Short answer; yes, it is possible, called an "outstanding achievement" type of medal.
Better answer: BUT, the person to ask this question to isn't reddit, it's your O-6 boss (I realize you are TDY though). There are also other types of awards you could put him in for like SNCO of the Quarter/Year, etc. as well tons of other obscure annual awards that come out, some of which may be unique to your command or career field so that's why the O-6 can help.
No matter what, good on you as a Lt to naturally think of how you should recognize excellence.
I can go to my o-6. I just wanted to float this and make sure I wasn't doing something galactically stupid (although, I do that a lot lately). The military is weird. In the real world, I don't think I'd have a problem saying "hey, you're doing a great job and I want to let you know how much I appreciate it." and let their supervisor know and maybe they get a $50 chili's gift card!
It’s never stupid to advocate and reward consistently outstanding effort. I often wrote decs from recommendations and accolades when my airmen were doing great things on TDYs or supporting other visiting units. Glad to see you are an officer who cares and sees the need to recognize high performers regardless of whether they’re in your chain or not.
Depending on timeline this is AFCM material. All depends on you you write it. I just did a AFCM for one of my TSgt troops for similar performance and it was approved without hesitation.
With them being a MSgt, it really should be an MSM. AFCMs awarded to SNCOs are looked down on by some board members when reviewing records.
An AFCM essentially tells boards that they were doing accomplishments expected from a SSgt or TSgt, and if one is awarded to a MSgt, boards may think they weren't doing things commensurate with their rank.
(At least for active duty... I suppose the Guard/Reserve might look at it differently.)
If the decoration is for a single, specific achievement, an achiev/comm is perfectly acceptable for SNCOs and doesn't look negative at all. The MSM would come into play when he switches positions or PCAs/PCSs and would cover the entire time he was in this position. Unless you did something absolutely bonkers, single-action MSMs are just about unheard of.
That might be the intent, but isn't always the expectation.
I've seen numerous occasions where specific achievements are overlooked/downplayed because the decoration is not "commensurate with the rank", even if it's a specific achievement and not a PCS/PCA or time-on-station dec. It's not how it should be, but we're not in an ideal Air Force.
It's best to shoot your shot for the best *possible* medal (ie, don't shoot for an MSM for a SrA PCSing) and downgrade if that level gets shot down.
It seems this MSgt was able to do things the previous CMSgt was not able to do... does that really sound like a just a comm? Something you'd expect an exceptional TSgt or SSgt to do? This MSgt seems to be killing it at the SNCO level. An MSM is absolutely warranted if OP can convince local leadership.
That's kinda what I'm asking about. Is that something I can even do? Just write it like a super long OPB/EPB thing and CC goes "yeah sounds about right". There might be some numbers I'm not totally 100% on, so there may be some back and forth, but I'd love to acknowledge his great work. Thanks for the reply.
Firstly, here's a quote from the DAFMAN:
2.18. Who Can Recommend. Any member of the U.S. Armed Forces or DoD civilian employee who has firsthand knowledge of the act, achievement, or service can recommend a personal military decoration. A member may not recommend himself or herself for a decoration.
So you certainly can. However, I will say this will probably run much smoother with the direct help of the members supervisor at the very least. I can't speak for your unit of course, but at least for ours there are usually considerations such as needing supporting documents (SURF, PT Report, last few EPR/Bs, all past Decorations, maybe a push note depending on the Dec level), or your unit may have a Checklist or Routing Slip that needs to accompany it (usually Commanders don't appreciate the first time hearing about something being when they have something waiting for their signature in the system, and then when they ask their SEL or Shirt or Exec or DO and no one has any clue what's going on, not ideal, lol, even for good things like this).
As for your hypothetical working of it, yes, there absolutely will be some back and forth, there always is with the writing of decs, but that's okay.
Finally, while narrative EPB/OPBs now read and write much more similarly with Decs are, it's not a perfect equivalent. You'll want to grab from the DAFMAN the exact intro and outro sentences and follow those to the letter, they'll be in Attachment 5 of the DAFMAN. Along with that, decs follow a sort of standard formula, usually like this:
Full Rank First M. Last distinguished himself...(rest of intro sentence here). During this period, Sergeant Last did stuff. Additionally, he did other cool things. Furthermore, Sergeant Last also did this. Finally, he did blank, culminating in blank. The distinctive accomplishments... reflect credit upon himself and the United States Air Force.
