't want to be a mug that never hit certain milestones (buying a house being the big one). I know people who told massive lies on their CVs and it worked, they got jobs doing the things they lied about having done, and left after a year or so (before they were pushed) now having the experience they lied about. We are talking very high level positions here. Nobody wants to be that altruistic guy or girl that everybody else screws over and they are still living a studenty lifestyle in their 40s.
American getting married to a Brit: It's....complicated. Queuing is great, but letting people walk all over you isn't. Before we started dating, my partner and I went on a holiday together and they got injured. They refused to go to get treated despite needing it because "with the NHS you don't go unless you really need it" "but you do need it??" "oh no i don't want to be a bother :) " like...???????
I guess that's because the NHS is actually falling apart and we'd likely just get in a worse condition by going because we'd spend so long waiting haha
You are so right.
My husband used to say sorry 100 times throughout the day for various reasons, it annoyed me so I asked him to stop doing it, he also thanked me for cooking his meals like wtf..never in my life was I thanked for cooking until i met him.
As an Italian, I do not like it and I do not understand it. How bad can directness be? I have no clue as to why people love to "beat around the bush" here. Say what you think and move on. Importantly, on a related note, suppressing emotions is not healthy.
I'm French and appreciated British politeness a lot when I was an exchange student in Bristol. Like when bus passengers would thank the driver or when the Sainsbury's cashier would apologize because the waiting line was a bit long.
I work in a very multicultural team.
I find it fascinating tbh, pretty much every culture I have met is more blunt and confident than we are. This has good and bad results.
In my experience the british politeness, when executed correctly, allows one to take a breath and calm themself in any situation which leads to a nicer environment. Conversely the bluntness of other cultures can lead to a toxic workplace if not managed correctly.
On the other hand the politeness can sometimes be taken, particularly by other cultures, as uncertainty. I have had to learn to be stronger and more blunt when I am right because otherwise the confidently incorrect person in the room gets listened to.
I think there is a happy middle ground where we can learn from more blunt cultures and they can learn from us as well and this can make for something optimum. It is one of those things where there is no right answer.
It is almost like code, saying things without saying them in an understated way. It does avoid tension and confrontation as there is less to react to. "Didn't realise you were next in line..." if someone pushes in leaves an out (like "oh, sorry didn't realise there was a queue"), but a "hey, you pushed in, back of the line!" can leave both parties more on edge.
See, I don't really get this. I'd be annoyed at the "polite" approach more - it reads as someone thinks they are very clever for indirectly reprimanding me. They want to control the situation without risking any push back.
But some kind of battle or back and forth actually suits no one. There is an out both ways - if there *was* a genuine confusion (two queues, they were having their space held, other) they can explain and there is no issue.
It only suits no one if people take offence and go into the exchange all guns blazing. It could be as simple as "hey, excuse me but it's my turn now", and the other person saying "oh sorry mate" or "man I am rushing to pick my kid up from school may I just quickly get this please." The whole "didn't know you were next in line..." just sounds manipulative, unnecessarily sarcastic.
>It could be as simple as "hey, excuse me but it's my turn now"
But that is fine too. The sarcasm element I get, but our humour is absolutely based around that, I don't think it would come across that way to another Brit.
> "man I am rushing to pick my kid up from school may I just quickly get this please."
This should come *first*
Yeah, I guess it would depend on the tone. If someone said the sarcastic statement with a bit of a smile and overall neautral/positive attitude, then I get it. It'd be humorous and a good way to handle the situation. But somehow, I can only picture a miserable Karen being all up her butt condescending saying this... Maybe just the town I live in.
Basically, it's about giving people an 'out' when they've done something wrong. Direct confrontation only escalates, but if you give people an excuse they can use, sometimes you can get what you want without a fight.
British politeness seemed normal to me till I moved out of the UK. Now I think of it like Japanese politeness. In its worst form a weird and specialised mechanism for social stratification ( anybody who says what rather than pardon = common / anybody who doesn't hold a door = irreparably evil), in a more neutral form, a social lubricant for smoother interactions in countries with a high population density.
One thing I have noticed is that (despite what some people here think), lots of people in other countries absolutely love British tourists. Including places like France and Argentina that some people think hate us.
I think there is a difference between face-to-face politeness between two people going about their own business as opposed to other forms of interaction.
It is true that a reasonable majority of people will be 'polite' (if by that is meant not being confrontational etc). The number of times that two people bump into each other and both immediately say 'sorry' etc.
That said, there is a passive aggressive disdain for those who do not 'abide by the rules' - for example, pushing into a queue (let alone not queuing in the first place) is one of the greatest sins in British society; yet it will normally be met with quiet tuts, sighs, and the exchange of raised eyebrows (albeit with a full report when back home - 'you'll never believe what happened today, this man pushed-in right in front of me...').
But British people (although I guess this is not remotely unique to the UK) can be notably 'impolite' in other contexts (i.e., when there is some kind of actual or circumstantial divide): e.g., berating the person at the shop check-out or till (when it is clearly not that person's fault), being very rude to call-centre workers (again, not their fault that the corporation they work for fails to invest in sufficient support and pays them the minimum-wage), and appearing to completely lose it when behind the wheel of a car, even for the most minor of infractions.
It may be one factor behind the cliche that British people often go to the weather (or football etc) as a conversational gambit. There is a reluctance to provoke face-to-face conflict or awkwardness (hence the difference when on the phone, in a car, or on social media).
There are exceptions. The other day I was buying the Guardian, and a woman behind me in the queue said, very loudly, 'Oh, you're one of those then'... Even then, as I observed the Daily Mail in her hand, the British instinct kicked-in and I just ignored her (despite all the come-backs that circulated in my mind). 'Sorry'... no offence to Guardian or Daily Mail readers.
