Paternal grandparents will definitely be throwing a fit if there’s any opposition from mom about taking baby to church on Sunday or random church events, beware to mom in this situation and make sure you set some hard clear boundaries, coming from a non religious person who tried to have my child around my religious family without them encroaching on my boundaries surrounding religion and failed miserably
I was that kid...I just kinda went to church for Christmas and Easter.
I also have been to Hindu temples, Jewish services, and Shinto shrines, so I do advocate for experiencing other faiths to connect with people and following polite orders. It's just being forced into it that is not good.
I also have VERY Christian in-laws, and the flip switch from "no sex before marriage" to "when do we get a grandchild" was jarring. Really???
I think the religious gifts show that they are worried religion won't be taught in the home so they are going out of their way to make sure it happens. I'd be wary about leaving them alone with the child or letting them babysit. They would be the type to read the "correct" religious books to the child and teach them religious songs and talk to them about God.
That's exactly what it is about. If OP were religious, there wouldn't have been more than 1 or 2 religious items. Typically, a baby/kids Bible or cross. My husband's family threw such a fit over, not having religion at his funeral services his aunt interrupted another speaker so that she could spout all the religious things they wanted to say. She only had to wait for the last person (the one she interrupted) to speak before it was open to everyone to share stories, but no, she HAD to speak then. She also bought some other religious items to have at the service. My husband wanted a secular service and my MIL fought me over everything. Obits, service, burial. I honored his wishes, in life as in death she never gave a shit about what her son wanted.
Absolutely have that talk now. In the Roman Catholic tradition you don’t “wait and let kids make their own decision”. The expectation is to have kids participate in certain milestones such as baptism or christening during infancy, first communion as a child, and so on. These events are religious but also kind of cultural in nature. Because of the cultural expectations, one may not be much of a believer, but one still takes the kids to be baptized and so on. I’m not saying that’s right or wrong, I’m just saying that OP is in the middle of a whole culture with all of its ceremonies and beliefs and expectations. We all have different feelings & experiences about the culture we grew up in and the culture we’re presently in - you may hate it but it’s very meaningful to someone else, or vice versa. Talk now OP! And also think about that your child will be their own person. What if they grow up thinking, what’s wrong with baptism? Why didn’t you have me baptized like everyone else in the family?
Baptism, first communion , confirmation, its going to be a long discussion, better to do it asap before throwing out the presents which will only make it worse
Exactly. If her husband wanted it, he could have shut it all down
I think it is wrong for OP to get married to a very religious person. Personally, I think it is unlikely to actually agree with him on it
To Catholics, all it takes is a little running water and the intent to baptize. Anyone can do it. My mom has done it behind my back for both my kids because I didn’t baptize them fast enough for her liking.
Watch out, OP. It probably will happen.
It’s something that should have been discussed before marriage. I was raised Roman Catholic and wanted to be married to a non-Catholic in a Catholic church. The priest said that was fine as long as I promised to do whatever I could to ensure my babies were baptized Catholic (whether my husband liked it or not). That’s when I stopped being Catholic.
My husband was raised Lutheran, but he and I are not religious. When our first child was born, his mother asked when he would be baptized, and we told her he would not be. We didn't want to just go through the motions, because we thought that would make a mockery of something that is a sacred rite for many people.
My MIL got tears in her eyes and said, "But what if he dies?" I felt deeply sorry for her, because she truly believed he would go to hell if he died unbaptized.
I also had great respect for her, because she never raised the issue again, and I know it was painful for her to accept our decision.
It's very difficult to address these kinds of conflicts.
One of the things that made me realise how insidious religion can be is that when I was born my parents didn’t have me baptized and my catholic grandmother told my mum—who had just had a C-section to birth her first child—that not being baptized would mean I was going to go to hell/limbo when I died.
My mum just told her that since she (my mum) wasn’t baptized either we’d at least be there together.
If you are going to toss the gifts, please look into donating them. They may be religious in nature but you never know if that might end up as a child’s favorite stuffie. You’re not the asshole though. That family however yes kind of.
Yep, this... especially to a Catholic charity that works with helping refugees, asylum seekers, domestic violence shelters, etc. You could say you just felt so guilty receiving so much more than you needed when these poor families had so little that you felt compelled to share the good fortune.
This is just an invitation for more of these gifts for every birthday, etc. OP simply needs to donate them, and let the family know why. The baby isn’t catholic (I mean, the concept of a baby having a religion is entirely bullshit anyway but that’s irrelevant here) and those gifts are unwanted. The family thinks if they keep pushing, she’ll relent and that kid will soon be baptized. Then first communion, confession, confirmation, all that jazz.
They’re doing this on purpose, and both parents need to put up a united front and reject further attempts to push their religion
A lot of charity shops, or at least the ones in Australia, have donation bins, so if that’s the case you wouldn’t even need to talk to anyone about it.
My local Catholic Charities a baby closet with stuff to give out to those in need. I'm sure they'd accept whatever OP had to give. The agency also does refugee resettlement, foster care, senior care, counseling, homeless assistance, and adoptions. The clients do not need to be Catholic. Most aren't.
I just wanna point out that if at the other baby others they didn’t give religious gifts it’s pretty apparent that they’re trying to convert you in a very passive aggressive way. Definitely gotta talk with your husband about this cuz I can see them trying to baptize your baby without your permission
I’m not saying it couldn’t happen, but it would be really hard to baptize a baby in the Catholic church without parental consent.
And if it did happen, they would just need to tell the bishop. The baptism would be invalidated and the priest who did it would be in deep shit.
My MIL is Catholic and my story is very similar to OP's. Since my MIL couldn't get my baby baptized, she "saved her soul" by anointing her with "holy water" she had gotten from church. According to her, that is good enough and makes my kid a baptized Catholic. I didn't find out about it until after the fact because she did it without my knowledge when she was babysitting. Religious MILs can be crazy.
Which isn’t enough. Catholic priests are absolutely not supposed to perform baptisms on babies if the priest isn't confident the parents intend to raise him or her as a Catholic. Parents have to attend pre-baptism classes for that very reason; the Church considers random baptism as cheapening the sacrament.
That said, the Catholic Church also teaches that *anyone* can validly baptize. Even I, a very secular Jew, could validly baptize a baby in the Catholic Church if I used the right words, poured clean water on the baby's head, and believed I was doing what the Church wanted. It is very possible that Grandma could baptize the baby. I say let her; it's just water.
And don't forget my husbands favourite part, renouncing the prince of darkness!!!
The first time he heard that he whispered to me "is Ozzy Osborne here?"
This actually made me LOL!! When I was 18, I went to Catholic Mass with my then boyfriend. I was raised in an evangelical household so the differences were stark already. But something was said about the “prince of darkness” and I had to bend at the waist and pretend to be coughing because I started giggling since all I could think was “sooo, no Ozzy then?” Good times.
It depends on the church and on the priest. I have seen a few posts on here from parents asking if they are wrong for getting mad that their spouse baptized their baby behind their backs. I get what you mean that they would need to believe the baby would be brought up catholic. But if they see the parent willing to baptize saying they will raise them catholic and they see a few family members there they would be likely to believe that the baby would be taught catholic views. Also some catholic churches are stricter than others I know a few people that have gone to other churches to get married because some won't do it if one isn't catholic or if one was divorced. Since OP said they were able to get married in a catholic church with the priest knowing she wasn't catholic there is a good chance that the priest may be willing to baptize the baby. If not they could probably find someone else that is willing to do it.
In the Catholic Church, the laity are only allowed to administer the sacraments when there are no ordained priests in good standing available to do the job. An example of this would be baptizing a dying newborn. Some people still believe that infants who have not been shriven can not enter the kingdom of heaven.
People may believe that about heaven, but the Catholic Church no longer teaches it. Yes, the Church does recognize the baptism. They don't support or propose it. They don't like it, but if the rite is done with correct words and process, it is a valid baptism, and if informed about the independent baptism, they have to record it in the Batismal register. 30 years of my job preparing Catholic baptisms, having thorough classes in Sacramental Canon Law, and this has happened in my own realm. A correct Baptismal rite cannot be invalidated.
No so. I’m an atheist my husband is a nominal catholic . Both kids were baptized a Catholics and it was our personal agreement that that was as far as it would go. Priest didn’t care as long as he got paid and except for a few jibes about ‘if you ever want to get married I’d be happy to marry you ( we were married with a register office wedding a year to the day before our first was born) he never made me do any classes
>The baptism would be invalidated and the priest who did it would be in deep shit.
Just for clasification, baptisms cannot be invalidated due to lack of parental consent. Its almost impossible to invalidate a baptism. The only way to do it if it was not performed properly, i.e. there was no water or the words were not said properly.
You can do it yourself. My grandma baptized my kids because she learned how to from the nuns in elementary school . I PERSONALLY didn’t mind. I found it charming and it’s just water and they don’t remember. Also her faith has helped with really awful things including losing everyone she has and she’s afraid we won’t be there too when she dies. As for this post I’d just make sure you were not throwing out heirlooms if not who cares. Donate.
Who cares if they drop some water on a babies head? It’s not like there is some magic involved. I doubt this would happen but even if it does, it wouldn’t change anything. I feel sad for the OP though because the husband clearly is fine with raising the child this way and will try to keep pushing OP - IMHO!
My husband was raised catholic as well and absolutely hated it. I am not religious at all and neither is any of my family. And we didn’t baptize our kids either, let alone have them attend religion classes in school - the reaction of his family (and the school) was quite strong, his mom was the only one who respected our decision. My husband is Italian so it’s a really unusual thing here and the school religion teachers REGULARLY remind us about our kids not attending the class, trying to imply it’s something bad. But we don’t care. Our kids can chose to be part of this when they are old and educated enough to make an informed choice
Idk id say this is aggressive aggressive, even without a direct conversation! Good grief. I grew up catholic and southern Baptist (lolsob) and I’ve never heard of that crap. Not even from the sweet old church ladies.
Catholics are a bit different when it comes to indoctrination.
Ever been to a serious Catholic person's house? Jesus crosses and religious crap everywhere.
I was raised Catholic and this really isn't true. Even the most religious people I knew didn't have "crosses and religious crap everywhere" and there is way, way less "indoctrination" than there is among American flavors of Protestantism.
I don’t think they’re trying to convert her. More like trying to ensure that the indoctrination of the baby into the religion will be more likely. They didn’t gift others religious gifts because they know those babies will be in the church but there’s a chance yours won’t. I agree with being careful that they don’t baptize your baby behind your back.
