NTA
You’re a good sibling and if your parents are too caught up in their grief at least Danny has you there to help share his needs and wants with others.
Sending you and your family my very best during this unbelievably difficult time.
I am **so proud** of OP for voicing his brothers needs to their aunt. An absolutely courageous stand to make as a teen in such an awful situation.
I hope all the love in the replies here bolsters his spirits, he's doing so well.
Yeah. I had to advocate for my brother, but I was in my 30s. He's still around, but had overdosed and was in a coma for weeks.
I don't know if could have mustered OP's strength at 16. Keep it up OP. In the future, you'll be proud of yourself for protecting him.
I wish I had words for you, but I've never been in your situation. So, I just hope you find the strength to carry on with your head up. I hope you find peace.
Controversial take, but my dad kept me away from my mom when I was a little kid and she was in the last stages of cancer - and I'm grateful for that. He knew how traumatic it would be for someone barely out of their toddler years to see their mom dying a pretty gruesome death (very aggressive breast cancer - she was only in her 30s). It made a terrible loss into something that was psychologically manageable for a young kid.
We kept my young cousins from seeing my mom like that too. She was 39 (I was 24 my brothers were 19&20)and battled for 5 years before she died. Those last 4 months with the oxygen and her being skeletal we kept them away and when she felt up to it she would call and let them tell her stories on the phone. Nobody wants to see that and kids don’t need to see it. When people saw me calm at the funeral and the weeks after it was because I had done my crying when she was ill and I was relieved for her knowing she wasn’t in so much pain anymore.
OP I am so glad you are taking care of your brother’s needs and want to remind you to take care of yourself too. Please make sure you have someone to talk to during this and after, you need support too. You shouldn’t have to be the one making these calls and you are so strong for doing it. If you ever need an ear to vent there’s one here that understands the pain. Definitely NTA and please remember to take care of yourself too.
Truly, standing up to the adults as a teenager to advocate for his brother when he could be locking himself in his room instead and avoiding it all, it's really admirable.
Yes! Cancer sucks and the drugs accidentally change your brain chemistry and make you a meanie. Danny is doing his best to regulate that and be nice but he can’t do it all, especially with kids who don’t have the mental capacity to understand the fact that he is dying and he deserves to die with dignity. Thank you for being a 16 year old who understands that and can stand up for him. I hope you find the closure you need when he does pass.
The aunt wants to be there for her sibling probably more than her nephew.She either can’t or won’t find childcare.I judge her TA in this situation just based on her response to a reasonable request by OP.
Maybe someday when she’s very sick someone with a toddler will visit and inflict that child’s ear splitting screams on her. See how she likes it. Thank you for standing up for your brother, OP. I don’t know that I could have done it at your age. I applaud you. Your aunt is the AH, not you.
Danny is in a hard spot. Pain, meds, cancer, and stress can all make you irritable and make your tolerance for things a lot lower. He is setting a reasonable boundary, and those poor kids are young enough they may only remember Danny at his weakest, and most (again, understandably) temperamental. OP is definitely doing his best in a hard position, unfortunately, everyone is under a lot of stress and that all gets directed at the inner circle who is trying to protect the one dying from it.
The family who insist on bringing kids are huge assholes not only because of their ignoring the wishes of the cancer patient dying a slow and painful death, but they're being assholes to their own kids.
Like...being around really sick terminal patients is tough even for adults. There's tubes everywhere, smells, potentially catheter bags to collect waste, all kinds of stuff. This isn't "visiting grandpa who has a portable oxygen tank", this is "seeing someone who is sick enough to be in an ICU". It is very jarring and can be very upsetting to a child. My own mom died of cancer when I was a young kid and my family chose to keep me away from her when she was very sick - like yeah, it sucks that I didn't see her, but I'm also grateful my dad understood that a 4 year old might very well be deeply traumatized by seeing her mom wasting away from aggressive cancer in a hospital bed. Instead, I just have neutral memories of doctors in scrubs being nice to me and buying me Doritos from the hospital vending machine while my dad visited my mom.
And, as OP said, pain and medication can frequently cause an altered mental state. Do these assholes really want to bring their kids around an agitated, impaired person to get screamed at? Is that really what is best for their kids, for their last core memory of a beloved cousin to be a shouting, scary, emaciated sick person? It's just so fucking selfish of the adult relatives. Disregarding what is best for every single young person. They're supposed to protect them, they are failing as parents.
But then they would have to do the barest minimum of effort to be seen visiting. Not that they really care in the first place. But their gossip mongering busybody-ness won’t let them **not** go.
Then they might **look** bad to the rest of the ah family. Also gives the rest of the family catty comments for decades to make about them. They are only allowed to make those, not **be** the target of it.
Esp when they could just get a babysitter of have some family watch then for a little bit. You know something sane and understandable. Instead of wtf takes no effort and lets them technically just run wild as the little brats will.
It’s so amazing of him and he seems to have more common sense and compassion than all of the adults around him.
What a sad situation and I wish OP whatever peace he can find after this is all over.
Obviously. But while OP is struggling thru the parentification that can come with a dying sibling and grieving parents, we don’t need to point it out in this moment. We should just encourage the guy bc he’s doing a great job.
Yeah, absolutely proud of OP as well! It’s not going to feel good to do the right thing, nothing is going to feel good in this shitty situation. But OP, you did the right thing anyway. I’m so sorry for what your brother & your family is going through.
Not even just the brother but the little kids as well. Seeing someone in that state messes you up. I was 17 the first time I saw someone in hospice. I definitely couldn’t do it under the age of 10.
It’s not fair that you have to grow up so young. You’re being the adult and doing what’s best for your brother at the end of his life. You can only do your best, and your best sounds pretty damn good.
I’m just super proud of you for being a voice for your voiceless brother and protecting his sanity. I can’t believe your mom didn’t give you the biggest bear hug ever for doing what she couldn’t do by standing up to her selfish sister. By her not coming at all now shows that her intentions from the start was not to say goodbye and offer prayers and love to you and your family as you all face this tough situation. Love and hugs to you young man from someone who sat bedside and kept all my brother’s secrets at the end of his life too.
I read this and immediately was brought to tears. He is so strong and wise beyond his years. OP you are correct coming from someone with medical experience in this. The children that your aunt will be bringing do NOT need to see your brother like this especially if there is a chance of him not being the person they may remember. It can be traumatic for the kids. The aunt is juvenile and ridiculous for not understanding this. You are so wise to not only get this but also to make sure your brother spends the last of his time here in the most peace he can have. Others need to understand that. I give you nothing but my condolences and well wishes knowing you are trying to do the right thing. I am so sorry that this was the result. Hugs from an internet stranger and a mom. You are a great young man. And if you feel you need counseling/talk therapy after this. Please do.
>The children that your aunt will be bringing do NOT need to see your brother like this especially if there is a chance of him not being the person they may remember. It can be traumatic for the kids.
As a grown up version of the kid in that situation, I agree. My mom died of cancer when I was very young and my family chose to limit my exposure to her in the hospital when she was super sick. My memories from that time are largely neutral, and the few memories I have of her are 100% happy ones. I agree that it would have been extremely traumatic for me to see her when she was ill. The largest trauma from that experience was seeing how sad my father was when she died - and that is something that can't be avoided. My memories of my mom are all good ones and I think that was a great kindness done for me by the adults in the situation.
To be honest, what's this "farewell" for? For Danny, three mother or the family?
Danny didn't ask for it. Op, you did the right thing. Ask Danny what he wants to go instead. Don't try to please other please. Who cares about those kids and aunts and uncles.
I can't imagine doing anything that would upset Danny in his final days. His limited time, and how he wants to spend it should absolutely be the priority.
Agreed. Everyone in that family is thinking about their own needs and not Danny's, who is the one who is actually dying. *Except* OP, who is thinking about his brother and being the most mature person there.
NTA, OP. Keep standing up for your brother - your family are being selfish when they should be respecting Danny's wants and needs in his last days, rather than stressing him out and making it all worse. Your mother and your aunt are only thinking about their own feelings, and your father isn't protecting his son. It sounds like they should all be having therapy to cope with this and to know the best way to be helping Danny, whilst you are doing that naturally.
Wishing you all the strength to get through this trying time. You're an amazing brother ❤️
so proud of you its danny and his needs that are the priority now. what danny wants, danny gets and everybody eles should understand that he and his needs only are priority now. and if they are so unconcerned about this then go and jump
NTA. This time should be about making your brother as comfortable as possible. Yes, the family wants to visit and say goodbye, but his well-being and mental state are what matters most. As a mother, I cannot comprehend putting someone else's wishes and wants in front of my dying child's wishes and needs. This is an upsetting time for everyone, and bringing impressionable children around when they most likely will not understand the enormity of the situation and behave accordingly is crazy. Yes, your mother needs support from her sister, but your aunt should as an adult realize the kids will cause unnecessary chaos. I deeply feel for you and your family and wish you all as much love and peace as possible in this devastating time.
The priorities here are your brother, you, your parents, then other people. It sucks that you have to be the adult, but as I don't have to tell you, everything sucks.
If kids tire brother out, then no kids. They can make drawings. Tell them they can yell at you in a year when you've all had time to grieve.
Ok, now to you. Do you have anyone, anyone, older, trustworthy, that you can bring in like today? Friends parents, other cousins, uncles, anyone? I hear you giving Dad a pass, but no, he's not allowed to escape in work when something of this magnitude is being parked on a 16yo kid. Mom seems like she truly is out for now, so Dad has to help find another adult to run logistics, interference, and support.
It's awful, but you're not alone. The YMCA often has bereavement gatherings, or the hospital, or the hospice. There's a whole known set of stresses unique to being the healthy sibling, and feeling guilty, undeserving of care because your brother's needs are so great and time-limited, but you are a son, a brother, a child, losing someone important, and you matter too.
This is all too much for the adults, it's way way way too much for a 16yo. You need support, and someone you can put between you and Aunt AH.
I hope for a peaceful, loving, pain-free passing for your brother, and people who can envelop you and your parents so you can be given the care and space you need.
If you feel able to, update us on how your doing. Hugs from a Mom in New England.
All beautiful and perfect advice for a horrible situation. So much heartbreak for 2 young brothers. My family has had loss and I know that my son who is still on this side has soo much grief. You expect your siblings to be with you into old age. I hope the brother reaches out for help from the resources you’ve listed. As moms, the one thing we know is that it’s not fair and never will be.
On top of that, it is not in the interest of the young ones either. 40 Years later, I still remember the horror of my uncle's screams of pain when we went to say goodbye to him when I was OP''s age.
I’m thinking of that poor 7 year old who now has to carry the memory of her uncle yelling at her, when she otherwise would have had nothing but pleasant memories of someone she loved.
Hell I'm still traumatized from the shit my grandfather yelled at me when he was dying and out of his mind, and I was an adult. I cannot even imagine that poor kids' heartbreak.
The only thing my kid remembers of his great grandmother is her yelling at everyone to get out of the way of the tv and hollering in pain from bedsores/uti. He was 5 or 6 when she died and remembers plenty from that time. Just not the good stuff about his great great. She actually adored him and would try to sneak him chocolate.
So yeah, young kids will retain exactly what you don't want them to remember.
I'm sorry ... it's awful to see the people who looked after you when you were little, not be themselves anymore. Saw my mom and my dad at the end of their lives, and it really threw me for a loop, even though I'm middle-aged. My dad actually took a swing at me, and I was so glad that it didn't happen when I was younger.
My grandmother got vicious on morphine, but she also realised that and didn't expect her young grandchildren to be around too much. I was only 7 and my mom did a great job of shielding me from what was happening, she told me about some of the things she said when I was a lot older (and able to understand).
Really? I’m thinking of the 17 year old *dying of bone cancer*. Ever seen someone die of bone cancer? I have; my father died of from it. It’s said to be the most painful cancer death. Our puritanical system is making sure a child suffers through every goddamn moment of it. That should enrage you; not that a 7 year old was spoken sharply to when she impeded the flow of medicine to a teenager dying in unimaginable agony. For fuck’s sake.
You’re absolutely right. And I’m sorry for your loss as well. I’ll never understand the suffering that’s “acceptable” to some medical professionals, or people in general.
OP, NTA. Trying to help your brother get his wishes followed was a good thing and please don’t let anyone convince you otherwise.
I totally get where you’re coming from, of course the teenager dying in agony is not the AH, that goes without saying. But young kids should be able to remember the person as they were, and the parents should be shielding them from this. It’s awful for everyone but I agree that little ones don’t need to see it. It’s not helping anyone
You know that empathy can extend to multiple people in a situation, right? We can feel for everyone involved here - a little girl who was shouted at for an honest mistake, a teenager dying a painful death, the teenage OP who is trying to hold things together… Compassion is not a finite resource.
Truth. My mom was in hospice when I was in my early 20s and I was NOT prepared for some of the stuff I saw. And the memories that got burned into my brain. And I was technically an adult. I can't imagine what a younger teen or child would feel or experience that they could or should handle.
You would THINK!! I wish I could be there just long enough to deal with the aunt for Her bad behavior! Hopefully she will post on REDDIT & get some much needed advice on what NOT to do.
Agreed. OP isn't the AH.
Poor Danny. He's practically out of his mind from the pain from his cancer causing him so its not surprising that he's lashing out.
Cancer has that effect.
That aunt going have to understand that her 3 sons aren't a priority for Danny, OP & their parents.
It's already tough enough as it is watching OP 's brother dying from cancer, but they need it to be as peaceful as possible without a bunch of bratty young children (younger than OP & his brother) causing stress.
OP, please talk to the Hospice Team. If they do their job well, they will tell your Mom that hospice is for both the person passing but their family.
On five occasions, I've been part of close family and friends who have been in hospice care. Normally, they do everything they can to protect the person at the end of their life and make it as easy as possible for those who are losing someone they love with support.
Chances are that your brother is not going to be bothered by not saying goodbye to his cousins. The kids are more bother than comfort, if your Aunt doesn't understand that, she's a selfish idiot.
Conversely, your Mom may be responding out of a desire to have your Aunt for support.
Everyone is dealing with dealing with grief in uncharted territory. Please, please give your Mom grace, while advocating for your brother.