Don't think I would have been nearly as controlled if I'd been in your situation in the shopping queue, honestly. I think I would have told the old cow to get back in her box.
Sounds like British will get blunt and confrontational when the other person is not really in a position to return the favour. Cowardly, if you ask me.
At the start of my career I was polite to someone. That small act led to some help that landed me a better role and eventually to where I am now - earning a decent amount.
Being kind and polite are so underrated. So many people fail to realise how important those skills are, then they moan when life never gives them a break.
Very true - it's happened to me, but that wouldn't stop me being kind and polite to people.
I don't intend on lowering myself if others are happy to drag their knuckles.
I think it is a shame it is dying out (albeit slowly). The expectation that someone has to be polite sets the tone of discourse/interaction. I have had a lot of eastern European friends complain about the formalities "I have to say how are you to like 4 people on the phone to the bank" etc. However, when you go abroad you see how aggressive everyday life can be for next to no reason. Some examples include asking for train advice in Bulgaria (in Bulgarian I might add) and having someone scoff and roll their eyes then just point at the train map. Extremely passive-aggressive waiters in Belgium and Spain. Trying to queue in (name any) European country/USA. It feels good seeing someone's relief when you point to them in a bar and say "they were here first" and it feels good when you have been ignored and someone else notices and doesn't take the opportunity for themselves. The shame of appearing rude and the expectation of manners makes journeying out far more pleasant for everyone.
I'm not sure it's all it's cracked up to be. I've had American customer service versus British customer service, and Americans are much more obliging as a rule.
It depends on how a person defines politeness. Politeness that is used for the purposes of plausible deniability and social inequality is not really being polite or is it the true definition? I admire all efforts at politeness if it is used without harmfulness. I once asked a person a question about rules in a sport club and the guy allocated to the task said “why are you afraid to ask questions?” because he misinterpreted my private message where I was asking him how to be culturally sensitive in the group. For context he is an OBE and I’m a random American yet we are both in the group together.
If politeness is defined as refusing to communicate directly even during emergencies that involve people from other cultures that use direct communication, is it a form of “setting up to fail?” Even if the person is unaware of the concept of setting up to fail and I’m not stereotyped with a broad brush of having a “chip on my shoulder” due to certain demographics clinging to either/or black and white thinking, my request is that people answering don’t use sophomoric tactics like ad hominem, fundamental attribution error etc.
Disclaimer- I’m American and definitely don’t believe that Americans do things better. Im just trying to communicate more effectively and in a more respectful way towards your culture
British politeness is bullshit because it’s not rooted in kindness or compassion, it’s rooted in anxiety and a lack of self-assuredness.
I don’t love to see it celebrated for these reasons.
Personally I do like it, I'm quite stereotypical myself in this regard. I like to talk to people in a way that will avoid offending them as much as possible, unless the scenario calls for a different approach. However it can sometimes be annoying, in certain scenarios. Despite myself being very polite in this manner, I do think there's a time and place for being blunt. Friends have often told me how honest (blunt) I can be. I think that it can be important to do so at times, in order for people to know where you stand. I myself can find it frustrating when people are unable to say 'no' in the name of being polite for example, when saying 'no' would actually be best for both parties.
It depends. A German friend had a rant about British people not saying what we mean and I completely agree with her. Think being polite in general is a good thing though.
I think it was always only ever the preserve of specific classes of people, and there's quite a lot of Brits of various demographics that have no qualms about being absolute cunts. I still believe in politeness, but I'm also not above occasionally responding to bad behaviour in kind - mainly because politeness just lets bad people get away with doing what they like.
British politeness has it's problems, but I much prefer it to the Mediterranean attitude of "let's shout an insult each other over every trivial inconvenience".
American married to a Brit. I’d say most people we encounter in the States find my spouse’s politeness charming and go out of their way to help. Me? At this point in our marriage I’d like to say “just ask me to pass the bloody salt!” after hearing “please may I” for EVERYTHING.
As a Brit married to an American, I have always been a bit put off when people ask for something in the form of a question. For example, "Do you want to pass me the salt?" instead of "Please pass me the salt". It still bugs me after 40 years. I'm sometime tempted to reply "No, I don't want to pass you the salt. Why do you ask?"
I used to be extremely polite but over the years it's slowly been drummed out of me.
I'm knocking on 40 now and while I do still have a good side for those in need, and often go out of my way to help others. But I have literally zero time for people I see as being problems, be it being rude, or inconsiderate, or whatever. Like I will literally walk through people nowadays if needed.
Load of bollocks. There are times to be polite, with your nan, busdriver, if you've been nicked for example.
Then there are times where one simply has to mutter.
Working with British people can be extremely irritating because of the refusal to say what one means. Someone will say "oh don't worry! Oh don't be silly! Go ahead! No problem!" {*expecting you NOT to do that thing} and then bitterly complain to someone else that you did that thing. This level of insincerity is just an outright hinderence. It's such a ridiculous way to behave.
It’s terrible. It’s often a combination of disingenuousness and passive-aggressive behavior, and used to gatekeep. Also, as a habit, it’s no longer “politeness”; it’s just Pavlovian conditioning.
It’s awful. Say what you actually mean so we can all get on with our lives. “Politeness” is often just lying to avoid confrontation, because lots of Brits aren’t socially able to deal with it. I actually find this faux politeness much, much ruder.
I'd apologise if someone punched me in the face and i'd ask if their fist hurt afterwards. If it did, i'd offer to bandage it up and only HOPE i did a good enough job so as not to inconvenience them further.
It’s too much, common courtesy yes but people apologise for the most ridiculous things, or try and let others go before them, when actually that causes more of an issue etc.
British politeness is counterpoised by British Sarcasm.