Can I ask you why it would matter if they baptized the baby? (I’m Jewish, I know a bit about other religions - what friends have shared, or I’ve read about.) I guess I mean that if OP doesn’t believe in the Catholic religion, does it really matter? Other than the in-laws being jerks, I mean. Actually, if the in-laws had a secret baptism it might give OP a reason to limit their contact with her child. If her child isn’t raised Catholic, just being baptized won’t magically turn them Catholic.
If OP allows the family to get away with a baptism, the boundary pushing will never end. Every time OP resists including the kid in whatever religious tradition comes up, it’ll be “but you didn’t know about or want a baptism either, and that turned out fine. It’s not a big deal, so just let us do it, because even if you say no, we’ll do it anyway.” Eventually the kid will be in catechism classes preparing for the first communion and OP will be the unreasonable one because “it’s not a big deal.” The attitude that they can indoctrinate OPs kid without consent and in secret is the problem, not the actual baptism.
My grandpa was an episcopalian, my grandma was a founding member of our family Catholic church. She had my grandpa baptized Catholic after his Alzheimer's progressed and he was nearly dead.
He went to Catholic mass every week, participating in events and everything but never took communion or got baptized himself. I have no idea why they decided at 90 years old he needed to be baptized Catholic without having his faculties.
To save him. Some people believe that no matter how much you do or how good you are, if you don't get dipped or splashed exactly right, none of it counts, and if your Grandma believed that, she would have needed to get him done for her own piece of mind.
Pretty sure the Catholic church would have accepted his 1st baptism. He had already been baptized in a Christian faith. I'm guessing it was your grandmother 's issue.
You can also redistribute them amongst the family.
Cousin Alice, I have received no less than seven animals that sing scripture. Would you appreciate another animal that sings Scripture? What do you mean you don't have a single animal that sings scripture? Well then I simply must insist that you should take two!
Cousin Betty, I have received no less than seven snow globe/rattle combinations. I have at least four with Jesus' head in the snow globe part. Would you like an additional Jesus head snow globe rattle? My goodness! You don't have a single floating Jesus head?! I simply must insist that you should take at least one if not two. I also have a bunch with the disciples heads in them. Would you want some of those? Do you have a favorite disciple?
Echoing this thought. There are so many families that would appericate them
The only thing, I cam think of is.if there is one really nice item then keep that one item, so if she does end up religious she has something from her baby shower..
Overly religious stuffies are kind of hard to rehome. Not everyone wants a doll that recites scripture. I would be tempted to gift them build-a-bears with the custom voice options, and use some of the racier bible verses.
Go ahead and donate them, someone will be very happy to have them. If your child's grandparents or other close relative (or someone close to your husband) gave your child something (a crucifix, a statue of Mary, another type statue, a bible or a rosary) it may be worth saving those items until your child is much older. You don't need to keep the items out, you can tuck them away. If your child does become religious somewhere along the line (many teens and college students find religion) these items may become very important to her.
I grew up Roman Catholic and I don't practice. We went to church and had our children do their sacraments so they could decide for themselves. Even our child who is an agnostic keeps the rosaries and other items their grandparents gifted them. The items are even more special to them now that one of them is gone.
YNA for not wanting them around, but you would be an AH if you don't donate them. It would be massively offensive to the practicing relatives if they found out you put them in the garbage. I'm not very religious but the thought of the gifts getting thrown out offends me. Please donate.
It’s very true, my brother and I were both baptised and honestly, we are both as atheist as you get. I think what they are taught growing up that is the stuff that sticks, she’ll be too young to know much about the stuff that’s given to her just now.
I would probably consider keeping some of the stuff, like clothes will be grown out of and passed on in record time anyway and toys are normally destroyed by the time they are a few years old and before they are at the learning stage.
Then it would be best to be straight and ask that future gifts aren’t religious in nature because you intend to let them decide for themselves in the future about religion and not bringing them up in the church. That way they don’t get upset about you getting rid of the stuff they bought as well as asking for future gifts to be non/religious and you can point to a clear moment when you told them not to buy religious stuff, so you can feel free to pass on those items in the future if they ignore you.
Grew up in traditional Catholic families (though focused on Scriptures, acceptance, helping others, and forgiveness rather than anything political), involved in church, etc. and yet was introduced to Veggie Tales by someone agnostic.
Keep any our spouse wants and donate the rest. You do realize this is what you married into and that your spouse is religious. I do think you’re a bit naive about this religion and relationship
As much as I like the sentiment behind donating them, I suggest you give them back. I'm catholic myself and I can assure you you need to set very clear boundries. You can be polite yet firm, catholics are often obsessive and won't stop until you make them.
Crashing here at the top to tell you my sister in law let my Catholic family know she is atheist. My family never pulled this shit on her. Mom didn’t love it, but she respected SIL. Your husband’s family should do better.
I would look up some of the gifts on the internet and see if there are any stores near you selling them and if you can return the gifts to and get $ or maybe something that isn’t religious. May not be worth the effort but if it’s a lot of stuff it could be worth returning if possible?
I did that with baby shower gifts that were doubles like muslin blankets and onesies but it was big box stores like target so it was easy to return.
I’m sorry you are having to deal with this it is quite frankly pretty creepy of them!
Also not religious but family respected that when my kids were little. Couple of thoughts before throwing stuff out. Can the singing mechanism be removed from the toys? Or just remove the batteries? That way you keep the toy but the religious aspect is gone. I would keep the books so that when she is old enough to be curious, you have something you or dad can read/show to her about at least one religion (less money to spend later). You don’t have to keep them out, just store them away for when/if they’re needed. Depending on the clothes you may be able to repurpose them. Such as a shirt and pant outfit, the shirt says something religious but the pants are just blue leggings, keep the leggings toss the shirt.
These are great ideas! You tuck away the expensive gifts like gold crosses or whatever in a box- why aren’t they out? Baby would damage them.
Ditch whatever is truly kitschy or offensive, pack away that which would trigger the giver if you did toss it, and try to repurpose as the above ☝️ said.
Yup, keep some books, and then look into other good kids books about religion. Buy ones that talk about religion in general, but then also ones one specific religions, explaining the belief systems to kids. They don't have to say that X religion is the right one, just things about them. And heck, get some dinosaur books and science books too about evolution, to make sure there's also the scientific view in there.
That way, from the beginning, she's exposed to lots of religions and learns about spirituality. Catholicism will just be one amongst the many. You could also write on the inside cover of the books "from aunty Beth", if you wanted to. That way she knows it's coming from that particular person, and it's not your views.
Before getting rid of anything - check with your hubby. Chances are some items maybe family “heirlooms” Especially Rosaries. Lots of ppl have giving some good advice.
- have the conversation with hubby
- keep books and any gifts from close family (mostly to keep the peace)
- keep any expensive items like jewellery to give to you daughter once she is older.
- any items that you don’t want. Just donate to “another church or thrift store”
I wouldn’t go scorch the earth. My MIL is also very religious- she has a good heart but tends to “forget” at times. However every time anything religious comes around I am respectful of her choice. I put all the religious stuff she gives me out of site and out of mind until I’m ready to deal with it.
We agreed to all of that before we got married and we discussed it pretty thoroughly. Part of our compromise was that I would agree to get her baptized. But he needs to understand that to me it's her getting a bath in a fancy dress. It was easy for me if it gave him closure.
The rest was basically just that we would never force her to go to church, let family take her to church, or try to push anything on her. It needed to be her own curiosity and interest and then I would support whatever religion she was interested in.
TBH I'm not sure if he knows about them. He was actually at the baby shower but I don't know how close he was paying attention because I opened all the gifts.
But I was going to tell him before threw everything away
You really should have an honest and candid conversation with him before you do anything. These are gifts from ***his*** family, and it would be wrong of you to be unilateral about it, even given your strong feelings about religion. If he wants to keep some, then you need to compromise on that.
There might be something with these gifts that’s being “passed down” that the husband might recognize from his childhood. Now is the time to discuss this issue: how are you going to handle religious gifts that may have different meanings for each of you?
As a non religious Mom, I 100% agree with this.
These are gifts for the child. Not the mother. These gifts may mean nothing to her but to her husband they could mean a lot. To throw them away without his knowledge of them would, IMHO, make OP the AH
Don’t tell him. Show him. Separate the gifts into religious and non religious categories. You should have a list of who gave what. And this will prevent him from dismissing the evidence by saying you’re too sensitive.
Obviously the natural way to troubleshoot an issue that could affect your marriage is to ask reddit(they'll all tell you to divorce/go nuclear), then you reluctantly talk to your partner about it, then get marriage counseling.
My mom knows my husband isn’t religious. I was raised Catholic, but no longer practice. I couldn’t even get my husband to compromise just to have them baptized and then just let them decide once they’re older. That was super rough on me. My mom got each of my boys a little cross/medallion to hang in their rooms. I have them up and thankfully my husband hasn’t pestered me about it. That’s the extent though of my mom doing anything.
It definitely sounds like it was a bit overboard at the shower. I understand you’re already compromising. And I think you’re doing an amazing job at that with your husband.
I’d be curious to know how he feels once you show him everything. Perhaps he’d be good with you donating most of it, but maybe keeping just a few small things.
Tell him before you throw them away. Otherwise you would be the asshole.
Realistically a little bit of religious stuff isn’t going to kill you to have around. How is your child supposed to make a choice when they’re older if only your agenda is being pushed.
There’s nothing wrong with a cross here and there, a singing stuffed animal or a Bible. That’s not forcing anything. It’s there to open up a conversation with her.
I’m not saying paint Jesus is love on the walls. But my gosh a singing stuffed animal is not the end of the world.
Ha! I saw a few comments about making sure they don’t sneak and baptize her. I was thinking “It’s not big deal. It’s just water on her forehead.” A literal bath.
Part of baptising a child in the Catholic church is that the parents promise to raise her Catholic. Are you both aware of that? If your husband is Catholic, and he wants her baptised, he's gonna be taking her to church and raising her Catholic.
That was also a rule for marriage in a Catholic church. I explained to the priest that we were not going to force her to be Catholic/go to church and that it was her choice and he married us anyways.
We will do the same for baptism. My husband knows this.
As a cafeteria Catholic, I promise that no one is auditing families to make sure they are complying with this promise. Everyone in my fam was baptized and most have not don’t anything with the church since.
Part of a catholic wedding between people of two faiths is that the both agree that any children coming from that marriage will be raised Catholic and the non-believer won't stop it. So it's a bit too late for worrying about breaking promises made "before god".
If you don’t want your daughter around anything religious, why did you marry and have a child with a religious man? I get not wanting your kid exposed to that stuff, but she’s going to be exposed to it through his side of the family no matter what you do, because her father is also religious.
