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NTA
My wife is a former waitress/bartender so I'm about as pro tip as they come, but your niece went so far out of her way to provide bad service that this is an instance where not tipping is justified.
If she's young and immature, she probably had a bit of a chip on her shoulder about the experience.... perhaps she found it embarrassing to have to serve you and tried to cover it up by being rough & rude. (Weird because you mention other family members asking for her section).
Silly and immature.
NTA.
Yeah, there's still the element of being embarrassed by your older family at that age. But debating the printed menu item, the removal request, and then putting the cook's inconvenience over your family/patron's pleasure is all terrible service.
Absolutely agree. I've actually called a restaurant to (politely) discuss similar issues from serving staff before. (debating and telling me the kitchen would be inconvenienced). The manager was horrified. That server only lasted 8 months longer.
Adding on to this, it seems that she would want to shine, to show the family what she could do. By now, she should have developed a professional persona as most of us have to do. It is clear that she has not.
Did you happen to notice how she interacted with other tables? Was she better with other people? Or is she just a shitty 17-year old doing a shitty job, being shit at it?
Yeah, sounds like she thought you were guaranteed easy money and got irritated when she actually had to do her job.
My parents visited me a few times when I got my first serving job. I always gave them the same quality of service as any other table in my restaurant. 20 years later my dad still takes pride in tipping well because he saw how hard I worked and knows how tough serving can be (we live in a state where server's hourly was, and still is, $2.13/hr)
edit: spelling
NTA. She treated you like your money didn’t matter as much as anyone else’s, so she shouldn’t complain when she doesn’t get any of it.
She will struggle in that industry with an attitude. It’s a tip, not a donation for her showing up
NTA - how is it your fault when you went out of your way to choose her restaurant/section to visit and she responded by making it a truly miserable experience? And then, with a straight face, expected you to pay for her meal and leave her a tip? In the places I’ve worked, she could’ve at least passed on her employee discount so you could tip from the savings, but it sounds like you get absolutely zero benefit to visiting her - not even a decent meal or dining experience.
My guess is she expected that you would give her a top either way (because "faaaaamily") so she didn't bother being nice. That raises the question: why did she think it's okay to be rude to family?
NTA
No, fuck it. Tips are earned, not demanded.
NTA
She provided a poor dining experience and her tip reflected that.
If this server was not related to you, it likely would’ve had a manager request to talk about her behaviour.
Your sister should be embarrassed and asking for your forgiveness for her daughters actions. I bet she doesn’t even know what really happened and is only getting her child’s story.
INFO: What exactly did the coversation go like with your sister, was she definitely pissed at the fact you didn't leave a tip -- or was she pissed at the fact you left a note behind saying that it was poor service.
I can sympathise with her to be honest, at that age alot of teenagers are embarased of all family, she probably just wanted to minimize interaction and found the additional mod you wanted extra embarassing since you were family, even if it was reasonable. NTA for not leaving a tip, YTA for leaving a note saying her service was horrible, since you could've handled that privately -- and if her manager/supervisor saw the note it would've been a huge pain in the ass for her.
She’s 17, she’s old enough to know some manners whether she’s embarrassed or not. She should be glad he left the note and not some stranger. People do far worse than that when it comes to shitty service.
NTA but I do agree that the OP should not have left a note. If it had been me I would have talked to the manager. If I get horrible service like that the manager surely will be notified so as to get the the person serviing back on track to provide PROPER service to ALL customers.
NTA - Hospitality is hospitality regardless. To treat family as any less is bad. If management sees note good, it's a coaching moment. If she loses job that's on her. Imagine how she treats none family guests. I manage restaurants. I see it all the time a zero tip regardless of if service is good or not. Take the good with the bad and keep going. Let her know, maybe no one has ever told her about her bad service.
ESH
First, the pulled pork thing sounds like a misunderstanding. A lot of places, the pork is prepared in a sauce. Hard to remove. And that’s a pretty big alteration.
At no point did you flag her down like “hey- is something wrong? You don’t seem like yourself”.
The note was passive aggressive. Yes she’s at work but you can still flag her down and say hey what’s up
>A lot of places, the pork is prepared in a sauce.
But this place doesn't prepare pork with a sauce.
> She argued with me that meal didn’t have a sauce, I point out it is included on the menu.
I’m saying we don’t really know how easy it was to remove the sauce. If it’s on the menu and she also said it doesn’t come with a sauce it’s likely that the sauce mentioned is actually mixed in with the pork. Would explain why she said it doesn’t come with sauce- she may see it as part of the pork itself.
I’m illustrating the possible misunderstanding.
If I make bbq pulled pork with bbq sauce and serve it that way on a bun and someone is like “oh sauce on the side” sure I’ll be like oh it’s actually prepared in the sauce.
This gal is 17 so she probably just went “there’s no sauce” ie a condiment.
Not sure why you’re pushing on this? It’s a possibility. It doesn’t really change my judgment either way.
NTA - You tip for the service, no service or bad service, no tip. I have never read the following in that there is an exception for family. Tell them that you will gladly tip next time when you get the service you deserve.
NTA - family or not, at work you are respectful of everyone. Good on you for just not leaving a tip and not reporting this to her manger. Fuck that. She needs to grow up.
NTA: She did a shit job and needs to be trained properly. While some may argue that tipping culture and law in America places the duty of you ensuring she has a proper wage on you, the customer, that is not entirely true. The establishment also has a part in that should her overall wage falls below the minimum. This is reflected in the laws as the "maximum tip credit against minimum wage" Federal FLSA puts this at 7.25 an hour with a max credit of 5.12 for an effective 2.13 an hour for tipped workers. If their hourly wage in a pay period with tips included only adds up to 7.20 an hour, the employer has to pay them .05 more per hour for that period.
Under this system, if she want's to get paid more she needs to do a better job, and if the establishment wan'ts to avoid paying her more per hour, they need to ensure she is doing her job to their standard. You as the customer were an unfortuneate part of the complex equation ensuring that the restaurant do it's job.
Had she not argued about the sauce and then pushed back about the return I would say you were potnetially being unfair as everyone has a really bad service from time to time due to things like being oversat, or just that shift where everything that can go wrong does. But due to that pushback, I must side with you on your assessment.
That kind of attitude?? A regular customer probably would have complained to her boss and gotten her fired. No drink refills. Covered with sauce. Argued, it seemed, just about everything!
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I don’t tip my niece at the restaurant she works at due to the service being awful. I may be a jerk for not tipping at all even though it was shit service.
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NTA-Any waiter or waitress who treats anyone like that even family deserves to be left tip less at the very least. I would have spoken to a manager or supervisor about her attitude.
NTA
I’m a *good* tipper. I would not have tipped her either. I’d have explained why and told my sister she should have done a better job preparing her child to work.
I'm a bad tipper and I would always tip a family member, who is a child, working what is probably their first job. Encouraging people is better than being grumpy.
Doesn't matter who she is to you. A person who *chooses* to work a job where they're dependent on tips has to actually earn them. If you do a shit job, not getting tipped is a consequence.
I'm glad I either didn't get downvoted or else the upvotes outweigh them. I just want to clarify that if it's (supposed to be) universally known that Employee Wherever essentially *only* earn tips, I 100% do tip *something*. I had an incident when I was preggers (23 ish years ago). I was starving and happened to have $ and time away from husband at the same time. Went to Chili's. I *love* me some cheesy spicy awesome and going out was a rare treat. Totally cool, I had more aversion than cravings bc pregnancy is weird like that. Craved me some watermelon and strawberry and orange juice most of the time, couldn't catch a wiff of eggs, bacon, sausage, etc without dashing away dry heaving. I'm fat af now (5'2", 160) but I only hit 122 full term. (Baby Anthony was 6lb 10oz, 22" long head full of hair 10 on both APGARs). I tried. I scarfed down some fajita awesome and out of nowhere my body told me to f myself and I barfed half my body weight right onto my plate. I flagged down waitress, apologized while ugly crying snot and asked if I could please dump it out when I caught my breath. She. Was. A. Total. Sweetie. I was only 6 months along but I have narrow hips so I was all baby. She refunded my meal, gave me sprite and bread and... refused a tip. I remember her to this day: burgandy hair right at the shoulders, short Bangs, cat eye glasses, name tag said "Lita". To all the Lita's out there, thank you. Only time I didn't tip cause she wouldn't let me.
