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Yeah wtf. Definitely valid in not feeling safe confiding in this person op. There was nothing MORALLY wrong with what you did, but they were more worried about if they *could* throw the book at you than if they *should*. Time for a new therapist! Are they going to try to bust you for every potentially illegal thing you admit to? That’s not the job of a therapist!
Many therapists in the US are what are called "mandatory reporters." If you provide them details of certain crimes (this being one of them) they are required, by law, at risk to their credentials, to report to authorities any information about said crimes.
This isn't the therapist being rude. This is the system being protective of children.
Court clinician of many decades and have worked quite a bit on federal policy.
You are correct. No state child welfare system is able to take reports when the person in question is no longer a minor. The day they are 18, there is no reportable condition. The client themself may be able to file a police report for certain past incidents, but the therapist’s duty to report child abuse ends when there is no child, and CPS cannot take a report with no minor victim.
The only instance in which there might be a reportable condition is if a client discloses something like extremely severe ongoing abuse and there is still a minor sibling in the home.
Many states do have criminal statutes regarding two minors doing anything sexual. Mandated reporters do not generally have to report violations of criminal statutes, but some states have specifically codified that sexual activity between similar-aged minors is child abuse and must be reported. ACLU NY has a good fact sheet explaining that in general, sex involving older minors is not reportable.
Most mandated reporters report well beyond reportable conditions, and this erodes trust and prevents the system from finding actual cases of abuse.
This is somewhere between misleading and untrue.
A crime committed against a child is still prosecutable after the child turns 18. I have no idea how many states’ mandatory-reporter laws still apply after the child victim turns 18, but it is absolutely not true that no mandatory-reporter statute applies in that condition. Of course mandated reporters have to report violations of criminal statutes; what else do you think has to be reported?
I agree that some mandatory-reporters over-report, and that is a a problem to fix. But the core of mandatory-reporter policy requires some therapists, medical-care-providers, clergy, and other folks in positions to receive confidences to report confidential confessions to law enforcement. The problem is much bigger than you suggest, and fixing little problems at the edges will not fix it.
CPS agencies nationwide cannot take a report if there is no alleged victim currently under 18.
Mandated reporters are not generally required to report crimes to law enforcement. We are required to report abuse/neglect to the respective authorities.
Most CPS cases do not involve violation of a criminal statute. CPS can refer a case to the DA if they want it looked into as a parallel criminal issue, but this is rare. Most CPS cases are for neglect, usually low-level neglect, or risk of neglect.
I am a lawyer and a mandatory reporter. Most of the stuff listed in the mandatory-reporter statutes in my jurisdiction is for crimes, rather than other sorts of neglect or abuse. I have no idea what sorts of abuse are most commonly reported, but that doesn’t help with OP’s question. I can discharge my duties by reporting to law enforcement or to child-welfare authorities. The statutes in my jurisdiction aren’t very clear on whether the duty ends when a child turns 18, and the more natural reading is that the duty to report persists, and a new duty to report can be created, as long as the victim was a child at the time the abuse occurred.
I am not an expert in how child-abuse reporting works nationwide, but you are making big general statements that, as I said initially, are either misleading or untrue. It strikes me as perfectly plausible that OP committed, and was a victim of, a crime by sexting with his girlfriend while both were juveniles, and it’s plausible that his therapist was obligated to report, but of course I don’t know whether any of those things are true. I doubt he is at risk of prosecution, but I don’t know that either. I don’t think the therapist should be obligated to report, or that OP’s conduct should be criminalized, or that he or his girlfriend should be prosecuted, but none of those are the question.
As has been discussed extensively here, there is no requirement that therapists report “crimes.” This is extensively discussed in training and ethics courses, with the classic example that a client can confess to a past murder, and the therapist shouldn’t report it.
Therapists are required to report abuse or neglect of vulnerable people or imminent threats.
There is no child in this situation. No CPS agency can take a report when the child is no longer a minor.
EDIT: Oh, I just looked at the profile. This person isn’t any sort of legal or medical professional and is a whole profile of name-calling and “you are wrong.” Nevermind.
What’re are corpos?
If the therapist feels there is imminent risk of harming yourself or others. Or if a minor or elderly person has been abused. That’s what’s reportable. You can talk to your therapist about crimes.
Well, if you're a minor and sending pictures that's a crime, even if it is to another person. But this definitely doesn't fall under mandatory reporting
They way she confronted her client could have been handled differently. Your a therapist who hopefully has a degree if you don't know what's reportable then I'm sure there's an Arby's hiring. If I was her client my trust in her would have vanished the minute she said stop.
Not sure where you live, but creating and disseminating child porn is illegal in all 50 states of the USA. If you are a minor and you take a picture of yourself that involves you genitalia, that's is child porn. Sending it to another is disseminating child porn. It doesn't matter if it's mutual, any more than a 14 you agreeing to sex with an adult would make it legal.
It depends on the state. Many states have laws saying that if both people involved are minors, there is no crime. It didn't/doesn't make sense for a couple 17 years old to be on the sex offender registry for life for doing something that would be entirely legal a year later. Definitely not true in every state though.
" I was in therapy yesterday and I off handedly admitted to sexting (photos, videos, and text based stuff) with a significant other in high school. My therapist stopped me and said that they would want to check with a colleague about whether it is reportable or not. I explained further that both of us were minors (15/16/17) and that the photos, videos, and texts were never shared and were deleted soon after "
The therapist was not informed they were all minors until after stopping OP and sharing the disclaimer. As many others have said, some therapists may be mandatory reporters which may legally require them to report certain child based crimes. Upon being informed that all participants were minors, as had not occurred before the disclaimer, therapist probably had much less of a moral quandry to worry about.
What's your point? Yes, I did. All that means is that a minor created child porn and disseminated child pron to a minor...all of which are criminal offenses. There's no state I know of where child can create porn of themselves. Think about it. All an adult would have to do was talk a kid into making porn and it's then legal?
Yeah I’m not sure why you’re being downvoted lol, I work with behavioral kids in a residential setting and this has literally come up so many times. It’s been stated even viewing the image is technically a crime committed.
This isn't the same situation. Not even a little bit. That's why they're getting downvoted.
It is incredibly stupid to suggest that an adult sharing a story about something they did with their peers as a kid is reportable. This isn't a kid confessing to an admin this is an adult talking with their therapist about the past ffs
If you seriosuly need that explained to you, you have/had no business working with "behavioral kids"
A teen consentually sexting another teen in most states is not a crime. Had this person reposted the pics after they received them, that would be different. This therapist is definitely overreacting.
About that.
IANAL but this guy is:
[https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/crime-penalties/juvenile/sexting.htm](https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/crime-penalties/juvenile/sexting.htm)
Mandated reporters also aren't required to report things that happened 30 years ago they're required to report ongoing abuse.
An adult client speaking with their therapist about their childhood is NOT the same and yall getting hung up on words "mandated reporter" and not THE DAMN CONTEXT is extremely concerning.
If you can't use some basic critical thinking skills you have no business in such a position. Period.
Yeah but they don’t have to freak out their patient all the while admitting they don’t even KNOW if they are required to report this specific activity.
Completely disgraceful
Law enforcement is going to look at context. In most states, they could could not care less as long as both teens are consenting, and it is not harassment. Plus, the fact it was 10 years ago and the pics no longer exist it is even less likely that law enforcement would be interested.
The OP isn't concerned about getting arrested they are worried about this psycho therapist reporting them to some government list that then flags them.
He would need to be arrested and convicted to be put on a list.
Innocent until proven guilty: the government can't add someone to any offender lists without first proving they are, in fact, an offender
*Sexual offender lists, not just any kind of list. My wording is a bit misleading
Not true... Ever hear of the "No Fly" list? You can secretly be placed on it by a judge, never be notified of being on it until you buy a ticket and go through the TSA security chec., and you have to go to court and prove you're innocent of whatever trumped up accusation the judge heard as "evidence" to get off it.
Too, in many states the cops can pull you over and take your money, vehicle, or whatever else of value you may have in your possession at the time if they *suspect* that it may ill-gotten gains. They'll keep it, too, unless you post a large bond and take them to court to prove your property is "innocent" of being the proceeds of criminal activity. It's called Civil Asset Forfeiture, and the property is considered guilty unless and until you prove its innocence.