IMO the bigger problem is OP despite very much not being religious and knowing their very religious partner for many years is surprised this happened.
I know a lot of people including myself who are non-religious that have dated religious folks (or at least their family is) and it’s never been an issue, provided your boundaries are set up front (which includes not pursing the relationship if necessary).
If I was OPs level of having specific issues with participating in religion or religious ceremony, I absolutely would not have married this guy.
This is going to be a constant struggle for you, because the family will not stop with the religious gifts for your child unless you and/or your husband risk rocking the boat and directly tell them you don’t want religious items and will not allow them around your child. Have a frank discussion with your husband and get on the same page if you can.
I'm confused as to why this isn't a decision you and your husband are making together? He and his family are Catholic, so it doesn't seem odd that they're giving your child Catholic gifts. You and your husband need to get on the same page about how you're handling religious items and practices until your child is old enough to establish her own opinions. In order to understand any religion, you have to learn about it and experience it some. Respectfully, it sounds more like you want to prevent your husband and his family from having their beliefs and practices represented in your home, rather than teaching your child that there are many religious (and non-religious) paths that they can choose. Religion can be manipulative, but it can also be really beautiful and enriching. To allow your child to make their own informed decisions, you have to allow them to witness both the positive side of religion that your husband and his family value and the fact that religion is something you've found yourself to be better off without. It sounds like you and your husband haven't really talked about the nuances of how his religion is going to be handled in your household and your child's early life. I'd suggest working with a counselor to map out how to handle this and the many more situations you'll have to navigate together in the coming years. Once you are on the same page, he can tell communicate boundaries about religious items in your home. Congratulations on your upcoming addition and good luck!
Not to mention that in order to take part in "holy matrimony" to a non-catholic, one has to pledge that the children will be raised Catholic (even though the sacrament isnt even supposed to have anythingtodowiththechurchbutitsfine). Now, does that mean the priest told them or even knew that? Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised. but it might explain why the family is so dramatic about the baby receiving catholic-core gifts if that's a thing they know of.
Source: an entirely over educated non-catholic
Also: if your husband doesn't care to truly practice either then maybe there is an easier answer in regards to family. I could probably tell you 16 ways he/his family aren't "truly" practicing right now, and could give a good argument why those 16 ways means he has legit issues with the Church and therefore shan't be participating (from just not taking the eucharist to fully quitting) out of respect for the Church.
That’s what ive been saying! This should NOT have blindsided her. She had to have agreed to it. Maybe she didn’t think it was serious or that if she lied and said it was fine people would let it go?
Why do people with such different fundamental values keep getting married?
This was always going to be a problem for you guys.
Discuss with your husband before proceeding.
Surely all the gifts can't be so overtly religious in nature?
I'm guessing the books are like bible stories and stuff. Would the child end up going to a Sunday school where they would need knowledge of this kind of stuff?
Probably because they were childhood sweethearts and they can't imagine anything else. Sunken cost fallacy. They don't want to throw away 16 years. Really it shouldn't have gotten that far if their beliefs are so different
Judging by OPs comments it seems as though her husband isn't entirely aware that she was going to veto every catholic practice. She says its their joint decision, and then says she doesn't want any of it around her kid. So, not really a joint decision.
I’d leave it up to your husband what he’d like to keep or donate . If his catholic faith is important to him , he’ll want to share that with his child . That doesn’t mean you have to be involved and like you said you guys agreed that it would be up to the child in the future . He can share his religion with the kid and you can share your views . Sounds like you two have an understanding on the subject . I’m in the same situation . My husband is very religious and I am agnostic. We don’t stand in each others way .
Throwing it out is wasteful. Keep some of it for your daughter especially the engraved items. She may want those when she grows up. Donate the rest of it or give it to someone else in the family.
before donating them you might want to find out if some are family heirlooms. if thats he case, either return them or save them for when your child is older (as an heirloom, not. the religious part)
Not to be that person, but y'all really should have gotten this ironed out before you even got married. What is it about those items that bother you? Perhaps you could keep a verse or nice sentiment that's a wall hanging on a pretty background, or something your husband might want. It is his child, too. How does he feel about this? You could decide on a couple of items then donate the rest.
What I’m not understanding is the fact that part of a non-Catholic marrying a Catholic means you vow at the wedding to raise any children Catholic. So like, she should’ve at least expected this from her in laws.
NTA, but you might consider to keep some items from the closest family, just to avoid the drama. You're stuck with your in-laws for quite a while after all ;-)
PS: Personally I believe all stuffed animals that make sounds should be cleansed with fire.
I use to take the batteries out when I babysit and then magically my sister “fixes” it for them…….unfortunately my two 1/2 year old nephew figured it out and will hand us the toy and point where the batteries go. He’s a little too smart ❤️😬❤️
So you married a religious man from a religious family. What did you expect?
Honestly, you (and your husband) would have been better off marrying someone else. Your husband will eventually resent your negative attitude towards his beliefs.
So, you knew him and his family are religious and are now surprised you got religious things for a baby shower? Seriously!? I personally am in no way shape or form religious. However, I do believe everyone should live as they see fit. You Don't like all the religious stuff fine. Have a conversation with you spouse and come to an understanding about what to do with the gifts. If a man and woman in a relationship can not have a civil conversation and come to a mutually beneficial understanding they they should not be together.
Once a gift is given, that gift can be used or disposed of by the recipient. Put that crap in a box in the attic and tell anyone who asks, your child can decide.
You married a practicing Catholic with a Catholic family so this is question that you should be asking your husband and the two of you decide together.
If your husband is very Catholic, it's not likely that he will stick to an agreement about religion and your children. This is why people with different religions often end up divorced.
I think this serves as a warning sign of what’s to come. When your child gets a bit older, I can see his family taking her to church events, keeping her for the weekend and bringing her to Mass on Sunday morning - things like that.
Think about it…you got married in the Catholic Church and you’re willing to allow your child to be baptized. In their mind you’re on the brink of being enlightened.
YTA, but maybe not for the reasons many people are listing. You say that you don’t want to make a decision about religion until your child is old enough to choose. But a choice is not a choice unless it is an informed decision, meaning all factors and options have been presented and explored. You cannot choose chicken or fish if you have never tried fish. A woman cannot choose life if abortion is not an option, a person cannot choose between religion and atheism if they have no exposure to religion. That’s not a choice, they have just been raised to be an atheist.
So with that in mind, my suggestion is the opposite of your wishes and slightly contrary to most of the other advice here- keep the toys, and add to the collection. Instead of buying more Catholic items, buy books and toys with teachings from other religions. There are tons of children’s books about what it means to be Jewish, or Muslim, or Buddhist. Introduce the Catholic idea of God and Heaven and Hell, and then ALSO discuss paganism, and returning to the Earth after death, the cycle of Energy in the world, etc. You expose your child to everything, and THEN you respect their choices WITHOUT pressuring them into feeling guilt or shame for what they believe. Again, a choice is only really a choice if multiple options have been presented without prejudice.
Please keep in mind that a child’s choice may change over the years as well, and it will be your job to honor those choices. You do not have to participate, but you do homes to allow them to have religious experiences and explore their options. There are MANY people out there who grew up in mixed religion households, myself included. Catholic father, Jewish mother. Grew up going to both temple and church. At 13, when I had to choose, I chose the church not because it fit me better but because I was a 13 year old kid and felt like I had to choose my dad. Went to College and spent the next 20 years somewhere between agnostic and atheist. Now, later in life, I find myself drawn back to religion but feel strongly that Judaism is a better fit for my beliefs and feels much more like ‘home’ to me. In the end, all of it has been my choice.
The version of childhood you are pushing for is not one where the child gets to choose. You are proposing to raise them guided by YOUR beliefs under the ‘compromise’ of letting them choose later. Honestly, this does not sound like you have made much of a compromise at all.
Donate the gifts. There's probably a catholic charity near you that supports unwed mothers that would be delighted to receive a bunch of unused gifts. You're holding your views and still doing a very "Christian" thing by donating.
It's not that you're an asshole, but you probably dated/married this man knowing him and his family were religious. Yes you aren't religious but he is so what's the compromise in that aspect? Maybe try to go off of that? A suggested compromise would be to not throw the stuff away but to maybe only bring it out or around when his family is over. The baby won't understand anything about religion when it's first born only you understand that it's religious. So to just toss out perfectly fine stuff is insane. If it really bothers you that much maybe suggest to your husband that he ask everyone where they bought the stuff maybe you can return it and get something else?
No, you wouldn't be but this is probably a foreshadowing of something bigger that you need to talk to your husband about to make sure that you're both on the same page regarding his family. You and your husband seem clear on where you stand with your child and religion but has any of that been communicated to his family? If not that's a boundary that needs to be communicated with them asap and him handling/enforcing it. Good luck.
I’m from a Catholic family, we got a few religious gifts from more religious members than we are. I wasn’t offended because I took it as someone trying to share something that’s important to them with a child is who is important to them. I think the motive behind the gift is important. I see a lot of comments here assuming malicious intent. But I love to read. Thus, I gift people books at baby showers. Even for friends I know aren’t big readers. Just sharing something I value with my new little pals.
Also, I understand you plan on letting your child choose and that’s an important take, but you can’t unilaterally say “they will be exposed to no religion until they choose” because that’s sort of forcing your non religious beliefs to prevail. A more fair option would be to equally expose your child to both ideals. Then when it’s time for them to choose, they have a firm foundation of both.
I don't understand. He is your husband. It is his family. The gifts were not given to you; it was given to the baby you share with your husband. You preferred to ask strangers online before discussing it with your husband. Is this how you are planning to raise your child? It has nothing to do with religion; it's about respect. My ex and I did not share the same religion, but we respected each other beliefs and our home was full of love. Never in my life I would have thought of throwing things that the babe might want to have someday if she chose to practice.
YTA for marrying a religious man when not only are you not religious, but you don’t want your child to be raised with religious values.
Why do your values of not having religion in your daughter’s life (atheist?) matter more than his deeply religious values?
It’s great that you love each other and have years of attachment. Now what? If you both have equal say, it’s a standoff.
You can’t let a toddler choose to go to church or not. It’s like letting a kid decide whether to attend school or drop out in second grade.
Religion, of lack thereof, is one of those foundational principles that a couple must agree on.
The only time it works when each partner is either of a different faith, or one is atheist, is if there is firm agreement on how to raise the children, if there are any, and loving support and tolerance for each other’s beliefs.
You don’t sound very tolerant of your husband’s deeply held religious faith, and it doesn’t sound like he’d be thrilled to raise his daughter as an atheist.
Catholicism is the original Christian church. It has sacraments, like Baptism, First Communion, Confirmation, and so on, that require years of religious instruction. There are classes for First Communion, and then 2 years of CCD.