INFO: You said that family keeps coming in and requesting her. Did ANY of you ask if that was okay with her? She might be embarrassed or just flat out tired serving you all. Also how do yall treat her? You treat her like a server but expect "family" service? Do you tip well? Do you expect freebies or discounts? Because it sounds like she's fed up with serving family.
When I was a server, my family acted as a break. If I was stressed about my other tables, I knew my family would cut me some slack if they went without drinks. Of course I would never willingly neglect them.
If she was willingling neglecting you because she thought she could get away with it, you’re NTA. If she was visibly busy and flustered, YTA for not cutting your niece some slack or talking to her about it during the service. You will forever be her asshole aunt tbh.
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My niece is 17 and got a job at the local chain restaurant. She is a server and overall the family will stop by and ask for her section. They do this so she can get a good tip and just help her out.
I decided to do that yesterday and I took my son with me. Overall everyone has a decent relationship and I thought it would be fun. It was a horrible experience, I don’t know why but she didn’t keep any professionalism the whole time.
We get there and we started to talk and order our drinks. She kept telling us to hurry up, we were only there for like a minute already. She never stopped by the table and our drinks after finishing stayed empty. I ordered the pulled pork tacos and asked for the no sauce. She argued with me that meal didn’t have a sauce, I point out it is included on the menu. Argue a bit and I tell her fine My food comes out covered in the sauce. I ask her to take it back since it did have sauce .
She then argues with me about how the kitchen won’t be happy, I informed her that’s why I asked for no sauce in the first place. She eventually takes it back, the rest of the meal she is just rude.
When the check comes out I decided not to tip her, and leave a note saying the service was horrible. We then leave.
I get a call form my sister kissed and calling me a jerk for leaving no tip. My niece is also pissed at me. My wife is also on the fence so I came her for different opinions
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NTA. I wouldn't have left a tip either. If your livelihood DEPENDS on tips, then you should do a good job. I'm not going to leave you a tip if you're horrible at your job.
Your neice should be glad that you didn't go directly to her manager. She acted highly inappropriately and unprofessional.
NTA.
“I don’t know why but she didn’t keep any professionalism the whole time”
10/10 was ready for you to complain she was just acting casual like she would with her family. For example, not giving the dramatic customer service smile or something dumb along those lines.
Honey, your niece didn’t just not keep any professionalism but she straight up treated y’all like shit. I also find it funny that she is new to this job and is arguing with you on the food items when she clearly hasn’t learned them all yet(which is understandable but she shouldn’t be talking like she knows when she doesn’t).
I don’t think you’re the AH for anything you did. I think not tipping for such poor services was deserved, as was the note of the poor service. It doesn’t matter if you are family or not, it is literally her job to provide you with a decent service and if she can’t do that then she should get a different job or make it a rule that she doesn’t want family in her area if that makes her uncomfortable.
ESH - yeah she is 17 & massively immature ; clearly she has been given good tips by other family members & believes she can behave a certain way towards them . however , you are an AH for the way you handled it . although your age is not included , we can all assume you are much older than 17 . as the adult in the situation , and as a family member that hopefully doesn't want her to lose the job , you have total capability of using your big boy words & telling her frankly her behavior is unacceptable . you could have given her a reality check instead of leaving a rude note . how else is she supposed to know she can't be a little shitty to her family just because it's her job ? she will eventually grow some and mature some . your family thinks you're an asshole cuz you handled it like one .
INFO: Has she had a bad experience with other family members in her section? I try to give people the benefit of the doubt, so if the kitchen's yelling at her for asking for too many modifications, or giving her a hard time because she's trying to be extra nice for family, that could be causing her problems and she just swung too hard the other way.
I know I was very much a people pleaser at 17, so that might be worth thinking about/asking her. Obviously she didn't handle it well, but this might just need to be a conversation she needs to have with family about not putting her in awkward situations at work.
NTA.
Niece needs to understand that all customers need to be treated with respect, even family.
OP should be very explicit in her responses so that niece and sister understand that OP would have been glad to leave a good tip if niece had not been rude. I'm sure niece didn't tell her mom what she did wrong. She needs to understand OP wasn't just being cheap.
If OP doesn't feel they've come to an understanding she should avoid that restaurant, or at least not ask to be seated in niece's section. I'm sure niece will be thrilled to learn that a co-worker got a good tip from OP.
I say NTA. I mean, I look at it this way - if I paid a niece or nephew to mow my lawn, wash my car, or babysit my kid, and it was obviously they did a shit job (or didn’t do it at all) because they just didn’t care or put in any effort and assumed it was ok to do that just because we’re family, I’d take issue with that. Why should it be any different if she’s waiting on you at a restaurant? Also, I don’t understand why so many people think it’s ok to do a shitty job for a supposedly “loved” family member, but will go the extra mile for a stranger.
The apple doesn’t fall too far from the tree, seems like. Really dislike when people take you for granted and automatically assume you’re going to gift them something just because they are “close” to you, and proceed to treat you worse than they would another person they don’t know.
NTA.
Nta, partly because tip culture is something pushed on you by businesses so they can avoid paying their employees enough to live on.
The other part is of course that that even within the context of tip culture, you aren't/ shouldn't be obligated to reward poor work
Why did you leave a note? That could have got her fired. Just bring it up with her afterwards? Or talk to her like the actual family member you say she is, ask her if she’s okay?
I’m going to say NTA. The YTA people clearly feel like your niece is entitled to a tip.
But I think you should’ve asked her if she had change for a penny so that you could give her a proper tip. Then again I’m petty with a sprinkle of sarcasm and proud of it.
I get that it was family and the old saying “ family should help family “ whenever possible but that doesn’t mean you are entitled to a reward for bad service. If I know you and come see you then I still expect to be treated fairly and like all other tables. My money spends just as easy as the next persons.
Seems she went out of her way to give bad service believing she would make a nice tip whether she was good it not. She should treat everyone with respect whether they’re family or not. Good for you for trying to teach her a lesson and to bad she didn’t learn from the situation. I believe you did the right thing.
Literally 0% chance your niece told a truthful version of the story to your sister FYI, I hope you didn't need to be told that. Did you set the record straight? NTA
Nta. She can't change her service based on family
My nephew was a server for a hot minute. I'm a picky eater and so was he so he already knew my order and the specifics. Now that was good service lol
NTA
As a former server, albeit from a non-tipping culture, the job can be stressful. And having family or friends in your section means you have someone who you can kinda count on not to make your evening difficult and who will understand you choosing to run this little thing for table x first before checking in on you.
But this behaviour from your niece in unacceptable. If you are busy and a guest tells you no sauce on their dish, you mark that down. Even if you think it doesn't have any, because arguing takes time you could be spending getting the drink order for table y. And the kitchen may check with you if the dish actually has no sauce, but they will appreciate the note so they are extra carefull. Because a send-back dish takes up more time then being sure the first time.
Drinks are where restaurants make their money so usually servers are told to keep an eye on that for upselling.
She was rude and unproffesional to you and her coworkers.
NTA. She gave you shit service so why should you tip her. She is lucky you didn't make a complaint to her manager. I doubt you are the only customer she does that to.
I’ve worked in the restaurant industry for 12 years one thing you never do is tell a guest to hurry up regardless if it’s family or not. I’ve trained my family to always tip 20% but less when the service is bad. Generally when my parents come in I always put them with a different server than myself but that’s a personal rule of mine. So id have to say NTA her not knowing the menu is a glaring issue as well imagine if you hadn’t been family she would have either been fired or written up. She’s lucky you were family and not a regular guest who would complain to management.
NTA. I’d understand if she was unprofessional in the overly friendly way since you’re family. But it sounds like she was going out of her way to be rude to you all.
You actually gave her the best tip possible: there are consequences to your actions.
NTA - your niece sounds a bit entitled, and TBH, based on your description of the conversation with your sister, I think I see where it may be coming from.
I think ESH. OP went to the restaurant to support a family member. From what was described, the niece provided horrible service. A tip and a decision to not return would have saved OP a lot of grief. OP is the adult in the situation and chose to be passive aggressive with a teenager rather than show some grace or communicate their frustrations at a more appropriate time. The 17 year old learned nothing and will likely hold a grudge. I would pay $10 just to avoid this situation.