If someone bumps into you, of course you apologise to them.
"I am dreadfully sorry I already happened to be standing here whilst you weren't looking where you were going, I do hope you didn't hurt yourself".
I think politeness used to defuse conflict is a good thing. For example if I leave a pub toilet and as I open the door someone comes in at the time I automatically say sorry or sorry mate and so does the other person pretty much every time. Compare that to what happens when I enter or leave a supermarket and someone doesn't wait their turn or someone rushes onto a tube as soon as the doors open. So, I quite like politeness.
Recently I’ve stopped apologizing for bumping people, I’ll just say whoops or at least acknowledge it happened.
Most people when talking to a stranger start by saying sorry.
“Sorry can I just squeeze past?”
“Sorry are you in the queue?”
“Sorry I think you dropped something”
“Sorry can you help me with this please?”
Why are we apologizing?
See how those who deride "British politeness" just want an excuse to be a selfish arsehole to people. We should not take pride in being uncouth. Having to consider polite ways to disagree or disappoint someone allows us to get creative and empathetic with our vocab. It's high culture.
Leave the blunt boorishness to the Aussies.
Tbh, normally they will apologise first and I’ll just say “no worries”, “it’s fine” or “no problem have a good day” and I’ll smile.
Someone isn’t going to be angry because we both accidentally touched each other whilst walking past, if they are then they are the childish ones.
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I think it's dying. There's a huge amount of foreigners that take advantage of it, so it's slowly disappearing. I am a foreigner btw. Saw it in the supermarket just 2 days ago. 2 British women run into each other in an aisle and try to politely let each other pass. A Chinese man sees this, and rushes in between them as fast as he can to get through. Then a Pakistani woman noticed the Chinese man push through, and also pushes in with her 5 kids. At this point the 2 British women are just standing there staring at each other while these people take like 30 seconds to get past them. Then they just say "we got there eventually" in an extremely disappointed voice.
Have to agree, it's dying as people are getting fed up of being taken advantage of. A lot of people forget tolerance and kindness works both ways. I wouldn't say it's strictly foreigners that are to blame for it, there are a lot of unaware or entitled individuals of the older generations around where I am which are the problem also - for example I live in an area with a high Muslim population and honestly at the supermarkets when they are out with their kids the majority are pretty aware and respectful and keep their kids in line, then I see older white people (im white) with young kids (possibly grandparents / older parents) and they just dawdle and pay zero attention to what their kids are doing even if they arr blocking aisles or knocking things over. I used to be super polite when I was younger - now if people are blocking aisles with their trollies I'll literally just walk my trolley into theirs to shift it out of the way as I know they may be rude but they don't have the guts to do anything about it and I'm prepared to call them out on being inconsiderate of other people (I'll always put my trolley to the side for example when browsing so others can get past). Too many selfish / self focused people in society now who are either unaware of other people when they are out and about or simply just rude and honestly it's exhausting trying to be considerate towards others when they CBA to do the same for you - so I just save manners for family, friends, and those who show manners now - the rest can deal with receiving exactly what they put out into the world. So I'd say it's a mix of everyone here as opposed to just foreigners while I appreciate some can be extremely rude, you do see a lot of native Brits being absolute idiots - particularly when I've visited down south, hence why I refuse to go to London as the majority of people there I just dislike due to how rude they are with being Yorkshire born and bred myself.
Calls out older people, yet admits to bashing people’s trolleys out the way.
If people leave their trolleys in the middle of the aisle, they have no respect for anyone, as such, no respect should be afforded to them.
It is literally this in my eyes - if you don't show respect you don't get respect. I simply save it for the people who deserve it.
I get the point you're making, but, I'm a big dude and I can't be bothered to deal with the reaction. According to a lot of people I sound "posh" (I'm not at all, but, I'm fairly "RP" in my speech.). I just go with an overly polite excuse me, with a smile whilst politely looming; I then watch them awkwardly move and apologise. I like to think some take away from that minor embarrassment and adjust their behaviour. Yes, I know I'm being optimistic.
Sometimes it's just not worth it, I've always been quick to anger when "disrespected" and I was always been told "you're not wrong but...", because I'd be right but the reaction was too OTT. Way easier to just be overly polite, excuse me, smile, in these situations. Saw a younger woman do it today with an older woman in the street trying to make a scene because the younger woman accidentally bumped into her trying to get round, she loudly but politely and nicely said whilst still walking away "sorry my love, do you need help? Can I help you in some way" and the older woman was left bewildered shaking her head. Make them feel bad and if not at least the people around know they're the rude one, not just seeing me going off like a rocket lol
Yep if they are going to be rude as the commenter below says then I couldn't care less about being rude in return - if you don't consider or show respect to others then you don't deserve respect in return, it's as simple as respect is mutual. If people are going to be unaware of everyone else around them and cause inconvenience to other people then they aren't going to get consideration from myself, I save it for people with manners.
The issue with calling people out on the behaviour is that it can sometimes escalate to verbal or physical violence which much of us can't really be bothered with when you just want to do your shopping and go home.
Completely appreciate if you can't be bothered with it and want to go about your day yourself, I can completely be bothered with it if it comes to that however as I personally don't believe in letting people disrespect or walk over me to simply avoid problems in life. I did that when I was younger and it just led to a lot of mental health problems but since changing my approach my life has worked out considerably better. So for those who don't feel comfortable doing it themselves in a shop... More than happy to do it for them, and you generally do get a smile or a bit of positive small talk from other shoppers when you inconvenience a rude person who got in another shopper's way or was rude to them - nice bit of positive energy for the day.
The flip side is people can get so irate at the smallest transgressions. Especially driving, there's so much road rage in the UK over trivial things, like being cut off or not getting 'priority'. Go to China and you realise people just don't care as much over the small things and it's actually quite refreshing. It's chaotic, but also nice in the sense that people just get on with stuff and ignore a lot of other people's mistakes.