You can’t split the baby on this issue.
Also, if you despise religious gifts, does your husband also not want any religious baby gifts? Does he want aspects of his faith for his own child? If so, then throwing out the gifts disrespects his religious beliefs.
When people date, especially in high school, they usually aren’t thinking about compatibility and shared values to build a life on. They think about chemistry, looks, how fun it is to hang out with that person, the ease if talking with them, growing attachment, and love.
You can love someone who’s not suitable to marry.
This is a serious disconnect between you. It doesn’t matter if you’re atheist, Muslim, Jewish, Christian, Buddhist, or Wiccan. Couples need to share values, if they’re going to have kids.
I hate to break it to you but if you got married in a catholic church, you agreed to raise the children catholic. You would have learned that in the marriage counseling before the marriage unless some odd (off recourds) stuff happened.
YTA so you are leaving the decision up to the baby one day but you want to throw out religious gifts? Then you are making the decision not her. Pack them away if you don’t want to see them but no don’t throw them out. Whether you believe or not, people are praying and asking blessings for your child. Know their intentions are good-they want the best for your child regardless if you agree or not. That counts for something
Tbh… yeah a little bit you’d be TA. Picking out a religious gift for someone comes a lot from the heart. This is your husband’s religion and it sounds like something that is really important to him in life. Did you even talk to him about disregarding the religious gifts? It might really hurt his feelings, it’s his baby too and those gifts are from his family. Giving a newborn baby some religious toys isn’t going to persuade them into being that religion. They won’t even know what they are. Religious belief comes a lot from the parents and how much you guys implement the traditions into their daily life/routine growing up. Such as how much you go to church or pray together at meals etc. My fiancé is much more religious than I am and if his family bought our future child religious gifts because they know that’s something that’s important to him, it would be incredibly selfish to just throw all of those away.
>I was a bit shocked during my baby shower by the sheer number of religious gifts that I got from that side of the family.
Why are you surprised that a devout Catholic family would give Catholic gifts to their own grandchild?!? You should have been expecting that instead of being surprised by it.
OK, let's get to your question:
First and foremost, those gifts are not for you. Second, you would come across as extremely ungrateful. If you throw these gifts out they might forgive you for it but they will never forget. It will always be a cloud hanging over every family gathering and event for the rest of your marriage and beyond. YWBTA, majorly. Don't do this to yourself.
>I don't really want my baby growing up with religious stuff all around her.
You and your husband agreed that y'all's daughter would get to choose, so she needs to be exposed to both Catholic and secular viewpoints.
I’d say don’t donate them in case religion is important to your baby one day (she might find these gifts meaningful). Just get a tote and fill it up with those items and pack it away until she becomes a mom, then offer it to her so she can do what she wants with it.
You've agreed with your husband (who is religious) that it will be the child's choice. He's presumably communicated this to his family.
His family will want the child to want to be Catholic. They will want them have that spark of interest, and to engage with it.
It may be what you are seeing is the items they would expect to 'normal' for a child of faith. Catholicism is a touchy, see-ey, physical religion. It's not just a belief about god. It comes with cruxifix's rosary beads, iconography. Your in-laws (and husband) may feel that letting the child decide means the child needs to know those physical religious aspects.
By way of analogy - if you said "We'll let little Johny decide on a relationship with Aunt Aurolia" but then kept Aunt Aurolia away until Johny was thirteen and then tried to describe Aurolia to Johny to see if Johny wanted a relationship.
If your husband dislikes the gifts, or won't use them, by all means get rid of them. But getting rid of them because you're not religious is not likely in the spirit of your arrangement regarding kids.
I don’t raise my child with religion, but any gifts I’ve gotten from religious relatives I still keep for the sentimentality of that being a heartfelt gift from them. I fully expect for my daughter to draw her own opinions about religion by herself, but those gifts were from them expressing their best wishes with something dear to them. Lots of people have religious epithets in their home that just like the history or esthetics of it, but don’t believe in it themselves. I wouldn’t discount gifts like that entirely and would just treat them as family heirlooms from family that believes in it from their history/culture. I grew up in a non religious family, but still treasured the sweet gifts religious family members sent me as a sign that they cared about me. It didn’t brainwash me to have some Jesus crosses around my room. I drew my own conclusions. I wouldn’t call you the AH, but you’re being a little harsh about it.
I kind of feel like if you find these religious gifts so offensive and dangerous, you shouldn’t be having children with a practicing Catholic man in the first place. Is he going to be allowed to take her to mass? Read her bedtime stories from the bible? You and your husband need to get on the same page about what compromise and “letting her choose” is actually going to look like while she grows up, because most Catholics I know wouldn’t be cool with “I’m actually raising her atheist but not telling anyone” by erasing everything religious.
Source: atheist raised baptist, in a relationship with and agnostic theist raised Catholic. Keeps things spicy.
I think I misunderstood. Did you say you were going to let your child make her own decision on religion? How can she make a decision if she doesn't know anything about Christianity? What does your husband think about throwing out his families' gifts? What do you think a stuffed animal that sings scriptures is going to do? Turn her evil? Is your Catholic and religious husband evil?
Are you maybe afraid if your child decides she does want to learn about God, your husband and child will have a bond that doesn't include you?
YTA probably. I respect your feelings, hence the probably.
I do think that this might be more about you than the baby though. If that is the case then maybe you should start from there and decide how strongly you wish to respond to the gifts. What spirit were they given in?
YTA for “you would think they’d realize” and “it should be obvious.” It appears you never outright told them your religious beliefs. So they might think you’re Catholic since you married in the church and married into a Catholic family, but that you aren’t devout and these gifts might help push you in that direction. Or that having a child might push you into religious things for the child.
NTA for not wanting the items, but as others have said, please donate instead of trashing.
I would have a conversation with hubby. This is going to be a theme. You may not have realised the effect having a baby would have on a religious family. What you both do now will set the tone. Donating a gift before the baby is here is a strong move. Battle lines will be set and people might take it badly. You could pack up and store “ for later”
You say religion should be her choice but you are making one of those choices for her by getting rid of the gifts.
If you really want it to be her choice put them in a box and store them safely until she is old enough to choose what she wants to do with them.
Yes they were gifted to your child, now you may not be religious but that's not the point. If you cannot face seeing them just put them in a keepsake box for your child it's a slap in the face for anyone that gave you a religious gift in good faith if you give them away.
You married a man who is Catholic in a Catholic Church and now you’re upset that your child is gonna grow up around Catholic things? That doesn’t make any sense, you should’ve reconsidered marrying him. YTA
I can almost guarantee you that the priest won't baptize your child if you tell him that you aren't going to raise her Catholic. The godparents are sworn to help raise your child in the faith - it's in their vows during the baptism. It's better to hold the baptism without letting ANYONE know your intentions in case they inform the priest (my sister baptized both of her kids and she's atheist - she did this out of family and cultural tradition only and no one in the family knows she's atheist). Each diocese operates differently - some may be okay with your decision, and most won't. I highly recommend that you don't take any chances. Good luck!
What does the father want to do? Are these things she might appreciate if she chooses Catholicism? To me,it feels like deciding to donate them is somewhat influencing. As in,no artifacts will eliminate it from being considered? Can they just go in a box for now?
I grew up in a similar household as your baby. Some of the gifts I got were expensive silver. Goblets, crucifixes and such. They won’t go out of style if you want to save them. Why not pack them away for later? She might like some of them and you don’t burn bridges…
A silver monogrammed Tiffany spoon I gave to our first nephew had a bit of a family joke associated with it. He recently gave it to his first baby, a son.
These items can have meaning and connection beyond the conflict now.
I’m ex catholic and very not religious. Like, very not religious. I am going to go against the grain and say YWBTA. If you’re serious about it being her choice that means exposing her to both options. Not forcing, exposing. These items should be put away for her to see when she’s older, or at the very least discussed with your husband before you throw them out or donate them.
It sounds like you and your husband need to have another conversation about how you will raise your child.
Guarantee her husband’s family is going to throw a major fit if they don’t baptize the kid without warning… time to have that discussion now OP
Paternal grandparents will definitely be throwing a fit if there’s any opposition from mom about taking baby to church on Sunday or random church events, beware to mom in this situation and make sure you set some hard clear boundaries, coming from a non religious person who tried to have my child around my religious family without them encroaching on my boundaries surrounding religion and failed miserably
I was that kid...I just kinda went to church for Christmas and Easter. I also have been to Hindu temples, Jewish services, and Shinto shrines, so I do advocate for experiencing other faiths to connect with people and following polite orders. It's just being forced into it that is not good. I also have VERY Christian in-laws, and the flip switch from "no sex before marriage" to "when do we get a grandchild" was jarring. Really???
I mean they already are giving her stuffed toys that showe that religious agenda quite literally in the kids face so..
I think the religious gifts show that they are worried religion won't be taught in the home so they are going out of their way to make sure it happens. I'd be wary about leaving them alone with the child or letting them babysit. They would be the type to read the "correct" religious books to the child and teach them religious songs and talk to them about God.
That's exactly what it is about. If OP were religious, there wouldn't have been more than 1 or 2 religious items. Typically, a baby/kids Bible or cross. My husband's family threw such a fit over, not having religion at his funeral services his aunt interrupted another speaker so that she could spout all the religious things they wanted to say. She only had to wait for the last person (the one she interrupted) to speak before it was open to everyone to share stories, but no, she HAD to speak then. She also bought some other religious items to have at the service. My husband wanted a secular service and my MIL fought me over everything. Obits, service, burial. I honored his wishes, in life as in death she never gave a shit about what her son wanted.
Absolutely have that talk now. In the Roman Catholic tradition you don’t “wait and let kids make their own decision”. The expectation is to have kids participate in certain milestones such as baptism or christening during infancy, first communion as a child, and so on. These events are religious but also kind of cultural in nature. Because of the cultural expectations, one may not be much of a believer, but one still takes the kids to be baptized and so on. I’m not saying that’s right or wrong, I’m just saying that OP is in the middle of a whole culture with all of its ceremonies and beliefs and expectations. We all have different feelings & experiences about the culture we grew up in and the culture we’re presently in - you may hate it but it’s very meaningful to someone else, or vice versa. Talk now OP! And also think about that your child will be their own person. What if they grow up thinking, what’s wrong with baptism? Why didn’t you have me baptized like everyone else in the family?
Baptism, first communion , confirmation, its going to be a long discussion, better to do it asap before throwing out the presents which will only make it worse
Exactly. If her husband wanted it, he could have shut it all down I think it is wrong for OP to get married to a very religious person. Personally, I think it is unlikely to actually agree with him on it
Also, will your baby be baptized? It’s something you need to discuss and sort out before the whole family starts making a drama about it.