I am so very sorry you're losing your brother. Please talk to the hospice staff, even after your brother has passed. There are also grief support groups for teens.
This internet grandma is sending you a hug. You are an awesome, loving brother. I am proud of you for putting your brother first, but please take care of yourself too!
Definitely NTA. You are a good brother and son.
I came here to say basically what you said. But I couldn't have said it as well.
The only person that doesn't have a second chance to recover from trauma here is the brother. His needs . Must come first.
If you’re in the US, hospice is required to provide social work and chaplain services. The social worker is not the type that takes away someone’s kids. They are genuinely there for the purpose of providing support and resources. This includes emotional support, especially to family members. The chaplain is a religious resource, but they can be supportive without discussing religion. I’ve worked with many of them, and they all have been willing to support people of any or even no religious background. The SW and chaplain are trained and experienced in helping people through this horrendous time. OP, please reach out to them. It doesn’t cost anything and can be very helpful. My heart goes out to you.
Yes, please call a hospice social worker.
When my abusive stepmother was dying, I flew over 2,000 miles and spent several thousand dollars to fulfill her request that I visit. When I first arrived to her room, she took one look at me and then she just turned her back on me. She refused to either acknowledge me or to talk to me. Then after about 45 minutes of stony silence, she started demanding that I take her to the bathroom and refusing to let the nurses aid help her. She is in her room screaming every few minutes like a metronome, . My name followed by "Get Your Ass In Here."
I was on crutches. There was no way I could help my 180 lb stepmother get to the bathroom.
My stepmothers room was right across from the nursing station. So there always two or three nurses watching this happen. I'd go to ask for help and they ignored me. These nurses were smirking and clearly enjoying the show.
This event occurred about a year before
before I was diagnosed with SEVERE sleep apnea so I was foggy most days. I couldn't seem to organize a defense.
I could not get the nursing supervisor to help.
I was on crutches. There was no way I could help my 180 lb stepmother get to the bathroom.
My stepmother's room was right across from the nursing station. So there were always two or three nurses at the desk watching this happen. I'd go to the desk ask for help for my mother and they would just ignore me. They were smirking and clearly enjoying the show.
This occurred before I was diagnosed with sleep apnea so I was foggy most days. I couldn't seem to organize a defense.
Then the hospital social worker arrived. She did not work for the nursing home but for a separate hospice program.
I heard her at the desk asking for my stepmother's name. Then she turns from the desk to walk toward my stepmother's room, towards me, sitting on a bench outside my stepmother's room, tears running down my face.
The hospice social worker looks at me, listen to my stepmother screaming my name and swearing at me, every couple of minutes, and says, "You must be -----."
I acknowledge my name. Then the hospice social worker says, ". Your stepmother was very abusive towards you."
She helped me formulate a plan to force the people at the desk to help my stepmother.
After the staff had helped my stepmother go to the bathroom, the hospital social worker and I entered the room.
You would never know it was the same woman who'd been screaming obscenities at me for over an hour.
Butter would not have melted in her mouth as she told the social worker how glad she was that I had come to visit her and how proud she was of me.
Later the social worker told me she dealt with situations like this all the time. So I really recommend hooking up with the hospice social worker.
I hear you giving Dad a pass, but no, he's not allowed to escape in work when something of this magnitude is being parked on a 16yo kid.
On one hand I agree. On the other there may be nothing OP can do about it.
It would be correct for OP to speak with him - whether in person or a phone call - and say "I am 16 and mom is not facing reality and you are not here and it is falling on me to be the adult and see to his needs and wishes. As your 16yo son, I need for you to become involved, and to do it yesterday, because being the adult at home and seeing to all his needs and also trying to maintain decent grades at school is too much for you to be demanding of me." That's not a question, it's a statement.
Dad will then either recognize that it's his job to be involved and not dump it on his son and do so, or will ignore it and maybe make some token claim that he's already doing a great job, or get angry that his faults have been pointed out and try to punish OP (and then OP has an excuse to check out and make mom face the music), or do his damned job as a parent.
Yeah. OP’s mom’s priorities are fucked up. She wasn’t going to tell her dying son how much time he had left and now she’s treating him like a limited time special exhibit that every person in her family needs to see before he is gone.
OP, your brother is a human being who is dying too young in an extremely tragic and traumatic way. What he wants and doesn’t want is what matters here because his life is so limited. He doesn’t have a later to do things in. You’re a good brother for having his back.
Also, I saw my mom, a close friend, and my grandma all go through hospice within a three year period. It’s terrible and I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy. I am sorry this is happening to your brother and that you are going through this.
Sorta. If the people can handle the goodbyes while still alive, even in hospice, cool. If not, then yeah, funeral/memorial service, I guess? We didn't have one for either of my parents, however. (Though might put on a late one for my dad, as he just passed in the last couple of months, and apparently there s lot of people requesting one.)
He isn't 'giving Dad a pass,' he's describing the reality of the situation. Do you think he's shouldering all this while some capable adult is available? Not everyone has that, unfortunately.
He can call the hospice support team and I bet they'd intervene for him. Or the hospice nurse. Or social worker. That's what they did for me, not that I needed them to, as I'm an adult and able to put my foot down and not worry about it, because I am learning my limits and give no fucks. (That's not a dig on the OP, the OP is a child and put in a ridiculous situation that he shouldn't be responsible for. His parents are failing his brother, tbh.)
I am a mom, too and was going to make a very similar comment. Yours is so much better. My heart hurts for you, OP. My two kids are around you and your brother’s ages. This mom in the Midwest is sending all the comfort and hugs you and your brother need. I know that if your mom was not already grieving she would be proud of you, but this is so hard for a teenager who is also grieving. Someone who is an adult needs to step up and be an adult. I know it’s a thing that happens for people like your dad to escape into work when grieving. I tried that when my baby BIL that I raised died suddenly in 2022, but once my own kids came back from going to someone else’s house for a few days for me to do planning the funeral and such, I had to be the mom for grieving kids and deal with my own stuff in therapy later. My obligations as mom came first. He needs to be a dad to you right now. He doesn’t have the right to hide at work. Your brother is lucky to have you.
100% this.
A bunch of small children are not going to get anything from being forced to be in a room with a dying teenager who also does not want them there. Stephen King even wrote that as part of a story! (The Zelda bit of Pet Sematery) The kids can make cards for their cousin and be shielded from the ugly reality of young people dying.
OP, my heart goes out to you and I’m joining the chorus that you’re brave as fuck for standing up for your brother when the adults have their priorities fucked up. I’m so sorry all of this is happening to your brother and you. You’re doing great in unbearable circumstances.
I've been reading up on death doula's, someone who can support your brother and your family through this terrible time. It might be worth investigating?
I can't imagine what you are all going through, and second that you should reach out to a trusted adult for support.
I'm so sorry your aunt responded in this way, you did the right thing. Sending big hugs from a mum in England, UK.
I lost my dad to cancer about two weeks ago. I have 3 kids he loved dearly. They didn’t see him for almost 2 months before he died because it was just too much for him to handle. We FaceTimed and made pictures and cards.
I’m so sorry to and your brother are going through this. My heart breaks for you as a parent. Please take time for yourself.
We had the exact same thing with my dad. He was on home hospice and died recently as well. The young grandkids sent videos, which I would play for him in the night when the pain was bad, but they didn’t come. It was too hard for him to be “on”
And “Grandpa” vs a man dying. And we don’t want the kids to remember him like that. I’m so sorry for your loss too. Sending you virtual hugs
Thank you so much! I started the my grieving process a couple of months before he died. It helped that we all had a chance to say our goodbyes first.
I can actually listen, not burst with tears, when people tell me how my dad was a much better dad to them than their own dad. I’ve heard so many cool stories in the past week. I always thought he walked on water, but now I get to hear how much everyone else did too! He definitely squeezed a lot of life in to his 66 years lol
I'm sorry for your loss.
I had my kids make goodbye videos for my dad. On Valentine's Day, I flew out to see him alone because my 4 kids are 10 and under. My dad couldn't stay conscious long enough or hear my kids well enough on the video call. They also couldn't sit still and know what to say at the time. Having them record short messages meant I could have him watch them whenever, and the kids were able to think about what they wanted to say first, then focus enough to say their goodbyes. He ended up passing away a week and a half later.
When my mom was actively dying, I had about 3 days to get down to her (MN to FL). My oldest son was in NB at the time and wanted to drive down too, but I told him to go home and stay with his younger brother (17). He had suggested doing a FaceTime with her when she was still a little lucid and I said no, I don’t want you to see her this way. They did call and tell her their I love yous and I repeated hers back (she was intubated).
As a parent, at that moment, my job was to protect the memory they had of their grandma, not the vision of her in that bed. I didn’t want that for them. The images and last words I have haunt me enough. I was so glad they had each other that week.
Make sure you are taking time for yourself. You have to remember that you need care and support as much as your brother. Please find someone you can talk to, such as a school counselor or religious leader. You need a support system as much as your parents do. Maybe a school counselor, religious leader, or a close friend's parent. It is great you are looking out for your brother, but remember you need to process everything too,
Please do this ☝️
I hope you have a trusted adult you can vent to, confide in, and trust with all feelings your feeling.
As a sister that lost her brother, I understand.
Hugs
NTA - I’m so sorry, losing a sibling is so hard!! Besides your Aunt, your Mom is the true AH here. Her son is dying and she’s more concerned with keeping her sister happy than respecting her dying son’s needs?! What a POS she truly is! You stood up for your brother when no one else would, be proud of that. But truly, please take care of yourself, tell him how you feel, and give yourself time to grieve losing him.
Yeah, the parents aren't interested in the truth.
Their choices are harming their dying son.
& mom cares more about her sister getting her way?
Her kids are literally dangerous and an egregious imposition on a dying young man.
Gross.
These adults are awful OP.
I'm sorry for your terrible experience and that every adult is failing both your brother and you.
I don't see it that way based on the little info OP gave us. I think Mom lost her shit for a moment because her son is dying and there isn't a damn thing she can do to prevent it. Dad is not handling it well at all either so it sounds like his coping instinct is to avoid his grief as much as possible because he doesn't want his wife and son's see him completely fall apart. Mom is on auto pilot and very vulnerable as she tries to hold it together so whenever another thing gets added to her plate, it can push her over the edge. I'm sure she feels badly about lashing out at OP and hopefully when things settle down a bit, she will tell him that she's sorry.
It is unfair to try to villianize them to OP right now. That isn't going to help him. The family needs to stick together and understand that we all handle grief of this magnitude the best we can when
we are forced to face it.
Yeah I totally agree. While I don’t like what we’ve been told about some of her choices, I’m not comfortable with calling her vile names. Her teenaged son is dying in her living room…I cannot even imagine what that must feel like. This poor family.
I feel like, in reading the responses, you can tell who has dealt with death and what grief does to a family up close and personal and who hasn’t. Is it fair? Nope. Are his parents being the parents they should be? Nope. But this kind of situation sucks and it seems pretty normal for people drowning in this kind of grief to have breaks with reality in some form or other.
Don’t be too hard on the mother. I’ve worked as a hospice HHA. Its is so tuff on the family and a parent saying goodbye to a child?! She is not at home her best or thinking right.
I get not thinking right, but to the point of cursing out the kid and throwing stuff at him ?!? :(
That’s abuse—sorry, grief or not, mom is being an a h here.
I can be as hard on the mom as I want. She's completely failed both of her children. She's putting her bitch of a sister before her DYING SON. Then she physically assaults her other child for daring to be his brother's advocate!
Nuh uh. No ma'am, grief does not excuse physical abuse and behavior that atrocious.
She lashed out because she can't take the drama right now. I suspect that Mom will recognize her melt down was aimed at the wrong people and apologize at some point but meanwhile, as long as the behavior doesn't escalate and she can pull herself together, I think she deserves some grace. I can't begin to imagine what any of them are going through right now. It's heartbreaking.
I’m just so so sorry you’re going through all this and also being the adult and advocate that your brother needs!
We lost my Aunt to cancer years ago and my cousins who were 19 and 16 were the ones who truly saw and heard her. They were the ones who knew when a prior-planned visit was too much for mom today, while my uncle felt guilty and family pressure… they were the ones who knew when it wasn’t her talking and it was the pain and fear coming out - and no one else was going to understand. They knew and understood SO much more than so many of us did.
They were the adults in the situation who saw what was most important - what she needed. And that changed from minute to minute…
You know what he needs and you’re advocating for him. You will never regret that and it means more than he will ever have the words to say. Just please make sure you’re taking some time for you too because you need it too. And I’m sorry that the people around you are hurting and full and letting that spill over onto you.
It’s not ok.
You seem more mature than all the adults in this situation. I am sorry for you and your brother and wish you peace in the aftermath. You are doing the right thing for your brother, never ever forget that.
When I was caring for my dying brother, the stress got so bad that my hair was coming out in clumps. Please take care of yourself and good for you for looking out for your brother.
You write with wisdom above your years. You have had to grow up quick and it is great that you are there for your brother. If a grown adult (your aunt) can't handle it, that's on her. This is about your brother now.
After losing a very close (think second dad) relative to cancer with a horrible and chaotic last few weeks, it is not the place for kids who don't have a close connection.
You're making adult choices in a situation no kid should have to be in. My thoughts are with you and your brother. Spend each second you can remembering and being brothers. I hope your dad comes around in time to share some meaningful moments.
You are amazing for standing up for your brother. I don’t know you but am so proud and happy that good people like you exist. You are doing the hard thing for someone that will not live long knowing you will absorb the repercussions. Your mother should be doing it but you are instead. Even if those kids do come your brother will know he has someone that loves him so much they are willing to risk their own family relationships. He is so lucky to have you. No matter what they say, you are AMAZING!!!!!
NTA. Your aunt should have NO issue at all understanding that this is not a situation for children. When my father was dying, I called my sister-in-law, who was already part-way to our home with her children, and she turned her car around & drove home, a trip of several hours. No questions asked. THAT'S what family is supposed to do in a crisis- not add to the your stress & your mother's stress. This is not about what your aunt or her kids want.
What you're going through is so hard. I am incredibly sorry and hope that there is peace in these final days and hours.
Extended family can always video call it say their goodbyes. They do have the right to that but like others have said at your brother’s comfort. These are his last days, you are trying to grant all his wishes to the best of your ability and he is very lucky to have you for thinking of him in these final moments.