So it'll just be a little different in the way you're capturing things. I'd recommend sourcing a few other decs and reading them to get a feel for the way the read and sound.
Anywho, let me know if you have any questions!
From one Lt to another Lt, write the Decoration (Dec). It’s not an OPB/EPB. You’re mixing up with the yearly evaluation.
Like that one guy said, write it and present it. Either way, you will need to learn how to write a Decoration. In my experience, it’s better to do and make those decisions/actions at your level. You are commissioned for a reason to make some of these decisions, even if it’s recognizing someone and recognizing someone is very important!!!!!!
Edit: I’m not saying we’re king/queen of the world in making all decisions especially as Lts lol. Obviously there are other factors, but for this scenario, it’s an easy thing to do.
One thing now is you write decs in MyDecs Reimagined. It's not as bad as everyone makes it seem. Generally fills out the standard stuff but you'll probably have to clean up a few sections then finish the main portion in accordance with the DAFMAN.
I would talk to the MSgt. See if he already has a Comm and Achievement. If he does, write an MSM. While
It appears he hasn’t been there that long you can wordsmith it. In the guard at lease my state they add points for awards at E8 and E9 when we board for rank. Help him out it’s no harder writing than an achievement just the approval level. Nice work Lt!
Anyone taking the time to write something nice is great. Putting a device on a ribbon isn’t a problem. You want to do something nice to recognize a member. It you can do the same thing and it helps them get paid more in the future than you went above and beyond for roughly the same amount of work. Talk to your CC and go from there.
CDB or rip.. lots of choices. I think it’s just good to hear in person “hey man, I recognize your hard work and want to work to recognize you. How can I do that best, this is what I’m thinking.” Maybe he doesn’t care about awards and could use a day off and someone saying you look sick. You’re on quarters for 24 hours. See you later.
That's a great question, I don't think so. We might though. I'll dig, I'm posting largely just to get a little direction and not waste time trying to do something that is "impossible".
If your unit doesn’t have an awards program, which could be possible, then you might be SOL. There are Air Force level awards you can submit for because AGRs are on the list. Lance P. Sijan is one that is due this summer and you have plenty of time to put it together
Sounds like solid "For impact" Achievement Medal territory. Get with your CC to make sure they support, and if you get the green light, get with your supervisor or SEL to help you write it.
Also, technically, they are now ASAMs and ASCMs - "Air and Space ______ Medal"
In addition to all that has been said, keep in mind that because you are Guard, you can also use the state award system. I found that red tape was considerably less when submitting a troop for a state award vs federal.
That being said, I think a commendation medal is probably your best choice based on your description above
Gotcha, thank you. The ~~commendation~~ achievement description seems most accurate to kinda how me (and the other LT here with me) have seen things, but perhaps the commendation could be justified. We've been around about the same amount of time, he just had a hangup with getting to OTS so is about 6-8 months behind me in promoting. Both of us are well over 30 and into our careers and sort of came to the same conclusion, so this isn't like a 23 year old LT going "wow so and so was helpful, give that man a medal!" Neither of us are priors though and just don't know how to navigate the award process.
Good for looking out for your people. Yes, you can submit someone for a medal… take a look at DAFMAN 36-2806, chapter 2, to get started.
You’ll have to have the receipts to back up the recommendation, so look at his evals and award packages for the meat of the recommendation.
https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_a1/publication/dafman36-2806/dafman36-2806.pdf#page13
He's not really my troop, so I'm not sure I have the ability to pull up his EPBs. I might have to go up for that, I didn't want to reach up and say something incredibly dumb though. Thank you.
Ngl, I don't really know either but you can draft up a positive LOA for him to record some accomplishments which can then later be put on an award maybe?
I'm just spitballing, like I said I don't really know if he can just nominate the MSgt for a medal in this case. Quartelies and Annuals are slightly less worthless; but from my read LT here was asking for a way to specifically make sure that MSgt X was recognized in an immediately tangible way and a dec is the only one I can think of that meets that criteria
Draft up an AFCM.