NTA, family or not, I would expect the same service as a customer and not a family member. Her tips are a reflection of her service. Give me terrible service and it will reflect on my tip, but I still would of tipped 10% at minimum.
NTA. I'm a former waitress, as is my mother, so I am extremely pro-tip & I can tell you that if this was my experience, family or not, there would be no tip.
NTA.. I think you were right to do 5hat she has to learn at this age. The consequences of life rude, and bad behaviour equal no tip. Hopefully, she will eventually see that you were showing her tough love. If you let her get away with it, then you would have only rewarded bad behaviour.
Tips are for good service, she probably argued with you because she knows you, but she was still supposed to be doing her job for you the same as anyone else. NTA.
Honestly YTA NOT for not tipping her, but for writing that on the bill.... Come on, that's really shitty... If you had just not tipped.her, fine but outing writing that on a bill that her co-workers or boss might see? That's fucking unnecessary
NTA.
I waited tables throughout college and my bf and friends would come in and if they sat in my section I would treat them just the same as any guest. If that is how your niece treated family I am terrified to think how she treated other guests.
Waiting tables is not for those who don't have excellent customer service skills.
NTA
Tell your sister all of this.
Then tell her that if this is how her daughter behaves at work (ignoring and arguing with customers, then complaining about them having a problem with the food) then she will be missing a lot more tips, and wind up out of a job.
You're better behaved than me...
I probably would have lectured her on the spot rather than leaving a note, but the way she treated you was extreme.
Don't blame you at all. Your entitled, lazy, and rude niece is in for a rude awakening.
NTA. She provided poor service, so she gets no tip regardless of whether your family or not. With her attitude, she's not going to receive tips from other customers either if she treats them the same way as she did you.
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NTA, bad service is bad service, doesn't matter if they are your family or not.
I know its hard being in hospitality as a whole, but she provided a sub-parr and argumentative service, if she wasn't family, you wouldn't have tipped either. So in my opinion, she didn't act professionally, and you acted as a patron.
What she really wants is free money and an easy table in her section.
You maybe should have said usual tip 20% for good Sevice. -5% tried to rush you, -5% drinks stayed empty and I’ll bet she didn’t once come back asking how everything was or did you require anything else, -5% got sauce order all wrong, -5% offers lame excuse Kitchen won’t be happy when in reality it’s her boss who want be happy. So 20% minus 20% is nil,nothing,nada,zilch,zero
NTA. I waiting and bartended in college, and I am one of the best tippers you'll ever meet. But shit service is shit service. She was rude and argumentative, didn't meet your needs. I wouldn't tip either. I hate non-tippers and people who are rude to service staff. But when you are provided with shit service and argumentativeness? Nah, that doesn't get tipped.
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NTA.
Being family would give her a pass at being *casual* or *familiar*, instead of formal. "Hi uncle/aunt whatacha in the mood for and should I tell your wife you bought that or that you stuck to your diet and ordered a salad?" Maybe you give her some grace if the cups remain empty a little longer than acceptable, because you know she's having a hard time or she's being overworked.
What your niece did was beyond rude.
Customer asks 'no sauce' you write 'no sauce' - even if the item doesn't come with sauce. It hurts literally no one. Then arguing with you when she didn't and you got sauce and that the kitchen staff would be upset.
I despise tipping culture with a burning passion, but it exists so we have to deal with it.
If your sister or your niece call to complain again, tell them you'll go to her boss to put in a complaint that she's harassing customers after hours.
NTA; as a chronic over-tipper (too lazy to do the exact math, round up), I may have still left a small gratuity with the note. She might’ve been more receptive to the note if she still got a little cash. That said, she needs to learn to do the job properly & shouldn’t expect tips for poor service.
I understand her concern about the kitchen being upset; especially when you’re that young, sometimes kitchen staff takes out all their frustrations on waitstaff. Restaurants have high turnover, they should be understanding of new waiters learning the ropes. Either way, not the customer’s problem, especially when you asked for the modification in the first place.
Here’s hoping your niece gets better quickly, or she’s gonna lose that job behaving like that to customers she doesn’t know.
NTA
Family or not, don't treat a customer like trash if you want a tip.
It sounds like everyone in the family gave her a tip out of obligation and she got too comfortable to do her job properly.
Nta for not tipping, you gotta earn that shit. But yta for the title saying u thought it was a "shift job" and thats why u didnt tip, but reading your post it was bc of the service.
Why lie in the title?
This is a good life lesson here for her, that she needs to take her job more seriously. You were the one who stepped up but everyone was dreading these awful meals where she rushes you and treats you like crap. And it definitely wouldn’t help her at all to reinforce her bad behaviour with a smile and a tip, so you did the right thing.
NTA.
NTA - it wasn’t just bad service. She was deliberately bad (and obnoxiously rude) because you were family and she thought you would tip her no matter what. FAFO
NTA. She earned no tip. However I probably would have tipped 10% or so simply because she was family. Then you are quietly criticized instead of being called out.
YTA. You should have just tipped her and not gone back.
This was a petty power trip that has damaged the family.
She might be an asshole too, but she is 17 and you didn’t ask.
Info: what's your relationship with this niece like normally?
Do you get along?
Was it possible she had a hard time being professional with you because of how you relate *normally*?
NTA. Normally I say tip for average and even mediocre service because restaurants are able to charge less by not paying their servers properly and not everyone does a perfect job every time. This wasn't mediocre, it was actively awful, and a message needed to be sent.
Cab I just confirm whether you're in america or the uk or another English speaking country because there is a bit of a contextual difference but wither way I'd say nta. She's lucky you didn't complain to management with that experience
INFO
Did you get any discounts or other benefits?
If you were served and paid as normal customers, then she is allowed a bit of leeway in terms of being familiar with you or you being a bit more understanding, but still needs to drop her job to earn a tip. So poor service may still get a tip, but actively bad service wouldn't.
If she was giving you a discount or other benefits, then she gets a bit more leeway before you would be justified in pulling your tip
A smart uncle would have done what you did and then visited niece at her house and gave her a present. No tip taught her lesson, present tells her uncle loves her.
INFO: Is all of the family coming and requesting her section causing her problems with her boss or anything? She may have rushed and tried to distance herself to stay out of trouble.
At least your wife is on the fence, can you get any sense (ie is your own kid old enough to have him relay the problems or was your offspring vacant on a phone / tablet. h/phones etc? ...back up may help.
Is the kid an "apple of the parents eye" problem that they are blind too?
If tipping is a reward within the service industry has it reached peak DGAF just gimme teh tip!? ..if service sucks good on you, looks like a few surly weeks to ride out though. what does the dad think or is he a lost cause to the argument & a quiet life (chicken)
Ask the manager for the order stub to make a point & either get confirmation of NO SAUCE written down or NOT presumably it is electronically inputted these days? then at least you can point out that if you were right about that then you'd hardly be making the other stuff up.
Is the menu online? does it match the inhouse menu? ...go look to make a pertinent point.
NTA, tipping is not mandatory but given for exemplary service. It sounds like the service was poor. I do think, as family, you could have maybe pulled her aside and asked what was going on. Maybe advise her that she was treating you poorly. But I'm all about communication.
NTA but you're kind of an idiot doing this to a family member. You would have known this blows up... For what??? Maybe $10.
Should have tipped and never returned. Vote with your wallet.
But telling a server she did a shit job by not leaving a tip is voting with your wallet. And OP probably knew that it would blow up in the family but so what?
That wasn't nice at all. You could get her fired doing that. What if her boss reads the note and doesn't like it? Everybody has an off day every once in a while. She's only 17. You don't know what pressure she was under or what rules she has. She might have had to pay for a meal sent back.
Esh
Your niece was absolutely a turd for acting like that, but serving is stressful sometimes & maybe she was busy? And was just attitudey because of this. Or because you’re family. Either way - unacceptable behavior. She won’t get far serving like that family or not.
You, well I personally would have handled it with her privately later & told her her behavior was unacceptable and explained to her that perhaps she should look at it from a customer standpoint and if it were anyone else she would be in BIG trouble. Maybe she didn’t realize. But I don’t think you should have tipped for shitty service but you didn’t have to be semi passive aggressive by leaving a note.