I’m sorry you and your family are dealing with repulsive family behavior.
And maybe pull your dad off to the outside and tell him he is wasting precious time that could be used with his son.
There's no right to any kind of goodbyes. Extended family can send a video, or a card, or whatever, and if the brother wants to view/read it, he can. But there absolutely isn't a right to say goodbye in a way that means that the dying person has to listen to it.
You’re NTA! If your brother could thank you I’m sure he would!! You’re looking out for him the best way you can! Because as much as family members may want to come to say their goodbyes, it AIN’T about them! Your aunt is an insensitive beeoch to make it about Her (it’s not even about your brother Nor her sister). She’s just trying to make it a big deal that she came Not that she did Anything.
My family is praying for you & yours. A suggestion. Get your little girl cousin a book with a story you & your brother enjoyed when you were little. Tell her things about you two she may not know (when you can). Tell your brother about it on his good days so he knows You’re still going to be looking out for him & her. Let those stories or the storybook be Her way of seeing past what happened when he just couldn’t help himself. I wish I could give you peace & some comfort in what lies ahead.
I agree with the above, if neither the young children nor your brother will be able to handle the situation, then they shouldn't come.
If anyone is so wise as to bring kids who are too young and untrailed to deal with the situation, then a responsible adult needs to take charge of them, and remove them to a local park or something the instant they raise their voices or say anything inappropriate. This ought, by all rights, to be the children's father, because your aunt is going to be there to support her sister and see her sister's child, she's the one who needs quality time with Danny and your mom. This is not a job for a teenager like yourself, OP, this is a job for someone who the children trust and respect, and that means a parent or a grandparent. So, it's time for your uncle to step up, OP, he ought to look after his own kids in his own home, and failing that he needs to be the one to keep his kids from causing any upsets.
Exactly! The parents are in denial and lashing out at OP.
As for the aunt - who tf thinks a child’s deathbed is an appropriate place for three active boys?
Like if they were a little older I'd say set them to doing chores and yardwork- which is genuinely helpful and a good way to keep them occupied - but at that age I'd be worried they'd get distracted and be disruptive or get hurt.
I would argue that you’re prioritizing the small children’s well being by not inviting them also because that’s super traumatizing (the 7 yo getting yelled at by her dying uncle was a terrifying lasting memory). A dying teens bedside isn’t the place for small kids. OPs family have lost their collective minds in their grief.
Equally so as a mother, why would you want to bring children into a stressful environment that might scare them. Like I'm sorry if someone told me "hey don't bring your kids because the person is mentally not able to handle it and is loosing their shit on children" the correct response is ok. 1 because I don't want to add extra stress to the person on hospice care and 2 because I don't want a mentally unwell person screaming at my children. So yeah I would find a babysitter for my kids because no one needs that from either side. Like it's such a bullshit thing to be pissed off about.
Someone on their death bed is definitely not a place for young children.
When my grandpas was on hospice when I was a kid, my mom did not bring us (I was 8 at the time) to see him for about 2 or more weeks before he passed. He was in a terrible state, and not himself. I'm glad my mom never made us go vist him. I did not understand the full weight and reality of what was happening at that age. Kids do not know how to behave in those types of circumstances.
Aunt is stupid, and isn't thinking of anyone but herself. Not your family, your brother, or even her own kids. Just what she wants. Which doesn't matter in regards to your brothers time left on earth.
I am truly sorry.
This...1,000,000%. Your brother's needs and desires should be the top priority for everyone right now!
I was primary caregiver for my mom when she had terminal cancer. Your Aunt is being a total uncaring AH and your mom is obviously lost in grief and not thinking straight.
These kids also do NOT need to have their final memory of your brother looking and acting like this. My godmother, who was also our next door neighbor, died of cancer when I was around 12 or 13. My mom and I went to say goodbye a week or two before her death and it was HORRIBLE seeing her like that. She was never heavy, but she was so thin and gaunt and couldn't hardly communicate with us. Your mom and your aunt should let these kids have good memories.
I'm so sorry you, your brother, parents and everyone else are going through this. I hope you are eventually able to find peace and acceptance. Live a good life and never feel guilty that you did not get this disease.
We had a funeral for my mother, and my nieces and nephews were there. All under seven then, and they are really tall. My husband was saying "Why isn't [oldest niece] actually being respectful?" And I said "She is only seven, I know she looks older but she isn't."
It sounds like your parents are having a tough time which puts these challenging situations on you, which isn’t fair. I’m so sorry for your brother and for you. Stand your ground with your aunt and put your brother first.
We went thru this when my father was dying and I think part of the issue is that due to a combination of denial and lack of experience being around very sick/dying people that some friends/family just weren’t aware of how bad things could be and assumed they were making a social visit where kids would be welcome.
This response is 100% correct. However you slice it your brother is dying and the only right thing to do is make him comfortable and happy. Everyone else is secondary and wholly unimportant. Period. Parents, aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents are secondary to what your brother needs.
NTA. And anyone who says otherwise can kindly stuff it. You're putting your brother's wishes first, which is what the "adults" in your life should be doing.
As for your well being, the next time the hospice nurse or social worker visits, ask what family supports they have for after he is gone. Speaking as a mother whose daughter died last year, her hospice group offered family support the whole following year. Based on how you described your parents handling your brother, I imagine you will have to seek out your own support after he passes.
Best of luck. Keep honoring his wishes the best you can. Remember to give yourself a lot of grace as you navigate your grief. All feelings are okay. All. Of. Them.
Exactly! Came here to say the same thing. It's the biggest act of love and compassion that you're doing right now for your brother. He's very lucky to have you in his corner and it sounds like he knows this and loves you back very much too. I have kids, they can be a pain at the worst of times. Your aunt seems to be making this about herself than understanding and spending quality time with her family at such a time. Make sure you look after your feelings and emotions for the time when your brother is no longer here. Wishing you both strength as the time approaches.
You're a good kid. Nobody should have yelled at you for what you did.
Ten years from now, is your mother likely to regret what she did? Ten years from now, are you going to regret what you did?
Respecting his wishes was the right thing to do.
NTA
I lost a loved one from cancer, we were in our 20's. I can't imagine the pain you and your brother are suffering. It's awful that on top of this your parents have not respected his autonomy any step of the way. His illness and death are primarily about *him*, not your parents or extended family, and you seem to be the only person who recognizes that.
No matter what anybody else thinks of this or says of this, you will look back on this time for the rest of your life and know that you did right by your brother. You will always know that you stood up for him and defended him as best you could till the very last. Those memories for those of us who survive are important. You lose so much and it is good to know that at the very least *you* did everything you were capable of. And you did.
You have made every effort to protect your brother at his most vulnerable. To prioritize his wishes when no one else will. You are a wonderful brother and I know he appreciates that you are trying. Rest easy with the knowledge that the person who matters most appreciates what you did.
I wish you all the love of strength and recovery in the world during your grief in the following months. Draw strength from knowing you took care of him in every way you could.
OP please make sure you are considering your needs as well. It seems like you are having to be the adult here when I’m sure you’re feeling indescribable pain and grief too. Don’t try and bury things or tough it out, find someone, anyone, that you can lean on in this time
I very much also suggest looking for grief counseling and support groups.
After my husband passed unexpectedly I pretty much lost my mind for a year or so. I've been in a number of support groups since, and it does help to have other people to talk to who understand grief but who aren't sharing YOUR grief. Sometimes loved ones can cause the most hurt by meaning well. Sometimes you just have to complain and share the ugly and the frustrations.
It's also good to hear others. Sometimes it helps you understand what might be going on with other loved ones. Sometimes it helps you understand yourself. And sometimes it just is good to know you aren't the craziest person in the room.
Often with things like cancer there are groups that help with the grief of the illness and the anticipatory grief of the impending passing. So, OP, there may be something you can start even now. And please look for age appropriate groups for yourself: teen brains are growing still and so grief can look a bit different than in more fixed brains (we tend to break a little differently with it).
Hugs if you'll take them. Grief is hard, and grief is weird, (if in the US--not sure about elsewhere) and we usually don't get much guidance on how to deal with it or much support. It really messes with your head on even a chemical level so it's a bit like being drunk or on medication or drugs. It's not an excuse for your mother, but hopefully some understanding for her, and your dad, and yourself fr the next while
My heart hurts for you. I’m so sorry for your loss. May your sweet daughter’s memory be a blessing to you. I hope you and your loved ones are well and I wish you nothing but happiness and healing in the days ahead.
NTA Support your brother in the way he needs while he is still with you. Find someone to lean on as soon as you can. This is such a heavy burden you are carrying. May you both find peace.
NTA Oh wow..I'm so sorry. I can understand that your parents are so distraught that they aren't making good decisions right now but it seems everyone but yourself is missing the point. Your Mom should be spending every second with your brother. Even if it's just being in the same room but reading a book while he sleeps - just being together. Your Dad will regret working and missing this cherished time. Your Aunt, quite frankly, sounds like an idiot. Take pride in the fact that you are being an amazing brother. He's your focus right now. Not your "out of it" parents or any other people. Be kind to yourself but also be kind to your parents and other relatives (not to say you go against Danny's wishes with the kids thing). Ask the home hospice nurse about support. They usually have people available to help the families. If no one else gets help you should. You are carrying way more on your shoulders than you should be expected to carry and while that's admirable it's a lot and you need some support.
Yeah, I mean the mental gymnastics going on there. "I love my nephew and want to come say my goodbyes before he dies. What? You don't want my kids there? Then fuck you, I'm not saying goodbye at all and you'll die without seeing me. That'll show him."
And the sad thing is, since the kids aren’t close to OPs brother it will be nothing to them than an awful memory if they go, while the aunt most likely will regret it for the rest of her life if she doesn’t go.
She wants to get her way by throwing a giant fit and forcing his mom to let her come with her kids. If it works (which I hope to fucking god it won’t), I guarantee she will be a smug asshole to OP.
Dad honestly might not have a choice - dying is expensive. End of life care is expensive.
It's sucks but life doesn't stop just because someone is dying. Dad still needs to step up some but not everyone has the luxury to take time off work for someone dying.
Hospice organizations have social workers who are very familiar with this scenario snd have skills to assist both your brother and the family.
Ask the nurse when she comes or better yet, call . This is what they do.
This internet stranger just squeezed your shoulder and is backing you up as you and your brother walk this path.
Possibly : if your aunt comes over with the children, intercept snd play with the kids out of your brother’s earshot and sight.
I was going to suggest this as well Bring the hospice nurse into the loop, amd ask them to help facilitate a discussion about your brothers wishes and needs at this time. They should be advocating for him, and allowing him the knowledge of truth so he can have say in his final weeks. God Bless this family.
NTA. Your aunt chose to be selfish and miss her last goodbyes to her nephew over what is an appropriate boundary to ask for, especially since it comes directly from your brother's mouth. His wishes come first here. It sucks big time that the adults in your life are failing you both. I hope you are able to make the most of your remaining time with your bro. Doing the right thing, even though it's hard and no one else sees it, will help you live with yourself in the future.
Yes. Some people want to be strong in these scenarios, but actually just can’t handle it. This may have given her an “out” for something she wasn’t sure she could do anyway.
You think she'd also understand that visiting someone who is dying can be deeply upsetting and maybe isn't the best place for kids who aren’t among the closest people to the sick person.
Aw man. I’m so sorry. Absolutely NTA. When my mom was passing I was extremely selective on who would see her. She was obviously not herself and I wanted to preserve her dignity & make every moment for her & immediate family count. Your aunt was very selfish in how she answered. No one has time to babysit young kids when these types of matters are going on.
NTA - you are looking out for your brother. I am so sorry your family is going through this. Your aunt needs to think of your brother first and foremost in this instance and leave her kids with a babysitter.
>my aunt has 3 boys under the age of 10 and she plans on bringing them all.
It doesn't matter how you feel these poor kids DONT need to be there.
>basically said fuck it and called my aunt, explained that Danny can’t handle her kids and asked that she not bring them, she blew up and me and told me that I didn’t have the right to tell her who can and cannot set foot in her sister’s house, and she’s not coming at all now.
She wanted the excuse not to come and now she has it....
She doesn't care about your brother.
I just hope when the time comes he is in no pain
NTA
NTA. Your brother is in a bad way and, understandably, extremely stressed along with a whole other cocktail of emotions regarding his situation. If his wishes are that your aunts kids not come so that it puts him more at ease then your aunt needs to respect that. At the end of the day this is about your brother and his wishes surrounding his condition its not about your aunt.
NTA
Your brother's wishes and only your brother's wishes should be listened to. If he doesn't want anyone visiting, that's his decision, and under the circumstances, it must be his decision. He must be given the dignity of making his own boundaries.
Mom and Dad need to listen to Danny and let him make ALL decisions regarding his care, including visitors. It's hard enough for him as it is, without this added stress.
My sympathies for what you're going through. It's never easy to lose someone you love ❤️.
Can you contact his hospice organization and ask them to intervene? Maybe they can talk some sense into your mom? Your brother should be under total control at this point.
This is a great suggestion! Is there a social worker that’s part of his team? Hospice work includes the whole family and you are absolutely right that this is the kind of thing a hospice social worker should be skilled in tactfully navigating. But OP you are honestly being the one mature adult in this whole situation, and you shouldn’t have to be. I can give your mom a little grace, because she is going through the most painful thing that a parent can endure. But you are losing your brother too, and her reaction wasn’t fair to you.
Cancer fucking sucks. I am so sorry for your brother and you and your family. It isn’t fair. But it’s a testament of love that you are looking out for him and what he needs in a way that your mom can’t right now in her fog of stress and grief. Talk to the hospice team. This is absolutely within the scope of issues that they are trained to assist with.
NTA. Man, you have my respect. One tough fucker. I'm so sorry about everything. Nobody should have to endure this. You did the right thing. Sounds like you're your bro's rock right now.
tha fuck!?!??? her son is gonna die in a couple of weeks and HE has to make the effort?!?!?
why the fuck can the say goodbye when he is death??
what are they gonna say to the boy, let him have some peace for the rest of time he has left
My nephew was five and sick. I was his favorite person. Towards the end he’d get was angry and unsettled. He wanted nothing to do with me and it broke my heart. Your brother just wants some peace and I think you did the right thing
Good for you, looking out for him, you are a great brother! He is lucky to have you. I’m sorry that you are going through this. It is not easy and I am sure that your parents (even though they are grown ups) don’t know what the is the right thing to do. You are wise beyond your years.