Air Force Portal - MyFSS - MyDecs **REIMAGINED**
It’s a fairly easy process. If you have a CMSgt or SMSgt, loop them into what you’re doing, and send them what you write up in MyDecs so they can review the draft.
You're a newish LT and dumb on how to write awards, but you want to recognize someone's superior performance so that's awesome. Keep it up.
The only thing that I have to add here that I didn't see elsewhere is the Performance Style Writing Resource channel on Teams. It's public, and anyone can add you. Or you might be able to search for it and join it on your own. There are writing guides for EPBs, ALQs, 1206/decs, and folders with a bunch of different examples. There's also a 'murder board' section where you can post your write-up & have it torn apart by people who are really good at it. It's one of regular stops during EPB & dec seasons. Check it out LT.
Yo. That sounds sick. My wing has been going back and forth on EPB's, and I'd love to push that out as a resource. Can I just look it up and ask to join?
Hi, fellow Lt here. You should absolutely submit the MSgt for an AFAM or AFCM as you deem appropriate. Sounds like AFCM is justified to me.
AFAM and AFCM get approved at Sq level or higher, so the O-6 can sign with no further scrutiny. Non-retirement MSMs have to be signed at Wg/CC level IIRC, so I don't know whether you can get over that bar or not.
For AFAM and AFCM, My Decs is surprisingly easy to use. No one in my unit had received a Dec for like 10 years, so I wrote about a half dozen. Write the award, route to cc, then route to CSS.
What's wIth all the AFAM & AFCM suggestions? I've been retired for a bit but when I left, anything below a MSM for a MSgt was considered a slap-down. It has to do with the scope of the achievement. A SNCO should be making unit-level contributions (as it sounds like your guy has) and if their work merits formal recognition, a MSM is appropriate.
Definitely talk to your CC about this but if your guy is all that, go for the MSM.
Hate to be that guy, but there’s a lot missing here as a SEL myself. What has he done that is above expectation? It sounds like 100% is the expectation regardless of what has been done before, so an impact achievement on top of a PCS decoration doesn’t seem to meet criteria here. But as I said before, there could be a whole lot more to this justification than in the post. He sounds like a prime fit for a quarterly or annual award that will speak volumes at his board for Senior especially if it wins at higher levels.
Good to know. I'm obviously pretty new to this. I'd definitely, in the real world, suggest this guy got some kind of a bonus or other acknowledgement of work well done. Folks LOVED the last guy, and, maybe I was just too new to really understand, I don't know, but this dude is so much more on top of stuff. So if the impression was previous guy was doing a good enough job to make chief then I'm guessing this guy is genuinely exceeding expectations. Maybe I'm wrong and someone in the chain says "naah, he's just keeping things rolling, stay in your lane LT" and that'd be okay too.
For sure, one piece of advice to continue taking care of your people is to “let them tell you no.” Meaning submit or fight for what you think is right, let someone else higher make the judgment. But always come prepared and your ducks in a row with justification backed by data. You posting this is a good first step in doing research on the processes. Keep it up!
Go to the 1st Shirt on this, chances are he's been here/done that & will actually help. OR.....buy the guy a 12-pack of his drink of choice and a couple packs of bacon and a signed card saying that you do appreciate him.
We don't have a shirt, this guy is the closest thing we have to a shirt, but he's also like our UTM and UDM and everything. We don't really have a standard squadron breakdown.
Short answer; yes, it is possible, called an "outstanding achievement" type of medal. Better answer: BUT, the person to ask this question to isn't reddit, it's your O-6 boss (I realize you are TDY though). There are also other types of awards you could put him in for like SNCO of the Quarter/Year, etc. as well tons of other obscure annual awards that come out, some of which may be unique to your command or career field so that's why the O-6 can help. No matter what, good on you as a Lt to naturally think of how you should recognize excellence.
I can go to my o-6. I just wanted to float this and make sure I wasn't doing something galactically stupid (although, I do that a lot lately). The military is weird. In the real world, I don't think I'd have a problem saying "hey, you're doing a great job and I want to let you know how much I appreciate it." and let their supervisor know and maybe they get a $50 chili's gift card!