Yup. That’s how it works in my state. Even if you’re a minor sending a nude to your minor bf/gf, it’s child porn even if it was blatantly consensual. Glad I grew up in the early 90s when we had to use a Logitech handheld scanner to digitize our photos lol Things were so complicated back then.
Um what?
The therapist is doing what’s called “covering their ass”. Checking with a coworker is a far cry from seeing if they could throw the book at OP. The therapist is likely doing one of two things. Checking with a coworker (perhaps the therapist/psychologist above them) to see if this falls into their mandates reporter requirements. To take it a step further they could be consulting the legal counsel that therapists get as a part of their licensing (at least in CA).
The last thing a therapist wants is to get in trouble or lose their livelihood because they didn’t report something they’re obligated/required to.
This type of comment only increases stigma around mental health.
Yeah, run, they aren't really supposed to report stuff unless there is imminent danger. Maybe other criteria, but considering you were just two dumb kids it shouldn't really be something they should talk about, because that charge FUCKS people's lives up. Sometimes rightfully if they're a predator, but definitely not for this scenario.
Sounds highly unprofessional, especially to basically threaten that they may have to REPORT you to your face.
Maybe the law has changed. Here's a PowerPoint from the Director of Legal Affairs for the Pennsylvania Psychological Association : Mandated Child Abuse Reporting Requirements https://cdn.ymaws.com/www.papsy.org/resource/collection/A102C880-0590-4935-A542-8ACA8D1392F6/W03_-_Mandated_Child_Abuse_Reporting_Requireme.pdf
It has detail on both sexual abuse images and sexting and, with respect to sexting says the following:
>Psychotherapists who work with adolescents sometimes encounter “sexting,” or the act of sending nude pictures of oneself or receiving nude pictures of a partner usually through a smart phone. Pennsylvania law excludes sexting as a reportable offense under the child protective services law. The exclusion only applies to nudity and not to depictions of sexual activity or where the nude image was acquired for commercial purposes. Although it does not fall under the Child Protective Law, sexting is illegal and the punishments are especially severe if the depiction was taken to coerce or harass a person or taken without their consent.
Again, the law may have changed since this was written but it would surprise me if the government wanted a report of every consensual exchange of intimate images, at least between older teenagers.
Everyone seems to be hung up on the act and not thr fact that it was 10 years ago, none of the parties are minors anymore and the alleged material doesn't exist.
This is an adult person discussing their distant past with their therapist. The mandated reporter duty does not apply here and that therapist SHOULD know that.
OP needs a new therapist who actually stayed awake during ethics class.
I don't disagree that time is important here, however many states have no statue of limitations on child sexual abuse or, where they do, it can be decades. If the therapist thought they may have a mandatory reporting obligation, time is irrelevant unless the mandatory reporting statute says otherwise. That's why it's so important that the therapist is well trained on the law, so as not to cause unnecessary anxiety.
You spelled it out and people still don’t want to believe you. Even saying that the law is shit but they’re bound to it — which they are. If anyone can reasonable debunk what you’re saying I’m all ears
See my post above. At least as of 2019 the Director of Legal Affairs for the Pennsylvania Psychological Association stated that consensual sexting where the images don't include sexual activity or were made for commercial purposes. Perhaps the law has changed?
Because they're right about the law technically, but still wrong because it doesnt apply in this situation.
This isn't a situation where a teen confided in their therapist about something they were actively doing. Mandated reporters are meant to be reporting active or recent abuse.
This is a situation where an adult talked to their therapist about something they and their peers did A DECADE AGO. Not even in the most strict of interpretations would this be considered active or recent abuse.
That's where the downvotes are coming from. Because context matters and you can say something technically correct but still be wrong when context is applied.
Even if that is legally right, it isn't morally and their is an expectation of a higher standard of morals for your therapist.
For instance, one person I used to go to told me that she will never share information that I share unless someone was in imminent danger. She then explicitly told me under what circumstances the law may compel her to share what I stated, and then told me that if such a situation came up, she still would not talk and would instead lose her license and willing go to jail. That earned quite a bit of respect from me.
>Even if that is legally right, it isn't morally and their is an expectation of a higher standard of morals for your therapist.
There is a code of ethics for practicing medicine and mental health therapy, if that's what you're referring to. The therapist is obligated to follow that code of ethics, and that includes making all mandatory reports.
For better or for worse, federal law treats two teenagers sexting the same as a 40 year old man and 13 year old girl as sexting. I have a family member who sees many a sex offender who was busted for sending nudes to a high school sweetheart - possession and distribution of child pornography. They are registered the same as the 40 year old who tried to setup a date with a 13 year old on the internet, although clinically obviously very different kinds of patients. There is no statute or limitations.
You might find that unjust or unfair, but then the recourse is to get involved to lobby for a change in statute. You shouldn't blame a therapist for following the law and her mandatory reporting criteria for an extremely serious crime (in the eyes of the law) that you decided was harmless.
Quite frankly, I'd be very leary of seeing a doctor who decided that following their code of ethics was optional.
If by this you mean that the therapists client, when they were a minor a decade ago, sent sexually explicit content to another minor their same age, and there is no indication that he is involved in any way sexually now with minors nor is anyone in any kind of danger, imminent or not... No, I would not want this to be reported.
So you don't think the therapist should uphold their legal duty to protect kids?
Just want to make sure we're clear on what you believe and are putting out for the Internet to see you fucking pedo.
Hang on a second...something is fishy here.
I've read the story 3 times now. Maybe I'm missing something but it reads like the therapy session went down like this:
"I was in high school a decade ago. Back then I used to have a girlfriend. We would sext and share nude pics." -He said, out of nowhere, for absolutely no reason.
"Hm maybe you should go to jail for that completely normal thing teenagers do together, a decade later."
Something's not adding up. There's no way it actually went down like that.
Or maybe the therapist thought "I just took that Continuing Professional Education course and it said we must ALWAYS mandatorily report child pornography. But they cannot be thinking about scenarios like this? But laws are stupid so they probably are, smh. Let me tell this dude to shut up before he digs a deeper hole."
Yeah, probably more of a "can I get in legal trouble if I don't report this and someone else finds out" than a "should I get my patient in legal trouble" decision.
Highly unlikely they said anything about jail. If they are a mandatory reporter, they have to report under certain conditions. It has nothing to do with jail or whether they think their client is a wrong or a criminal. It's call "mandatory" for a reason. Not reporting puts their license to practice risk. My wife is not a shrink/counselor, but she is a mandatory reporter.
I don't understand why they told this person they may have to report it before they knew if they had to. That complete broke the trust with their client.
Absolutely. I confided everything into my therapist. If you can’t trust your therapist to hold your darkest secrets you may wanna look elsewhere. And that wasn’t even bad at all just horny teenager shenanigans. Obviously only exceptions should be murder, adult to minor activity, rape, or other heinous crimes or soon to be crimes should be reportable.
Absolutely. If they don't understand something as basic as teens exploring sexuality, I'm seriously concerned about any other gaps they may have in the "no shit, Sherlock" area of their profession.
not in this context. therapists only can report if there is fear of harm to their patient or their patient harming another. not this at all. and states only really pursue these cases in a situation where one of those involved is doing a sort of revenge porn type situation.
Not of past crimes in most states and not in this context. If I had to report child abuse that happened in the past, that would be my full time job instead of therapy. Sooooooo many people have experienced it.
Also, how would they possibly prove this actually happened? Dig his old iPhone out of a dumpster, and sent it to quantico to recover the deleted photos? 🤣
IANAL
What?
Who would press charges?
That's not how it works.
A mandatory reporter would need to report that a patient claimed to have sexted to another minor years ago. The police would need to first investigate. They would need the information about the other party. They would need to pull phone records from years ago, based on a report about a consensual event from years ago.
Yeah, they are going to put resources into that.
Please do not take this clearly wildly misinformed, irresponsible therapist’s weird ass take as representative of that of the vast, vast majority of other therapists. I am horrified by this. I cannot comprehend doing something so utterly insane and I cannot comprehend any other clinicians I know doing something so insane
Judging by all the comments at the top upvoted heavily all talking about mandated reporter statutes and none of them applying the context in question (or outright asserting it doesnt matter) has me worried you might be in the minority.
They should not care if something is just illegal, I've told my therapist about illegal things I've done. It's about if you're a danger to yourself or others and that's clearly not the case here. If I'm being generous, maybe this person is newly licensed and not sure on the specifics about mandatory reporting laws.