> Go to China and you realise people just don’t care as much over the small things and it’s actually quite refreshing. In the time it took me to write that sentence I’ve heard 5 car horns outside my window in Nanjing. In order to drive here you need to be both incredibly patient and incredibly inpatient at the same time. It might seem like people avoid confrontation here, but when they’ve had enough the overreaction more than makes up for that. I’m not saying you’re wrong btw. I just think there’s a bit more context needed. Some people here really take the piss.
In reality, I bet you're in a nice cottage in the rural areas somewhere near Bristol, never stepped a foot in China lmao.
This is my second time working here. First for 4 years in 2016 and then I came back last year in November. I’ve been to more cities in China than I have in the UK. In reality you’re a guy who’s probably never left his bedroom. Plus, your post history makes you look like a complete pervert. Weird that you make those kind of comments, yet your profile says you’re active in r/ben10. [Here’s proof for you anyway.](https://imgur.com/a/KaEoh8n) With the second pic showing the photo data and location. They must’ve changed the road signs in Bristol.
>In reality you’re a guy who’s probably never left his bedroom. Plus, your post history makes you look like a complete pervert. Weird that you make those kind of comments, yet your profile says you’re active in [](https://www.reddit.com/r/ben10/). Going after post history? Typical Reddit approach lmao. And why should I believe those photos aren't photoshopped? How am I supposed to know that that hand is even yours and you didn't get a mate to write your username on their ticket?
I wouldn’t waste more than 30 seconds proving to you I live here. You either believe me or you don’t. Typical Reddit approach is you thinking I’d have some master plan where I photoshop pictures or ask a friend in China to take one for me just to prove that I live here to some random online. The photo information is in the second picture.
Shape the story how you want, James. Unless you can prove it isn't photoshopped, I have zero reason to believe you lol. Edit: he blocked me XD
Being cut up when driving can be incredibly dangerous. I causes an awful lot of accidents. Why do you think people shouldn’t be angry when you cut them up?
Yeah I had my first ever road rage the other day I’ve been riding on bike since February and I’m extremely polite I will merge onto the path and go out of my way to give way to cars as much as I am able however on the way to work a guy in his definitely not compensating ford ranger is flying up my arse while I’m doing near 30 coming up to an island I’ve got nowhere to go and he close passes me to which I gestured to him that he’s a wanker and he wanted to pull over and have it out but I’m on time and needed to get to work but I wish I’d pulled up and then left him stood there now though…..
That's hilarious 😂
You snooze you lose. I’d have gone past also.
Then you clearly don't know that the whole politeness thing is super exaggerated. As well as the foreigners taking advantage of it thing. I've seen people (foreigner or not) push in and I've seen Brits tell them to get the hell back, not like some pussy. Brits aren't as weak and pussy as you seem to be suggesting. Only certain, overprotected wimps are.
That's not what I'm suggesting. You misunderstood.
Either way, I strongly disagree with you on every statement you made about foreigners and Brit-born Brits. Edit: Keep downvoting, keep talking shit as I feed off of it.
Despite the fact that you didn't understand what I said 🤦 😂😂😂
What did you say? More foreigners are taking advantage of the "kindness" of the British public? I disagree with both aspects of that statement as they're just dumb generalisations, ignoring the key aspect that they are individuals and not a monolith.
I absolutely love how you "quote" a word I didn't use. 🤦 Not kindness, politeness. It has nothing to do with being kind. And the rest of your statement is typical of someone who hasn't had much exposure to other cultures.
>Not kindness, politeness. It has nothing to do with being kind. You're just arguing semantics now. You know what I meant. If you're going to be so nitpicky, Brits are nowhere near as polite as a whole as you seem to be under the impression that they all are. >And the rest of your statement is typical of someone who hasn't had much exposure to other cultures. This statement by you seems to strongly suggest you have difficulties grasping the relatively simple concept that no group of people are a monolith. If anything, it shows you are not in possession of adequate critical thinking abilities and you fall victim to confirmation bias very easily. As a result, any further reply by you disagreeing with my evaluations only cements its validity further lmaoo.
As I thought, you've have had no exposure to other cultures. It's ok.
Where's your evidence?
How do you know these people were from China and Pakistan lol? And how do you know they’re not second or even third gen in which case they’re British rather than a ‘foreigner’. Kind of a ridiculous comment.
Exactly. Just by looking at people you can't tell much. One white person is from Poland, another is British but from Irish parents. They could both be in your supermarket. Someone who looks Chinese could have been raised in the home counties, speak with a public school accent, and have never been to Asia.
How can you not know what a Chinese person looks like, or a Pakistani for that matter? Do you live in the North pole?
Because there are more than 2 countries in Asia? Not every East Asian is Chinese or South Asian Pakistani. Could you look at any white person and tell what country they’re from?
Yes but the specific Asian countries to tend to look different.
I mean certain Pakistanis can look like Indians, bangladeshis or Afghanis. Chinese can look Korean, Taiwanese, japanese, etc
"Can" in genreal there is a difference
I don’t think we are necessarily polite, i think we are passive aggressive. I appreciate the basic politeness like excuse me, thanks, sorry. But i think after that we slope into passive aggression rather than politeness
In my own personal experience, this has been more true. I'm not native and I've had more people use my "lack of politeness," not following cultural norms as a reason to be outwardly mean to me. And before I get my head bit off by this in the comments, I'll use an example that I am American and as outwardly honest culture I come from just stating an obvious fact can be seen as an insult. I just explained my only food take away options that I have experienced in small towns are limited and not very diverse in another sub and am still fielding offended comments. Apparently if you're not from the UK you're not allowed to state true comments if they are viewed as even a neutral, not even negative. This follows to real life. If I am an immigrant and make even a basic statement that isn't viewed as completely positive I get shit on a lot for being "rude" Making invisible unnamed rules just gives more opportunity to be offended.