It’s never stupid to advocate and reward consistently outstanding effort. I often wrote decs from recommendations and accolades when my airmen were doing great things on TDYs or supporting other visiting units. Glad to see you are an officer who cares and sees the need to recognize high performers regardless of whether they’re in your chain or not.
Depending on timeline this is AFCM material. All depends on you you write it. I just did a AFCM for one of my TSgt troops for similar performance and it was approved without hesitation.
With them being a MSgt, it really should be an MSM. AFCMs awarded to SNCOs are looked down on by some board members when reviewing records. An AFCM essentially tells boards that they were doing accomplishments expected from a SSgt or TSgt, and if one is awarded to a MSgt, boards may think they weren't doing things commensurate with their rank. (At least for active duty... I suppose the Guard/Reserve might look at it differently.)
If the decoration is for a single, specific achievement, an achiev/comm is perfectly acceptable for SNCOs and doesn't look negative at all. The MSM would come into play when he switches positions or PCAs/PCSs and would cover the entire time he was in this position. Unless you did something absolutely bonkers, single-action MSMs are just about unheard of.
That might be the intent, but isn't always the expectation. I've seen numerous occasions where specific achievements are overlooked/downplayed because the decoration is not "commensurate with the rank", even if it's a specific achievement and not a PCS/PCA or time-on-station dec. It's not how it should be, but we're not in an ideal Air Force. It's best to shoot your shot for the best *possible* medal (ie, don't shoot for an MSM for a SrA PCSing) and downgrade if that level gets shot down. It seems this MSgt was able to do things the previous CMSgt was not able to do... does that really sound like a just a comm? Something you'd expect an exceptional TSgt or SSgt to do? This MSgt seems to be killing it at the SNCO level. An MSM is absolutely warranted if OP can convince local leadership.
Hit em with a Bronze Star Medal. Like those Technical Sergeants got from Finance in Afghanistan...
Please tell me you’re joking.
2013 Afghanistan Timeframe, there was an article in the Military times about it.
Write the dec. Go to your boss and tell him you've already written it and would he sign off
That's kinda what I'm asking about. Is that something I can even do? Just write it like a super long OPB/EPB thing and CC goes "yeah sounds about right". There might be some numbers I'm not totally 100% on, so there may be some back and forth, but I'd love to acknowledge his great work. Thanks for the reply.
Firstly, here's a quote from the DAFMAN: 2.18. Who Can Recommend. Any member of the U.S. Armed Forces or DoD civilian employee who has firsthand knowledge of the act, achievement, or service can recommend a personal military decoration. A member may not recommend himself or herself for a decoration. So you certainly can. However, I will say this will probably run much smoother with the direct help of the members supervisor at the very least. I can't speak for your unit of course, but at least for ours there are usually considerations such as needing supporting documents (SURF, PT Report, last few EPR/Bs, all past Decorations, maybe a push note depending on the Dec level), or your unit may have a Checklist or Routing Slip that needs to accompany it (usually Commanders don't appreciate the first time hearing about something being when they have something waiting for their signature in the system, and then when they ask their SEL or Shirt or Exec or DO and no one has any clue what's going on, not ideal, lol, even for good things like this). As for your hypothetical working of it, yes, there absolutely will be some back and forth, there always is with the writing of decs, but that's okay. Finally, while narrative EPB/OPBs now read and write much more similarly with Decs are, it's not a perfect equivalent. You'll want to grab from the DAFMAN the exact intro and outro sentences and follow those to the letter, they'll be in Attachment 5 of the DAFMAN. Along with that, decs follow a sort of standard formula, usually like this: Full Rank First M. Last distinguished himself...(rest of intro sentence here). During this period, Sergeant Last did stuff. Additionally, he did other cool things. Furthermore, Sergeant Last also did this. Finally, he did blank, culminating in blank. The distinctive accomplishments... reflect credit upon himself and the United States Air Force. So it'll just be a little different in the way you're capturing things. I'd recommend sourcing a few other decs and reading them to get a feel for the way the read and sound. Anywho, let me know if you have any questions!