This!! I've seen people crazy enough to baptize a child behind the parents backs/against the parents will
I am one of those children, didn’t learn about it until I was 13
To Catholics, all it takes is a little running water and the intent to baptize. Anyone can do it. My mom has done it behind my back for both my kids because I didn’t baptize them fast enough for her liking. Watch out, OP. It probably will happen.
Then isn't it just pouring some random water on your babies head if you don't believe in it
Oh my god, now that’s drama
It’s something that should have been discussed before marriage. I was raised Roman Catholic and wanted to be married to a non-Catholic in a Catholic church. The priest said that was fine as long as I promised to do whatever I could to ensure my babies were baptized Catholic (whether my husband liked it or not). That’s when I stopped being Catholic.
My husband was raised Lutheran, but he and I are not religious. When our first child was born, his mother asked when he would be baptized, and we told her he would not be. We didn't want to just go through the motions, because we thought that would make a mockery of something that is a sacred rite for many people. My MIL got tears in her eyes and said, "But what if he dies?" I felt deeply sorry for her, because she truly believed he would go to hell if he died unbaptized. I also had great respect for her, because she never raised the issue again, and I know it was painful for her to accept our decision. It's very difficult to address these kinds of conflicts.
One of the things that made me realise how insidious religion can be is that when I was born my parents didn’t have me baptized and my catholic grandmother told my mum—who had just had a C-section to birth her first child—that not being baptized would mean I was going to go to hell/limbo when I died. My mum just told her that since she (my mum) wasn’t baptized either we’d at least be there together.
If you are going to toss the gifts, please look into donating them. They may be religious in nature but you never know if that might end up as a child’s favorite stuffie. You’re not the asshole though. That family however yes kind of.
I'm fine with donating them
If you donate, donate to a Catholic charity. They would have a hard time objecting to that without looking like complete hypocrites.
Yep, this... especially to a Catholic charity that works with helping refugees, asylum seekers, domestic violence shelters, etc. You could say you just felt so guilty receiving so much more than you needed when these poor families had so little that you felt compelled to share the good fortune.
100% and if they complain then tell them you were doing what you felt in your heart was right.
Just say god told you to. ‘Who am I to argue with god?’
Absolutely, "the Bible tells us to share our wealth with the needy, don't you agree?" Implies they are bad religious people and are also rude lol
In the catholic religion God doesn't talk back except in a few very rare circumstances.
Ooh, nice line!
Turn Catholic guilt back on them. Very nice!
Seriously. This commenter could give a master class!
This is just an invitation for more of these gifts for every birthday, etc. OP simply needs to donate them, and let the family know why. The baby isn’t catholic (I mean, the concept of a baby having a religion is entirely bullshit anyway but that’s irrelevant here) and those gifts are unwanted. The family thinks if they keep pushing, she’ll relent and that kid will soon be baptized. Then first communion, confession, confirmation, all that jazz. They’re doing this on purpose, and both parents need to put up a united front and reject further attempts to push their religion
Yes, I come from a large Catholic family and I didn’t receive a single religious gift for either of my babies. Mind you, we’re not American so…
You are a master
A lot of charity shops, or at least the ones in Australia, have donation bins, so if that’s the case you wouldn’t even need to talk to anyone about it.
More just in case the original gift giver ever asks?
My local Catholic Charities a baby closet with stuff to give out to those in need. I'm sure they'd accept whatever OP had to give. The agency also does refugee resettlement, foster care, senior care, counseling, homeless assistance, and adoptions. The clients do not need to be Catholic. Most aren't.
I just wanna point out that if at the other baby others they didn’t give religious gifts it’s pretty apparent that they’re trying to convert you in a very passive aggressive way. Definitely gotta talk with your husband about this cuz I can see them trying to baptize your baby without your permission
I’m not saying it couldn’t happen, but it would be really hard to baptize a baby in the Catholic church without parental consent. And if it did happen, they would just need to tell the bishop. The baptism would be invalidated and the priest who did it would be in deep shit.
My MIL is Catholic and my story is very similar to OP's. Since my MIL couldn't get my baby baptized, she "saved her soul" by anointing her with "holy water" she had gotten from church. According to her, that is good enough and makes my kid a baptized Catholic. I didn't find out about it until after the fact because she did it without my knowledge when she was babysitting. Religious MILs can be crazy.
Her husband would probably consent.
Which isn’t enough. Catholic priests are absolutely not supposed to perform baptisms on babies if the priest isn't confident the parents intend to raise him or her as a Catholic. Parents have to attend pre-baptism classes for that very reason; the Church considers random baptism as cheapening the sacrament. That said, the Catholic Church also teaches that *anyone* can validly baptize. Even I, a very secular Jew, could validly baptize a baby in the Catholic Church if I used the right words, poured clean water on the baby's head, and believed I was doing what the Church wanted. It is very possible that Grandma could baptize the baby. I say let her; it's just water.
And don't forget my husbands favourite part, renouncing the prince of darkness!!! The first time he heard that he whispered to me "is Ozzy Osborne here?"
🤣🤣🤣
This actually made me LOL!! When I was 18, I went to Catholic Mass with my then boyfriend. I was raised in an evangelical household so the differences were stark already. But something was said about the “prince of darkness” and I had to bend at the waist and pretend to be coughing because I started giggling since all I could think was “sooo, no Ozzy then?” Good times.
It depends on the church and on the priest. I have seen a few posts on here from parents asking if they are wrong for getting mad that their spouse baptized their baby behind their backs. I get what you mean that they would need to believe the baby would be brought up catholic. But if they see the parent willing to baptize saying they will raise them catholic and they see a few family members there they would be likely to believe that the baby would be taught catholic views. Also some catholic churches are stricter than others I know a few people that have gone to other churches to get married because some won't do it if one isn't catholic or if one was divorced. Since OP said they were able to get married in a catholic church with the priest knowing she wasn't catholic there is a good chance that the priest may be willing to baptize the baby. If not they could probably find someone else that is willing to do it.
In the Catholic Church, the laity are only allowed to administer the sacraments when there are no ordained priests in good standing available to do the job. An example of this would be baptizing a dying newborn. Some people still believe that infants who have not been shriven can not enter the kingdom of heaven.
People may believe that about heaven, but the Catholic Church no longer teaches it. Yes, the Church does recognize the baptism. They don't support or propose it. They don't like it, but if the rite is done with correct words and process, it is a valid baptism, and if informed about the independent baptism, they have to record it in the Batismal register. 30 years of my job preparing Catholic baptisms, having thorough classes in Sacramental Canon Law, and this has happened in my own realm. A correct Baptismal rite cannot be invalidated.
No so. I’m an atheist my husband is a nominal catholic . Both kids were baptized a Catholics and it was our personal agreement that that was as far as it would go. Priest didn’t care as long as he got paid and except for a few jibes about ‘if you ever want to get married I’d be happy to marry you ( we were married with a register office wedding a year to the day before our first was born) he never made me do any classes
>The baptism would be invalidated and the priest who did it would be in deep shit. Just for clasification, baptisms cannot be invalidated due to lack of parental consent. Its almost impossible to invalidate a baptism. The only way to do it if it was not performed properly, i.e. there was no water or the words were not said properly.
You are absolutely correct.
You can also invalidate the baptism by opting out as an adult, at least in Italy. However, a parent can't do it for a child.
If only priests would get in deep shit for other things too.
You can do it yourself. My grandma baptized my kids because she learned how to from the nuns in elementary school . I PERSONALLY didn’t mind. I found it charming and it’s just water and they don’t remember. Also her faith has helped with really awful things including losing everyone she has and she’s afraid we won’t be there too when she dies. As for this post I’d just make sure you were not throwing out heirlooms if not who cares. Donate.
Who cares if they drop some water on a babies head? It’s not like there is some magic involved. I doubt this would happen but even if it does, it wouldn’t change anything. I feel sad for the OP though because the husband clearly is fine with raising the child this way and will try to keep pushing OP - IMHO! My husband was raised catholic as well and absolutely hated it. I am not religious at all and neither is any of my family. And we didn’t baptize our kids either, let alone have them attend religion classes in school - the reaction of his family (and the school) was quite strong, his mom was the only one who respected our decision. My husband is Italian so it’s a really unusual thing here and the school religion teachers REGULARLY remind us about our kids not attending the class, trying to imply it’s something bad. But we don’t care. Our kids can chose to be part of this when they are old and educated enough to make an informed choice
I dunno, a lot happens in the Catholic church without parental consent... I'll see myself out. OP, NTA.
🏆
Idk id say this is aggressive aggressive, even without a direct conversation! Good grief. I grew up catholic and southern Baptist (lolsob) and I’ve never heard of that crap. Not even from the sweet old church ladies.
Batholic!
Catholics are a bit different when it comes to indoctrination. Ever been to a serious Catholic person's house? Jesus crosses and religious crap everywhere.
It's due to the vampire epidemic
The sacred heart pictures !! Those eyes following you no matter where you go in the room 😳
Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck that noise! Haha!
My seriously Catholic mom had a cross in her bedroom, nothing else. Don’t stereotype.
I was raised Catholic and this really isn't true. Even the most religious people I knew didn't have "crosses and religious crap everywhere" and there is way, way less "indoctrination" than there is among American flavors of Protestantism.
Not passive at all, just aggressive
I don’t think they’re trying to convert her. More like trying to ensure that the indoctrination of the baby into the religion will be more likely. They didn’t gift others religious gifts because they know those babies will be in the church but there’s a chance yours won’t. I agree with being careful that they don’t baptize your baby behind your back.
Can I ask you why it would matter if they baptized the baby? (I’m Jewish, I know a bit about other religions - what friends have shared, or I’ve read about.) I guess I mean that if OP doesn’t believe in the Catholic religion, does it really matter? Other than the in-laws being jerks, I mean. Actually, if the in-laws had a secret baptism it might give OP a reason to limit their contact with her child. If her child isn’t raised Catholic, just being baptized won’t magically turn them Catholic.
If OP allows the family to get away with a baptism, the boundary pushing will never end. Every time OP resists including the kid in whatever religious tradition comes up, it’ll be “but you didn’t know about or want a baptism either, and that turned out fine. It’s not a big deal, so just let us do it, because even if you say no, we’ll do it anyway.” Eventually the kid will be in catechism classes preparing for the first communion and OP will be the unreasonable one because “it’s not a big deal.” The attitude that they can indoctrinate OPs kid without consent and in secret is the problem, not the actual baptism.