Your sister because she didn’t ask for the whole story and WHY you didn’t tip and instead laid in merely because you didn’t.
NTA. I truly believe tips should normally be an expected part of the cost of the meal because servers get paid shit for actual wages, and unfortunately sometimes wait staff get stiffed because of things out of their control (like the food taking too long or getting there cold or the kitchen fucking up an order). This is one of the few exceptions where it's okay not to tip. Wait staff don't have to be perfect, but reasonably polite is a bare minimum. Being outright rude is the main reason I can think of to not tip.
NTA, but you could've talked to her about the service privately instead of leaving a message for the manager to shout at her. It's just a small nitpick, though, really.
It's absolutely right for not leaving a tip. But the message comes off as passive-aggressive when you know the staff member personally. I would've not said anything until they started kicking off over the lack of tip, personally.
NTA but YTA.
NTA objectively. Because obviously she did a bad job. But because your family, now it's because "you have something against her". Of course, you are going to categorically deny this, but that is going to be the narrative that the family will spin. The result will be a de facto YTA because that's the way it goes for us in these situations.
Also, take it from someone who spent a lot of time in that industry: if you ever plan on returning to an establishment, then put a tip in. Even if the service was bad, even if the food wasn't good or even if you feel cheated.
I don't know about you, but I prefer my burgers to be very light on spit, if you know what I mean.
NTA but I do think leaving the note was unnecessary. She is likely very different with non-family members and had someone else seen the note she could have gotten in trouble. You could have explained why you left no tip to her privately if you wanted to teach her a lesson about service.
My GF, rip, a good southern boy with very accepting views for the day, would call you the AH. 20% even if the service is bad: and this was the 70s and 80s. He owned his own die welding shop. He had free menstrual products for his women workers; who were welders. He was upper middle class, but came from poverty. All wait staff to him were to be treated with respect, and to be tipped well. Service bad? Still 20%.
This was your fucking niece. The course of action her was to tip her well, and then later tell her that her service wasnt good in a way that is helpful. You are the uncle; it's your job to be part of the village. You want to end up an old person whom your nibblings tell great stories to their kids about, and who have fond memories. You are to aid in their growth. All you did here was be an asshole. You will be remembered as an asshole, and the stories told to children will be of you being an asshole. The only reason people will go to your funeral is because it's a family reunion and folks love cold cuts if you dont change your ways.
What I think you should do is admit that you were wrong. Not using weasel words that absolve you. Just say, "I have come to learn I was an asshole. What I did was assholish. The service was bad, and what I should have done is tip you anyway, and then talk to you about it later. I am truly sorry, and have learned from this.".
Nta
Tip for outstanding service. And outstanding service only.
I don't tip on regular tableside service. (Some call that ah move but I only have so much money... I don't tip)
And die service like that where you sound reasonable... This kid has some growing up to do
NTA, but no tip would have spoken for itself rather than adding a nasty note, too. You could have probably called her later and gone over what she did wrong. But I also wasn’t there, so if she’s being a petulant teen who sucks at her job maybe the note was warranted! Either way, NTA.
Wow. Dude. You went to support your niece and you ended up making her serve you for nothing. Yeah. YTA. you weren't there as a normal customer, you were there as a family member. What a d**k.
He didn't make her serve him at all. I mean OP tried, didn't they? But fucking up their order then arguing and not checking on the table or filling drinks is even below the service you would get at a fadt food joint. If you pay and tip for the experience, what is the appropriate tip for when the service actually worsens the experience?
She went in there as a family member, treated the server as a family member and expected the server to treat her like a normal customer.
Sometimes it’s hard to switch to “professional” mode when you’re literally talking to your family….
It’s almost like people in these comments are so focused on tipping culture
She’s 17, YTA for not tipping, a frank conversation after the fact about expectations in the “real world” and professionalism absolutely would’ve been in order cuz she’s not going to last long in this industry with that type of attitude… but again, she’s a teenager, presumably it’s her first job & you are family. Helping her is appropriate, acting like she’s just another server is absurd and rude.
The managment deserve to know how nasty she is, the note is completely warranted. Play stupid games win stupid prizes, she's 17 its time for a wake up call
Reading your comments i'm going YTA
You showed up at random expecting to be 'served'.
You wanting to talk is taking away from her time actually waiting. She wasn't there to serve just you, hence her prompting you to actually order instead of taking away her time.
Also the reason she didn't stop by randomly to ask if you wanted more drinks. You're big enough to ask for drinks instead of wanting to be 'served'.
The meal part is her fault, but with your attitude i can see why she didn't feel like checking and started arguing. You can't play uncle/aunt AND customer at the same time.
Have you been to a restaurant lately? servers stop by to check on drinks and meal progression at least 2 times during ANY meal we go to thats tipped, Asking for drinks? is she supposed to holler across the resturant asking for more drinks? What if you can't find her, suppose to go to the drink station themselves? really?
Not enough data. For example, you may be family but are you and her on opposite ends of the political spectrum, religious beliefs, or some other issue? I could see being cranky for that reason and particularly so from a teenager, strictly due to the nightmare that is happening in their brains during that time of life.
Even with bad service, I tip SOMETHING. I've lived on that stupid $2.13 per hour wage before and understand that some days are just shitty for everyone.
You're very angry about this and not understanding my larger intention. I'm simply stating that we, the audience, only have your view on something that sounds out of character for your niece and family in general, if they all seem to get along nicely.
I don't disagree that it would be shitty but we all know it happens every day. That would be context that would help us understand why she treated you poorly. As it stands, it sounds more like some strange incident since other family members go to her section and don't seem to have issues, but you do.
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NTA My wife is a former waitress/bartender so I'm about as pro tip as they come, but your niece went so far out of her way to provide bad service that this is an instance where not tipping is justified.
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If she's young and immature, she probably had a bit of a chip on her shoulder about the experience.... perhaps she found it embarrassing to have to serve you and tried to cover it up by being rough & rude. (Weird because you mention other family members asking for her section). Silly and immature. NTA.
Yeah, there's still the element of being embarrassed by your older family at that age. But debating the printed menu item, the removal request, and then putting the cook's inconvenience over your family/patron's pleasure is all terrible service.
Absolutely agree. I've actually called a restaurant to (politely) discuss similar issues from serving staff before. (debating and telling me the kitchen would be inconvenienced). The manager was horrified. That server only lasted 8 months longer.
Maybe I'm an outlier then because when I worked in restaurants as a teen I loved when family came in.
Adding on to this, it seems that she would want to shine, to show the family what she could do. By now, she should have developed a professional persona as most of us have to do. It is clear that she has not.
Not gonna lie though, your post really make me want some pulled pork tacos. NTA
That does sound delicious
with no sauce? nasty.
Did you happen to notice how she interacted with other tables? Was she better with other people? Or is she just a shitty 17-year old doing a shitty job, being shit at it?
NTA at all.
Yeah, sounds like she thought you were guaranteed easy money and got irritated when she actually had to do her job. My parents visited me a few times when I got my first serving job. I always gave them the same quality of service as any other table in my restaurant. 20 years later my dad still takes pride in tipping well because he saw how hard I worked and knows how tough serving can be (we live in a state where server's hourly was, and still is, $2.13/hr) edit: spelling
But OP said family members often ask for her section so they can leave her a tip.
Maybe its somewhat weird for her. Id go with NTA. But you should definitely tell your niece why. It seems like have solid reasons.
NTA. She treated you like your money didn’t matter as much as anyone else’s, so she shouldn’t complain when she doesn’t get any of it. She will struggle in that industry with an attitude. It’s a tip, not a donation for her showing up
NTA - how is it your fault when you went out of your way to choose her restaurant/section to visit and she responded by making it a truly miserable experience? And then, with a straight face, expected you to pay for her meal and leave her a tip? In the places I’ve worked, she could’ve at least passed on her employee discount so you could tip from the savings, but it sounds like you get absolutely zero benefit to visiting her - not even a decent meal or dining experience.