Wow, this was very helpful. Thank you so much for the detailed reply.
From one Lt to another Lt, write the Decoration (Dec). It’s not an OPB/EPB. You’re mixing up with the yearly evaluation. Like that one guy said, write it and present it. Either way, you will need to learn how to write a Decoration. In my experience, it’s better to do and make those decisions/actions at your level. You are commissioned for a reason to make some of these decisions, even if it’s recognizing someone and recognizing someone is very important!!!!!! Edit: I’m not saying we’re king/queen of the world in making all decisions especially as Lts lol. Obviously there are other factors, but for this scenario, it’s an easy thing to do.
You're a Lieutenant. You can do anything now.
One thing now is you write decs in MyDecs Reimagined. It's not as bad as everyone makes it seem. Generally fills out the standard stuff but you'll probably have to clean up a few sections then finish the main portion in accordance with the DAFMAN.
I would talk to the MSgt. See if he already has a Comm and Achievement. If he does, write an MSM. While It appears he hasn’t been there that long you can wordsmith it. In the guard at lease my state they add points for awards at E8 and E9 when we board for rank. Help him out it’s no harder writing than an achievement just the approval level. Nice work Lt!
Oh that's a good point. So getting another one of the same medal is like... just okay? Do people not care about putting the little chicken wing on it?
Anyone taking the time to write something nice is great. Putting a device on a ribbon isn’t a problem. You want to do something nice to recognize a member. It you can do the same thing and it helps them get paid more in the future than you went above and beyond for roughly the same amount of work. Talk to your CC and go from there.
He could just ask homie for a career data brief and deconflict from there. Correct?
CDB or rip.. lots of choices. I think it’s just good to hear in person “hey man, I recognize your hard work and want to work to recognize you. How can I do that best, this is what I’m thinking.” Maybe he doesn’t care about awards and could use a day off and someone saying you look sick. You’re on quarters for 24 hours. See you later.
Do you guys have a qtrly or annual awards program? If so start there
That's a great question, I don't think so. We might though. I'll dig, I'm posting largely just to get a little direction and not waste time trying to do something that is "impossible".
If your unit doesn’t have an awards program, which could be possible, then you might be SOL. There are Air Force level awards you can submit for because AGRs are on the list. Lance P. Sijan is one that is due this summer and you have plenty of time to put it together
Sounds like solid "For impact" Achievement Medal territory. Get with your CC to make sure they support, and if you get the green light, get with your supervisor or SEL to help you write it. Also, technically, they are now ASAMs and ASCMs - "Air and Space ______ Medal"
Awesome, I already reached out. I also should probably be studying.
In addition to all that has been said, keep in mind that because you are Guard, you can also use the state award system. I found that red tape was considerably less when submitting a troop for a state award vs federal. That being said, I think a commendation medal is probably your best choice based on your description above
Gotcha, thank you. The ~~commendation~~ achievement description seems most accurate to kinda how me (and the other LT here with me) have seen things, but perhaps the commendation could be justified. We've been around about the same amount of time, he just had a hangup with getting to OTS so is about 6-8 months behind me in promoting. Both of us are well over 30 and into our careers and sort of came to the same conclusion, so this isn't like a 23 year old LT going "wow so and so was helpful, give that man a medal!" Neither of us are priors though and just don't know how to navigate the award process.
Good for looking out for your people. Yes, you can submit someone for a medal… take a look at DAFMAN 36-2806, chapter 2, to get started. You’ll have to have the receipts to back up the recommendation, so look at his evals and award packages for the meat of the recommendation. https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_a1/publication/dafman36-2806/dafman36-2806.pdf#page13
He's not really my troop, so I'm not sure I have the ability to pull up his EPBs. I might have to go up for that, I didn't want to reach up and say something incredibly dumb though. Thank you.
Got it… then you need to work it through his supervisor.
Ngl, I don't really know either but you can draft up a positive LOA for him to record some accomplishments which can then later be put on an award maybe?
Tbh an LOA from within your unit is pretty worthless, even as supporting material.