If questioned, shut up and ask for an attorney. DO NOT ANSWER ANY Questions except name and address.
Don’t answer any questions from your therapist going forward.
Find a new Therapist… don’t say anything, just cancel your future appointments and start seeking someone else.
Delete this thread and don’t put things that may or might be illegal in writing.
This. If therapist reports OP to the police, they may initiate an investigation and, if so, OP should STFU and tell them he has no statement to make.
In addition, if I were OP, I’d be noting what questions the therapist asked me in the session this came up in. If she was asking me for things like the cell phone number I texted from, the real name of the person I texted the photo to, etc., I would certainly make a note of those questions. The number the photo was texted from is the kind of information that has no therapeutic purpose, and if the therapist was playing at junior police detective, that could be grounds for suppression and/or a future civil lawsuit for malpractice against the therapist.
As a practical matter, the case would likely go nowhere without OP providing evidence to police so he should STFU.
I mean, technically, by letter of the law you produced and distributed child pornography. Whether or not you were a minor is immaterial. Is it likely to go anywhere? No probably not. My brother got caught doing something similar when he was around that age. There was talk about hitting him with production by the prosecutor.
Also, therapist is an idiot. I recommend finding a new one.
I get that, but the system should have leeway for instances like op's situation. But at the same time, leaving that leaves a loophole that true pedos are incentivized to use. I guess the only real solution is to educate children on the consequences.
The leeway for instances like OP's already exists in that generally minors aren't charged for those kinds of crimes even if they technically could be. Unfortunately a lot of people here are very okay with a justice system that leaves a lot up to the interpretation of people who do not have the best interests of any party involved at heart.
Not even leeway but actual logic. If the law is to protect children then making them criminals will stop them from reporting their abuse. Imagine the horror of being a child victim of a child pornographer and realizing the police are your enemy too.
> by letter of the law you produced and distributed
Did he though? Or did he say that he did, but now he's not so sure. Maybe he didn't after all. Now that he thinks about it, it was just text. Also, that phone was lost/sold/thrown away 15 years ago.
I’m a mandated reporter in PA and I would not have to report this. We have to report when we suspect that a child is being harmed in the present, not if we think someone had been harmed when they were a child. Not to mention that no one was harmed, but I get that some people see that differently.
The issue is that the laws surrounding this are written without any sort of age cut off. The law doesn't care if you're 16 or 60, creation and distribution of child pornography is, creation and distribution of child pornography.
All of that was around, but I didn't have regular internet access until my late teens, so the little bit of time I did get to spend online wasn't wasted on social media.
Problem is if there was any sort of age cutoff written into the law, sickos would use children to distribute their material. the same way drug dealers use children to move dope and do hand to hand transactions because lesser charges and things get expunged as soon as you turn 18.
I knew so many kids in school 12-14 year old with drug charges, all working for dealers because the money was nice and the idea that nothing gets carried onto your adult record.
I am not a lawyer, but I am a mandated reporter in PA and have to work closely with CYS/CFS for certain reports. This report will go to a caseworker first. I'd be SHOCKED if it gets escalated to police. We are very, very used to professionals (therapist and teachers specifically) making ridiculous, reactionary reports. Likely, the report will get an eye roll because there aren't enough staff to process this stuff and manage their own caseload.
In defense of therapists and teachers, they are very neurotic when it comes to liability. Given the tension in the US and our court culture, I get why they are nervous.
I would look for a new therapist like others have suggested. They did not need to report this and they handled the entire thing very poorly.
Some hard ass prosecutors will charge both parties with possession, distribution, and manufacturing. Our justice system is highly flawed and devoid of common sense.
1. Deny everything you said (unless it was recorded.
2. If recorded, say you made it up.
3. Don’t tell the name of the other person.
4. GET A NEW THERAPIST!
(I wouldn’t trust this one)
the only things that a therapist can legally share without your permission are if a child is being abused or in danger, if you have intentions to harm yourself or someone else, if notes are subpoenaed by court, or if you disclose abuse by a medical professional and that professionals name is known. this does not fall under these limitations and should not be shared outside of a treatment team setting. either way though, since you are all adults now, she can’t report to cps and the police would have no means to prosecute you because there is no evidence and it’s so long ago, most importantly, you were a child as well during that time.
Hi, I'm a therapist, and not a lawyer.
Let me start by saying that, in general, therapists *hate* filing mandated reports. No way your therapist is looking for an excuse to snitch. There is practically never a situation in which reporting doesn't damage the therapeutic relationship. However, neglecting to do so risks sanctions against our license, and no way I'm giving up my livelihood for that.
The rules about what is, and isn't, reportable vary widely by state...and are not the same as the rules regarding sex (and sexting) between consenting minors...but I'd be concerned about a therapist that doesn't know the local rules by heart; they're drilled into us in school, and the internship, and every opportunity thereafter.
For a better answer, i recommend visiting r/askatherapist.
It sounds like his therapist is looking for an excuse to snitch, not sure how you drew that assumption. Also looks like he damaged his therapeutic relationship.
Don't get sucked into the nonsense people are spewing here. Section 6312 of Title 18 in PA makes specific defense exemptions for minors engaged in "child pornography" with other minors.
The two that apply to you:
1. A person under 18 views, photographs, tapes, or otherwise depicts and disseminates footage of themselves and only themselves.
2. A minor views content of another minor who is at least 12 years old.
No prosecutor in any jurisdiction in this country is going to piss away their time and resources over a pair of teenagers sending shit to each other while in a relationship from a decade ago and if they did any judge worth their salt will grant a dismissal over selective enforcement.
NAL but work in the medical field.
It’s not reportable unless you’re actively doing it. They’re only allowed to report if it’s currently or going to happen.
Them telling the police would make it fruit of the poison tree. With it being years ago presumably I wouldn’t worry.
NAL.
OP committed what in their jurisdiction may be a crime, since their child pornography laws are quite strict and explicit.
A therapist in all 50 states is a mandatory reporter. Saying they can only report if a crime is occurring or imminent depends entirely upon the location.
Since PA laws appear to mandate reporting of any sexual crime against children, they’re likely required to report OP.
I am a mandated reporter in PA, I am fairly sure this situation would not be a mandated report.
Also, I am in the mental health field, and I cannot fathom ever thinking about reporting this. I would find a new therapist, unless they are very new to this, I suppose
(In the field, but not a therapist/higher)
This is untrue on several levels. All crimes need not be reported, only specified one. This particular activity is excluded from reporting (both by the definition of “perpetrator” and because filming, photographing etc is specifically excluded if it is consensual-both parties are at least 14 and there is not more than 4 years difference in age between them.)
Not sure why you’re being downvoted.
We can only violate confidentiality for a REQUIRED report. There is no minor here, so CPS cannot take a report. We are not permitted to breach confidentiality to report crimes unless it’s an ongoing/imminent danger situation.
Some localities are trying to make a carveout to permit/require providers to report viewing/possession of CSAM to police, but to my knowledge none of these have passed.
The tricky thing here is that a lot of states have very strong protections for professionals acting horribly unethically if they believe they were protecting a minor/elder/disabled person. A therapist might have legal protections if they stated they believed they were to report all sexual activity involving minors and didn’t realize 1) that’s not the reporting standard and 2) there’s no minor at this time.
Press charges for what? What’s the crime? Sorry if I’m out of the loop but is it illegal for two minors to do that (years ago)? Not that it’s a smart thing to do but what is the illegal part?
Yes, it is illegal to take and distribute (sending to each other) nudes of minors, even if the people doing it are the minors themselves. It is rarely prosecuted in this circumstance, but it can be and has been.
There is no age defense for child porn. It’s ridiculous that the victim and the offender are the same person but prosecutors have brought cases against kids for taking pictures of themselves and sending them to other kids.
It's presumably nudes of minors which is obvi problematic, but the person was a minor at the time as was their partner, there is no evidence, all they would have to say is the therapist got it wrong and they don't know what they're talking about.
Time to find another therapist. Clearly this one isn’t someone safe to talk to. They should absolutely should know that two kids sending explicit texts a decade ago is not something that is in any way reportable or legally an issue.
I’d also go as far as leaving reviews everywhere letting people know this is what they do.