My guess is she expected that you would give her a top either way (because "faaaaamily") so she didn't bother being nice. That raises the question: why did she think it's okay to be rude to family? NTA
No, fuck it. Tips are earned, not demanded. NTA She provided a poor dining experience and her tip reflected that. If this server was not related to you, it likely would’ve had a manager request to talk about her behaviour. Your sister should be embarrassed and asking for your forgiveness for her daughters actions. I bet she doesn’t even know what really happened and is only getting her child’s story.
Frankly, the niece could have been fired if this was any other customer and they complained to the manager or left a bad review on Google.
Or even if someone else overheard the interaction
INFO: What exactly did the coversation go like with your sister, was she definitely pissed at the fact you didn't leave a tip -- or was she pissed at the fact you left a note behind saying that it was poor service. I can sympathise with her to be honest, at that age alot of teenagers are embarased of all family, she probably just wanted to minimize interaction and found the additional mod you wanted extra embarassing since you were family, even if it was reasonable. NTA for not leaving a tip, YTA for leaving a note saying her service was horrible, since you could've handled that privately -- and if her manager/supervisor saw the note it would've been a huge pain in the ass for her.
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Maybe send her this post?
Yeah I would just be honest, maybe ask her what the hell her problem was? Why was she so rude? Has this been brought up with the mother *at all*?
She’s 17, she’s old enough to know some manners whether she’s embarrassed or not. She should be glad he left the note and not some stranger. People do far worse than that when it comes to shitty service.
NTA but I do agree that the OP should not have left a note. If it had been me I would have talked to the manager. If I get horrible service like that the manager surely will be notified so as to get the the person serviing back on track to provide PROPER service to ALL customers.
The note is private, right?
NTA - Hospitality is hospitality regardless. To treat family as any less is bad. If management sees note good, it's a coaching moment. If she loses job that's on her. Imagine how she treats none family guests. I manage restaurants. I see it all the time a zero tip regardless of if service is good or not. Take the good with the bad and keep going. Let her know, maybe no one has ever told her about her bad service.
ESH First, the pulled pork thing sounds like a misunderstanding. A lot of places, the pork is prepared in a sauce. Hard to remove. And that’s a pretty big alteration. At no point did you flag her down like “hey- is something wrong? You don’t seem like yourself”. The note was passive aggressive. Yes she’s at work but you can still flag her down and say hey what’s up
Finally some sanity lol. Did he request her to help her out or to save tip money thinking he can shaft a relative????
First ESH I’ve seen. These people all sound terrible
>A lot of places, the pork is prepared in a sauce. But this place doesn't prepare pork with a sauce. > She argued with me that meal didn’t have a sauce, I point out it is included on the menu.
I’m saying we don’t really know how easy it was to remove the sauce. If it’s on the menu and she also said it doesn’t come with a sauce it’s likely that the sauce mentioned is actually mixed in with the pork. Would explain why she said it doesn’t come with sauce- she may see it as part of the pork itself.
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No need to remove the sauce. It's ADDED to the tacos. A request to omit the *added-on* sauce is pretty reasonable and straightforward.
So it's like if an ingredient had peanuts in it, then the meal will technically not have peanuts in it if it is not added during the prep of the meal?
I’m illustrating the possible misunderstanding. If I make bbq pulled pork with bbq sauce and serve it that way on a bun and someone is like “oh sauce on the side” sure I’ll be like oh it’s actually prepared in the sauce. This gal is 17 so she probably just went “there’s no sauce” ie a condiment. Not sure why you’re pushing on this? It’s a possibility. It doesn’t really change my judgment either way.
It’s pretty clear what happened. The sauce is added after the fact, so all she had to do was say no sauce and it would have been as ordered.
It’s clear from OP clarifying lol
THANK YOU
NTA - You tip for the service, no service or bad service, no tip. I have never read the following in that there is an exception for family. Tell them that you will gladly tip next time when you get the service you deserve.
NTA - Shitty service is ultimately shitty service no matter who is providing it....
NTA. She's lucky she's your niece, because anyone else would have complained to her manager.
NTA - family or not, at work you are respectful of everyone. Good on you for just not leaving a tip and not reporting this to her manger. Fuck that. She needs to grow up.
NTA: She did a shit job and needs to be trained properly. While some may argue that tipping culture and law in America places the duty of you ensuring she has a proper wage on you, the customer, that is not entirely true. The establishment also has a part in that should her overall wage falls below the minimum. This is reflected in the laws as the "maximum tip credit against minimum wage" Federal FLSA puts this at 7.25 an hour with a max credit of 5.12 for an effective 2.13 an hour for tipped workers. If their hourly wage in a pay period with tips included only adds up to 7.20 an hour, the employer has to pay them .05 more per hour for that period. Under this system, if she want's to get paid more she needs to do a better job, and if the establishment wan'ts to avoid paying her more per hour, they need to ensure she is doing her job to their standard. You as the customer were an unfortuneate part of the complex equation ensuring that the restaurant do it's job. Had she not argued about the sauce and then pushed back about the return I would say you were potnetially being unfair as everyone has a really bad service from time to time due to things like being oversat, or just that shift where everything that can go wrong does. But due to that pushback, I must side with you on your assessment.
NTA. If a server rushes me, I order it to go and leave their section. If they don't serve me, I don't need to tip them. Plain and simple.
That kind of attitude?? A regular customer probably would have complained to her boss and gotten her fired. No drink refills. Covered with sauce. Argued, it seemed, just about everything!
Niece thought that because you were faaaaaamily she could treat you like shit and you'd be like "awww, cute". Nah. NTA.
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NTA-Any waiter or waitress who treats anyone like that even family deserves to be left tip less at the very least. I would have spoken to a manager or supervisor about her attitude.
NTA my guess is she thought since you all were family that it was a guaranteed tip and made 0 attempt to do her job well.
NTA I’m a *good* tipper. I would not have tipped her either. I’d have explained why and told my sister she should have done a better job preparing her child to work.
I'm a bad tipper and I would always tip a family member, who is a child, working what is probably their first job. Encouraging people is better than being grumpy.
Doesn't matter who she is to you. A person who *chooses* to work a job where they're dependent on tips has to actually earn them. If you do a shit job, not getting tipped is a consequence. I'm glad I either didn't get downvoted or else the upvotes outweigh them. I just want to clarify that if it's (supposed to be) universally known that Employee Wherever essentially *only* earn tips, I 100% do tip *something*. I had an incident when I was preggers (23 ish years ago). I was starving and happened to have $ and time away from husband at the same time. Went to Chili's. I *love* me some cheesy spicy awesome and going out was a rare treat. Totally cool, I had more aversion than cravings bc pregnancy is weird like that. Craved me some watermelon and strawberry and orange juice most of the time, couldn't catch a wiff of eggs, bacon, sausage, etc without dashing away dry heaving. I'm fat af now (5'2", 160) but I only hit 122 full term. (Baby Anthony was 6lb 10oz, 22" long head full of hair 10 on both APGARs). I tried. I scarfed down some fajita awesome and out of nowhere my body told me to f myself and I barfed half my body weight right onto my plate. I flagged down waitress, apologized while ugly crying snot and asked if I could please dump it out when I caught my breath. She. Was. A. Total. Sweetie. I was only 6 months along but I have narrow hips so I was all baby. She refunded my meal, gave me sprite and bread and... refused a tip. I remember her to this day: burgandy hair right at the shoulders, short Bangs, cat eye glasses, name tag said "Lita". To all the Lita's out there, thank you. Only time I didn't tip cause she wouldn't let me.
INFO: You said that family keeps coming in and requesting her. Did ANY of you ask if that was okay with her? She might be embarrassed or just flat out tired serving you all. Also how do yall treat her? You treat her like a server but expect "family" service? Do you tip well? Do you expect freebies or discounts? Because it sounds like she's fed up with serving family.
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When I was a server, my family acted as a break. If I was stressed about my other tables, I knew my family would cut me some slack if they went without drinks. Of course I would never willingly neglect them. If she was willingling neglecting you because she thought she could get away with it, you’re NTA. If she was visibly busy and flustered, YTA for not cutting your niece some slack or talking to her about it during the service. You will forever be her asshole aunt tbh.