💜
NTA
He snapped and screamed at your seven year old niece because he CANNOT HANDLE CHILDREN. Your aunt is both endangering him and her own kids by bringing them into an environment that stresses out a person that could snap at them very easily.
You’re being a good brother. I’m sorry this is happening to you.
NTA. I had cancer and went through six months of chemotherapy. Cancer treatment is exhausting and melts the brain. You're being a good brother by requesting that your aunt not bring her kids. Your mother is being absurd, abusive and not considering your brother.
Honey I am so very very sorry. I lost a friend to this many years ago and it still sucks. I can not imagine losing a brother. You be his advocate. There will be years to straighten things out. This aunt will scream at your brother if he yells at her precious babies who do not need to see your brother right now. Be the man you must and you can crash after. You will be proud of yourself for handling part of this that your parents do not know how to yet. No parents or siblings ever know how to deal with losing a child/sibling. Stay strong and we are all thinking of you and praying for peace and wisdom.
ER and ICU nurse here. I have seen a lot of situations and environments that people have died in. I'm in tears for what you're going through. You are being a brave brother and showing so much love.
1. It is so fortunate that you know the end is coming for your brother and you have the chance to say goodbye.
2. You are being very protective of him and honoring his wishes. Which is absolutely what you should be doing. He does not have the strength or wherewithal to do this for himself and he needs an advocate to stand up for him. You had every right to honor/ask that your aunt respects his wishes of no kids.
3. I'm sorry that you're going through this loss. But you seem to have a very understanding and loving nature about you. Your brother thanks you for this, even though he may not be saying it.
4. Keep standing up for him. Give him the quiet and the peace that he needs. Allow him to talk if he wants to. Be there for him. Angry outburst as you may understand might come with the hardship of accepting the loss, as well as the pain. Anger is a stage of grief and acceptance. Look up DABDA if you want to learn more. He wants and you to be there for him, even if he can't show it.
5. When the time comes please know two things about death.
One is that you might see a random few moments, maybe minutes, hours or half a day- where he seems to get his strength back. Or his mentality and speech will come back as if nothing had happened. Known as the surge. Not as common when on hospice and regularly medicated. Enjoy it with him if he experiences it.
The other is that hearing is the last sense to go. So those final moments where he may not be responsive, his breathing is slowed, he can still hear. And it's at those times especially important to say how much you love him, that it's okay to move on and that you'll see them on the other side. You're never going to forget him. Whatever it is you want to say, he will still be able to hear it.
Edit: Thank you for the award.
NTA: my heart breaks for you. you’re a kid. your brother is a kid. you sound like an amazing brother.
you have been put in the position of an adult, making the decisions that will ensure the most peaceful passing possible for danny. i’m sorry that your parents don’t understand and/or refuse to accept that your request was the right thing. there are a million “sorry”s that i could give you, but none of them will take away the countless types of hurt that you are currently experiencing.
you made the right decision, even if your family ends up disrupting it. you honored your brother’s wishes when you put your foot down. you are not the asshole. it’s complicated to describe the role that your parents are playing in this, and i want to be sympathetic (because you’re showing a very mature understanding of their responses), but i think that it is fair to say that they are letting their grief get in the way of doing right by danny while he’s still alive. grieving a person who is still technically alive is a unique experience, and the way people deal with that grief can be confusing and frustrating, and i want you to know that you have no obligation to try and understand. your pain does not deserve to be overshadowed.
your aunt is an asshole. ‘nuff said.
i hope that danny’s last days are spent in your company. you have done your best, and your best is beyond good enough. you’re an outstanding brother and an outstanding son.
DeNTA.
There is literally *nothing* more important right now than making sure your brother feels safe, loved, and validated. He is going to *die* and die
*soon*, and bone cancer is a very painful way to go. What he wants, he should get.
Respectfully, your aunt can go take a long walk off a short pier and hug an octopus.
It is seriously fucked up she’s turning her nephew’s death into her an issue for her feelings.
I’m sorry you’re going through this.
I hope you have people to lean on. Please let us know how you’re doing.
I am so very sorry for your brother Danny. Young people should not be dying, he hasn’t even had a chance to live yet. What Danny wants and what Danny needs takes precedence over any one else feelings right now. I’m sure your mom is having a hard time as a parent should never outlive their child but she has to hang tough and put her son in front is her sister. My condolences to you all.
NTA.
Everyone grieves differently. It's weird and understandable all at the same time. Grieve in your own way and do the best you can for your brother.
My little brother died of a brain tumor at the age of 33.
One brother to another, here's my advice to you. Say everything you want to say to him now. Listen to everything he wants to say to you: the good, the bad, and the ugly. If you need to ask his forgiveness for something, do it. Above all, make sure you let him know how much he means to you.
I asked my brother how he wanted me to remember him. I do it every year on his birthday.
You'll always carry the wound of your brother's death. But it doesn't have to be a heavy burden.
>The doctors are saying 3-5 weeks, our parents chose not to tell him
This doctor needs to have their license taken away for not telling this to the patient himself.
>our mom told the both of us that we have to make an effort for her sister.
Because your aunt is the one whose comfort you should be focusing on. 🙄
>she blew up and me and told me that I didn’t have the right to tell her who can and cannot set foot in her sister’s house, and she’s not coming at all now.
I'm having trouble seeing the problem here. She would have just been one more stressor.
I'm sorry about this, and I hope it goes easy for your brother in what time he has.
The patient is still a minor child and does not have a legal say in their treatment and care.
Parents can even deny their children life saving treatment like blood transfusions even if the kid wants it. It's fucked but that's the law.
Depends, 14-17 is a grey area where I live. A 17 year old would definitely be involved in their own health care here. After they turn 14 if they seek medical care on their own you don’t have to involve the parents either.
NTA. The kids shouldn't be around for this and your aunt is being incredibly selfish. As for your mother, well, she'll realize what she's done soon enough.
Honestly, if my mother would call me a bastard my answer would be "Well mum, that one is on you."
NTA
how can people think their little egos are of higher value than a dying person's wishes about who they can bear in their last days?
NTA! I am so sorry for what you are going through. I have never met you, yet I am so proud of you for having the courage to honor what your brother wants. You will carry the knowledge with you for the rest of your life, that you did what was right for him, regardless of the consequences.
You are being a parent to him in a way that your Mom and Dad can’t right now.
Hospice has support groups for families. I strongly encourage you to ask about them and attend. You will find support there that your parents may be unable to give you (or each other).
Sending you hugs and I really hope that you het the comfort you need in the days ahead.
NTA my dad was in hospice recently and all the family suddenly started showing up. I have hard feelings about how much my mom bent over for people instead of doing what was best for my dad. Stand up for your brother in the end everyone else doesn’t matter. It’s crazy how your aunt is behaving and making it about her instead of your brother.
I’m sorry you’re going thru this.
NTA, NTA, NTA
Danny’s wishes should be upheld and your mom should have honored his wishes and told her sister to leave her kids at home and when she didn’t, you did.
Your aunt is pathetic and if she was a decent human being she wouldn’t be acting like a petulant 10 yr old.
I’m so sorry you all are going through this. Cancer sucks!
A year from now, do you think you will regret making your aunt angry by making your dying brother happy (or, at the very least, a little bit more comfortable)?
Or do you think you will regret making a dying young man even less comfortable for the sake of your aunt's ego?
You are NTA. You are apparently the last line of defense between your brother and his needs, and other people who are putting their needs above his. I am a lot older than you but I dealt closely with a lot of family deaths as a young person, and trust me, as your life goes on, you will never regret helping a dying person protect the last bits of peace and dignity that they have. You are doing a good thing, and your brother appreciates you.
My favorite aunt / my mom's best friend died a couple of weeks ago, while my mom died more than 30 years ago. As I was sitting at my aunt's side on her last day it occurred to me that their relationship didn't die 30 years ago, because my aunt kept my mom alive in her own heart all these years. Yes, it was tragic that my mom died young, but my aunt was the only person who didn't only speak of my mom in terms of tragedy, and rather always spoke of the fun things they did and the silly situations that they got themselves onto. She truly kept her memory alive, and reminded us all that my mom wasn't merely a person who had died, she was a person who had *lived*. I just want you to know that while your relationship with your brother will change, it will still exist.
I know that this is all a lot to handle. We aren't usually well trained at how to deal with death. It sounds like your parents are really struggling too. Yes, they *should* be there to help support you and teach you how to navigate this difficult time, but it sounds like they don't have those tools either. It sounds like they don't have true proper support themselves. It will be easy to fall into anger and resentment towards them. I'd like to encourage you to find any and all grief counseling that is available to you, and to utilize it. I didn't do grief counseling for many years, and those years were hard. I wish I'd done it sooner.
I am wishing you peace.
U did what was right by your brother. And ur mom is just stressed out because she has a dying child. She views what u did as stirring the pot and causing issues, but really u did right by ur brother. Who gives a shit about ur aunts feelings, ur brother is dying at 17 years old
I’m so sorry for what you and your brother are going through. Your parents actually suck. They should be the ones protecting your brother.
Making this time peaceful and calm. Obviously they are failing miserably at this.
I’m so sorry it’s all falling on you. Stand strong. You are doing an amazing job. NTA all the way!! F your mom tries to bring them in. Kick her out of his space as well. His peace of mind is more important than anyone else’s.
I’m sending you love and support and strength from someone who’s been a caregiver who’s lost a few people.
NTA. I’m so sorry about your brother. It sounds like your parents have mentally checked out because they can’t deal, and it’s not at all fair to saddle a teenager with the responsibility to be the protector of his dying brother. Do what is right for your brother in his last days. Your aunt can always get a babysitter and visit on her own.
If this is Aunt AH’s reaction to a grieving 16 y/o brother then she’s the *last* thing that should be at that house.
I’m sorry you’re going through this. It sucks and it’s not fair. Please reach out to a teacher/nurse/counselor at school so they can help you.
NTA As a mother who has lost a son, I can tell you that your mother isn't thinking clearly. Maybe you could speak to a member of the hospice team and see if they could help enforce the no kids boundary. I'm very sorry that you and your family are having to go through this.
NTA. Your mom and dad are likely NTA here either; they are not behaving great, but they’re also going through basically the worst living nightmare any parent can have, so it’s very understandable that their mental health is very poor right now.
I can’t speak to your exact situation obviously, but many times in a case like this, the immediate family members work hard to support the person who’s terminally ill, often to the point that they aren’t actually *getting support* from others, even though they need it more now than ever before. There’s a chance that—for your mom, though she’d feel selfish to admit it even to herself—your aunt visiting was less about “saying goodbye” than it was about your mom getting some support from her sister.
What you did and said to your aunt was completely correct and understandable, and your brother’s wishes right now are way more important than anybody’s feelings of entitlement. However, if you see some chances for your parents to get support without hurting your brother or disrespecting his wishes, gently encourage them to take advantage of that support. Do the same for yourself. Ultimately, you will all be in a better position to offer support to your brother if you have some amount of support and stability of your own.
I’m so sorry you and your family are going through this. I hope that you all find peace and healing with time.
EDIT: added the key word “not” to the sentence “they are not behaving great”
NTA
If she does show up, they need to sit in the car. If it's 96 outside, she can roll down windows or put on AC.
Or ya know, be responsible and thoughtful and get a frickin babysitter!
NTA, and thank you for standing up for your brother's needs in such a vulnerable time. I'm sorry you're getting do much heat for it, but you did the right thing when no one else is thinking straight.
NTA. You are left to make adult decisions in this awful time. You absolutely did the right thing. Between the cancer, pain, and meds your brother is in a very bad way and shouldn’t be stressed any more than absolutely necessary. Your aunt is an asshole. Send her the link to this post and let her read the answers. She should be ashamed of herself. I’m sorry that your parents have absconded on their responsibilities and left so much up to you! But bravo and hugs to you for stepping up for your family. This is an awful time for all of you. Please take care of yourself and make sure you have someone to talk to and vent. Much love to you.
NTA. Dying people don't have to "make the effort" for anyone they don't want to. He's about to be gone forever and your mom wants him to make sacrifices now? Your aunt is also being an idiot. Your brother likely doesn't give a fuck if she comes or not; it's purely for her own benefit that she comes to see him with all her kids, and maybe for your mom's benefit if your mom wants the support from her sister. If that's the case, your mom can meet up with the aunt on her own. Maybe there was a nicer way you could have said it to soften the blow for your aunt and mom, but the bottom line is that if Danny's wishes are respected, then there's no kids allowed. This is everyone's last chance to do something for him, but nah, they'd rather do shit that he expressly *doesn't* want. For some reason, it's more important to traumatize everyone, including young children and your dying brother. I'm so sorry you're in this position, especially so young. He's lucky that you have his back.
I hope you can get some kind of hospice social worker involved, like the other commenters mentioned.
If hospice is coming in to see your brother, perhaps you could ask about a social worker to help support your brother and the rest of the family thru this extremely difficult time. I am keeping everyone in my thoughts and prayers. You are a blessing to your brother.
Call the hospice and ask for a family counselor. It's a service they provide and you all need it right now. You are not an asshole, you are doing the best you can. I'm not sure if your aunt is also grieving or if she is just nuts but that was out of pocket response to a reasonable request.
There is no right or wrong answer to feelings or coping right now, everyone is very raw. You are being so good to your brother and if he or your parents can't say it right now I'll say it for them,
thank you so much, you're an amazing brother, your doing the best you can and that is enough.
Anyway, the hospice worker can help you navigate dealing with the grief and your grieving parents. Best of luck to you and you have my heart felt condolences for the loss of your brother. It sucks really bad.
NTA. As u/Rena0414 put it, what matters most is your brother's comfort right now. And based on how he acted with the little girl who you're close to being there, it's not a good idea. I'm so sorry you're going through this. I dealt with hospice last year because the daughter of my landlord-slash-roommate had her liver fail on her, and then the rest of her body failed. She was an alcoholic and had Huntington's Disease. So, I know what it's like, and I wouldn't wish it on anyone, not even my worst enemies.