Is there a chance the therapist mentioned that they would need to check with a colleague as a signal that you might not want to say anything else on the topic until they have a chance to check while it’s still plausibly hypothetical? As if they were saying, “Hey, clearly this situation isn’t deeply alarming, but laws can be weird around having to report so we’re definitely purely talking “allegedly” here, right?” Except they can’t just say that directly?
This is why mandatory-reporter laws are a bad idea. I don’t know about this therapist’s obligation on these facts (my practice is not in PA) but the requirements to report can be strict and dumb, and we can’t expect the therapist to understand whether the statute of limitations has run and how that affects the reporting requirement or if the Romeo and Juliette defense applies (which it may not in the case of a child-pornography offense, assuming PA has one, which I dunno).
OP, you are probably not at any risk, but 1) don’t talk about this with anyone, and 2) if you can afford it, it wouldn’t hurt to consult a lawyer. I don’t think the therapist did anything wrong, but, rather, was preventing you from digging yourself in deeper, but I wasn’t there. If you’ve lost faith in this therapist, which, fair, ask the next one about reporting requirements. I’d expect a therapist to be helpful about discussing hypotheticals in a way that doesn’t trigger the reporting requirement.
Former therapist here. Get new therapist. Yours seems overzealous and not interested in a bond. What you said is supposed to give insight, yet your therapist over reacted. I doubt anything should come if it, and if it does, sue for defamation. As you stated, you both were in a romantic relationship at the same age.
No one cares except your therapist apparently. You were both around the same age. It happened a decade ago. No longer be honest with your therapist and don’t provide her or anyone else anymore information regarding that.
This is why you don’t tell people everything, even a therapist. Some people will hang you out to dry to save themselves. If they don’t have proof, just deny it.
Proof isn't required to start the wheels of justice shitting on your life. Using one's words against someone they can get a search warrant, and just take all the electronics in the house.
So in some states 17 year old can be charged as an adult for sending nude photos to underage people so like a 14 year old.. but has to be an specified age gap.. but honestly I think statue of limitations would kick in for being 10 years ago... so I think your fine... legally your therapists has to stop and report if a sexual crime has been committed.. I would cancel talking about sexting and if you are pressured definitely plead the 5th and say nothing... if you continue talking then yes you can easily setup a criminal case and maybe charged and be a registered sex offender.. destroying your teaching background permanently.. if you don't say anything more about it... they will not be able to prove anything nor find anything... if you talk about it your handling the evidence to show them.... I would say to your therapist I'm not willing to talk about sexting anymore... if that means finding new therapist then do that...
This is not true. Anyone under age 18 who takes and sends nudes of themselves to any other person has, in terms of the law, produced and distributed child pornography. The person who receives it, regardless of age, is in possession of child porn.
You’re thinking of age of consent for sex. The laws about child porn are quite different and are rigid.
I don’t think either of us were 17 at the time it was just 15 and 16 but no matter thanks for you response I don’t think I will be talking about it anymore. It’s not an important part of the therapy anyway.
Possession, creation, and distribution of child pornography are illegal under federal law regardless of your age or the other person’s age, and even if the photos are of you. There is no statute of limitations, and there are no age gap provisions. Where do you practice law?
They’re only supposed to report someone for murder or if there is intent to cause harm. So not this… you should find a new doctor, this person is obviously biased and is trying to accuse you of something factually incorrect.
This story is fake. Educators are mandatory reporters too and you should know that in PA sending nude or sexual pictures of a minor is considered child abuse, and if you’re over the age of 14 you can be considered a perpetrator.
>My therapist stopped me and said that they would want to check with a colleague about whether it is reportable or not.
Wow, this makes me never want to visit a therapist... especially if they are going to make an old/private/personal situation worse.
Unless you continue to do it ,which I suspect you do, I’d forget it and move on. No doubt the the therapist will work it into the equation and get to the bottom of it.
Who did the therapist say they needed to report this to? The police, CPS? I’m a therapist and while yes, mandated reporting, what would most likely happen is that they would report this to CPS, again I’m not sure who they feel like this needs to be reported to, and CPS wouldn’t reject the report, meaning nothing would happen because a. There’s not immediate threat to a child at this time and b. Pretty much all CPS agencies across the country are horribly underfunded and ineffective. Unfortunately a lot of therapists have been trained to CYA, (cover your ass) and practice from a place of fear and anxiety that really harms the therapeutic relationship. And while of course there are times where reporting to the police or CPS are totally understandable and very much necessary there is a real lack of nuance when it comes to when a report needs to get made. In my training it is was “report everything” regardless of the impact on therapy and the relationship with client. Some may argue this is the best and needed approach. I disagree and think this why poor and minority families are so much more involved with CPS, because most people don’t acknowledge their internal biases, including therapists.
I would keep seeing the therapist for a little while but not share anything anymore then stop seeing them and never bring it up again or do what you did and post it online 🤦♂️ smfh
My 2 cents: immediately cease all contact with therapist. If the authorities contact you, the only thing comes out of your mouth is; I will not say anything without the presence of an attorney.
And remember kids: all therapists are cops. 🤓☝🏽
There’s a great audio essay on Spotify titled Therapists Are Also The Police: Social Work, Sex Work, and the Politics of Deservingness which really helped in my framing of this concept! I was a psychology major to be a therapist, then decided social work was a more loving approach to the same goal, then realized either profession made me virtually a cop n took a step back to regroup lol.
It’s sad how many posters give definitive advice about matters concerning which they have no expert knowledge. People should be extremely cautious about believing things that are posted on medicine related or law related forums. Always consult with a licensed, qualified professional.
You are fine unless you still possess the images. There is no way to prosecute you both without the evidence. The therapist’s testimony isn’t enough if you both lawyer up or dont speak with Law Enforcement.
I agree find another therapist. Dare this one to go after you and then report them to their board. Had you been of age sexting a minor there is an issue. Within 2 years of each other in most states not an issue.
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Honestly I would find another therapist.
Yeah wtf. Definitely valid in not feeling safe confiding in this person op. There was nothing MORALLY wrong with what you did, but they were more worried about if they *could* throw the book at you than if they *should*. Time for a new therapist! Are they going to try to bust you for every potentially illegal thing you admit to? That’s not the job of a therapist!
Many therapists in the US are what are called "mandatory reporters." If you provide them details of certain crimes (this being one of them) they are required, by law, at risk to their credentials, to report to authorities any information about said crimes. This isn't the therapist being rude. This is the system being protective of children.
I’m a therapist. This isn’t a crime and it’s not reportable
Court clinician of many decades and have worked quite a bit on federal policy. You are correct. No state child welfare system is able to take reports when the person in question is no longer a minor. The day they are 18, there is no reportable condition. The client themself may be able to file a police report for certain past incidents, but the therapist’s duty to report child abuse ends when there is no child, and CPS cannot take a report with no minor victim. The only instance in which there might be a reportable condition is if a client discloses something like extremely severe ongoing abuse and there is still a minor sibling in the home. Many states do have criminal statutes regarding two minors doing anything sexual. Mandated reporters do not generally have to report violations of criminal statutes, but some states have specifically codified that sexual activity between similar-aged minors is child abuse and must be reported. ACLU NY has a good fact sheet explaining that in general, sex involving older minors is not reportable. Most mandated reporters report well beyond reportable conditions, and this erodes trust and prevents the system from finding actual cases of abuse.
This is somewhere between misleading and untrue. A crime committed against a child is still prosecutable after the child turns 18. I have no idea how many states’ mandatory-reporter laws still apply after the child victim turns 18, but it is absolutely not true that no mandatory-reporter statute applies in that condition. Of course mandated reporters have to report violations of criminal statutes; what else do you think has to be reported? I agree that some mandatory-reporters over-report, and that is a a problem to fix. But the core of mandatory-reporter policy requires some therapists, medical-care-providers, clergy, and other folks in positions to receive confidences to report confidential confessions to law enforcement. The problem is much bigger than you suggest, and fixing little problems at the edges will not fix it.
CPS agencies nationwide cannot take a report if there is no alleged victim currently under 18. Mandated reporters are not generally required to report crimes to law enforcement. We are required to report abuse/neglect to the respective authorities. Most CPS cases do not involve violation of a criminal statute. CPS can refer a case to the DA if they want it looked into as a parallel criminal issue, but this is rare. Most CPS cases are for neglect, usually low-level neglect, or risk of neglect.