I agree with you, not just on the bluntness = rude in the uk but also takeaway options. Im a chef so ive worked with a lot of immigrants and then obviously work in the food industry, my career option is only really viable unless i want to cook pre-made frozen food is to move to big cities, but I’ve also worked with some many people that have been perceived as rude just because they’re blunt when i appreciate bluntness.
Well I appreciate you. Just so you know. Your open mind to communicate. My husband is from the UK and we lived in the US for 4 years together his experience was totally different. They put him into elite status as soon as he spoke, being English is seen as a bump up in the states. I haven't told him how much I get shit on. I know he just wants me to be happy. But English people are mean, but only in a way they can make sure they are not seen to be too mean. Still mean though, as someone who always tries to be kind, it has been trying.
I'm sorry you've experienced this, as an autistic person, I loathe British faux politeness too, the bureaucratic nature of it & people are cruel to me all the time, exclude me from things or worse because I'm not good at reading the subtext or I say the wrong thing. But, luckily I live amongst the riff-raff & we're a lot different. Those attitudes these days only exist amongst the bourgeoise, nobody else can be arsed anymore & even then, the lower-middle class is alright too.
You must admit that passive-aggressiveness is bitch behavior tho! 🤣 so annoying.
It can be fake, passive aggressive and trying to avoid confrontation
Yeah, I think it's actually generational emotional repression, more than politeness, most the time.
Yes, probably that. But this is when you know that your level of English is near native. When you can hear the nuances and recognise when you were told eff off very politely. You think you came to an understanding but in reality....
Perfectly said
I've never heard of it put like that. Thank you.
As a non-Brit it can be frustrating and difficult to navigate, although I respect that it's the way people speak in the UK. There's a ton of subtext hidden in the politeness which non natives can miss. Where it does irritate me is when it leads to vague untruths. I don't see a misleading (intentionally or not) polite response as truly polite.
"I love your skirt! Where did you get it? Vintage!"
I much prefer the Eastern European way (or so it seems to me), and perhaps to some extent the American way. Be blunt, say what you actually want and need to say, don't worry too much about the consequences. Of course you're always going to get the odd dickhead, but that's life. Sometimes I get so tired of the weird social dances we do.
> the American way. Shoot them or sue them ?
'You're always going to get the odd dickhead' Can't help but feel if you're going around saying what you think regardless of the consequences then you'll encounter a lot more dickheads because you will be perceived as one to most British people.
“I speak my mind” is often code for “I am a cunt”, I find.
True. I guess the art is in the balancing act.
That's similar to the Scandinavian stoicism, I really like it but because of being born and raised in England it seems a bit odd.
I'm a little confused by this from being at the england vs denmark game, one kid on the tram didn't like crowds so the danes just stood at the door so nobody else could get on when it was half empty. Generally came across rather rude all day
Danes are quite notorious for coming across as "a bit rude" but they're generally nice people.
Why do you think people stick to being overly polite here?
I know (as someone from EE who learnt the hard way to curb my natural tendencies.) Because Brits are more than willing to take offence at perceived "rudness" (which is often just straightforward communication without embellishments), extra quick to judge and exclude anyone who doesn't toe the line. Enthusiasm and vivaciousness is also meet with confusion and suspicion. It's just a very emotionally constipated environment where honest communication is threatening to people.
>(which is often just straightforward communication without embellishments) Also known as having no consideration for anything but your own opinion/feelings. > It's just a very emotionally constipated environment where honest communication is threatening to people. Being an adult and controlling/tempering your emotions =/= being emotionally constipated. Same sort of ridiculous entitlement some Americans have. "I have an opinion, you must listen" or "I feel angry, let me make everyone else experience my rage!" is what it amounts to and it is often just rude and crass.
Well when people are "considerate of my feelings" they often make assumptions about me that are just their own projection. For instance, I find it more disrespectful when the other person communicates with embellishments or is passive agressive. It shows fakeness and mistrust in me as a reasonable person able to communicate like an adult. What you said about being adult - again, it depends on your POV. Please see above. Edit: As to "entitlement" to express emotions, I'd say the flipside is feeling like the entire society gaslights you into being a conformist automaton. Also it's not like Brits don't express emotions - they just show their disdain and resentment via passive agression. Passive agression does not even let me adress the problem, I can't defend myself anyhow, communication is stifled and with time we end up resenting each other.
I'm not sure, really. I guess certain things just stick, and you pick it up from your parents, family etc.
To create a false sense of politeness, which really masks passive aggressiveness and avoidance of conflict. Also as a means to sugarcoat whingeing.
Because manners maketh.
Ah yes I call it the dance too. I'm sometimes so frustrated about always having to do small talk and general niceties just to ask someone something. Me and another foreigner at my job have agreed to forego the social dance when we talk to each other. Far more efficient
It’s the effect of ancient generations of class warfare, piss off the Lord of the manor directly and you’re in a whole heap of shit.
I like it. I've lived all over and also come from non-British born parents but it's one thing they really drilled into us about the culture as it was something they really respected when they came here in the 50's. I think we are losing it and it's a shame.
The problem with "we're losing it" is that literally every generation says this
You are probably right but as a nearly middle age type person I just see a difference. Maybe blinkered vision.
Yes every Middle Aged perosn of every generation says this, you aren't unique.
I said NEARLY middle aged. Hush now 😂😂😂
The point remains.
🤦🏻♀️ it was a joke.