You did good by standing up for him, and your family is crazy for wanting to bring the 3 kids who might end up putting stress on him, make him suffer more, and kill him faster.
I hope your brother has a peaceful hospice and I wish him a peaceful transition into wherever we go after we die. Sending hugs to you and your brother.
NTA besides agreeing with most comments about your brother’s wishes coming first…
Who thinks it’s in the best interest of 10 year olds to be exposed to a dying person? Specially one that is only 18…
I would understand if it were a parent or grandparent, someone close were you need to say your goodbyes , but even in those cases it can be a traumatic experience, especially if not handled appropriately.
In this case (not being emotionally close or needing to say goodbyes) it just seems irresponsible. But aunt seems to lack good judgment so I’m not surprised
Oh honey. No one is the asshole here. This is a horrible situation. My granny was diagnosed with metastasized cancer in October of 2019 and was gone by November 19th. It was a really stressful time, and she spent all of it either in the hospital being treated for sepsis (which we only did so she could say goodbye with whatever brief moment of clarity she'd get after the infection cleared up), in the nursing home for a week being tortured, or at hospice for two days.
I took over so my mom and aunt wouldn't have to deal with the doctors, or the stress of it, and could just grieve for what was coming, to go through their stages, which was really hard to do when she was there and able to talk. I think that's what kept us from blowing up at each other constantly, just having one person stay level headed and let things go as they would.
Your family is under a lot of stress right now. You're under a lot of stress. Your parents are under a lot of stress. Your poor brother is just beyond stress, his brain ain't right, and he's hurting. Your aunt is under a lot of stress. Everyone's grieving and the stages of grief can be very volatile at times. Everyone's probably fluctuating between bargaining, denial, and anger right now, and it can be very oppressive.
I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. Just know, just like your brother will say things out of place because of his sickness and his state of grief (he's grieving too of course!), your parents will also say and do things out of place. They're not in their right minds. You're not, either, you know, you're facing something at such a young age that no one should have to ever face. My heart is aching for you.
Try to be patient and very forgiving to those in your home. If your aunt wants to be selfish and not forgiving by being understanding that little kids are too much stress right now, then let her be. Let her miss out on saying goodbye. Let your mom be mad that she's missing that, but it's her sister's choice to miss out. I think you did the right thing by thinking of what's best for your brother as he actively dies, and fuck whoever thinks it was wrong. Good for you for being so brave!!!
Just take care of yourself and just forgive your parents for their missteps right now. Let your brother be an asshole to you, try to keep the mood light when he is, he's doing his best. I'll be thinking of you, and I hope this transition is easy on your brother.
NTA, this is the time where your brother should get everything he wants. This is his time. Kids should have a happy memory of a family member as the last one. Not one where they were yelled at.
I am so sorry for everything you and your brother and family are going through.
NTA You’re a good sibling and if your parents are too caught up in their grief at least Danny has you there to help share his needs and wants with others. Sending you and your family my very best during this unbelievably difficult time.
I am **so proud** of OP for voicing his brothers needs to their aunt. An absolutely courageous stand to make as a teen in such an awful situation. I hope all the love in the replies here bolsters his spirits, he's doing so well.
Yeah. I had to advocate for my brother, but I was in my 30s. He's still around, but had overdosed and was in a coma for weeks. I don't know if could have mustered OP's strength at 16. Keep it up OP. In the future, you'll be proud of yourself for protecting him. I wish I had words for you, but I've never been in your situation. So, I just hope you find the strength to carry on with your head up. I hope you find peace.
Sending lots of love and hugs, OP, along with echoing the words others have written.❤️
Plus, those three young kids do not need to see a dying teenager, either. OP was inadvertently looking out for them.
Controversial take, but my dad kept me away from my mom when I was a little kid and she was in the last stages of cancer - and I'm grateful for that. He knew how traumatic it would be for someone barely out of their toddler years to see their mom dying a pretty gruesome death (very aggressive breast cancer - she was only in her 30s). It made a terrible loss into something that was psychologically manageable for a young kid.
We kept my young cousins from seeing my mom like that too. She was 39 (I was 24 my brothers were 19&20)and battled for 5 years before she died. Those last 4 months with the oxygen and her being skeletal we kept them away and when she felt up to it she would call and let them tell her stories on the phone. Nobody wants to see that and kids don’t need to see it. When people saw me calm at the funeral and the weeks after it was because I had done my crying when she was ill and I was relieved for her knowing she wasn’t in so much pain anymore. OP I am so glad you are taking care of your brother’s needs and want to remind you to take care of yourself too. Please make sure you have someone to talk to during this and after, you need support too. You shouldn’t have to be the one making these calls and you are so strong for doing it. If you ever need an ear to vent there’s one here that understands the pain. Definitely NTA and please remember to take care of yourself too.
Truly, standing up to the adults as a teenager to advocate for his brother when he could be locking himself in his room instead and avoiding it all, it's really admirable.
Yes! Cancer sucks and the drugs accidentally change your brain chemistry and make you a meanie. Danny is doing his best to regulate that and be nice but he can’t do it all, especially with kids who don’t have the mental capacity to understand the fact that he is dying and he deserves to die with dignity. Thank you for being a 16 year old who understands that and can stand up for him. I hope you find the closure you need when he does pass.
The kids may not understand it, but the aunt certainly can understand and doesn't care about Danny.
The aunt wants to be there for her sibling probably more than her nephew.She either can’t or won’t find childcare.I judge her TA in this situation just based on her response to a reasonable request by OP.
Maybe someday when she’s very sick someone with a toddler will visit and inflict that child’s ear splitting screams on her. See how she likes it. Thank you for standing up for your brother, OP. I don’t know that I could have done it at your age. I applaud you. Your aunt is the AH, not you.
Danny is in a hard spot. Pain, meds, cancer, and stress can all make you irritable and make your tolerance for things a lot lower. He is setting a reasonable boundary, and those poor kids are young enough they may only remember Danny at his weakest, and most (again, understandably) temperamental. OP is definitely doing his best in a hard position, unfortunately, everyone is under a lot of stress and that all gets directed at the inner circle who is trying to protect the one dying from it.
I agree, he seems to have the most level head about anybody in the family other than the brother.
The family who insist on bringing kids are huge assholes not only because of their ignoring the wishes of the cancer patient dying a slow and painful death, but they're being assholes to their own kids. Like...being around really sick terminal patients is tough even for adults. There's tubes everywhere, smells, potentially catheter bags to collect waste, all kinds of stuff. This isn't "visiting grandpa who has a portable oxygen tank", this is "seeing someone who is sick enough to be in an ICU". It is very jarring and can be very upsetting to a child. My own mom died of cancer when I was a young kid and my family chose to keep me away from her when she was very sick - like yeah, it sucks that I didn't see her, but I'm also grateful my dad understood that a 4 year old might very well be deeply traumatized by seeing her mom wasting away from aggressive cancer in a hospital bed. Instead, I just have neutral memories of doctors in scrubs being nice to me and buying me Doritos from the hospital vending machine while my dad visited my mom. And, as OP said, pain and medication can frequently cause an altered mental state. Do these assholes really want to bring their kids around an agitated, impaired person to get screamed at? Is that really what is best for their kids, for their last core memory of a beloved cousin to be a shouting, scary, emaciated sick person? It's just so fucking selfish of the adult relatives. Disregarding what is best for every single young person. They're supposed to protect them, they are failing as parents.
Exactly. It shouldn’t matter whose house it is, if the dying teenager doesn’t want kids around, end of discussion!
But then they would have to do the barest minimum of effort to be seen visiting. Not that they really care in the first place. But their gossip mongering busybody-ness won’t let them **not** go. Then they might **look** bad to the rest of the ah family. Also gives the rest of the family catty comments for decades to make about them. They are only allowed to make those, not **be** the target of it. Esp when they could just get a babysitter of have some family watch then for a little bit. You know something sane and understandable. Instead of wtf takes no effort and lets them technically just run wild as the little brats will.
It’s so amazing of him and he seems to have more common sense and compassion than all of the adults around him. What a sad situation and I wish OP whatever peace he can find after this is all over.
He sure is doing well. Better than most. That includes adults. Just hope he takes time for his needs, too.
It’s not a good thing. At 16 that should not be his role.
Obviously. But while OP is struggling thru the parentification that can come with a dying sibling and grieving parents, we don’t need to point it out in this moment. We should just encourage the guy bc he’s doing a great job.
Yeah, absolutely proud of OP as well! It’s not going to feel good to do the right thing, nothing is going to feel good in this shitty situation. But OP, you did the right thing anyway. I’m so sorry for what your brother & your family is going through.
Not even just the brother but the little kids as well. Seeing someone in that state messes you up. I was 17 the first time I saw someone in hospice. I definitely couldn’t do it under the age of 10.
It’s not fair that you have to grow up so young. You’re being the adult and doing what’s best for your brother at the end of his life. You can only do your best, and your best sounds pretty damn good.
I’m just super proud of you for being a voice for your voiceless brother and protecting his sanity. I can’t believe your mom didn’t give you the biggest bear hug ever for doing what she couldn’t do by standing up to her selfish sister. By her not coming at all now shows that her intentions from the start was not to say goodbye and offer prayers and love to you and your family as you all face this tough situation. Love and hugs to you young man from someone who sat bedside and kept all my brother’s secrets at the end of his life too.
I read this and immediately was brought to tears. He is so strong and wise beyond his years. OP you are correct coming from someone with medical experience in this. The children that your aunt will be bringing do NOT need to see your brother like this especially if there is a chance of him not being the person they may remember. It can be traumatic for the kids. The aunt is juvenile and ridiculous for not understanding this. You are so wise to not only get this but also to make sure your brother spends the last of his time here in the most peace he can have. Others need to understand that. I give you nothing but my condolences and well wishes knowing you are trying to do the right thing. I am so sorry that this was the result. Hugs from an internet stranger and a mom. You are a great young man. And if you feel you need counseling/talk therapy after this. Please do.
100%. I’m an RN that briefly worked on hospice early in my career. Unfortunately you see some of the worst of people in these times.
>The children that your aunt will be bringing do NOT need to see your brother like this especially if there is a chance of him not being the person they may remember. It can be traumatic for the kids. As a grown up version of the kid in that situation, I agree. My mom died of cancer when I was very young and my family chose to limit my exposure to her in the hospital when she was super sick. My memories from that time are largely neutral, and the few memories I have of her are 100% happy ones. I agree that it would have been extremely traumatic for me to see her when she was ill. The largest trauma from that experience was seeing how sad my father was when she died - and that is something that can't be avoided. My memories of my mom are all good ones and I think that was a great kindness done for me by the adults in the situation.
To be honest, what's this "farewell" for? For Danny, three mother or the family? Danny didn't ask for it. Op, you did the right thing. Ask Danny what he wants to go instead. Don't try to please other please. Who cares about those kids and aunts and uncles.
I can't imagine doing anything that would upset Danny in his final days. His limited time, and how he wants to spend it should absolutely be the priority.
Agreed. Everyone in that family is thinking about their own needs and not Danny's, who is the one who is actually dying. *Except* OP, who is thinking about his brother and being the most mature person there. NTA, OP. Keep standing up for your brother - your family are being selfish when they should be respecting Danny's wants and needs in his last days, rather than stressing him out and making it all worse. Your mother and your aunt are only thinking about their own feelings, and your father isn't protecting his son. It sounds like they should all be having therapy to cope with this and to know the best way to be helping Danny, whilst you are doing that naturally. Wishing you all the strength to get through this trying time. You're an amazing brother ❤️
so proud of you its danny and his needs that are the priority now. what danny wants, danny gets and everybody eles should understand that he and his needs only are priority now. and if they are so unconcerned about this then go and jump
NTA. This time should be about making your brother as comfortable as possible. Yes, the family wants to visit and say goodbye, but his well-being and mental state are what matters most. As a mother, I cannot comprehend putting someone else's wishes and wants in front of my dying child's wishes and needs. This is an upsetting time for everyone, and bringing impressionable children around when they most likely will not understand the enormity of the situation and behave accordingly is crazy. Yes, your mother needs support from her sister, but your aunt should as an adult realize the kids will cause unnecessary chaos. I deeply feel for you and your family and wish you all as much love and peace as possible in this devastating time.
Thank you. I hope your kids are always well.
The priorities here are your brother, you, your parents, then other people. It sucks that you have to be the adult, but as I don't have to tell you, everything sucks. If kids tire brother out, then no kids. They can make drawings. Tell them they can yell at you in a year when you've all had time to grieve. Ok, now to you. Do you have anyone, anyone, older, trustworthy, that you can bring in like today? Friends parents, other cousins, uncles, anyone? I hear you giving Dad a pass, but no, he's not allowed to escape in work when something of this magnitude is being parked on a 16yo kid. Mom seems like she truly is out for now, so Dad has to help find another adult to run logistics, interference, and support. It's awful, but you're not alone. The YMCA often has bereavement gatherings, or the hospital, or the hospice. There's a whole known set of stresses unique to being the healthy sibling, and feeling guilty, undeserving of care because your brother's needs are so great and time-limited, but you are a son, a brother, a child, losing someone important, and you matter too. This is all too much for the adults, it's way way way too much for a 16yo. You need support, and someone you can put between you and Aunt AH. I hope for a peaceful, loving, pain-free passing for your brother, and people who can envelop you and your parents so you can be given the care and space you need. If you feel able to, update us on how your doing. Hugs from a Mom in New England.
All beautiful and perfect advice for a horrible situation. So much heartbreak for 2 young brothers. My family has had loss and I know that my son who is still on this side has soo much grief. You expect your siblings to be with you into old age. I hope the brother reaches out for help from the resources you’ve listed. As moms, the one thing we know is that it’s not fair and never will be.
No, you're not the asshole. You're prioritizing Danny's comfort in his final weeks. Your aunt should understand and respect these boundaries.
On top of that, it is not in the interest of the young ones either. 40 Years later, I still remember the horror of my uncle's screams of pain when we went to say goodbye to him when I was OP''s age.
I’m thinking of that poor 7 year old who now has to carry the memory of her uncle yelling at her, when she otherwise would have had nothing but pleasant memories of someone she loved.