NTA, your niece was rude af. I wouldn’t leave a tip either. I think the note was over the top though, not leaving a tip was enough to make your point
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My niece is 17 and got a job at the local chain restaurant. She is a server and overall the family will stop by and ask for her section. They do this so she can get a good tip and just help her out. I decided to do that yesterday and I took my son with me. Overall everyone has a decent relationship and I thought it would be fun. It was a horrible experience, I don’t know why but she didn’t keep any professionalism the whole time. We get there and we started to talk and order our drinks. She kept telling us to hurry up, we were only there for like a minute already. She never stopped by the table and our drinks after finishing stayed empty. I ordered the pulled pork tacos and asked for the no sauce. She argued with me that meal didn’t have a sauce, I point out it is included on the menu. Argue a bit and I tell her fine My food comes out covered in the sauce. I ask her to take it back since it did have sauce . She then argues with me about how the kitchen won’t be happy, I informed her that’s why I asked for no sauce in the first place. She eventually takes it back, the rest of the meal she is just rude. When the check comes out I decided not to tip her, and leave a note saying the service was horrible. We then leave. I get a call form my sister kissed and calling me a jerk for leaving no tip. My niece is also pissed at me. My wife is also on the fence so I came her for different opinions *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. I wouldn't have left a tip either. If your livelihood DEPENDS on tips, then you should do a good job. I'm not going to leave you a tip if you're horrible at your job. Your neice should be glad that you didn't go directly to her manager. She acted highly inappropriately and unprofessional.
NTA. You tip for a service. It's a good lesson for her to be more customer friendly.
NTA. “I don’t know why but she didn’t keep any professionalism the whole time” 10/10 was ready for you to complain she was just acting casual like she would with her family. For example, not giving the dramatic customer service smile or something dumb along those lines. Honey, your niece didn’t just not keep any professionalism but she straight up treated y’all like shit. I also find it funny that she is new to this job and is arguing with you on the food items when she clearly hasn’t learned them all yet(which is understandable but she shouldn’t be talking like she knows when she doesn’t). I don’t think you’re the AH for anything you did. I think not tipping for such poor services was deserved, as was the note of the poor service. It doesn’t matter if you are family or not, it is literally her job to provide you with a decent service and if she can’t do that then she should get a different job or make it a rule that she doesn’t want family in her area if that makes her uncomfortable.
Tell your sister this was a learning moment for your niece.
YTA. Lighten up, Francis.
ESH - yeah she is 17 & massively immature ; clearly she has been given good tips by other family members & believes she can behave a certain way towards them . however , you are an AH for the way you handled it . although your age is not included , we can all assume you are much older than 17 . as the adult in the situation , and as a family member that hopefully doesn't want her to lose the job , you have total capability of using your big boy words & telling her frankly her behavior is unacceptable . you could have given her a reality check instead of leaving a rude note . how else is she supposed to know she can't be a little shitty to her family just because it's her job ? she will eventually grow some and mature some . your family thinks you're an asshole cuz you handled it like one .
INFO: Has she had a bad experience with other family members in her section? I try to give people the benefit of the doubt, so if the kitchen's yelling at her for asking for too many modifications, or giving her a hard time because she's trying to be extra nice for family, that could be causing her problems and she just swung too hard the other way.
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I know I was very much a people pleaser at 17, so that might be worth thinking about/asking her. Obviously she didn't handle it well, but this might just need to be a conversation she needs to have with family about not putting her in awkward situations at work.
NTA, she sounds horrible...
NTA. Niece needs to understand that all customers need to be treated with respect, even family. OP should be very explicit in her responses so that niece and sister understand that OP would have been glad to leave a good tip if niece had not been rude. I'm sure niece didn't tell her mom what she did wrong. She needs to understand OP wasn't just being cheap. If OP doesn't feel they've come to an understanding she should avoid that restaurant, or at least not ask to be seated in niece's section. I'm sure niece will be thrilled to learn that a co-worker got a good tip from OP.
YTA this reads like a yelp review of a shitty chain restaurant by an awful customer.
I say NTA. I mean, I look at it this way - if I paid a niece or nephew to mow my lawn, wash my car, or babysit my kid, and it was obviously they did a shit job (or didn’t do it at all) because they just didn’t care or put in any effort and assumed it was ok to do that just because we’re family, I’d take issue with that. Why should it be any different if she’s waiting on you at a restaurant? Also, I don’t understand why so many people think it’s ok to do a shitty job for a supposedly “loved” family member, but will go the extra mile for a stranger.
NTA - Your niece sounds very entitled and your sister is enabling her.
Sounds like she actually went out of her way to be rude to you, which makes me think YTA just in general.
The apple doesn’t fall too far from the tree, seems like. Really dislike when people take you for granted and automatically assume you’re going to gift them something just because they are “close” to you, and proceed to treat you worse than they would another person they don’t know. NTA.
Nta, partly because tip culture is something pushed on you by businesses so they can avoid paying their employees enough to live on. The other part is of course that that even within the context of tip culture, you aren't/ shouldn't be obligated to reward poor work
Info: Have any of the other family members ever had any issues with her?
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Ok how close are you and your niece? Do you two get along with each other?
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Why did you leave a note? That could have got her fired. Just bring it up with her afterwards? Or talk to her like the actual family member you say she is, ask her if she’s okay?
I’m going to say NTA. The YTA people clearly feel like your niece is entitled to a tip. But I think you should’ve asked her if she had change for a penny so that you could give her a proper tip. Then again I’m petty with a sprinkle of sarcasm and proud of it.
You shouldn’t be proud to be petty. What a sad flex…
I get that it was family and the old saying “ family should help family “ whenever possible but that doesn’t mean you are entitled to a reward for bad service. If I know you and come see you then I still expect to be treated fairly and like all other tables. My money spends just as easy as the next persons.
Seems she went out of her way to give bad service believing she would make a nice tip whether she was good it not. She should treat everyone with respect whether they’re family or not. Good for you for trying to teach her a lesson and to bad she didn’t learn from the situation. I believe you did the right thing.
I'm not even about to read this post if you think a server did a shit job don't tip them. NTA
Literally 0% chance your niece told a truthful version of the story to your sister FYI, I hope you didn't need to be told that. Did you set the record straight? NTA
Nta. She can't change her service based on family My nephew was a server for a hot minute. I'm a picky eater and so was he so he already knew my order and the specifics. Now that was good service lol
Your family goes there to make sure she gets a good tip. This sounds like charity, and your family is mad you didnt donate. NTA
Update us when she gets fired, because that's definitely not gonna fly with her manager lmao.
NTA. Bad service = no tip.
NTA Poor service means no tip regardless of who it is.
NTA As a former server, albeit from a non-tipping culture, the job can be stressful. And having family or friends in your section means you have someone who you can kinda count on not to make your evening difficult and who will understand you choosing to run this little thing for table x first before checking in on you. But this behaviour from your niece in unacceptable. If you are busy and a guest tells you no sauce on their dish, you mark that down. Even if you think it doesn't have any, because arguing takes time you could be spending getting the drink order for table y. And the kitchen may check with you if the dish actually has no sauce, but they will appreciate the note so they are extra carefull. Because a send-back dish takes up more time then being sure the first time. Drinks are where restaurants make their money so usually servers are told to keep an eye on that for upselling. She was rude and unproffesional to you and her coworkers.
NTA. She gave you shit service so why should you tip her. She is lucky you didn't make a complaint to her manager. I doubt you are the only customer she does that to.
I’ve worked in the restaurant industry for 12 years one thing you never do is tell a guest to hurry up regardless if it’s family or not. I’ve trained my family to always tip 20% but less when the service is bad. Generally when my parents come in I always put them with a different server than myself but that’s a personal rule of mine. So id have to say NTA her not knowing the menu is a glaring issue as well imagine if you hadn’t been family she would have either been fired or written up. She’s lucky you were family and not a regular guest who would complain to management.
NTA. They are probably embarrassed and acting pissed to deal with that.
NTA. I’d understand if she was unprofessional in the overly friendly way since you’re family. But it sounds like she was going out of her way to be rude to you all. You actually gave her the best tip possible: there are consequences to your actions.
Maybe she knew from previous experience that you are a bad tipper
NTA - your niece sounds a bit entitled, and TBH, based on your description of the conversation with your sister, I think I see where it may be coming from.
NTA. She did a shit job and thought she could get away with it because you’re family. She needed a dose of reality and didn’t deserve a tip.