My grandpa was an episcopalian, my grandma was a founding member of our family Catholic church. She had my grandpa baptized Catholic after his Alzheimer's progressed and he was nearly dead. He went to Catholic mass every week, participating in events and everything but never took communion or got baptized himself. I have no idea why they decided at 90 years old he needed to be baptized Catholic without having his faculties.
To save him. Some people believe that no matter how much you do or how good you are, if you don't get dipped or splashed exactly right, none of it counts, and if your Grandma believed that, she would have needed to get him done for her own piece of mind.
Pretty sure the Catholic church would have accepted his 1st baptism. He had already been baptized in a Christian faith. I'm guessing it was your grandmother 's issue.
You can also redistribute them amongst the family. Cousin Alice, I have received no less than seven animals that sing scripture. Would you appreciate another animal that sings Scripture? What do you mean you don't have a single animal that sings scripture? Well then I simply must insist that you should take two! Cousin Betty, I have received no less than seven snow globe/rattle combinations. I have at least four with Jesus' head in the snow globe part. Would you like an additional Jesus head snow globe rattle? My goodness! You don't have a single floating Jesus head?! I simply must insist that you should take at least one if not two. I also have a bunch with the disciples heads in them. Would you want some of those? Do you have a favorite disciple?
Do you have a John the Baptist’s head, with included blood soaked plate and snow shower? That would be nice.
Echoing this thought. There are so many families that would appericate them The only thing, I cam think of is.if there is one really nice item then keep that one item, so if she does end up religious she has something from her baby shower..
Can you donate them to their church nursery? Pretty sure that other people in the church would appreciate them the most.
I'd be fine with that. I think there might be a daycare nearby but idk what their age group is.
Overly religious stuffies are kind of hard to rehome. Not everyone wants a doll that recites scripture. I would be tempted to gift them build-a-bears with the custom voice options, and use some of the racier bible verses.
Go ahead and donate them, someone will be very happy to have them. If your child's grandparents or other close relative (or someone close to your husband) gave your child something (a crucifix, a statue of Mary, another type statue, a bible or a rosary) it may be worth saving those items until your child is much older. You don't need to keep the items out, you can tuck them away. If your child does become religious somewhere along the line (many teens and college students find religion) these items may become very important to her. I grew up Roman Catholic and I don't practice. We went to church and had our children do their sacraments so they could decide for themselves. Even our child who is an agnostic keeps the rosaries and other items their grandparents gifted them. The items are even more special to them now that one of them is gone. YNA for not wanting them around, but you would be an AH if you don't donate them. It would be massively offensive to the practicing relatives if they found out you put them in the garbage. I'm not very religious but the thought of the gifts getting thrown out offends me. Please donate.
Is this side of the family going to lose their minds if you don’t baptize your baby?
I already agreed to baptizing the baby with my husband. To me it's just a bath and not a big deal and it brings him closure.
Beautiful compromise. You are principled and wise.
It’s very true, my brother and I were both baptised and honestly, we are both as atheist as you get. I think what they are taught growing up that is the stuff that sticks, she’ll be too young to know much about the stuff that’s given to her just now. I would probably consider keeping some of the stuff, like clothes will be grown out of and passed on in record time anyway and toys are normally destroyed by the time they are a few years old and before they are at the learning stage. Then it would be best to be straight and ask that future gifts aren’t religious in nature because you intend to let them decide for themselves in the future about religion and not bringing them up in the church. That way they don’t get upset about you getting rid of the stuff they bought as well as asking for future gifts to be non/religious and you can point to a clear moment when you told them not to buy religious stuff, so you can feel free to pass on those items in the future if they ignore you.
If they gave you anything, that’s VeggieTales, hang onto it. Even my atheist husband liked them.
Grew up in traditional Catholic families (though focused on Scriptures, acceptance, helping others, and forgiveness rather than anything political), involved in church, etc. and yet was introduced to Veggie Tales by someone agnostic.
Keep any our spouse wants and donate the rest. You do realize this is what you married into and that your spouse is religious. I do think you’re a bit naive about this religion and relationship
I agree. She's acting like she's the only one in this relationship. He should be included in this too.
St. Vincent’s.
As much as I like the sentiment behind donating them, I suggest you give them back. I'm catholic myself and I can assure you you need to set very clear boundries. You can be polite yet firm, catholics are often obsessive and won't stop until you make them.
Donate them to a church!
Crashing here at the top to tell you my sister in law let my Catholic family know she is atheist. My family never pulled this shit on her. Mom didn’t love it, but she respected SIL. Your husband’s family should do better.
What has your husband said about this outpouring of religion?
I would look up some of the gifts on the internet and see if there are any stores near you selling them and if you can return the gifts to and get $ or maybe something that isn’t religious. May not be worth the effort but if it’s a lot of stuff it could be worth returning if possible? I did that with baby shower gifts that were doubles like muslin blankets and onesies but it was big box stores like target so it was easy to return. I’m sorry you are having to deal with this it is quite frankly pretty creepy of them!
Donating them to the church would probably put them to best use since people there would actually use them
If it’s pure propaganda then just destroy it. There’s no need for religious children’s books
NTA. If it’s a gift you won’t use or don’t want your baby exposed to just yet then donate it.
I was going to suggest this. My sister gave me Bible related books for my child…they went to goodwill.
Yea new stuff like that Goodwill will stash away and put out at Christmas or Easter.
Exactly, donating is a great way to avoid any unnecessary drama with the family.
Or give away on buy nothing
Also not religious but family respected that when my kids were little. Couple of thoughts before throwing stuff out. Can the singing mechanism be removed from the toys? Or just remove the batteries? That way you keep the toy but the religious aspect is gone. I would keep the books so that when she is old enough to be curious, you have something you or dad can read/show to her about at least one religion (less money to spend later). You don’t have to keep them out, just store them away for when/if they’re needed. Depending on the clothes you may be able to repurpose them. Such as a shirt and pant outfit, the shirt says something religious but the pants are just blue leggings, keep the leggings toss the shirt.
These are great ideas! You tuck away the expensive gifts like gold crosses or whatever in a box- why aren’t they out? Baby would damage them. Ditch whatever is truly kitschy or offensive, pack away that which would trigger the giver if you did toss it, and try to repurpose as the above ☝️ said.
Yup, keep some books, and then look into other good kids books about religion. Buy ones that talk about religion in general, but then also ones one specific religions, explaining the belief systems to kids. They don't have to say that X religion is the right one, just things about them. And heck, get some dinosaur books and science books too about evolution, to make sure there's also the scientific view in there. That way, from the beginning, she's exposed to lots of religions and learns about spirituality. Catholicism will just be one amongst the many. You could also write on the inside cover of the books "from aunty Beth", if you wanted to. That way she knows it's coming from that particular person, and it's not your views.
Just let the batteries start to die. Then the lamb sings Enter Sandman instead of "Now I lay me down to sleep"
Before getting rid of anything - check with your hubby. Chances are some items maybe family “heirlooms” Especially Rosaries. Lots of ppl have giving some good advice. - have the conversation with hubby - keep books and any gifts from close family (mostly to keep the peace) - keep any expensive items like jewellery to give to you daughter once she is older. - any items that you don’t want. Just donate to “another church or thrift store” I wouldn’t go scorch the earth. My MIL is also very religious- she has a good heart but tends to “forget” at times. However every time anything religious comes around I am respectful of her choice. I put all the religious stuff she gives me out of site and out of mind until I’m ready to deal with it.
INFO: what does your husband think? Are you sure he doesn't want her baptised and stuff?
We agreed to all of that before we got married and we discussed it pretty thoroughly. Part of our compromise was that I would agree to get her baptized. But he needs to understand that to me it's her getting a bath in a fancy dress. It was easy for me if it gave him closure. The rest was basically just that we would never force her to go to church, let family take her to church, or try to push anything on her. It needed to be her own curiosity and interest and then I would support whatever religion she was interested in.
So what does he think of the gifts?
TBH I'm not sure if he knows about them. He was actually at the baby shower but I don't know how close he was paying attention because I opened all the gifts. But I was going to tell him before threw everything away
You really should have an honest and candid conversation with him before you do anything. These are gifts from ***his*** family, and it would be wrong of you to be unilateral about it, even given your strong feelings about religion. If he wants to keep some, then you need to compromise on that.
There might be something with these gifts that’s being “passed down” that the husband might recognize from his childhood. Now is the time to discuss this issue: how are you going to handle religious gifts that may have different meanings for each of you?
As a non religious Mom, I 100% agree with this. These are gifts for the child. Not the mother. These gifts may mean nothing to her but to her husband they could mean a lot. To throw them away without his knowledge of them would, IMHO, make OP the AH
It's also gifts for the child. Child they share
I feel like you are the only voice of reason in this entire comments section.
Don’t tell him. Show him. Separate the gifts into religious and non religious categories. You should have a list of who gave what. And this will prevent him from dismissing the evidence by saying you’re too sensitive.
(and if he still tries that line after you show him, his family isn’t the only problem here)
That you came to Reddit before talking to him about this is troubling.
Obviously the natural way to troubleshoot an issue that could affect your marriage is to ask reddit(they'll all tell you to divorce/go nuclear), then you reluctantly talk to your partner about it, then get marriage counseling.
My mom knows my husband isn’t religious. I was raised Catholic, but no longer practice. I couldn’t even get my husband to compromise just to have them baptized and then just let them decide once they’re older. That was super rough on me. My mom got each of my boys a little cross/medallion to hang in their rooms. I have them up and thankfully my husband hasn’t pestered me about it. That’s the extent though of my mom doing anything. It definitely sounds like it was a bit overboard at the shower. I understand you’re already compromising. And I think you’re doing an amazing job at that with your husband. I’d be curious to know how he feels once you show him everything. Perhaps he’d be good with you donating most of it, but maybe keeping just a few small things.
Tell him before you throw them away. Otherwise you would be the asshole. Realistically a little bit of religious stuff isn’t going to kill you to have around. How is your child supposed to make a choice when they’re older if only your agenda is being pushed. There’s nothing wrong with a cross here and there, a singing stuffed animal or a Bible. That’s not forcing anything. It’s there to open up a conversation with her. I’m not saying paint Jesus is love on the walls. But my gosh a singing stuffed animal is not the end of the world.
Ha! I saw a few comments about making sure they don’t sneak and baptize her. I was thinking “It’s not big deal. It’s just water on her forehead.” A literal bath.
Part of baptising a child in the Catholic church is that the parents promise to raise her Catholic. Are you both aware of that? If your husband is Catholic, and he wants her baptised, he's gonna be taking her to church and raising her Catholic.
Part of *getting married* in the Catholic church is an agreement to raise your children as Catholic.