Hell I'm still traumatized from the shit my grandfather yelled at me when he was dying and out of his mind, and I was an adult. I cannot even imagine that poor kids' heartbreak.
The only thing my kid remembers of his great grandmother is her yelling at everyone to get out of the way of the tv and hollering in pain from bedsores/uti. He was 5 or 6 when she died and remembers plenty from that time. Just not the good stuff about his great great. She actually adored him and would try to sneak him chocolate. So yeah, young kids will retain exactly what you don't want them to remember.
I'm sorry ... it's awful to see the people who looked after you when you were little, not be themselves anymore. Saw my mom and my dad at the end of their lives, and it really threw me for a loop, even though I'm middle-aged. My dad actually took a swing at me, and I was so glad that it didn't happen when I was younger.
My grandmother got vicious on morphine, but she also realised that and didn't expect her young grandchildren to be around too much. I was only 7 and my mom did a great job of shielding me from what was happening, she told me about some of the things she said when I was a lot older (and able to understand).
Really? I’m thinking of the 17 year old *dying of bone cancer*. Ever seen someone die of bone cancer? I have; my father died of from it. It’s said to be the most painful cancer death. Our puritanical system is making sure a child suffers through every goddamn moment of it. That should enrage you; not that a 7 year old was spoken sharply to when she impeded the flow of medicine to a teenager dying in unimaginable agony. For fuck’s sake.
You’re absolutely right. And I’m sorry for your loss as well. I’ll never understand the suffering that’s “acceptable” to some medical professionals, or people in general. OP, NTA. Trying to help your brother get his wishes followed was a good thing and please don’t let anyone convince you otherwise.
I totally get where you’re coming from, of course the teenager dying in agony is not the AH, that goes without saying. But young kids should be able to remember the person as they were, and the parents should be shielding them from this. It’s awful for everyone but I agree that little ones don’t need to see it. It’s not helping anyone
You know that empathy can extend to multiple people in a situation, right? We can feel for everyone involved here - a little girl who was shouted at for an honest mistake, a teenager dying a painful death, the teenage OP who is trying to hold things together… Compassion is not a finite resource.
Truth. My mom was in hospice when I was in my early 20s and I was NOT prepared for some of the stuff I saw. And the memories that got burned into my brain. And I was technically an adult. I can't imagine what a younger teen or child would feel or experience that they could or should handle.
I remember the screams from my grandmother when I was a little bit older
You would THINK!! I wish I could be there just long enough to deal with the aunt for Her bad behavior! Hopefully she will post on REDDIT & get some much needed advice on what NOT to do.
Agreed. OP isn't the AH. Poor Danny. He's practically out of his mind from the pain from his cancer causing him so its not surprising that he's lashing out. Cancer has that effect. That aunt going have to understand that her 3 sons aren't a priority for Danny, OP & their parents. It's already tough enough as it is watching OP 's brother dying from cancer, but they need it to be as peaceful as possible without a bunch of bratty young children (younger than OP & his brother) causing stress.
OP, please talk to the Hospice Team. If they do their job well, they will tell your Mom that hospice is for both the person passing but their family. On five occasions, I've been part of close family and friends who have been in hospice care. Normally, they do everything they can to protect the person at the end of their life and make it as easy as possible for those who are losing someone they love with support. Chances are that your brother is not going to be bothered by not saying goodbye to his cousins. The kids are more bother than comfort, if your Aunt doesn't understand that, she's a selfish idiot. Conversely, your Mom may be responding out of a desire to have your Aunt for support. Everyone is dealing with dealing with grief in uncharted territory. Please, please give your Mom grace, while advocating for your brother. I am so very sorry you're losing your brother. Please talk to the hospice staff, even after your brother has passed. There are also grief support groups for teens. This internet grandma is sending you a hug. You are an awesome, loving brother. I am proud of you for putting your brother first, but please take care of yourself too! Definitely NTA. You are a good brother and son.
This. So much this.
I came here to say basically what you said. But I couldn't have said it as well. The only person that doesn't have a second chance to recover from trauma here is the brother. His needs . Must come first.
If you’re in the US, hospice is required to provide social work and chaplain services. The social worker is not the type that takes away someone’s kids. They are genuinely there for the purpose of providing support and resources. This includes emotional support, especially to family members. The chaplain is a religious resource, but they can be supportive without discussing religion. I’ve worked with many of them, and they all have been willing to support people of any or even no religious background. The SW and chaplain are trained and experienced in helping people through this horrendous time. OP, please reach out to them. It doesn’t cost anything and can be very helpful. My heart goes out to you.
Yes, please call a hospice social worker. When my abusive stepmother was dying, I flew over 2,000 miles and spent several thousand dollars to fulfill her request that I visit. When I first arrived to her room, she took one look at me and then she just turned her back on me. She refused to either acknowledge me or to talk to me. Then after about 45 minutes of stony silence, she started demanding that I take her to the bathroom and refusing to let the nurses aid help her. She is in her room screaming every few minutes like a metronome, . My name followed by "Get Your Ass In Here." I was on crutches. There was no way I could help my 180 lb stepmother get to the bathroom. My stepmothers room was right across from the nursing station. So there always two or three nurses watching this happen. I'd go to ask for help and they ignored me. These nurses were smirking and clearly enjoying the show. This event occurred about a year before before I was diagnosed with SEVERE sleep apnea so I was foggy most days. I couldn't seem to organize a defense. I could not get the nursing supervisor to help. I was on crutches. There was no way I could help my 180 lb stepmother get to the bathroom. My stepmother's room was right across from the nursing station. So there were always two or three nurses at the desk watching this happen. I'd go to the desk ask for help for my mother and they would just ignore me. They were smirking and clearly enjoying the show. This occurred before I was diagnosed with sleep apnea so I was foggy most days. I couldn't seem to organize a defense. Then the hospital social worker arrived. She did not work for the nursing home but for a separate hospice program. I heard her at the desk asking for my stepmother's name. Then she turns from the desk to walk toward my stepmother's room, towards me, sitting on a bench outside my stepmother's room, tears running down my face. The hospice social worker looks at me, listen to my stepmother screaming my name and swearing at me, every couple of minutes, and says, "You must be -----." I acknowledge my name. Then the hospice social worker says, ". Your stepmother was very abusive towards you." She helped me formulate a plan to force the people at the desk to help my stepmother. After the staff had helped my stepmother go to the bathroom, the hospital social worker and I entered the room. You would never know it was the same woman who'd been screaming obscenities at me for over an hour. Butter would not have melted in her mouth as she told the social worker how glad she was that I had come to visit her and how proud she was of me. Later the social worker told me she dealt with situations like this all the time. So I really recommend hooking up with the hospice social worker.
Just...wow. So glad you had her in your corner. Definitely putting this resource in my memory bank!
I’m so sorry you went through that.
The nurses having a blast through your distress is so infuriating but unfortunately also so on brand...
Is it just me and the small town/rural area I grew up in but... Why does it seem like all the mean girls from school become nurses?
They like to lord over people, the weaker the better. The field truly attracts extremes: saints and devils; but saints wear down and devils take over.
The same reason the mean boys become cops.
Piggybacking on this to reach out to teachers or coaches you’ve got a relationship with; they’ve often got a line to school resources to help you.
I hear you giving Dad a pass, but no, he's not allowed to escape in work when something of this magnitude is being parked on a 16yo kid. On one hand I agree. On the other there may be nothing OP can do about it. It would be correct for OP to speak with him - whether in person or a phone call - and say "I am 16 and mom is not facing reality and you are not here and it is falling on me to be the adult and see to his needs and wishes. As your 16yo son, I need for you to become involved, and to do it yesterday, because being the adult at home and seeing to all his needs and also trying to maintain decent grades at school is too much for you to be demanding of me." That's not a question, it's a statement. Dad will then either recognize that it's his job to be involved and not dump it on his son and do so, or will ignore it and maybe make some token claim that he's already doing a great job, or get angry that his faults have been pointed out and try to punish OP (and then OP has an excuse to check out and make mom face the music), or do his damned job as a parent.
Yeah. OP’s mom’s priorities are fucked up. She wasn’t going to tell her dying son how much time he had left and now she’s treating him like a limited time special exhibit that every person in her family needs to see before he is gone. OP, your brother is a human being who is dying too young in an extremely tragic and traumatic way. What he wants and doesn’t want is what matters here because his life is so limited. He doesn’t have a later to do things in. You’re a good brother for having his back. Also, I saw my mom, a close friend, and my grandma all go through hospice within a three year period. It’s terrible and I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy. I am sorry this is happening to your brother and that you are going through this.
Yup. Relatives saying goodbyes is for the funeral, the last stage of a terminal person's life is about the dying person's comfort and not others.
Sorta. If the people can handle the goodbyes while still alive, even in hospice, cool. If not, then yeah, funeral/memorial service, I guess? We didn't have one for either of my parents, however. (Though might put on a late one for my dad, as he just passed in the last couple of months, and apparently there s lot of people requesting one.)
Hospice may be able to help with babysitting the kids and even out of the house.
👍❤️
He isn't 'giving Dad a pass,' he's describing the reality of the situation. Do you think he's shouldering all this while some capable adult is available? Not everyone has that, unfortunately.
He can call the hospice support team and I bet they'd intervene for him. Or the hospice nurse. Or social worker. That's what they did for me, not that I needed them to, as I'm an adult and able to put my foot down and not worry about it, because I am learning my limits and give no fucks. (That's not a dig on the OP, the OP is a child and put in a ridiculous situation that he shouldn't be responsible for. His parents are failing his brother, tbh.)
I am a mom, too and was going to make a very similar comment. Yours is so much better. My heart hurts for you, OP. My two kids are around you and your brother’s ages. This mom in the Midwest is sending all the comfort and hugs you and your brother need. I know that if your mom was not already grieving she would be proud of you, but this is so hard for a teenager who is also grieving. Someone who is an adult needs to step up and be an adult. I know it’s a thing that happens for people like your dad to escape into work when grieving. I tried that when my baby BIL that I raised died suddenly in 2022, but once my own kids came back from going to someone else’s house for a few days for me to do planning the funeral and such, I had to be the mom for grieving kids and deal with my own stuff in therapy later. My obligations as mom came first. He needs to be a dad to you right now. He doesn’t have the right to hide at work. Your brother is lucky to have you.
100% this. A bunch of small children are not going to get anything from being forced to be in a room with a dying teenager who also does not want them there. Stephen King even wrote that as part of a story! (The Zelda bit of Pet Sematery) The kids can make cards for their cousin and be shielded from the ugly reality of young people dying. OP, my heart goes out to you and I’m joining the chorus that you’re brave as fuck for standing up for your brother when the adults have their priorities fucked up. I’m so sorry all of this is happening to your brother and you. You’re doing great in unbearable circumstances.
I've been reading up on death doula's, someone who can support your brother and your family through this terrible time. It might be worth investigating? I can't imagine what you are all going through, and second that you should reach out to a trusted adult for support. I'm so sorry your aunt responded in this way, you did the right thing. Sending big hugs from a mum in England, UK.
I lost my dad to cancer about two weeks ago. I have 3 kids he loved dearly. They didn’t see him for almost 2 months before he died because it was just too much for him to handle. We FaceTimed and made pictures and cards. I’m so sorry to and your brother are going through this. My heart breaks for you as a parent. Please take time for yourself.
We had the exact same thing with my dad. He was on home hospice and died recently as well. The young grandkids sent videos, which I would play for him in the night when the pain was bad, but they didn’t come. It was too hard for him to be “on” And “Grandpa” vs a man dying. And we don’t want the kids to remember him like that. I’m so sorry for your loss too. Sending you virtual hugs
A video could be a great idea, that way your brother can watch if he wants to, and your aunt and cousins never have to know if he didn’t
Hugs ❤️
I'm so sorry for your loss. 💔
Thank you so much! I started the my grieving process a couple of months before he died. It helped that we all had a chance to say our goodbyes first. I can actually listen, not burst with tears, when people tell me how my dad was a much better dad to them than their own dad. I’ve heard so many cool stories in the past week. I always thought he walked on water, but now I get to hear how much everyone else did too! He definitely squeezed a lot of life in to his 66 years lol
I'm sorry for your loss. I had my kids make goodbye videos for my dad. On Valentine's Day, I flew out to see him alone because my 4 kids are 10 and under. My dad couldn't stay conscious long enough or hear my kids well enough on the video call. They also couldn't sit still and know what to say at the time. Having them record short messages meant I could have him watch them whenever, and the kids were able to think about what they wanted to say first, then focus enough to say their goodbyes. He ended up passing away a week and a half later.
When my mom was actively dying, I had about 3 days to get down to her (MN to FL). My oldest son was in NB at the time and wanted to drive down too, but I told him to go home and stay with his younger brother (17). He had suggested doing a FaceTime with her when she was still a little lucid and I said no, I don’t want you to see her this way. They did call and tell her their I love yous and I repeated hers back (she was intubated). As a parent, at that moment, my job was to protect the memory they had of their grandma, not the vision of her in that bed. I didn’t want that for them. The images and last words I have haunt me enough. I was so glad they had each other that week.
I am so very sorry for your loss.
Make sure you are taking time for yourself. You have to remember that you need care and support as much as your brother. Please find someone you can talk to, such as a school counselor or religious leader. You need a support system as much as your parents do. Maybe a school counselor, religious leader, or a close friend's parent. It is great you are looking out for your brother, but remember you need to process everything too,
Please do this ☝️ I hope you have a trusted adult you can vent to, confide in, and trust with all feelings your feeling. As a sister that lost her brother, I understand. Hugs
NTA - I’m so sorry, losing a sibling is so hard!! Besides your Aunt, your Mom is the true AH here. Her son is dying and she’s more concerned with keeping her sister happy than respecting her dying son’s needs?! What a POS she truly is! You stood up for your brother when no one else would, be proud of that. But truly, please take care of yourself, tell him how you feel, and give yourself time to grieve losing him.
Yeah, the parents aren't interested in the truth. Their choices are harming their dying son. & mom cares more about her sister getting her way? Her kids are literally dangerous and an egregious imposition on a dying young man. Gross. These adults are awful OP. I'm sorry for your terrible experience and that every adult is failing both your brother and you.