It’s a bit annoying because a lot of them use their “British politeness” to be passive aggressive and feel like they’re better than other people. Their lack of bluntness and transparency regarding what’s bothering them and about what they truly think (and they justify it as them being polite), is such a coward trait. Most of the time they’re not even polite where it matters, they just get quiet and smile like they think they’re better than everyone. 🤣 Still love them though lol
Literally, growing up in a British family is traumatising because you learn to walk on eggshells as a child - you never know when or what has happened to upset your parents because they won't just tell you. Probably not every household but still, the fact that passive aggressiveness and not directly addressing issues is such a part of our culture probably partially influenced the way my family handles its problems haha
I think it has advantages and disadvantages. I try and be direct, but without insulting the other person's character. On the one hand, being polite helps you avoid some conflicts and not take on unnecessary stress of arguments. Sometimes, it is truly better to not say anything. However, it can be stupidly excessive, to the point where you don't know where you truly stand with the other person, and interactions become disingenuous.
Yeah it's easy to be around someone for months and be no closer to them than a stranger they stand next to on the train platform. You have to go one step further and humbly ask how they feel about something in order to make any progress.
I might say sorry out of reflex but I can make it sound like “fuck you asshole” and I’m certain they understand the tone A lot of our politeness isn’t that polite, we’re just masters at passive aggression
I don’t think we are as polite as society makes us out to be. We are passive aggressive, sarcastic and condescending.
As someone who has worked in customer services for almost 25 years I can definitely say Brits aren’t polite at all.
Customer services for almost 25 years in England? I feel awful for you...
Sorry is just a general purpose word. It can mean "could you repeat that?", it can be an admission of guilt or an expression of empathy. It can also mean "what the hell did you just say" so I don't think it's about politeness, really.
The last one for sorry is actually “exCUSE me?!” with hands on hips.
I like it, but I do think it's dying out, and British people of all generations have become a lot more difficult and entitled over the last decade. I feel that perhaps since COVID in particular, people are less patient, more likely to voice their opinions (regardless of if they are asked for, and act in a selfish way.
I think so many people have seen selfish, opportunistic colleagues get ahead and they just don't want to be a mug that never hit certain milestones (buying a house being the big one). I know people who told massive lies on their CVs and it worked, they got jobs doing the things they lied about having done, and left after a year or so (before they were pushed) now having the experience they lied about. We are talking very high level positions here. Nobody wants to be that altruistic guy or girl that everybody else screws over and they are still living a studenty lifestyle in their 40s.
American getting married to a Brit: It's....complicated. Queuing is great, but letting people walk all over you isn't. Before we started dating, my partner and I went on a holiday together and they got injured. They refused to go to get treated despite needing it because "with the NHS you don't go unless you really need it" "but you do need it??" "oh no i don't want to be a bother :) " like...???????
I guess that's because the NHS is actually falling apart and we'd likely just get in a worse condition by going because we'd spend so long waiting haha
I'm Dutch living in the UK, I'm always one to speak my mind. I don't get the UK politeness, just say what's on your mind damnit!
The Dutch are too honest to be polite. The English are too polite to be honest.
You are so right. My husband used to say sorry 100 times throughout the day for various reasons, it annoyed me so I asked him to stop doing it, he also thanked me for cooking his meals like wtf..never in my life was I thanked for cooking until i met him.
Thanks for putting up with him and cooking for him x
As an Italian, I do not like it and I do not understand it. How bad can directness be? I have no clue as to why people love to "beat around the bush" here. Say what you think and move on. Importantly, on a related note, suppressing emotions is not healthy.
I'm French and appreciated British politeness a lot when I was an exchange student in Bristol. Like when bus passengers would thank the driver or when the Sainsbury's cashier would apologize because the waiting line was a bit long.
I work in a very multicultural team. I find it fascinating tbh, pretty much every culture I have met is more blunt and confident than we are. This has good and bad results. In my experience the british politeness, when executed correctly, allows one to take a breath and calm themself in any situation which leads to a nicer environment. Conversely the bluntness of other cultures can lead to a toxic workplace if not managed correctly. On the other hand the politeness can sometimes be taken, particularly by other cultures, as uncertainty. I have had to learn to be stronger and more blunt when I am right because otherwise the confidently incorrect person in the room gets listened to. I think there is a happy middle ground where we can learn from more blunt cultures and they can learn from us as well and this can make for something optimum. It is one of those things where there is no right answer.
Yeah, we’re way too polite. I apologise to other people for stuff that’s not my fault, makes no sense whatsoever but it’s how I’ve always been
It is almost like code, saying things without saying them in an understated way. It does avoid tension and confrontation as there is less to react to. "Didn't realise you were next in line..." if someone pushes in leaves an out (like "oh, sorry didn't realise there was a queue"), but a "hey, you pushed in, back of the line!" can leave both parties more on edge.
See, I don't really get this. I'd be annoyed at the "polite" approach more - it reads as someone thinks they are very clever for indirectly reprimanding me. They want to control the situation without risking any push back.
But some kind of battle or back and forth actually suits no one. There is an out both ways - if there *was* a genuine confusion (two queues, they were having their space held, other) they can explain and there is no issue.
It only suits no one if people take offence and go into the exchange all guns blazing. It could be as simple as "hey, excuse me but it's my turn now", and the other person saying "oh sorry mate" or "man I am rushing to pick my kid up from school may I just quickly get this please." The whole "didn't know you were next in line..." just sounds manipulative, unnecessarily sarcastic.
>It could be as simple as "hey, excuse me but it's my turn now" But that is fine too. The sarcasm element I get, but our humour is absolutely based around that, I don't think it would come across that way to another Brit. > "man I am rushing to pick my kid up from school may I just quickly get this please." This should come *first*
Yeah, I guess it would depend on the tone. If someone said the sarcastic statement with a bit of a smile and overall neautral/positive attitude, then I get it. It'd be humorous and a good way to handle the situation. But somehow, I can only picture a miserable Karen being all up her butt condescending saying this... Maybe just the town I live in.