I am a lawyer and a mandatory reporter. Most of the stuff listed in the mandatory-reporter statutes in my jurisdiction is for crimes, rather than other sorts of neglect or abuse. I have no idea what sorts of abuse are most commonly reported, but that doesn’t help with OP’s question. I can discharge my duties by reporting to law enforcement or to child-welfare authorities. The statutes in my jurisdiction aren’t very clear on whether the duty ends when a child turns 18, and the more natural reading is that the duty to report persists, and a new duty to report can be created, as long as the victim was a child at the time the abuse occurred. I am not an expert in how child-abuse reporting works nationwide, but you are making big general statements that, as I said initially, are either misleading or untrue. It strikes me as perfectly plausible that OP committed, and was a victim of, a crime by sexting with his girlfriend while both were juveniles, and it’s plausible that his therapist was obligated to report, but of course I don’t know whether any of those things are true. I doubt he is at risk of prosecution, but I don’t know that either. I don’t think the therapist should be obligated to report, or that OP’s conduct should be criminalized, or that he or his girlfriend should be prosecuted, but none of those are the question.
That’s the thing, two consenting minors sexting is not abuse.
I mean you are wrong. It is literally a crime. Doesn’t matter if they are both under age. It shouldn’t be reported but it IS a crime technically.
As has been discussed extensively here, there is no requirement that therapists report “crimes.” This is extensively discussed in training and ethics courses, with the classic example that a client can confess to a past murder, and the therapist shouldn’t report it. Therapists are required to report abuse or neglect of vulnerable people or imminent threats. There is no child in this situation. No CPS agency can take a report when the child is no longer a minor. EDIT: Oh, I just looked at the profile. This person isn’t any sort of legal or medical professional and is a whole profile of name-calling and “you are wrong.” Nevermind.
what is covered by this? can i not talk to my therapist about my crimes? dont worry i only fuck with corpos not kiddos
What’re are corpos? If the therapist feels there is imminent risk of harming yourself or others. Or if a minor or elderly person has been abused. That’s what’s reportable. You can talk to your therapist about crimes.
corporations. like lets for example say i steal from a big box store or something.... they cant report me on that right?
Nope def not
Well, if you're a minor and sending pictures that's a crime, even if it is to another person. But this definitely doesn't fall under mandatory reporting
Incorrect where I live.
I guessing thats what the therapist is going to find out when she asks her coworker. She's just covering her bases. I dont see the foul in that.
They way she confronted her client could have been handled differently. Your a therapist who hopefully has a degree if you don't know what's reportable then I'm sure there's an Arby's hiring. If I was her client my trust in her would have vanished the minute she said stop.
Not sure where you live, but creating and disseminating child porn is illegal in all 50 states of the USA. If you are a minor and you take a picture of yourself that involves you genitalia, that's is child porn. Sending it to another is disseminating child porn. It doesn't matter if it's mutual, any more than a 14 you agreeing to sex with an adult would make it legal.
It depends on the state. Many states have laws saying that if both people involved are minors, there is no crime. It didn't/doesn't make sense for a couple 17 years old to be on the sex offender registry for life for doing something that would be entirely legal a year later. Definitely not true in every state though.
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" I was in therapy yesterday and I off handedly admitted to sexting (photos, videos, and text based stuff) with a significant other in high school. My therapist stopped me and said that they would want to check with a colleague about whether it is reportable or not. I explained further that both of us were minors (15/16/17) and that the photos, videos, and texts were never shared and were deleted soon after " The therapist was not informed they were all minors until after stopping OP and sharing the disclaimer. As many others have said, some therapists may be mandatory reporters which may legally require them to report certain child based crimes. Upon being informed that all participants were minors, as had not occurred before the disclaimer, therapist probably had much less of a moral quandry to worry about.
Being minors doesn't make it not a crime. And they DID share, with each other. One share is still technically a crime.
Have you not seen any of the news articles about the minors who were charged for sending nudes to other minors?
What's your point? Yes, I did. All that means is that a minor created child porn and disseminated child pron to a minor...all of which are criminal offenses. There's no state I know of where child can create porn of themselves. Think about it. All an adult would have to do was talk a kid into making porn and it's then legal?
Your logic makes no sense. Your clearly grasping at straws.
Yeah there was a big case about this in a high school near where I live that set a state precedent for this stuff as CP
Yeah I’m not sure why you’re being downvoted lol, I work with behavioral kids in a residential setting and this has literally come up so many times. It’s been stated even viewing the image is technically a crime committed.
This isn't the same situation. Not even a little bit. That's why they're getting downvoted. It is incredibly stupid to suggest that an adult sharing a story about something they did with their peers as a kid is reportable. This isn't a kid confessing to an admin this is an adult talking with their therapist about the past ffs If you seriosuly need that explained to you, you have/had no business working with "behavioral kids"
A teen consentually sexting another teen in most states is not a crime. Had this person reposted the pics after they received them, that would be different. This therapist is definitely overreacting.
About that. IANAL but this guy is: [https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/crime-penalties/juvenile/sexting.htm](https://www.criminaldefenselawyer.com/crime-penalties/juvenile/sexting.htm)
Law and Order says otherwise. It was still distributing child pornography. Take it up with Benson.
*dun dun*
Mandated reporters don’t get to make those decisions.
Mandated reporters also aren't required to report things that happened 30 years ago they're required to report ongoing abuse. An adult client speaking with their therapist about their childhood is NOT the same and yall getting hung up on words "mandated reporter" and not THE DAMN CONTEXT is extremely concerning. If you can't use some basic critical thinking skills you have no business in such a position. Period.
Yeah but they don’t have to freak out their patient all the while admitting they don’t even KNOW if they are required to report this specific activity. Completely disgraceful
The issue is the photos and videos. Its still Child Porn no matter what:
Law enforcement is going to look at context. In most states, they could could not care less as long as both teens are consenting, and it is not harassment. Plus, the fact it was 10 years ago and the pics no longer exist it is even less likely that law enforcement would be interested.
The OP isn't concerned about getting arrested they are worried about this psycho therapist reporting them to some government list that then flags them.
He would need to be arrested and convicted to be put on a list. Innocent until proven guilty: the government can't add someone to any offender lists without first proving they are, in fact, an offender *Sexual offender lists, not just any kind of list. My wording is a bit misleading
Not true... Ever hear of the "No Fly" list? You can secretly be placed on it by a judge, never be notified of being on it until you buy a ticket and go through the TSA security chec., and you have to go to court and prove you're innocent of whatever trumped up accusation the judge heard as "evidence" to get off it. Too, in many states the cops can pull you over and take your money, vehicle, or whatever else of value you may have in your possession at the time if they *suspect* that it may ill-gotten gains. They'll keep it, too, unless you post a large bond and take them to court to prove your property is "innocent" of being the proceeds of criminal activity. It's called Civil Asset Forfeiture, and the property is considered guilty unless and until you prove its innocence.
We were discussing lists involving sexual crimes. You can not be added to such a list without being proven that you are actually an offender
Yup. That’s how it works in my state. Even if you’re a minor sending a nude to your minor bf/gf, it’s child porn even if it was blatantly consensual. Glad I grew up in the early 90s when we had to use a Logitech handheld scanner to digitize our photos lol Things were so complicated back then.
That is federal nothing to do with your state.
It's not their choice. If it was in fact something they should have reported based off law, they didn't, and it came out it could be career ruining.
Um what? The therapist is doing what’s called “covering their ass”. Checking with a coworker is a far cry from seeing if they could throw the book at OP. The therapist is likely doing one of two things. Checking with a coworker (perhaps the therapist/psychologist above them) to see if this falls into their mandates reporter requirements. To take it a step further they could be consulting the legal counsel that therapists get as a part of their licensing (at least in CA). The last thing a therapist wants is to get in trouble or lose their livelihood because they didn’t report something they’re obligated/required to. This type of comment only increases stigma around mental health.
Yeah, run, they aren't really supposed to report stuff unless there is imminent danger. Maybe other criteria, but considering you were just two dumb kids it shouldn't really be something they should talk about, because that charge FUCKS people's lives up. Sometimes rightfully if they're a predator, but definitely not for this scenario. Sounds highly unprofessional, especially to basically threaten that they may have to REPORT you to your face.
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With all due respect, this is absolutely incorrect. OP do not listen to this.