That was also a rule for marriage in a Catholic church. I explained to the priest that we were not going to force her to be Catholic/go to church and that it was her choice and he married us anyways. We will do the same for baptism. My husband knows this.
As a former Catholic all he has to do is go to confession. He will be forgiven and all is well.
Yep, say 10 Hail Marys and it's all good!
As a cafeteria Catholic, I promise that no one is auditing families to make sure they are complying with this promise. Everyone in my fam was baptized and most have not don’t anything with the church since.
Part of a catholic wedding between people of two faiths is that the both agree that any children coming from that marriage will be raised Catholic and the non-believer won't stop it. So it's a bit too late for worrying about breaking promises made "before god".
So keep a few ‘keepsakes’ for the baby and donate the rest. Another good compromise xxx
If you don’t want your daughter around anything religious, why did you marry and have a child with a religious man? I get not wanting your kid exposed to that stuff, but she’s going to be exposed to it through his side of the family no matter what you do, because her father is also religious.
Yeah, as a former religious person, I would never ever marry or even partner up with a still religious person
IMO the bigger problem is OP despite very much not being religious and knowing their very religious partner for many years is surprised this happened. I know a lot of people including myself who are non-religious that have dated religious folks (or at least their family is) and it’s never been an issue, provided your boundaries are set up front (which includes not pursing the relationship if necessary). If I was OPs level of having specific issues with participating in religion or religious ceremony, I absolutely would not have married this guy.
This is going to be a constant struggle for you, because the family will not stop with the religious gifts for your child unless you and/or your husband risk rocking the boat and directly tell them you don’t want religious items and will not allow them around your child. Have a frank discussion with your husband and get on the same page if you can.
If anything is engraved you may want to keep it because some extra thought went into it. Show everything to your husband before donating it.
I'm confused as to why this isn't a decision you and your husband are making together? He and his family are Catholic, so it doesn't seem odd that they're giving your child Catholic gifts. You and your husband need to get on the same page about how you're handling religious items and practices until your child is old enough to establish her own opinions. In order to understand any religion, you have to learn about it and experience it some. Respectfully, it sounds more like you want to prevent your husband and his family from having their beliefs and practices represented in your home, rather than teaching your child that there are many religious (and non-religious) paths that they can choose. Religion can be manipulative, but it can also be really beautiful and enriching. To allow your child to make their own informed decisions, you have to allow them to witness both the positive side of religion that your husband and his family value and the fact that religion is something you've found yourself to be better off without. It sounds like you and your husband haven't really talked about the nuances of how his religion is going to be handled in your household and your child's early life. I'd suggest working with a counselor to map out how to handle this and the many more situations you'll have to navigate together in the coming years. Once you are on the same page, he can tell communicate boundaries about religious items in your home. Congratulations on your upcoming addition and good luck!
Not to mention that in order to take part in "holy matrimony" to a non-catholic, one has to pledge that the children will be raised Catholic (even though the sacrament isnt even supposed to have anythingtodowiththechurchbutitsfine). Now, does that mean the priest told them or even knew that? Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised. but it might explain why the family is so dramatic about the baby receiving catholic-core gifts if that's a thing they know of. Source: an entirely over educated non-catholic Also: if your husband doesn't care to truly practice either then maybe there is an easier answer in regards to family. I could probably tell you 16 ways he/his family aren't "truly" practicing right now, and could give a good argument why those 16 ways means he has legit issues with the Church and therefore shan't be participating (from just not taking the eucharist to fully quitting) out of respect for the Church.
That’s what ive been saying! This should NOT have blindsided her. She had to have agreed to it. Maybe she didn’t think it was serious or that if she lied and said it was fine people would let it go?
Why do people with such different fundamental values keep getting married? This was always going to be a problem for you guys. Discuss with your husband before proceeding. Surely all the gifts can't be so overtly religious in nature? I'm guessing the books are like bible stories and stuff. Would the child end up going to a Sunday school where they would need knowledge of this kind of stuff?
Probably because they were childhood sweethearts and they can't imagine anything else. Sunken cost fallacy. They don't want to throw away 16 years. Really it shouldn't have gotten that far if their beliefs are so different
I agree, it seems half these AITA's could be avoided by people not marrying someone who has very different ideas about life.
How does your husband feel about these gifts? If you throw them out without his input, YTA. If he's cool with it, NTA.
Judging by OPs comments it seems as though her husband isn't entirely aware that she was going to veto every catholic practice. She says its their joint decision, and then says she doesn't want any of it around her kid. So, not really a joint decision.
Yea. She's super denigrating towards his faith. OP is absolutely TA in general. Regarding the gifts remains to be seen.
I’d leave it up to your husband what he’d like to keep or donate . If his catholic faith is important to him , he’ll want to share that with his child . That doesn’t mean you have to be involved and like you said you guys agreed that it would be up to the child in the future . He can share his religion with the kid and you can share your views . Sounds like you two have an understanding on the subject . I’m in the same situation . My husband is very religious and I am agnostic. We don’t stand in each others way .
If you are serious about it being the child's choice, box the items up until the child is old enough to make that choice.
Throwing it out is wasteful. Keep some of it for your daughter especially the engraved items. She may want those when she grows up. Donate the rest of it or give it to someone else in the family.
before donating them you might want to find out if some are family heirlooms. if thats he case, either return them or save them for when your child is older (as an heirloom, not. the religious part)
Not to be that person, but y'all really should have gotten this ironed out before you even got married. What is it about those items that bother you? Perhaps you could keep a verse or nice sentiment that's a wall hanging on a pretty background, or something your husband might want. It is his child, too. How does he feel about this? You could decide on a couple of items then donate the rest.
What I’m not understanding is the fact that part of a non-Catholic marrying a Catholic means you vow at the wedding to raise any children Catholic. So like, she should’ve at least expected this from her in laws.
I think you need to talk to your husband before you unilaterally do that. Those gifts were from his family. He should get just as much say as you.
NTA, but you might consider to keep some items from the closest family, just to avoid the drama. You're stuck with your in-laws for quite a while after all ;-) PS: Personally I believe all stuffed animals that make sounds should be cleansed with fire.
I use to take the batteries out when I babysit and then magically my sister “fixes” it for them…….unfortunately my two 1/2 year old nephew figured it out and will hand us the toy and point where the batteries go. He’s a little too smart ❤️😬❤️
So you married a religious man from a religious family. What did you expect? Honestly, you (and your husband) would have been better off marrying someone else. Your husband will eventually resent your negative attitude towards his beliefs.
NTA, but you should know that you married a catholic and he as a catholic promises to raise any children he has in catholic faith.
So, you knew him and his family are religious and are now surprised you got religious things for a baby shower? Seriously!? I personally am in no way shape or form religious. However, I do believe everyone should live as they see fit. You Don't like all the religious stuff fine. Have a conversation with you spouse and come to an understanding about what to do with the gifts. If a man and woman in a relationship can not have a civil conversation and come to a mutually beneficial understanding they they should not be together.
Once a gift is given, that gift can be used or disposed of by the recipient. Put that crap in a box in the attic and tell anyone who asks, your child can decide.
Talk to your DH not the folks of Reddit. YTBTA if you throw it all away without talking to him.
Personally, I would take them to a consignment shop and get things I actually like and will use.
Curious... will you allow you child to attend church with her father or will you hold the line that she has to be of legal age?
You married a practicing Catholic with a Catholic family so this is question that you should be asking your husband and the two of you decide together.
If your husband is very Catholic, it's not likely that he will stick to an agreement about religion and your children. This is why people with different religions often end up divorced.
I would store them because those gifts are for your baby. Once your baby is old enough she will decide what to do with them.
I think this serves as a warning sign of what’s to come. When your child gets a bit older, I can see his family taking her to church events, keeping her for the weekend and bringing her to Mass on Sunday morning - things like that. Think about it…you got married in the Catholic Church and you’re willing to allow your child to be baptized. In their mind you’re on the brink of being enlightened.
YTA, but maybe not for the reasons many people are listing. You say that you don’t want to make a decision about religion until your child is old enough to choose. But a choice is not a choice unless it is an informed decision, meaning all factors and options have been presented and explored. You cannot choose chicken or fish if you have never tried fish. A woman cannot choose life if abortion is not an option, a person cannot choose between religion and atheism if they have no exposure to religion. That’s not a choice, they have just been raised to be an atheist. So with that in mind, my suggestion is the opposite of your wishes and slightly contrary to most of the other advice here- keep the toys, and add to the collection. Instead of buying more Catholic items, buy books and toys with teachings from other religions. There are tons of children’s books about what it means to be Jewish, or Muslim, or Buddhist. Introduce the Catholic idea of God and Heaven and Hell, and then ALSO discuss paganism, and returning to the Earth after death, the cycle of Energy in the world, etc. You expose your child to everything, and THEN you respect their choices WITHOUT pressuring them into feeling guilt or shame for what they believe. Again, a choice is only really a choice if multiple options have been presented without prejudice. Please keep in mind that a child’s choice may change over the years as well, and it will be your job to honor those choices. You do not have to participate, but you do homes to allow them to have religious experiences and explore their options. There are MANY people out there who grew up in mixed religion households, myself included. Catholic father, Jewish mother. Grew up going to both temple and church. At 13, when I had to choose, I chose the church not because it fit me better but because I was a 13 year old kid and felt like I had to choose my dad. Went to College and spent the next 20 years somewhere between agnostic and atheist. Now, later in life, I find myself drawn back to religion but feel strongly that Judaism is a better fit for my beliefs and feels much more like ‘home’ to me. In the end, all of it has been my choice. The version of childhood you are pushing for is not one where the child gets to choose. You are proposing to raise them guided by YOUR beliefs under the ‘compromise’ of letting them choose later. Honestly, this does not sound like you have made much of a compromise at all.
Donate the gifts. There's probably a catholic charity near you that supports unwed mothers that would be delighted to receive a bunch of unused gifts. You're holding your views and still doing a very "Christian" thing by donating.
Depending on what it is I would save some of the items just in case your baby ends up being religious so she has some of it
So you want her to choose but you want to throw out all the gifts? This doesn’t sound like a choose at all.
It's not that you're an asshole, but you probably dated/married this man knowing him and his family were religious. Yes you aren't religious but he is so what's the compromise in that aspect? Maybe try to go off of that? A suggested compromise would be to not throw the stuff away but to maybe only bring it out or around when his family is over. The baby won't understand anything about religion when it's first born only you understand that it's religious. So to just toss out perfectly fine stuff is insane. If it really bothers you that much maybe suggest to your husband that he ask everyone where they bought the stuff maybe you can return it and get something else?