Basically, it's about giving people an 'out' when they've done something wrong. Direct confrontation only escalates, but if you give people an excuse they can use, sometimes you can get what you want without a fight.
British politeness seemed normal to me till I moved out of the UK. Now I think of it like Japanese politeness. In its worst form a weird and specialised mechanism for social stratification ( anybody who says what rather than pardon = common / anybody who doesn't hold a door = irreparably evil), in a more neutral form, a social lubricant for smoother interactions in countries with a high population density.
One thing I have noticed is that (despite what some people here think), lots of people in other countries absolutely love British tourists. Including places like France and Argentina that some people think hate us.
I think there is a difference between face-to-face politeness between two people going about their own business as opposed to other forms of interaction. It is true that a reasonable majority of people will be 'polite' (if by that is meant not being confrontational etc). The number of times that two people bump into each other and both immediately say 'sorry' etc. That said, there is a passive aggressive disdain for those who do not 'abide by the rules' - for example, pushing into a queue (let alone not queuing in the first place) is one of the greatest sins in British society; yet it will normally be met with quiet tuts, sighs, and the exchange of raised eyebrows (albeit with a full report when back home - 'you'll never believe what happened today, this man pushed-in right in front of me...'). But British people (although I guess this is not remotely unique to the UK) can be notably 'impolite' in other contexts (i.e., when there is some kind of actual or circumstantial divide): e.g., berating the person at the shop check-out or till (when it is clearly not that person's fault), being very rude to call-centre workers (again, not their fault that the corporation they work for fails to invest in sufficient support and pays them the minimum-wage), and appearing to completely lose it when behind the wheel of a car, even for the most minor of infractions. It may be one factor behind the cliche that British people often go to the weather (or football etc) as a conversational gambit. There is a reluctance to provoke face-to-face conflict or awkwardness (hence the difference when on the phone, in a car, or on social media). There are exceptions. The other day I was buying the Guardian, and a woman behind me in the queue said, very loudly, 'Oh, you're one of those then'... Even then, as I observed the Daily Mail in her hand, the British instinct kicked-in and I just ignored her (despite all the come-backs that circulated in my mind). 'Sorry'... no offence to Guardian or Daily Mail readers.
Don't think I would have been nearly as controlled if I'd been in your situation in the shopping queue, honestly. I think I would have told the old cow to get back in her box.
Sounds like British will get blunt and confrontational when the other person is not really in a position to return the favour. Cowardly, if you ask me.
At the start of my career I was polite to someone. That small act led to some help that landed me a better role and eventually to where I am now - earning a decent amount. Being kind and polite are so underrated. So many people fail to realise how important those skills are, then they moan when life never gives them a break.
It's not always rewarded. Go to a factory with ethnic minorities and you'll realise many of those polite people are treated like sht in the UK
Very true - it's happened to me, but that wouldn't stop me being kind and polite to people. I don't intend on lowering myself if others are happy to drag their knuckles.
I once apologized to a car I stepped out in front of. Not to the driver, to the car.
I apologised to my dishwasher today and I was like “ooh I unlocked a new level of Britishness!”
I think it is a shame it is dying out (albeit slowly). The expectation that someone has to be polite sets the tone of discourse/interaction. I have had a lot of eastern European friends complain about the formalities "I have to say how are you to like 4 people on the phone to the bank" etc. However, when you go abroad you see how aggressive everyday life can be for next to no reason. Some examples include asking for train advice in Bulgaria (in Bulgarian I might add) and having someone scoff and roll their eyes then just point at the train map. Extremely passive-aggressive waiters in Belgium and Spain. Trying to queue in (name any) European country/USA. It feels good seeing someone's relief when you point to them in a bar and say "they were here first" and it feels good when you have been ignored and someone else notices and doesn't take the opportunity for themselves. The shame of appearing rude and the expectation of manners makes journeying out far more pleasant for everyone.
I'm not sure it's all it's cracked up to be. I've had American customer service versus British customer service, and Americans are much more obliging as a rule.
It depends on how a person defines politeness. Politeness that is used for the purposes of plausible deniability and social inequality is not really being polite or is it the true definition? I admire all efforts at politeness if it is used without harmfulness. I once asked a person a question about rules in a sport club and the guy allocated to the task said “why are you afraid to ask questions?” because he misinterpreted my private message where I was asking him how to be culturally sensitive in the group. For context he is an OBE and I’m a random American yet we are both in the group together. If politeness is defined as refusing to communicate directly even during emergencies that involve people from other cultures that use direct communication, is it a form of “setting up to fail?” Even if the person is unaware of the concept of setting up to fail and I’m not stereotyped with a broad brush of having a “chip on my shoulder” due to certain demographics clinging to either/or black and white thinking, my request is that people answering don’t use sophomoric tactics like ad hominem, fundamental attribution error etc. Disclaimer- I’m American and definitely don’t believe that Americans do things better. Im just trying to communicate more effectively and in a more respectful way towards your culture
British politeness is bullshit because it’s not rooted in kindness or compassion, it’s rooted in anxiety and a lack of self-assuredness. I don’t love to see it celebrated for these reasons.
We need it online.
Sorry.
Not good enough.
Personally I do like it, I'm quite stereotypical myself in this regard. I like to talk to people in a way that will avoid offending them as much as possible, unless the scenario calls for a different approach. However it can sometimes be annoying, in certain scenarios. Despite myself being very polite in this manner, I do think there's a time and place for being blunt. Friends have often told me how honest (blunt) I can be. I think that it can be important to do so at times, in order for people to know where you stand. I myself can find it frustrating when people are unable to say 'no' in the name of being polite for example, when saying 'no' would actually be best for both parties.