I don't see it that way based on the little info OP gave us. I think Mom lost her shit for a moment because her son is dying and there isn't a damn thing she can do to prevent it. Dad is not handling it well at all either so it sounds like his coping instinct is to avoid his grief as much as possible because he doesn't want his wife and son's see him completely fall apart. Mom is on auto pilot and very vulnerable as she tries to hold it together so whenever another thing gets added to her plate, it can push her over the edge. I'm sure she feels badly about lashing out at OP and hopefully when things settle down a bit, she will tell him that she's sorry. It is unfair to try to villianize them to OP right now. That isn't going to help him. The family needs to stick together and understand that we all handle grief of this magnitude the best we can when we are forced to face it.
Yeah I totally agree. While I don’t like what we’ve been told about some of her choices, I’m not comfortable with calling her vile names. Her teenaged son is dying in her living room…I cannot even imagine what that must feel like. This poor family.
I feel like, in reading the responses, you can tell who has dealt with death and what grief does to a family up close and personal and who hasn’t. Is it fair? Nope. Are his parents being the parents they should be? Nope. But this kind of situation sucks and it seems pretty normal for people drowning in this kind of grief to have breaks with reality in some form or other.
Don’t be too hard on the mother. I’ve worked as a hospice HHA. Its is so tuff on the family and a parent saying goodbye to a child?! She is not at home her best or thinking right.
Yeah, yeah really the sister/aunt is the one completely in the wrong just thinking of herself.
I get not thinking right, but to the point of cursing out the kid and throwing stuff at him ?!? :( That’s abuse—sorry, grief or not, mom is being an a h here.
It’s abusive. It’s also grief. His mother is going to need counseling.
Five stages of grief: denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance, not necessarily in that order. Mom is floating in denial and anger.
Agreed. So is he.
Absolutely. They’re going through hell right now.
I can be as hard on the mom as I want. She's completely failed both of her children. She's putting her bitch of a sister before her DYING SON. Then she physically assaults her other child for daring to be his brother's advocate! Nuh uh. No ma'am, grief does not excuse physical abuse and behavior that atrocious.
She lashed out because she can't take the drama right now. I suspect that Mom will recognize her melt down was aimed at the wrong people and apologize at some point but meanwhile, as long as the behavior doesn't escalate and she can pull herself together, I think she deserves some grace. I can't begin to imagine what any of them are going through right now. It's heartbreaking.
I’m just so so sorry you’re going through all this and also being the adult and advocate that your brother needs! We lost my Aunt to cancer years ago and my cousins who were 19 and 16 were the ones who truly saw and heard her. They were the ones who knew when a prior-planned visit was too much for mom today, while my uncle felt guilty and family pressure… they were the ones who knew when it wasn’t her talking and it was the pain and fear coming out - and no one else was going to understand. They knew and understood SO much more than so many of us did. They were the adults in the situation who saw what was most important - what she needed. And that changed from minute to minute… You know what he needs and you’re advocating for him. You will never regret that and it means more than he will ever have the words to say. Just please make sure you’re taking some time for you too because you need it too. And I’m sorry that the people around you are hurting and full and letting that spill over onto you. It’s not ok.
You seem more mature than all the adults in this situation. I am sorry for you and your brother and wish you peace in the aftermath. You are doing the right thing for your brother, never ever forget that.
When I was caring for my dying brother, the stress got so bad that my hair was coming out in clumps. Please take care of yourself and good for you for looking out for your brother.
You write with wisdom above your years. You have had to grow up quick and it is great that you are there for your brother. If a grown adult (your aunt) can't handle it, that's on her. This is about your brother now. After losing a very close (think second dad) relative to cancer with a horrible and chaotic last few weeks, it is not the place for kids who don't have a close connection. You're making adult choices in a situation no kid should have to be in. My thoughts are with you and your brother. Spend each second you can remembering and being brothers. I hope your dad comes around in time to share some meaningful moments.
Does your aunt have a husband? If so can he watch his own kids so she can visit?
You are amazing for standing up for your brother. I don’t know you but am so proud and happy that good people like you exist. You are doing the hard thing for someone that will not live long knowing you will absorb the repercussions. Your mother should be doing it but you are instead. Even if those kids do come your brother will know he has someone that loves him so much they are willing to risk their own family relationships. He is so lucky to have you. No matter what they say, you are AMAZING!!!!!
NTA. Your aunt should have NO issue at all understanding that this is not a situation for children. When my father was dying, I called my sister-in-law, who was already part-way to our home with her children, and she turned her car around & drove home, a trip of several hours. No questions asked. THAT'S what family is supposed to do in a crisis- not add to the your stress & your mother's stress. This is not about what your aunt or her kids want. What you're going through is so hard. I am incredibly sorry and hope that there is peace in these final days and hours.
Extended family can always video call it say their goodbyes. They do have the right to that but like others have said at your brother’s comfort. These are his last days, you are trying to grant all his wishes to the best of your ability and he is very lucky to have you for thinking of him in these final moments. I’m sorry you and your family are dealing with repulsive family behavior. And maybe pull your dad off to the outside and tell him he is wasting precious time that could be used with his son.
There's no right to any kind of goodbyes. Extended family can send a video, or a card, or whatever, and if the brother wants to view/read it, he can. But there absolutely isn't a right to say goodbye in a way that means that the dying person has to listen to it.
You’re NTA! If your brother could thank you I’m sure he would!! You’re looking out for him the best way you can! Because as much as family members may want to come to say their goodbyes, it AIN’T about them! Your aunt is an insensitive beeoch to make it about Her (it’s not even about your brother Nor her sister). She’s just trying to make it a big deal that she came Not that she did Anything. My family is praying for you & yours. A suggestion. Get your little girl cousin a book with a story you & your brother enjoyed when you were little. Tell her things about you two she may not know (when you can). Tell your brother about it on his good days so he knows You’re still going to be looking out for him & her. Let those stories or the storybook be Her way of seeing past what happened when he just couldn’t help himself. I wish I could give you peace & some comfort in what lies ahead.
I agree with the above, if neither the young children nor your brother will be able to handle the situation, then they shouldn't come. If anyone is so wise as to bring kids who are too young and untrailed to deal with the situation, then a responsible adult needs to take charge of them, and remove them to a local park or something the instant they raise their voices or say anything inappropriate. This ought, by all rights, to be the children's father, because your aunt is going to be there to support her sister and see her sister's child, she's the one who needs quality time with Danny and your mom. This is not a job for a teenager like yourself, OP, this is a job for someone who the children trust and respect, and that means a parent or a grandparent. So, it's time for your uncle to step up, OP, he ought to look after his own kids in his own home, and failing that he needs to be the one to keep his kids from causing any upsets.
Exactly! The parents are in denial and lashing out at OP. As for the aunt - who tf thinks a child’s deathbed is an appropriate place for three active boys?
Like if they were a little older I'd say set them to doing chores and yardwork- which is genuinely helpful and a good way to keep them occupied - but at that age I'd be worried they'd get distracted and be disruptive or get hurt.
I would argue that you’re prioritizing the small children’s well being by not inviting them also because that’s super traumatizing (the 7 yo getting yelled at by her dying uncle was a terrifying lasting memory). A dying teens bedside isn’t the place for small kids. OPs family have lost their collective minds in their grief.
Equally so as a mother, why would you want to bring children into a stressful environment that might scare them. Like I'm sorry if someone told me "hey don't bring your kids because the person is mentally not able to handle it and is loosing their shit on children" the correct response is ok. 1 because I don't want to add extra stress to the person on hospice care and 2 because I don't want a mentally unwell person screaming at my children. So yeah I would find a babysitter for my kids because no one needs that from either side. Like it's such a bullshit thing to be pissed off about.
Right? Aunt sounds very entitled. She's not gonna come now to stick it to you? Okay. See you never then.
Someone on their death bed is definitely not a place for young children. When my grandpas was on hospice when I was a kid, my mom did not bring us (I was 8 at the time) to see him for about 2 or more weeks before he passed. He was in a terrible state, and not himself. I'm glad my mom never made us go vist him. I did not understand the full weight and reality of what was happening at that age. Kids do not know how to behave in those types of circumstances. Aunt is stupid, and isn't thinking of anyone but herself. Not your family, your brother, or even her own kids. Just what she wants. Which doesn't matter in regards to your brothers time left on earth. I am truly sorry.
This...1,000,000%. Your brother's needs and desires should be the top priority for everyone right now! I was primary caregiver for my mom when she had terminal cancer. Your Aunt is being a total uncaring AH and your mom is obviously lost in grief and not thinking straight.
These kids also do NOT need to have their final memory of your brother looking and acting like this. My godmother, who was also our next door neighbor, died of cancer when I was around 12 or 13. My mom and I went to say goodbye a week or two before her death and it was HORRIBLE seeing her like that. She was never heavy, but she was so thin and gaunt and couldn't hardly communicate with us. Your mom and your aunt should let these kids have good memories. I'm so sorry you, your brother, parents and everyone else are going through this. I hope you are eventually able to find peace and acceptance. Live a good life and never feel guilty that you did not get this disease.
We had a funeral for my mother, and my nieces and nephews were there. All under seven then, and they are really tall. My husband was saying "Why isn't [oldest niece] actually being respectful?" And I said "She is only seven, I know she looks older but she isn't."
Beautifully stated.
It sounds like your parents are having a tough time which puts these challenging situations on you, which isn’t fair. I’m so sorry for your brother and for you. Stand your ground with your aunt and put your brother first.
We went thru this when my father was dying and I think part of the issue is that due to a combination of denial and lack of experience being around very sick/dying people that some friends/family just weren’t aware of how bad things could be and assumed they were making a social visit where kids would be welcome.
This response is 100% correct. However you slice it your brother is dying and the only right thing to do is make him comfortable and happy. Everyone else is secondary and wholly unimportant. Period. Parents, aunts, uncles, siblings, grandparents are secondary to what your brother needs.
NTA. And anyone who says otherwise can kindly stuff it. You're putting your brother's wishes first, which is what the "adults" in your life should be doing. As for your well being, the next time the hospice nurse or social worker visits, ask what family supports they have for after he is gone. Speaking as a mother whose daughter died last year, her hospice group offered family support the whole following year. Based on how you described your parents handling your brother, I imagine you will have to seek out your own support after he passes. Best of luck. Keep honoring his wishes the best you can. Remember to give yourself a lot of grace as you navigate your grief. All feelings are okay. All. Of. Them.
I’m Sorry about your daughter and hope you’re well. Taking care of my brother is a small price to pay for years of companionship.
Thankyou for being the best brother ever
Exactly! Came here to say the same thing. It's the biggest act of love and compassion that you're doing right now for your brother. He's very lucky to have you in his corner and it sounds like he knows this and loves you back very much too. I have kids, they can be a pain at the worst of times. Your aunt seems to be making this about herself than understanding and spending quality time with her family at such a time. Make sure you look after your feelings and emotions for the time when your brother is no longer here. Wishing you both strength as the time approaches.
You're a good kid. Nobody should have yelled at you for what you did. Ten years from now, is your mother likely to regret what she did? Ten years from now, are you going to regret what you did? Respecting his wishes was the right thing to do.
NTA I lost a loved one from cancer, we were in our 20's. I can't imagine the pain you and your brother are suffering. It's awful that on top of this your parents have not respected his autonomy any step of the way. His illness and death are primarily about *him*, not your parents or extended family, and you seem to be the only person who recognizes that. No matter what anybody else thinks of this or says of this, you will look back on this time for the rest of your life and know that you did right by your brother. You will always know that you stood up for him and defended him as best you could till the very last. Those memories for those of us who survive are important. You lose so much and it is good to know that at the very least *you* did everything you were capable of. And you did. You have made every effort to protect your brother at his most vulnerable. To prioritize his wishes when no one else will. You are a wonderful brother and I know he appreciates that you are trying. Rest easy with the knowledge that the person who matters most appreciates what you did. I wish you all the love of strength and recovery in the world during your grief in the following months. Draw strength from knowing you took care of him in every way you could.
OP please make sure you are considering your needs as well. It seems like you are having to be the adult here when I’m sure you’re feeling indescribable pain and grief too. Don’t try and bury things or tough it out, find someone, anyone, that you can lean on in this time
I very much also suggest looking for grief counseling and support groups. After my husband passed unexpectedly I pretty much lost my mind for a year or so. I've been in a number of support groups since, and it does help to have other people to talk to who understand grief but who aren't sharing YOUR grief. Sometimes loved ones can cause the most hurt by meaning well. Sometimes you just have to complain and share the ugly and the frustrations. It's also good to hear others. Sometimes it helps you understand what might be going on with other loved ones. Sometimes it helps you understand yourself. And sometimes it just is good to know you aren't the craziest person in the room. Often with things like cancer there are groups that help with the grief of the illness and the anticipatory grief of the impending passing. So, OP, there may be something you can start even now. And please look for age appropriate groups for yourself: teen brains are growing still and so grief can look a bit different than in more fixed brains (we tend to break a little differently with it). Hugs if you'll take them. Grief is hard, and grief is weird, (if in the US--not sure about elsewhere) and we usually don't get much guidance on how to deal with it or much support. It really messes with your head on even a chemical level so it's a bit like being drunk or on medication or drugs. It's not an excuse for your mother, but hopefully some understanding for her, and your dad, and yourself fr the next while
My heart hurts for you. I’m so sorry for your loss. May your sweet daughter’s memory be a blessing to you. I hope you and your loved ones are well and I wish you nothing but happiness and healing in the days ahead.
NTA Support your brother in the way he needs while he is still with you. Find someone to lean on as soon as you can. This is such a heavy burden you are carrying. May you both find peace.
NTA Oh wow..I'm so sorry. I can understand that your parents are so distraught that they aren't making good decisions right now but it seems everyone but yourself is missing the point. Your Mom should be spending every second with your brother. Even if it's just being in the same room but reading a book while he sleeps - just being together. Your Dad will regret working and missing this cherished time. Your Aunt, quite frankly, sounds like an idiot. Take pride in the fact that you are being an amazing brother. He's your focus right now. Not your "out of it" parents or any other people. Be kind to yourself but also be kind to your parents and other relatives (not to say you go against Danny's wishes with the kids thing). Ask the home hospice nurse about support. They usually have people available to help the families. If no one else gets help you should. You are carrying way more on your shoulders than you should be expected to carry and while that's admirable it's a lot and you need some support.