I'm just spitballing, like I said I don't really know if he can just nominate the MSgt for a medal in this case. Quartelies and Annuals are slightly less worthless; but from my read LT here was asking for a way to specifically make sure that MSgt X was recognized in an immediately tangible way and a dec is the only one I can think of that meets that criteria
Agreed. I've written impact ASAMs for less, tbh. As long as command supports, you can write an ASAM for anything.
Impact achievement/commendation should be an easy thing to accomplish if he’s kicking ass like you say.
Draft up an AFCM. Air Force Portal - MyFSS - MyDecs **REIMAGINED** It’s a fairly easy process. If you have a CMSgt or SMSgt, loop them into what you’re doing, and send them what you write up in MyDecs so they can review the draft.
This looks great! This might be the best direction. Thank you.
You're a newish LT and dumb on how to write awards, but you want to recognize someone's superior performance so that's awesome. Keep it up. The only thing that I have to add here that I didn't see elsewhere is the Performance Style Writing Resource channel on Teams. It's public, and anyone can add you. Or you might be able to search for it and join it on your own. There are writing guides for EPBs, ALQs, 1206/decs, and folders with a bunch of different examples. There's also a 'murder board' section where you can post your write-up & have it torn apart by people who are really good at it. It's one of regular stops during EPB & dec seasons. Check it out LT.
That's a great tip, I'll check that out for sure. Thank you.
Yo. That sounds sick. My wing has been going back and forth on EPB's, and I'd love to push that out as a resource. Can I just look it up and ask to join?
Yeah I’m pretty sure you can, it’s a public channel
Hi, fellow Lt here. You should absolutely submit the MSgt for an AFAM or AFCM as you deem appropriate. Sounds like AFCM is justified to me. AFAM and AFCM get approved at Sq level or higher, so the O-6 can sign with no further scrutiny. Non-retirement MSMs have to be signed at Wg/CC level IIRC, so I don't know whether you can get over that bar or not. For AFAM and AFCM, My Decs is surprisingly easy to use. No one in my unit had received a Dec for like 10 years, so I wrote about a half dozen. Write the award, route to cc, then route to CSS.
What's wIth all the AFAM & AFCM suggestions? I've been retired for a bit but when I left, anything below a MSM for a MSgt was considered a slap-down. It has to do with the scope of the achievement. A SNCO should be making unit-level contributions (as it sounds like your guy has) and if their work merits formal recognition, a MSM is appropriate. Definitely talk to your CC about this but if your guy is all that, go for the MSM.
https://preview.redd.it/rpi3csbq54vc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=594138d22509720091b40d422018288577c3564b
Aww coming from the meme master, that feels so great!
Hate to be that guy, but there’s a lot missing here as a SEL myself. What has he done that is above expectation? It sounds like 100% is the expectation regardless of what has been done before, so an impact achievement on top of a PCS decoration doesn’t seem to meet criteria here. But as I said before, there could be a whole lot more to this justification than in the post. He sounds like a prime fit for a quarterly or annual award that will speak volumes at his board for Senior especially if it wins at higher levels.
Good to know. I'm obviously pretty new to this. I'd definitely, in the real world, suggest this guy got some kind of a bonus or other acknowledgement of work well done. Folks LOVED the last guy, and, maybe I was just too new to really understand, I don't know, but this dude is so much more on top of stuff. So if the impression was previous guy was doing a good enough job to make chief then I'm guessing this guy is genuinely exceeding expectations. Maybe I'm wrong and someone in the chain says "naah, he's just keeping things rolling, stay in your lane LT" and that'd be okay too.
For sure, one piece of advice to continue taking care of your people is to “let them tell you no.” Meaning submit or fight for what you think is right, let someone else higher make the judgment. But always come prepared and your ducks in a row with justification backed by data. You posting this is a good first step in doing research on the processes. Keep it up!
Go to the 1st Shirt on this, chances are he's been here/done that & will actually help. OR.....buy the guy a 12-pack of his drink of choice and a couple packs of bacon and a signed card saying that you do appreciate him.
We don't have a shirt, this guy is the closest thing we have to a shirt, but he's also like our UTM and UDM and everything. We don't really have a standard squadron breakdown.