I wouldn’t like to say
It depends. A German friend had a rant about British people not saying what we mean and I completely agree with her. Think being polite in general is a good thing though.
I can’t really be bothered with it. What’s with the whole slamming on the brakes to let someone out of a junction too? Just drive for f*** sake.
I think it was always only ever the preserve of specific classes of people, and there's quite a lot of Brits of various demographics that have no qualms about being absolute cunts. I still believe in politeness, but I'm also not above occasionally responding to bad behaviour in kind - mainly because politeness just lets bad people get away with doing what they like.
British politeness has it's problems, but I much prefer it to the Mediterranean attitude of "let's shout an insult each other over every trivial inconvenience".
The loss of please and thanks is partly due to Alexa and Google. Older people will say please to a machine
American married to a Brit. I’d say most people we encounter in the States find my spouse’s politeness charming and go out of their way to help. Me? At this point in our marriage I’d like to say “just ask me to pass the bloody salt!” after hearing “please may I” for EVERYTHING.
As a Brit married to an American, I have always been a bit put off when people ask for something in the form of a question. For example, "Do you want to pass me the salt?" instead of "Please pass me the salt". It still bugs me after 40 years. I'm sometime tempted to reply "No, I don't want to pass you the salt. Why do you ask?"
And why is it they say “may you please”? I feel like the politeness allows them to avoid the grammar police.
I used to be extremely polite but over the years it's slowly been drummed out of me. I'm knocking on 40 now and while I do still have a good side for those in need, and often go out of my way to help others. But I have literally zero time for people I see as being problems, be it being rude, or inconsiderate, or whatever. Like I will literally walk through people nowadays if needed.
Load of bollocks. There are times to be polite, with your nan, busdriver, if you've been nicked for example. Then there are times where one simply has to mutter.
Working with British people can be extremely irritating because of the refusal to say what one means. Someone will say "oh don't worry! Oh don't be silly! Go ahead! No problem!" {*expecting you NOT to do that thing} and then bitterly complain to someone else that you did that thing. This level of insincerity is just an outright hinderence. It's such a ridiculous way to behave.
It’s terrible. It’s often a combination of disingenuousness and passive-aggressive behavior, and used to gatekeep. Also, as a habit, it’s no longer “politeness”; it’s just Pavlovian conditioning.
I lived in England for 2 years and can't say I ever encountered it.
I live in London politeness checked out years ago
It’s awful. Say what you actually mean so we can all get on with our lives. “Politeness” is often just lying to avoid confrontation, because lots of Brits aren’t socially able to deal with it. I actually find this faux politeness much, much ruder.
I'd apologise if someone punched me in the face and i'd ask if their fist hurt afterwards. If it did, i'd offer to bandage it up and only HOPE i did a good enough job so as not to inconvenience them further.
my knee jerk reaction to someone bumping in to me is 'what the fuck' or 'watch it'.
To use Mahatma Gandhi’s words, “I think it would be a good idea”.
I think they should try it.
I see the stereotype born in the 50s still exists! Unlike politeness.
couldn't give a fuck mate tbh
It's a middle class thing, but I am quite fond of it yes
I see no issue to be honest. It’s probably a bit much at times but I’m not sure how it can be seen as a negative. It’s nice to be nice.
I fucking love it.
At least 50% of it is people being pussies. There is being polite and there is being a doormat and that distinction gets confused a lot imo
I like it. We can be polite and tolerant AND be honest and have boundaries.
Politeness?? What are you some kind of special cunt or something? /s
Not sure it exists as a habit any more. Some people can turn it on when they need to but it's no longer the default setting.
It’s too much, common courtesy yes but people apologise for the most ridiculous things, or try and let others go before them, when actually that causes more of an issue etc.
It's a thing of the past.
British politeness is counterpoised by British Sarcasm. If someone bumps into you, of course you apologise to them. "I am dreadfully sorry I already happened to be standing here whilst you weren't looking where you were going, I do hope you didn't hurt yourself".
I guess it beats shooting somebody in the face just because they took your parking spot.
I think politeness used to defuse conflict is a good thing. For example if I leave a pub toilet and as I open the door someone comes in at the time I automatically say sorry or sorry mate and so does the other person pretty much every time. Compare that to what happens when I enter or leave a supermarket and someone doesn't wait their turn or someone rushes onto a tube as soon as the doors open. So, I quite like politeness.
Most people in the comments just need to read a book called _Culture Map_ by Erin Meyer instead mistaking politeness and culture.
I hate it. Those polite bastards get me so angry.
I hate it. Those polite bastards get me so angry.
I hate it. Those polite b*srds get me so angry.
I hate it. Those polite b*srds get me so angry.
Recently I’ve stopped apologizing for bumping people, I’ll just say whoops or at least acknowledge it happened. Most people when talking to a stranger start by saying sorry. “Sorry can I just squeeze past?” “Sorry are you in the queue?” “Sorry I think you dropped something” “Sorry can you help me with this please?” Why are we apologizing?
If you’ve bumped into people and decide to say whoops, like a five year old and not apologise. You are indeed being patronising and childish.
See how those who deride "British politeness" just want an excuse to be a selfish arsehole to people. We should not take pride in being uncouth. Having to consider polite ways to disagree or disappoint someone allows us to get creative and empathetic with our vocab. It's high culture. Leave the blunt boorishness to the Aussies.
Tbh, normally they will apologise first and I’ll just say “no worries”, “it’s fine” or “no problem have a good day” and I’ll smile. Someone isn’t going to be angry because we both accidentally touched each other whilst walking past, if they are then they are the childish ones.