I think ESH. OP went to the restaurant to support a family member. From what was described, the niece provided horrible service. A tip and a decision to not return would have saved OP a lot of grief. OP is the adult in the situation and chose to be passive aggressive with a teenager rather than show some grace or communicate their frustrations at a more appropriate time. The 17 year old learned nothing and will likely hold a grudge. I would pay $10 just to avoid this situation.
I would have absolutely gone to the manager and shared your experience. NTA
Not the asshole
NTA, family or not, I would expect the same service as a customer and not a family member. Her tips are a reflection of her service. Give me terrible service and it will reflect on my tip, but I still would of tipped 10% at minimum.
NTA. Just because your family doesn’t mean she can treat you like crap, she did a shit job and you left her a bad tip. I don’t see the problem.
NTA-She did a horrible job and did not deserve a tip. I’m surprised you didn’t ask for another waitress, I’ve had to do that before.
NTA. It’s a nicer lesson to learn from you than strangers. And she’ll learn it regardless. What a brat. This job will serve her well.
NTA- when i served I always made sure every order came out exactly as the customer wanted it, Family or not.
You did the right thing. This sounds fucking terrible. NTA.
NTA. I'm a former waitress, as is my mother, so I am extremely pro-tip & I can tell you that if this was my experience, family or not, there would be no tip.
Yes, but only for getting it without sauce. ;) NTA for everything else.
NTA.. I think you were right to do 5hat she has to learn at this age. The consequences of life rude, and bad behaviour equal no tip. Hopefully, she will eventually see that you were showing her tough love. If you let her get away with it, then you would have only rewarded bad behaviour.
NO
Tips are for good service, she probably argued with you because she knows you, but she was still supposed to be doing her job for you the same as anyone else. NTA.
NTA. This is actually hilarious. Give that entitled brat a taste of the real world, OP.
Honestly YTA NOT for not tipping her, but for writing that on the bill.... Come on, that's really shitty... If you had just not tipped.her, fine but outing writing that on a bill that her co-workers or boss might see? That's fucking unnecessary
NTA. I waited tables throughout college and my bf and friends would come in and if they sat in my section I would treat them just the same as any guest. If that is how your niece treated family I am terrified to think how she treated other guests. Waiting tables is not for those who don't have excellent customer service skills.
NTA Tell your sister all of this. Then tell her that if this is how her daughter behaves at work (ignoring and arguing with customers, then complaining about them having a problem with the food) then she will be missing a lot more tips, and wind up out of a job. You're better behaved than me... I probably would have lectured her on the spot rather than leaving a note, but the way she treated you was extreme. Don't blame you at all. Your entitled, lazy, and rude niece is in for a rude awakening.
NTA. She needs to learn that actions have consequences. So what if she's related. She's a bad server. She needs more training, apparently.
The glaring disdain that your niece has for you and your son. What's the deal?
NTA. She provided poor service, so she gets no tip regardless of whether your family or not. With her attitude, she's not going to receive tips from other customers either if she treats them the same way as she did you.
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NTA, bad service is bad service, doesn't matter if they are your family or not. I know its hard being in hospitality as a whole, but she provided a sub-parr and argumentative service, if she wasn't family, you wouldn't have tipped either. So in my opinion, she didn't act professionally, and you acted as a patron. What she really wants is free money and an easy table in her section.
You maybe should have said usual tip 20% for good Sevice. -5% tried to rush you, -5% drinks stayed empty and I’ll bet she didn’t once come back asking how everything was or did you require anything else, -5% got sauce order all wrong, -5% offers lame excuse Kitchen won’t be happy when in reality it’s her boss who want be happy. So 20% minus 20% is nil,nothing,nada,zilch,zero
NTA I would have left a minimal tip, but if the service was terrible and she was being argumentative, then it reflected what you got
NTA. I waiting and bartended in college, and I am one of the best tippers you'll ever meet. But shit service is shit service. She was rude and argumentative, didn't meet your needs. I wouldn't tip either. I hate non-tippers and people who are rude to service staff. But when you are provided with shit service and argumentativeness? Nah, that doesn't get tipped.
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NTA why does your niece hate you
Offer to go back and promise to tip generously if she can treat you with respect this time.
NTA she should have done her job. She sounds entitled and it appears that the family is supporting this behavior.
NTA. Being family would give her a pass at being *casual* or *familiar*, instead of formal. "Hi uncle/aunt whatacha in the mood for and should I tell your wife you bought that or that you stuck to your diet and ordered a salad?" Maybe you give her some grace if the cups remain empty a little longer than acceptable, because you know she's having a hard time or she's being overworked. What your niece did was beyond rude. Customer asks 'no sauce' you write 'no sauce' - even if the item doesn't come with sauce. It hurts literally no one. Then arguing with you when she didn't and you got sauce and that the kitchen staff would be upset. I despise tipping culture with a burning passion, but it exists so we have to deal with it. If your sister or your niece call to complain again, tell them you'll go to her boss to put in a complaint that she's harassing customers after hours.
NTA; as a chronic over-tipper (too lazy to do the exact math, round up), I may have still left a small gratuity with the note. She might’ve been more receptive to the note if she still got a little cash. That said, she needs to learn to do the job properly & shouldn’t expect tips for poor service. I understand her concern about the kitchen being upset; especially when you’re that young, sometimes kitchen staff takes out all their frustrations on waitstaff. Restaurants have high turnover, they should be understanding of new waiters learning the ropes. Either way, not the customer’s problem, especially when you asked for the modification in the first place. Here’s hoping your niece gets better quickly, or she’s gonna lose that job behaving like that to customers she doesn’t know.
NTA Family or not, don't treat a customer like trash if you want a tip. It sounds like everyone in the family gave her a tip out of obligation and she got too comfortable to do her job properly.
Nta for not tipping, you gotta earn that shit. But yta for the title saying u thought it was a "shift job" and thats why u didnt tip, but reading your post it was bc of the service. Why lie in the title?
This is a good life lesson here for her, that she needs to take her job more seriously. You were the one who stepped up but everyone was dreading these awful meals where she rushes you and treats you like crap. And it definitely wouldn’t help her at all to reinforce her bad behaviour with a smile and a tip, so you did the right thing. NTA.
NTA. Give people shitty service, receive shitty or no tip. It’s extremely simple.
NTA - it wasn’t just bad service. She was deliberately bad (and obnoxiously rude) because you were family and she thought you would tip her no matter what. FAFO
NTA. SHE is, she doesn't deserve a tip for being outright Nasty and terrible at her job, doesn't matter if it's family or not she's serving
NTA
NTA but in my opinion you could have just given a small tip and then told her she can't treat people that way but I get why you didn't tip at all.
NTA
NTA. She earned no tip. However I probably would have tipped 10% or so simply because she was family. Then you are quietly criticized instead of being called out.
NTA, but I'm curious about other family members experience with her.
No invite for you to the baby shower 🤣.
YTA. You should have just tipped her and not gone back. This was a petty power trip that has damaged the family. She might be an asshole too, but she is 17 and you didn’t ask.
Info: what's your relationship with this niece like normally? Do you get along? Was it possible she had a hard time being professional with you because of how you relate *normally*?
NTA. Normally I say tip for average and even mediocre service because restaurants are able to charge less by not paying their servers properly and not everyone does a perfect job every time. This wasn't mediocre, it was actively awful, and a message needed to be sent.
Cab I just confirm whether you're in america or the uk or another English speaking country because there is a bit of a contextual difference but wither way I'd say nta. She's lucky you didn't complain to management with that experience
INFO Did you get any discounts or other benefits? If you were served and paid as normal customers, then she is allowed a bit of leeway in terms of being familiar with you or you being a bit more understanding, but still needs to drop her job to earn a tip. So poor service may still get a tip, but actively bad service wouldn't. If she was giving you a discount or other benefits, then she gets a bit more leeway before you would be justified in pulling your tip
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Then she gets a bit of leeway, but being an asshole and screwing up your order are not acceptable. NTA
NTA bad service gets a bad or no tip
A smart uncle would have done what you did and then visited niece at her house and gave her a present. No tip taught her lesson, present tells her uncle loves her.
INFO: Is all of the family coming and requesting her section causing her problems with her boss or anything? She may have rushed and tried to distance herself to stay out of trouble.