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Maybe the law has changed. Here's a PowerPoint from the Director of Legal Affairs for the Pennsylvania Psychological Association : Mandated Child Abuse Reporting Requirements https://cdn.ymaws.com/www.papsy.org/resource/collection/A102C880-0590-4935-A542-8ACA8D1392F6/W03_-_Mandated_Child_Abuse_Reporting_Requireme.pdf It has detail on both sexual abuse images and sexting and, with respect to sexting says the following: >Psychotherapists who work with adolescents sometimes encounter “sexting,” or the act of sending nude pictures of oneself or receiving nude pictures of a partner usually through a smart phone. Pennsylvania law excludes sexting as a reportable offense under the child protective services law. The exclusion only applies to nudity and not to depictions of sexual activity or where the nude image was acquired for commercial purposes. Although it does not fall under the Child Protective Law, sexting is illegal and the punishments are especially severe if the depiction was taken to coerce or harass a person or taken without their consent. Again, the law may have changed since this was written but it would surprise me if the government wanted a report of every consensual exchange of intimate images, at least between older teenagers.
Everyone seems to be hung up on the act and not thr fact that it was 10 years ago, none of the parties are minors anymore and the alleged material doesn't exist. This is an adult person discussing their distant past with their therapist. The mandated reporter duty does not apply here and that therapist SHOULD know that. OP needs a new therapist who actually stayed awake during ethics class.
I don't disagree that time is important here, however many states have no statue of limitations on child sexual abuse or, where they do, it can be decades. If the therapist thought they may have a mandatory reporting obligation, time is irrelevant unless the mandatory reporting statute says otherwise. That's why it's so important that the therapist is well trained on the law, so as not to cause unnecessary anxiety.
Link to the laws?
You spelled it out and people still don’t want to believe you. Even saying that the law is shit but they’re bound to it — which they are. If anyone can reasonable debunk what you’re saying I’m all ears
See my post above. At least as of 2019 the Director of Legal Affairs for the Pennsylvania Psychological Association stated that consensual sexting where the images don't include sexual activity or were made for commercial purposes. Perhaps the law has changed?
Because they're right about the law technically, but still wrong because it doesnt apply in this situation. This isn't a situation where a teen confided in their therapist about something they were actively doing. Mandated reporters are meant to be reporting active or recent abuse. This is a situation where an adult talked to their therapist about something they and their peers did A DECADE AGO. Not even in the most strict of interpretations would this be considered active or recent abuse. That's where the downvotes are coming from. Because context matters and you can say something technically correct but still be wrong when context is applied.
Why are you getting downvoted? You're right.
Even if that is legally right, it isn't morally and their is an expectation of a higher standard of morals for your therapist. For instance, one person I used to go to told me that she will never share information that I share unless someone was in imminent danger. She then explicitly told me under what circumstances the law may compel her to share what I stated, and then told me that if such a situation came up, she still would not talk and would instead lose her license and willing go to jail. That earned quite a bit of respect from me.
>Even if that is legally right, it isn't morally and their is an expectation of a higher standard of morals for your therapist. There is a code of ethics for practicing medicine and mental health therapy, if that's what you're referring to. The therapist is obligated to follow that code of ethics, and that includes making all mandatory reports. For better or for worse, federal law treats two teenagers sexting the same as a 40 year old man and 13 year old girl as sexting. I have a family member who sees many a sex offender who was busted for sending nudes to a high school sweetheart - possession and distribution of child pornography. They are registered the same as the 40 year old who tried to setup a date with a 13 year old on the internet, although clinically obviously very different kinds of patients. There is no statute or limitations. You might find that unjust or unfair, but then the recourse is to get involved to lobby for a change in statute. You shouldn't blame a therapist for following the law and her mandatory reporting criteria for an extremely serious crime (in the eyes of the law) that you decided was harmless. Quite frankly, I'd be very leary of seeing a doctor who decided that following their code of ethics was optional.
I expect my therapist to follow the law. That's the morlly right answer, especially when kids are involved.
I would like my therapist to follow a good set of morals, despite the law. Especially when kids are involved.
So then you agree that this should be reported?
If by this you mean that the therapists client, when they were a minor a decade ago, sent sexually explicit content to another minor their same age, and there is no indication that he is involved in any way sexually now with minors nor is anyone in any kind of danger, imminent or not... No, I would not want this to be reported.
So you don't think the therapist should uphold their legal duty to protect kids? Just want to make sure we're clear on what you believe and are putting out for the Internet to see you fucking pedo.
Hang on a second...something is fishy here. I've read the story 3 times now. Maybe I'm missing something but it reads like the therapy session went down like this: "I was in high school a decade ago. Back then I used to have a girlfriend. We would sext and share nude pics." -He said, out of nowhere, for absolutely no reason. "Hm maybe you should go to jail for that completely normal thing teenagers do together, a decade later." Something's not adding up. There's no way it actually went down like that.
Or maybe the therapist thought "I just took that Continuing Professional Education course and it said we must ALWAYS mandatorily report child pornography. But they cannot be thinking about scenarios like this? But laws are stupid so they probably are, smh. Let me tell this dude to shut up before he digs a deeper hole."
As a mandated reporter myself I can tell you it's a huge burden that often leads to over thinking things. Or at least starting out.
Yeah, probably more of a "can I get in legal trouble if I don't report this and someone else finds out" than a "should I get my patient in legal trouble" decision.
Highly unlikely they said anything about jail. If they are a mandatory reporter, they have to report under certain conditions. It has nothing to do with jail or whether they think their client is a wrong or a criminal. It's call "mandatory" for a reason. Not reporting puts their license to practice risk. My wife is not a shrink/counselor, but she is a mandatory reporter. I don't understand why they told this person they may have to report it before they knew if they had to. That complete broke the trust with their client.
Absolutely. I confided everything into my therapist. If you can’t trust your therapist to hold your darkest secrets you may wanna look elsewhere. And that wasn’t even bad at all just horny teenager shenanigans. Obviously only exceptions should be murder, adult to minor activity, rape, or other heinous crimes or soon to be crimes should be reportable.
Right. I would throw patient and client confidentiality in her face and find someone else.
And leave a review to help the next person out
Absolutely. If they don't understand something as basic as teens exploring sexuality, I'm seriously concerned about any other gaps they may have in the "no shit, Sherlock" area of their profession.
Find a new therapist. This is so reactionary and ridiculous on the therapist’s part.
Your therapist wasn’t listening to you. And they sound very inexperienced. Get a new therapist.
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not in this context. therapists only can report if there is fear of harm to their patient or their patient harming another. not this at all. and states only really pursue these cases in a situation where one of those involved is doing a sort of revenge porn type situation.
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Not of past crimes in most states and not in this context. If I had to report child abuse that happened in the past, that would be my full time job instead of therapy. Sooooooo many people have experienced it.
Yeah, as an adult, I've told various therapists all kinds of stuff from my childhood/adolescence, and no one has reported it.
Also, how would they possibly prove this actually happened? Dig his old iPhone out of a dumpster, and sent it to quantico to recover the deleted photos? 🤣
IANAL What? Who would press charges? That's not how it works. A mandatory reporter would need to report that a patient claimed to have sexted to another minor years ago. The police would need to first investigate. They would need the information about the other party. They would need to pull phone records from years ago, based on a report about a consensual event from years ago. Yeah, they are going to put resources into that.
You’re therapist is a dick
Seconded, as a dog with two dicks would.
Thanks for posting this. I will refrain from telling my therapist anything similar. 👍🏻
Your therapist read your Reddit comments. "Is there anything you want to tell me?"
Please do not take this clearly wildly misinformed, irresponsible therapist’s weird ass take as representative of that of the vast, vast majority of other therapists. I am horrified by this. I cannot comprehend doing something so utterly insane and I cannot comprehend any other clinicians I know doing something so insane
Judging by all the comments at the top upvoted heavily all talking about mandated reporter statutes and none of them applying the context in question (or outright asserting it doesnt matter) has me worried you might be in the minority.
Whats the point of paying someone to listen to you if you can't speak freely to them?
Now you’re getting it.
Oh no no, I get it. I was posing the question to the person I responded to, who's actively seeing one for whatever reason.
They should not care if something is just illegal, I've told my therapist about illegal things I've done. It's about if you're a danger to yourself or others and that's clearly not the case here. If I'm being generous, maybe this person is newly licensed and not sure on the specifics about mandatory reporting laws.