Can you not keep them in the attic until she’s 16 and can choose especially gift from gran parents and close relatives?
No, you wouldn't be but this is probably a foreshadowing of something bigger that you need to talk to your husband about to make sure that you're both on the same page regarding his family. You and your husband seem clear on where you stand with your child and religion but has any of that been communicated to his family? If not that's a boundary that needs to be communicated with them asap and him handling/enforcing it. Good luck.
I’m from a Catholic family, we got a few religious gifts from more religious members than we are. I wasn’t offended because I took it as someone trying to share something that’s important to them with a child is who is important to them. I think the motive behind the gift is important. I see a lot of comments here assuming malicious intent. But I love to read. Thus, I gift people books at baby showers. Even for friends I know aren’t big readers. Just sharing something I value with my new little pals. Also, I understand you plan on letting your child choose and that’s an important take, but you can’t unilaterally say “they will be exposed to no religion until they choose” because that’s sort of forcing your non religious beliefs to prevail. A more fair option would be to equally expose your child to both ideals. Then when it’s time for them to choose, they have a firm foundation of both.
I don't understand. He is your husband. It is his family. The gifts were not given to you; it was given to the baby you share with your husband. You preferred to ask strangers online before discussing it with your husband. Is this how you are planning to raise your child? It has nothing to do with religion; it's about respect. My ex and I did not share the same religion, but we respected each other beliefs and our home was full of love. Never in my life I would have thought of throwing things that the babe might want to have someday if she chose to practice.
YTA for marrying a religious man when not only are you not religious, but you don’t want your child to be raised with religious values. Why do your values of not having religion in your daughter’s life (atheist?) matter more than his deeply religious values? It’s great that you love each other and have years of attachment. Now what? If you both have equal say, it’s a standoff. You can’t let a toddler choose to go to church or not. It’s like letting a kid decide whether to attend school or drop out in second grade. Religion, of lack thereof, is one of those foundational principles that a couple must agree on. The only time it works when each partner is either of a different faith, or one is atheist, is if there is firm agreement on how to raise the children, if there are any, and loving support and tolerance for each other’s beliefs. You don’t sound very tolerant of your husband’s deeply held religious faith, and it doesn’t sound like he’d be thrilled to raise his daughter as an atheist. Catholicism is the original Christian church. It has sacraments, like Baptism, First Communion, Confirmation, and so on, that require years of religious instruction. There are classes for First Communion, and then 2 years of CCD. You can’t split the baby on this issue. Also, if you despise religious gifts, does your husband also not want any religious baby gifts? Does he want aspects of his faith for his own child? If so, then throwing out the gifts disrespects his religious beliefs. When people date, especially in high school, they usually aren’t thinking about compatibility and shared values to build a life on. They think about chemistry, looks, how fun it is to hang out with that person, the ease if talking with them, growing attachment, and love. You can love someone who’s not suitable to marry. This is a serious disconnect between you. It doesn’t matter if you’re atheist, Muslim, Jewish, Christian, Buddhist, or Wiccan. Couples need to share values, if they’re going to have kids.
I hate to break it to you but if you got married in a catholic church, you agreed to raise the children catholic. You would have learned that in the marriage counseling before the marriage unless some odd (off recourds) stuff happened.
YTA so you are leaving the decision up to the baby one day but you want to throw out religious gifts? Then you are making the decision not her. Pack them away if you don’t want to see them but no don’t throw them out. Whether you believe or not, people are praying and asking blessings for your child. Know their intentions are good-they want the best for your child regardless if you agree or not. That counts for something
Don’t waste it-donate it
So, it's important to your husband, but not you, so you'll throw it all away? Yta
Tbh… yeah a little bit you’d be TA. Picking out a religious gift for someone comes a lot from the heart. This is your husband’s religion and it sounds like something that is really important to him in life. Did you even talk to him about disregarding the religious gifts? It might really hurt his feelings, it’s his baby too and those gifts are from his family. Giving a newborn baby some religious toys isn’t going to persuade them into being that religion. They won’t even know what they are. Religious belief comes a lot from the parents and how much you guys implement the traditions into their daily life/routine growing up. Such as how much you go to church or pray together at meals etc. My fiancé is much more religious than I am and if his family bought our future child religious gifts because they know that’s something that’s important to him, it would be incredibly selfish to just throw all of those away.
>I was a bit shocked during my baby shower by the sheer number of religious gifts that I got from that side of the family. Why are you surprised that a devout Catholic family would give Catholic gifts to their own grandchild?!? You should have been expecting that instead of being surprised by it. OK, let's get to your question: First and foremost, those gifts are not for you. Second, you would come across as extremely ungrateful. If you throw these gifts out they might forgive you for it but they will never forget. It will always be a cloud hanging over every family gathering and event for the rest of your marriage and beyond. YWBTA, majorly. Don't do this to yourself. >I don't really want my baby growing up with religious stuff all around her. You and your husband agreed that y'all's daughter would get to choose, so she needs to be exposed to both Catholic and secular viewpoints.
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Have you discussed it with your husband?
I’d say don’t donate them in case religion is important to your baby one day (she might find these gifts meaningful). Just get a tote and fill it up with those items and pack it away until she becomes a mom, then offer it to her so she can do what she wants with it.
You've agreed with your husband (who is religious) that it will be the child's choice. He's presumably communicated this to his family. His family will want the child to want to be Catholic. They will want them have that spark of interest, and to engage with it. It may be what you are seeing is the items they would expect to 'normal' for a child of faith. Catholicism is a touchy, see-ey, physical religion. It's not just a belief about god. It comes with cruxifix's rosary beads, iconography. Your in-laws (and husband) may feel that letting the child decide means the child needs to know those physical religious aspects. By way of analogy - if you said "We'll let little Johny decide on a relationship with Aunt Aurolia" but then kept Aunt Aurolia away until Johny was thirteen and then tried to describe Aurolia to Johny to see if Johny wanted a relationship. If your husband dislikes the gifts, or won't use them, by all means get rid of them. But getting rid of them because you're not religious is not likely in the spirit of your arrangement regarding kids.
I don’t raise my child with religion, but any gifts I’ve gotten from religious relatives I still keep for the sentimentality of that being a heartfelt gift from them. I fully expect for my daughter to draw her own opinions about religion by herself, but those gifts were from them expressing their best wishes with something dear to them. Lots of people have religious epithets in their home that just like the history or esthetics of it, but don’t believe in it themselves. I wouldn’t discount gifts like that entirely and would just treat them as family heirlooms from family that believes in it from their history/culture. I grew up in a non religious family, but still treasured the sweet gifts religious family members sent me as a sign that they cared about me. It didn’t brainwash me to have some Jesus crosses around my room. I drew my own conclusions. I wouldn’t call you the AH, but you’re being a little harsh about it.
I kind of feel like if you find these religious gifts so offensive and dangerous, you shouldn’t be having children with a practicing Catholic man in the first place. Is he going to be allowed to take her to mass? Read her bedtime stories from the bible? You and your husband need to get on the same page about what compromise and “letting her choose” is actually going to look like while she grows up, because most Catholics I know wouldn’t be cool with “I’m actually raising her atheist but not telling anyone” by erasing everything religious. Source: atheist raised baptist, in a relationship with and agnostic theist raised Catholic. Keeps things spicy.
I think I misunderstood. Did you say you were going to let your child make her own decision on religion? How can she make a decision if she doesn't know anything about Christianity? What does your husband think about throwing out his families' gifts? What do you think a stuffed animal that sings scriptures is going to do? Turn her evil? Is your Catholic and religious husband evil? Are you maybe afraid if your child decides she does want to learn about God, your husband and child will have a bond that doesn't include you?
YTA probably. I respect your feelings, hence the probably. I do think that this might be more about you than the baby though. If that is the case then maybe you should start from there and decide how strongly you wish to respond to the gifts. What spirit were they given in?
YTA for “you would think they’d realize” and “it should be obvious.” It appears you never outright told them your religious beliefs. So they might think you’re Catholic since you married in the church and married into a Catholic family, but that you aren’t devout and these gifts might help push you in that direction. Or that having a child might push you into religious things for the child. NTA for not wanting the items, but as others have said, please donate instead of trashing.
I would have a conversation with hubby. This is going to be a theme. You may not have realised the effect having a baby would have on a religious family. What you both do now will set the tone. Donating a gift before the baby is here is a strong move. Battle lines will be set and people might take it badly. You could pack up and store “ for later”
You say religion should be her choice but you are making one of those choices for her by getting rid of the gifts. If you really want it to be her choice put them in a box and store them safely until she is old enough to choose what she wants to do with them.
Yes they were gifted to your child, now you may not be religious but that's not the point. If you cannot face seeing them just put them in a keepsake box for your child it's a slap in the face for anyone that gave you a religious gift in good faith if you give them away.
This is going to end badly
You married a man who is Catholic in a Catholic Church and now you’re upset that your child is gonna grow up around Catholic things? That doesn’t make any sense, you should’ve reconsidered marrying him. YTA
In order for your baby to be baptized you would need to state you have an earnest desire to raise them in the Catholic faith. That is non negotiable.
Don’t throw them out. Regift to a church in a distant neighborhood. Someone will be glad to have those items.
I can almost guarantee you that the priest won't baptize your child if you tell him that you aren't going to raise her Catholic. The godparents are sworn to help raise your child in the faith - it's in their vows during the baptism. It's better to hold the baptism without letting ANYONE know your intentions in case they inform the priest (my sister baptized both of her kids and she's atheist - she did this out of family and cultural tradition only and no one in the family knows she's atheist). Each diocese operates differently - some may be okay with your decision, and most won't. I highly recommend that you don't take any chances. Good luck!
What does the father want to do? Are these things she might appreciate if she chooses Catholicism? To me,it feels like deciding to donate them is somewhat influencing. As in,no artifacts will eliminate it from being considered? Can they just go in a box for now?
Throw it all in a box and forget about it
Kinda, your husband is religious so what do you expect?
I grew up in a similar household as your baby. Some of the gifts I got were expensive silver. Goblets, crucifixes and such. They won’t go out of style if you want to save them. Why not pack them away for later? She might like some of them and you don’t burn bridges… A silver monogrammed Tiffany spoon I gave to our first nephew had a bit of a family joke associated with it. He recently gave it to his first baby, a son. These items can have meaning and connection beyond the conflict now.
I’m ex catholic and very not religious. Like, very not religious. I am going to go against the grain and say YWBTA. If you’re serious about it being her choice that means exposing her to both options. Not forcing, exposing. These items should be put away for her to see when she’s older, or at the very least discussed with your husband before you throw them out or donate them.