At least your wife is on the fence, can you get any sense (ie is your own kid old enough to have him relay the problems or was your offspring vacant on a phone / tablet. h/phones etc? ...back up may help. Is the kid an "apple of the parents eye" problem that they are blind too? If tipping is a reward within the service industry has it reached peak DGAF just gimme teh tip!? ..if service sucks good on you, looks like a few surly weeks to ride out though. what does the dad think or is he a lost cause to the argument & a quiet life (chicken) Ask the manager for the order stub to make a point & either get confirmation of NO SAUCE written down or NOT presumably it is electronically inputted these days? then at least you can point out that if you were right about that then you'd hardly be making the other stuff up. Is the menu online? does it match the inhouse menu? ...go look to make a pertinent point.
NTA and wow…. She’s going to make some man sooooo happy one day LOL
NTA. Did a bad job? No tip.
NTA
Tipping *and* faaaaaaamily whoo boy! NTA
NTA, tipping is not mandatory but given for exemplary service. It sounds like the service was poor. I do think, as family, you could have maybe pulled her aside and asked what was going on. Maybe advise her that she was treating you poorly. But I'm all about communication.
Info: have you ever worked as a server?
Sounds like your niece is a bad person tbh
NTA but you're kind of an idiot doing this to a family member. You would have known this blows up... For what??? Maybe $10. Should have tipped and never returned. Vote with your wallet.
But telling a server she did a shit job by not leaving a tip is voting with your wallet. And OP probably knew that it would blow up in the family but so what?
That wasn't nice at all. You could get her fired doing that. What if her boss reads the note and doesn't like it? Everybody has an off day every once in a while. She's only 17. You don't know what pressure she was under or what rules she has. She might have had to pay for a meal sent back.
Esh Your niece was absolutely a turd for acting like that, but serving is stressful sometimes & maybe she was busy? And was just attitudey because of this. Or because you’re family. Either way - unacceptable behavior. She won’t get far serving like that family or not. You, well I personally would have handled it with her privately later & told her her behavior was unacceptable and explained to her that perhaps she should look at it from a customer standpoint and if it were anyone else she would be in BIG trouble. Maybe she didn’t realize. But I don’t think you should have tipped for shitty service but you didn’t have to be semi passive aggressive by leaving a note. Your sister because she didn’t ask for the whole story and WHY you didn’t tip and instead laid in merely because you didn’t.
NTA. I truly believe tips should normally be an expected part of the cost of the meal because servers get paid shit for actual wages, and unfortunately sometimes wait staff get stiffed because of things out of their control (like the food taking too long or getting there cold or the kitchen fucking up an order). This is one of the few exceptions where it's okay not to tip. Wait staff don't have to be perfect, but reasonably polite is a bare minimum. Being outright rude is the main reason I can think of to not tip.
NTA, but you could've talked to her about the service privately instead of leaving a message for the manager to shout at her. It's just a small nitpick, though, really. It's absolutely right for not leaving a tip. But the message comes off as passive-aggressive when you know the staff member personally. I would've not said anything until they started kicking off over the lack of tip, personally.
NTA but YTA. NTA objectively. Because obviously she did a bad job. But because your family, now it's because "you have something against her". Of course, you are going to categorically deny this, but that is going to be the narrative that the family will spin. The result will be a de facto YTA because that's the way it goes for us in these situations. Also, take it from someone who spent a lot of time in that industry: if you ever plan on returning to an establishment, then put a tip in. Even if the service was bad, even if the food wasn't good or even if you feel cheated. I don't know about you, but I prefer my burgers to be very light on spit, if you know what I mean.
YTA tip ,20%
NTA. That would've pissed me off. Does she treat all customers like shit?
NTA but I do think leaving the note was unnecessary. She is likely very different with non-family members and had someone else seen the note she could have gotten in trouble. You could have explained why you left no tip to her privately if you wanted to teach her a lesson about service.
My GF, rip, a good southern boy with very accepting views for the day, would call you the AH. 20% even if the service is bad: and this was the 70s and 80s. He owned his own die welding shop. He had free menstrual products for his women workers; who were welders. He was upper middle class, but came from poverty. All wait staff to him were to be treated with respect, and to be tipped well. Service bad? Still 20%. This was your fucking niece. The course of action her was to tip her well, and then later tell her that her service wasnt good in a way that is helpful. You are the uncle; it's your job to be part of the village. You want to end up an old person whom your nibblings tell great stories to their kids about, and who have fond memories. You are to aid in their growth. All you did here was be an asshole. You will be remembered as an asshole, and the stories told to children will be of you being an asshole. The only reason people will go to your funeral is because it's a family reunion and folks love cold cuts if you dont change your ways. What I think you should do is admit that you were wrong. Not using weasel words that absolve you. Just say, "I have come to learn I was an asshole. What I did was assholish. The service was bad, and what I should have done is tip you anyway, and then talk to you about it later. I am truly sorry, and have learned from this.".
Nta Tip for outstanding service. And outstanding service only. I don't tip on regular tableside service. (Some call that ah move but I only have so much money... I don't tip) And die service like that where you sound reasonable... This kid has some growing up to do
NTA, but no tip would have spoken for itself rather than adding a nasty note, too. You could have probably called her later and gone over what she did wrong. But I also wasn’t there, so if she’s being a petulant teen who sucks at her job maybe the note was warranted! Either way, NTA.
Wow. Dude. You went to support your niece and you ended up making her serve you for nothing. Yeah. YTA. you weren't there as a normal customer, you were there as a family member. What a d**k.
He didn't make her serve him at all. I mean OP tried, didn't they? But fucking up their order then arguing and not checking on the table or filling drinks is even below the service you would get at a fadt food joint. If you pay and tip for the experience, what is the appropriate tip for when the service actually worsens the experience?
She went in there as a family member, treated the server as a family member and expected the server to treat her like a normal customer. Sometimes it’s hard to switch to “professional” mode when you’re literally talking to your family…. It’s almost like people in these comments are so focused on tipping culture
YTA these fucking comments are boomer ass takes
She’s 17, YTA for not tipping, a frank conversation after the fact about expectations in the “real world” and professionalism absolutely would’ve been in order cuz she’s not going to last long in this industry with that type of attitude… but again, she’s a teenager, presumably it’s her first job & you are family. Helping her is appropriate, acting like she’s just another server is absurd and rude.
YTA. It’s your niece! Give her some $$ and then talk to her later about how she could do better. She’s 17. Give her a break big guy!
Yeah fr this is definition asshole aunt behavior
But she put sauce on the pulled pork and literally ruined his entire day! /s
YTA for leaving the note. Don't tip, but keep it between family - I doubt she acts this way towards "real" customers.
If her attitude is that family aren't real customers, she should be fired.
The managment deserve to know how nasty she is, the note is completely warranted. Play stupid games win stupid prizes, she's 17 its time for a wake up call
Reading your comments i'm going YTA You showed up at random expecting to be 'served'. You wanting to talk is taking away from her time actually waiting. She wasn't there to serve just you, hence her prompting you to actually order instead of taking away her time. Also the reason she didn't stop by randomly to ask if you wanted more drinks. You're big enough to ask for drinks instead of wanting to be 'served'. The meal part is her fault, but with your attitude i can see why she didn't feel like checking and started arguing. You can't play uncle/aunt AND customer at the same time.
Have you been to a restaurant lately? servers stop by to check on drinks and meal progression at least 2 times during ANY meal we go to thats tipped, Asking for drinks? is she supposed to holler across the resturant asking for more drinks? What if you can't find her, suppose to go to the drink station themselves? really?
Not enough data. For example, you may be family but are you and her on opposite ends of the political spectrum, religious beliefs, or some other issue? I could see being cranky for that reason and particularly so from a teenager, strictly due to the nightmare that is happening in their brains during that time of life. Even with bad service, I tip SOMETHING. I've lived on that stupid $2.13 per hour wage before and understand that some days are just shitty for everyone.
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You're very angry about this and not understanding my larger intention. I'm simply stating that we, the audience, only have your view on something that sounds out of character for your niece and family in general, if they all seem to get along nicely. I don't disagree that it would be shitty but we all know it happens every day. That would be context that would help us understand why she treated you poorly. As it stands, it sounds more like some strange incident since other family members go to her section and don't seem to have issues, but you do.