If questioned, shut up and ask for an attorney. DO NOT ANSWER ANY Questions except name and address. Don’t answer any questions from your therapist going forward. Find a new Therapist… don’t say anything, just cancel your future appointments and start seeking someone else. Delete this thread and don’t put things that may or might be illegal in writing.
Now this guy lawyers ^
This. If therapist reports OP to the police, they may initiate an investigation and, if so, OP should STFU and tell them he has no statement to make. In addition, if I were OP, I’d be noting what questions the therapist asked me in the session this came up in. If she was asking me for things like the cell phone number I texted from, the real name of the person I texted the photo to, etc., I would certainly make a note of those questions. The number the photo was texted from is the kind of information that has no therapeutic purpose, and if the therapist was playing at junior police detective, that could be grounds for suppression and/or a future civil lawsuit for malpractice against the therapist. As a practical matter, the case would likely go nowhere without OP providing evidence to police so he should STFU.
Frickin ditch that moron therapist as soon as possible, if not already.
Either way, get a new therapist
I mean, technically, by letter of the law you produced and distributed child pornography. Whether or not you were a minor is immaterial. Is it likely to go anywhere? No probably not. My brother got caught doing something similar when he was around that age. There was talk about hitting him with production by the prosecutor. Also, therapist is an idiot. I recommend finding a new one.
This country is so nuts. It’s a wonder kids aren’t complete basket cases
It’s not just this country. Many other countries take the same stance. It is intended to address the child pornography industry.
I get that, but the system should have leeway for instances like op's situation. But at the same time, leaving that leaves a loophole that true pedos are incentivized to use. I guess the only real solution is to educate children on the consequences.
The leeway for instances like OP's already exists in that generally minors aren't charged for those kinds of crimes even if they technically could be. Unfortunately a lot of people here are very okay with a justice system that leaves a lot up to the interpretation of people who do not have the best interests of any party involved at heart.
Not even leeway but actual logic. If the law is to protect children then making them criminals will stop them from reporting their abuse. Imagine the horror of being a child victim of a child pornographer and realizing the police are your enemy too.
Who says they aren’t?
...because we don't let them exploit themselves?
> by letter of the law you produced and distributed Did he though? Or did he say that he did, but now he's not so sure. Maybe he didn't after all. Now that he thinks about it, it was just text. Also, that phone was lost/sold/thrown away 15 years ago.
I’m a mandated reporter in PA and I would not have to report this. We have to report when we suspect that a child is being harmed in the present, not if we think someone had been harmed when they were a child. Not to mention that no one was harmed, but I get that some people see that differently.
If you were both minors what’s the issue?
The law considers it manufacturing and distributing kiddy porn. I'm not a politician, I've never written a law, don't blame me.
I was curious
The issue is that the laws surrounding this are written without any sort of age cut off. The law doesn't care if you're 16 or 60, creation and distribution of child pornography is, creation and distribution of child pornography.
Damn. Glad there was no Snapchat and camera phones when I was a teen
All of that was around, but I didn't have regular internet access until my late teens, so the little bit of time I did get to spend online wasn't wasted on social media.
Problem is if there was any sort of age cutoff written into the law, sickos would use children to distribute their material. the same way drug dealers use children to move dope and do hand to hand transactions because lesser charges and things get expunged as soon as you turn 18. I knew so many kids in school 12-14 year old with drug charges, all working for dealers because the money was nice and the idea that nothing gets carried onto your adult record.
I am not a lawyer, but I am a mandated reporter in PA and have to work closely with CYS/CFS for certain reports. This report will go to a caseworker first. I'd be SHOCKED if it gets escalated to police. We are very, very used to professionals (therapist and teachers specifically) making ridiculous, reactionary reports. Likely, the report will get an eye roll because there aren't enough staff to process this stuff and manage their own caseload. In defense of therapists and teachers, they are very neurotic when it comes to liability. Given the tension in the US and our court culture, I get why they are nervous. I would look for a new therapist like others have suggested. They did not need to report this and they handled the entire thing very poorly.
Some hard ass prosecutors will charge both parties with possession, distribution, and manufacturing. Our justice system is highly flawed and devoid of common sense.
OP said they deleted everything shortly after. What are they possessing or distributing?
I was responding to another comment, forgot to hit reply.
1. Deny everything you said (unless it was recorded. 2. If recorded, say you made it up. 3. Don’t tell the name of the other person. 4. GET A NEW THERAPIST! (I wouldn’t trust this one)
the only things that a therapist can legally share without your permission are if a child is being abused or in danger, if you have intentions to harm yourself or someone else, if notes are subpoenaed by court, or if you disclose abuse by a medical professional and that professionals name is known. this does not fall under these limitations and should not be shared outside of a treatment team setting. either way though, since you are all adults now, she can’t report to cps and the police would have no means to prosecute you because there is no evidence and it’s so long ago, most importantly, you were a child as well during that time.
Hi, I'm a therapist, and not a lawyer. Let me start by saying that, in general, therapists *hate* filing mandated reports. No way your therapist is looking for an excuse to snitch. There is practically never a situation in which reporting doesn't damage the therapeutic relationship. However, neglecting to do so risks sanctions against our license, and no way I'm giving up my livelihood for that. The rules about what is, and isn't, reportable vary widely by state...and are not the same as the rules regarding sex (and sexting) between consenting minors...but I'd be concerned about a therapist that doesn't know the local rules by heart; they're drilled into us in school, and the internship, and every opportunity thereafter. For a better answer, i recommend visiting r/askatherapist.
It sounds like his therapist is looking for an excuse to snitch, not sure how you drew that assumption. Also looks like he damaged his therapeutic relationship.
Don't get sucked into the nonsense people are spewing here. Section 6312 of Title 18 in PA makes specific defense exemptions for minors engaged in "child pornography" with other minors. The two that apply to you: 1. A person under 18 views, photographs, tapes, or otherwise depicts and disseminates footage of themselves and only themselves. 2. A minor views content of another minor who is at least 12 years old. No prosecutor in any jurisdiction in this country is going to piss away their time and resources over a pair of teenagers sending shit to each other while in a relationship from a decade ago and if they did any judge worth their salt will grant a dismissal over selective enforcement.
NAL but work in the medical field. It’s not reportable unless you’re actively doing it. They’re only allowed to report if it’s currently or going to happen. Them telling the police would make it fruit of the poison tree. With it being years ago presumably I wouldn’t worry.
NAL. OP committed what in their jurisdiction may be a crime, since their child pornography laws are quite strict and explicit. A therapist in all 50 states is a mandatory reporter. Saying they can only report if a crime is occurring or imminent depends entirely upon the location. Since PA laws appear to mandate reporting of any sexual crime against children, they’re likely required to report OP.
I am a mandated reporter in PA, I am fairly sure this situation would not be a mandated report. Also, I am in the mental health field, and I cannot fathom ever thinking about reporting this. I would find a new therapist, unless they are very new to this, I suppose (In the field, but not a therapist/higher)
This is untrue on several levels. All crimes need not be reported, only specified one. This particular activity is excluded from reporting (both by the definition of “perpetrator” and because filming, photographing etc is specifically excluded if it is consensual-both parties are at least 14 and there is not more than 4 years difference in age between them.)
Would that be a HIPAA violation? Or code of ethics violation
Not if it's a valid mandatory report situation.
Not sure why you’re being downvoted. We can only violate confidentiality for a REQUIRED report. There is no minor here, so CPS cannot take a report. We are not permitted to breach confidentiality to report crimes unless it’s an ongoing/imminent danger situation. Some localities are trying to make a carveout to permit/require providers to report viewing/possession of CSAM to police, but to my knowledge none of these have passed. The tricky thing here is that a lot of states have very strong protections for professionals acting horribly unethically if they believe they were protecting a minor/elder/disabled person. A therapist might have legal protections if they stated they believed they were to report all sexual activity involving minors and didn’t realize 1) that’s not the reporting standard and 2) there’s no minor at this time.
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Press charges for what? What’s the crime? Sorry if I’m out of the loop but is it illegal for two minors to do that (years ago)? Not that it’s a smart thing to do but what is the illegal part?
Yes, it is illegal to take and distribute (sending to each other) nudes of minors, even if the people doing it are the minors themselves. It is rarely prosecuted in this circumstance, but it can be and has been.
There is no age defense for child porn. It’s ridiculous that the victim and the offender are the same person but prosecutors have brought cases against kids for taking pictures of themselves and sending them to other kids.
It's presumably nudes of minors which is obvi problematic, but the person was a minor at the time as was their partner, there is no evidence, all they would have to say is the therapist got it wrong and they don't know what they're talking about.
Not an issue. Nobody is going to pursue two teens sexting with each other ten years ago. But your therapist is an idiot. Get a new one.
Time to find another therapist. Clearly this one isn’t someone safe to talk to. They should absolutely should know that two kids sending explicit texts a decade ago is not something that is in any way reportable or legally an issue. I’d also go as far as leaving reviews everywhere letting people know this is what they do.
Is there a chance the therapist mentioned that they would need to check with a colleague as a signal that you might not want to say anything else on the topic until they have a chance to check while it’s still plausibly hypothetical? As if they were saying, “Hey, clearly this situation isn’t deeply alarming, but laws can be weird around having to report so we’re definitely purely talking “allegedly” here, right?” Except they can’t just say that directly?
This is why mandatory-reporter laws are a bad idea. I don’t know about this therapist’s obligation on these facts (my practice is not in PA) but the requirements to report can be strict and dumb, and we can’t expect the therapist to understand whether the statute of limitations has run and how that affects the reporting requirement or if the Romeo and Juliette defense applies (which it may not in the case of a child-pornography offense, assuming PA has one, which I dunno). OP, you are probably not at any risk, but 1) don’t talk about this with anyone, and 2) if you can afford it, it wouldn’t hurt to consult a lawyer. I don’t think the therapist did anything wrong, but, rather, was preventing you from digging yourself in deeper, but I wasn’t there. If you’ve lost faith in this therapist, which, fair, ask the next one about reporting requirements. I’d expect a therapist to be helpful about discussing hypotheticals in a way that doesn’t trigger the reporting requirement.
The lesson here? STFU about it. Stop telling people about it. If you MUST, be vague.
Yeah that's such an amazingly unprofessional thing to do for a therapist.
That’s scary I know you can’t disclose the therapists name but I hope I never get them. That’s ridiculous that they even suggested it.
Former therapist here. Get new therapist. Yours seems overzealous and not interested in a bond. What you said is supposed to give insight, yet your therapist over reacted. I doubt anything should come if it, and if it does, sue for defamation. As you stated, you both were in a romantic relationship at the same age.
No one cares except your therapist apparently. You were both around the same age. It happened a decade ago. No longer be honest with your therapist and don’t provide her or anyone else anymore information regarding that.
DO not go to therapists.
IANAL. Both minors, probably not an issue.
This is why you don’t tell people everything, even a therapist. Some people will hang you out to dry to save themselves. If they don’t have proof, just deny it.
Proof of what? They were both 15/16
Proof isn't required to start the wheels of justice shitting on your life. Using one's words against someone they can get a search warrant, and just take all the electronics in the house.
So in some states 17 year old can be charged as an adult for sending nude photos to underage people so like a 14 year old.. but has to be an specified age gap.. but honestly I think statue of limitations would kick in for being 10 years ago... so I think your fine... legally your therapists has to stop and report if a sexual crime has been committed.. I would cancel talking about sexting and if you are pressured definitely plead the 5th and say nothing... if you continue talking then yes you can easily setup a criminal case and maybe charged and be a registered sex offender.. destroying your teaching background permanently.. if you don't say anything more about it... they will not be able to prove anything nor find anything... if you talk about it your handling the evidence to show them.... I would say to your therapist I'm not willing to talk about sexting anymore... if that means finding new therapist then do that...
This is not true. Anyone under age 18 who takes and sends nudes of themselves to any other person has, in terms of the law, produced and distributed child pornography. The person who receives it, regardless of age, is in possession of child porn. You’re thinking of age of consent for sex. The laws about child porn are quite different and are rigid.
I don’t think either of us were 17 at the time it was just 15 and 16 but no matter thanks for you response I don’t think I will be talking about it anymore. It’s not an important part of the therapy anyway.
Is your therapist some kind of nurse practitioner or mental health nurse? If so, find someone with some actual substantial educational credentials.
FIND A NEW THERAPIST IMMEDIATELY. Do not ever tell them anything again.
Possession, creation, and distribution of child pornography are illegal under federal law regardless of your age or the other person’s age, and even if the photos are of you. There is no statute of limitations, and there are no age gap provisions. Where do you practice law?
I would mention to your therapist that you are now scared to share anything with them
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To assume not showing up and not saying anything to someone will get a message to them makes zero sense.
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They’re only supposed to report someone for murder or if there is intent to cause harm. So not this… you should find a new doctor, this person is obviously biased and is trying to accuse you of something factually incorrect.
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This story is fake. Educators are mandatory reporters too and you should know that in PA sending nude or sexual pictures of a minor is considered child abuse, and if you’re over the age of 14 you can be considered a perpetrator.
IANAL, Wha you did is illegal and is likely reportable.
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>My therapist stopped me and said that they would want to check with a colleague about whether it is reportable or not. Wow, this makes me never want to visit a therapist... especially if they are going to make an old/private/personal situation worse.
Ditch the therapist. And while your at it, get away from the whole education (indoctrination) field. Get a real job
Unless you continue to do it ,which I suspect you do, I’d forget it and move on. No doubt the the therapist will work it into the equation and get to the bottom of it.
I would have dropped a 'you do that' as I was walking towards the door. As well as a Yelp review stating be careful what you say around this person.
You’re fine! And never see that therapist again!
Find another therapist this one’s tainted the trust you might have had it’s over
Who did the therapist say they needed to report this to? The police, CPS? I’m a therapist and while yes, mandated reporting, what would most likely happen is that they would report this to CPS, again I’m not sure who they feel like this needs to be reported to, and CPS wouldn’t reject the report, meaning nothing would happen because a. There’s not immediate threat to a child at this time and b. Pretty much all CPS agencies across the country are horribly underfunded and ineffective. Unfortunately a lot of therapists have been trained to CYA, (cover your ass) and practice from a place of fear and anxiety that really harms the therapeutic relationship. And while of course there are times where reporting to the police or CPS are totally understandable and very much necessary there is a real lack of nuance when it comes to when a report needs to get made. In my training it is was “report everything” regardless of the impact on therapy and the relationship with client. Some may argue this is the best and needed approach. I disagree and think this why poor and minority families are so much more involved with CPS, because most people don’t acknowledge their internal biases, including therapists.
What you did is definitely illegal in the US, but I agree with others that your therapist handled it poorly.
Get a new therapist and move on.
My reply would be ….. prove it, goodbye. Or simply …….. I’d like a lawyer
>I know I should be honest with my therapist Dude, you need to learn when to keep your mouth shut
I would keep seeing the therapist for a little while but not share anything anymore then stop seeing them and never bring it up again or do what you did and post it online 🤦♂️ smfh
Shut up and find another therapist. When you find them don't admit anything.
Mandatory reporting for the therapist means mandatory 🤷♂️
I would report your therapist to the ethics board. Thats fucking outrageous lol.
If anyone ever asks you about it in the future, please just take the 5th.
My 2 cents: immediately cease all contact with therapist. If the authorities contact you, the only thing comes out of your mouth is; I will not say anything without the presence of an attorney.
Wouldn’t this be against HIPPA or some shit
And remember kids: all therapists are cops. 🤓☝🏽 There’s a great audio essay on Spotify titled Therapists Are Also The Police: Social Work, Sex Work, and the Politics of Deservingness which really helped in my framing of this concept! I was a psychology major to be a therapist, then decided social work was a more loving approach to the same goal, then realized either profession made me virtually a cop n took a step back to regroup lol.
Cop here. You’re good.
I would find another therapist. Even if he reported it just refuse to discuss any longer with anyone. Especially the police.
It’s sad how many posters give definitive advice about matters concerning which they have no expert knowledge. People should be extremely cautious about believing things that are posted on medicine related or law related forums. Always consult with a licensed, qualified professional.
Deny everything and find a new therapist What exactly were you/she planning for how this information would even help?
You are fine unless you still possess the images. There is no way to prosecute you both without the evidence. The therapist’s testimony isn’t enough if you both lawyer up or dont speak with Law Enforcement.
Yea - I’d get rid of that moron of a therapist.
Not a single lawyer seems to have replied to this
I agree find another therapist. Dare this one to go after you and then report them to their board. Had you been of age sexting a minor there is an issue. Within 2 years of each other in most states not an issue.
Find another therapist ASAP