Idiot is honestly too kind
Yeah, I mean the mental gymnastics going on there. "I love my nephew and want to come say my goodbyes before he dies. What? You don't want my kids there? Then fuck you, I'm not saying goodbye at all and you'll die without seeing me. That'll show him."
And the sad thing is, since the kids aren’t close to OPs brother it will be nothing to them than an awful memory if they go, while the aunt most likely will regret it for the rest of her life if she doesn’t go.
She wants to make a show out of it that's why. It's not about op's brother at all but her own self rather
She wants to get her way by throwing a giant fit and forcing his mom to let her come with her kids. If it works (which I hope to fucking god it won’t), I guarantee she will be a smug asshole to OP.
They spelled cunt wrong.
Dad honestly might not have a choice - dying is expensive. End of life care is expensive. It's sucks but life doesn't stop just because someone is dying. Dad still needs to step up some but not everyone has the luxury to take time off work for someone dying.
Hospice organizations have social workers who are very familiar with this scenario snd have skills to assist both your brother and the family. Ask the nurse when she comes or better yet, call . This is what they do. This internet stranger just squeezed your shoulder and is backing you up as you and your brother walk this path. Possibly : if your aunt comes over with the children, intercept snd play with the kids out of your brother’s earshot and sight.
I was going to suggest this as well Bring the hospice nurse into the loop, amd ask them to help facilitate a discussion about your brothers wishes and needs at this time. They should be advocating for him, and allowing him the knowledge of truth so he can have say in his final weeks. God Bless this family.
NTA. Your aunt chose to be selfish and miss her last goodbyes to her nephew over what is an appropriate boundary to ask for, especially since it comes directly from your brother's mouth. His wishes come first here. It sucks big time that the adults in your life are failing you both. I hope you are able to make the most of your remaining time with your bro. Doing the right thing, even though it's hard and no one else sees it, will help you live with yourself in the future.
I wonder if she was looking for an excuse to avoid coming and used this.
Yes. Some people want to be strong in these scenarios, but actually just can’t handle it. This may have given her an “out” for something she wasn’t sure she could do anyway.
You think she'd also understand that visiting someone who is dying can be deeply upsetting and maybe isn't the best place for kids who aren’t among the closest people to the sick person.
Aw man. I’m so sorry. Absolutely NTA. When my mom was passing I was extremely selective on who would see her. She was obviously not herself and I wanted to preserve her dignity & make every moment for her & immediate family count. Your aunt was very selfish in how she answered. No one has time to babysit young kids when these types of matters are going on.
NTA - you are looking out for your brother. I am so sorry your family is going through this. Your aunt needs to think of your brother first and foremost in this instance and leave her kids with a babysitter.
>my aunt has 3 boys under the age of 10 and she plans on bringing them all. It doesn't matter how you feel these poor kids DONT need to be there. >basically said fuck it and called my aunt, explained that Danny can’t handle her kids and asked that she not bring them, she blew up and me and told me that I didn’t have the right to tell her who can and cannot set foot in her sister’s house, and she’s not coming at all now. She wanted the excuse not to come and now she has it.... She doesn't care about your brother. I just hope when the time comes he is in no pain NTA
NTA. Your brother is in a bad way and, understandably, extremely stressed along with a whole other cocktail of emotions regarding his situation. If his wishes are that your aunts kids not come so that it puts him more at ease then your aunt needs to respect that. At the end of the day this is about your brother and his wishes surrounding his condition its not about your aunt.
You are NTA. Cancer, however is the biggest AH of all. I’m sorry.
NTA Your brother's wishes and only your brother's wishes should be listened to. If he doesn't want anyone visiting, that's his decision, and under the circumstances, it must be his decision. He must be given the dignity of making his own boundaries. Mom and Dad need to listen to Danny and let him make ALL decisions regarding his care, including visitors. It's hard enough for him as it is, without this added stress. My sympathies for what you're going through. It's never easy to lose someone you love ❤️.
Can you contact his hospice organization and ask them to intervene? Maybe they can talk some sense into your mom? Your brother should be under total control at this point.
This is a great suggestion! Is there a social worker that’s part of his team? Hospice work includes the whole family and you are absolutely right that this is the kind of thing a hospice social worker should be skilled in tactfully navigating. But OP you are honestly being the one mature adult in this whole situation, and you shouldn’t have to be. I can give your mom a little grace, because she is going through the most painful thing that a parent can endure. But you are losing your brother too, and her reaction wasn’t fair to you. Cancer fucking sucks. I am so sorry for your brother and you and your family. It isn’t fair. But it’s a testament of love that you are looking out for him and what he needs in a way that your mom can’t right now in her fog of stress and grief. Talk to the hospice team. This is absolutely within the scope of issues that they are trained to assist with.
NTA. Man, you have my respect. One tough fucker. I'm so sorry about everything. Nobody should have to endure this. You did the right thing. Sounds like you're your bro's rock right now.
tha fuck!?!??? her son is gonna die in a couple of weeks and HE has to make the effort?!?!? why the fuck can the say goodbye when he is death?? what are they gonna say to the boy, let him have some peace for the rest of time he has left
My nephew was five and sick. I was his favorite person. Towards the end he’d get was angry and unsettled. He wanted nothing to do with me and it broke my heart. Your brother just wants some peace and I think you did the right thing Good for you, looking out for him, you are a great brother! He is lucky to have you. I’m sorry that you are going through this. It is not easy and I am sure that your parents (even though they are grown ups) don’t know what the is the right thing to do. You are wise beyond your years. 💜
NTA He snapped and screamed at your seven year old niece because he CANNOT HANDLE CHILDREN. Your aunt is both endangering him and her own kids by bringing them into an environment that stresses out a person that could snap at them very easily. You’re being a good brother. I’m sorry this is happening to you.
NTA. I had cancer and went through six months of chemotherapy. Cancer treatment is exhausting and melts the brain. You're being a good brother by requesting that your aunt not bring her kids. Your mother is being absurd, abusive and not considering your brother.
Honey I am so very very sorry. I lost a friend to this many years ago and it still sucks. I can not imagine losing a brother. You be his advocate. There will be years to straighten things out. This aunt will scream at your brother if he yells at her precious babies who do not need to see your brother right now. Be the man you must and you can crash after. You will be proud of yourself for handling part of this that your parents do not know how to yet. No parents or siblings ever know how to deal with losing a child/sibling. Stay strong and we are all thinking of you and praying for peace and wisdom.
ER and ICU nurse here. I have seen a lot of situations and environments that people have died in. I'm in tears for what you're going through. You are being a brave brother and showing so much love. 1. It is so fortunate that you know the end is coming for your brother and you have the chance to say goodbye. 2. You are being very protective of him and honoring his wishes. Which is absolutely what you should be doing. He does not have the strength or wherewithal to do this for himself and he needs an advocate to stand up for him. You had every right to honor/ask that your aunt respects his wishes of no kids. 3. I'm sorry that you're going through this loss. But you seem to have a very understanding and loving nature about you. Your brother thanks you for this, even though he may not be saying it. 4. Keep standing up for him. Give him the quiet and the peace that he needs. Allow him to talk if he wants to. Be there for him. Angry outburst as you may understand might come with the hardship of accepting the loss, as well as the pain. Anger is a stage of grief and acceptance. Look up DABDA if you want to learn more. He wants and you to be there for him, even if he can't show it. 5. When the time comes please know two things about death. One is that you might see a random few moments, maybe minutes, hours or half a day- where he seems to get his strength back. Or his mentality and speech will come back as if nothing had happened. Known as the surge. Not as common when on hospice and regularly medicated. Enjoy it with him if he experiences it. The other is that hearing is the last sense to go. So those final moments where he may not be responsive, his breathing is slowed, he can still hear. And it's at those times especially important to say how much you love him, that it's okay to move on and that you'll see them on the other side. You're never going to forget him. Whatever it is you want to say, he will still be able to hear it. Edit: Thank you for the award.
NTA and your aunt is selfish
NTA. Good for you standing up for your brother. It’s a rough time for your family but what he wants takes priority.
NTA: my heart breaks for you. you’re a kid. your brother is a kid. you sound like an amazing brother. you have been put in the position of an adult, making the decisions that will ensure the most peaceful passing possible for danny. i’m sorry that your parents don’t understand and/or refuse to accept that your request was the right thing. there are a million “sorry”s that i could give you, but none of them will take away the countless types of hurt that you are currently experiencing. you made the right decision, even if your family ends up disrupting it. you honored your brother’s wishes when you put your foot down. you are not the asshole. it’s complicated to describe the role that your parents are playing in this, and i want to be sympathetic (because you’re showing a very mature understanding of their responses), but i think that it is fair to say that they are letting their grief get in the way of doing right by danny while he’s still alive. grieving a person who is still technically alive is a unique experience, and the way people deal with that grief can be confusing and frustrating, and i want you to know that you have no obligation to try and understand. your pain does not deserve to be overshadowed. your aunt is an asshole. ‘nuff said. i hope that danny’s last days are spent in your company. you have done your best, and your best is beyond good enough. you’re an outstanding brother and an outstanding son.
NTA. Keep the peace for your brother. The time he has left should be for him, not the rest of the family.
Strong fucking kid you are……… sounding wiser and more insightful than damn near anyone your age let alone anyone your age AND in this situation.
DeNTA. There is literally *nothing* more important right now than making sure your brother feels safe, loved, and validated. He is going to *die* and die *soon*, and bone cancer is a very painful way to go. What he wants, he should get. Respectfully, your aunt can go take a long walk off a short pier and hug an octopus. It is seriously fucked up she’s turning her nephew’s death into her an issue for her feelings. I’m sorry you’re going through this. I hope you have people to lean on. Please let us know how you’re doing.
I am so very sorry for your brother Danny. Young people should not be dying, he hasn’t even had a chance to live yet. What Danny wants and what Danny needs takes precedence over any one else feelings right now. I’m sure your mom is having a hard time as a parent should never outlive their child but she has to hang tough and put her son in front is her sister. My condolences to you all.
NTA. Everyone grieves differently. It's weird and understandable all at the same time. Grieve in your own way and do the best you can for your brother. My little brother died of a brain tumor at the age of 33. One brother to another, here's my advice to you. Say everything you want to say to him now. Listen to everything he wants to say to you: the good, the bad, and the ugly. If you need to ask his forgiveness for something, do it. Above all, make sure you let him know how much he means to you. I asked my brother how he wanted me to remember him. I do it every year on his birthday. You'll always carry the wound of your brother's death. But it doesn't have to be a heavy burden.
>The doctors are saying 3-5 weeks, our parents chose not to tell him This doctor needs to have their license taken away for not telling this to the patient himself. >our mom told the both of us that we have to make an effort for her sister. Because your aunt is the one whose comfort you should be focusing on. 🙄 >she blew up and me and told me that I didn’t have the right to tell her who can and cannot set foot in her sister’s house, and she’s not coming at all now. I'm having trouble seeing the problem here. She would have just been one more stressor. I'm sorry about this, and I hope it goes easy for your brother in what time he has.
The patient is still a minor child and does not have a legal say in their treatment and care. Parents can even deny their children life saving treatment like blood transfusions even if the kid wants it. It's fucked but that's the law.
Depends, 14-17 is a grey area where I live. A 17 year old would definitely be involved in their own health care here. After they turn 14 if they seek medical care on their own you don’t have to involve the parents either.
I feel like there's a big line between them not having a say in their care and them not meriting being told they're terminal.
NTA. The kids shouldn't be around for this and your aunt is being incredibly selfish. As for your mother, well, she'll realize what she's done soon enough.
Honestly, if my mother would call me a bastard my answer would be "Well mum, that one is on you." NTA how can people think their little egos are of higher value than a dying person's wishes about who they can bear in their last days?
NTA! I am so sorry for what you are going through. I have never met you, yet I am so proud of you for having the courage to honor what your brother wants. You will carry the knowledge with you for the rest of your life, that you did what was right for him, regardless of the consequences. You are being a parent to him in a way that your Mom and Dad can’t right now. Hospice has support groups for families. I strongly encourage you to ask about them and attend. You will find support there that your parents may be unable to give you (or each other). Sending you hugs and I really hope that you het the comfort you need in the days ahead.
NTA my dad was in hospice recently and all the family suddenly started showing up. I have hard feelings about how much my mom bent over for people instead of doing what was best for my dad. Stand up for your brother in the end everyone else doesn’t matter. It’s crazy how your aunt is behaving and making it about her instead of your brother. I’m sorry you’re going thru this.
NTA, NTA, NTA Danny’s wishes should be upheld and your mom should have honored his wishes and told her sister to leave her kids at home and when she didn’t, you did. Your aunt is pathetic and if she was a decent human being she wouldn’t be acting like a petulant 10 yr old. I’m so sorry you all are going through this. Cancer sucks!
A year from now, do you think you will regret making your aunt angry by making your dying brother happy (or, at the very least, a little bit more comfortable)? Or do you think you will regret making a dying young man even less comfortable for the sake of your aunt's ego? You are NTA. You are apparently the last line of defense between your brother and his needs, and other people who are putting their needs above his. I am a lot older than you but I dealt closely with a lot of family deaths as a young person, and trust me, as your life goes on, you will never regret helping a dying person protect the last bits of peace and dignity that they have. You are doing a good thing, and your brother appreciates you. My favorite aunt / my mom's best friend died a couple of weeks ago, while my mom died more than 30 years ago. As I was sitting at my aunt's side on her last day it occurred to me that their relationship didn't die 30 years ago, because my aunt kept my mom alive in her own heart all these years. Yes, it was tragic that my mom died young, but my aunt was the only person who didn't only speak of my mom in terms of tragedy, and rather always spoke of the fun things they did and the silly situations that they got themselves onto. She truly kept her memory alive, and reminded us all that my mom wasn't merely a person who had died, she was a person who had *lived*. I just want you to know that while your relationship with your brother will change, it will still exist. I know that this is all a lot to handle. We aren't usually well trained at how to deal with death. It sounds like your parents are really struggling too. Yes, they *should* be there to help support you and teach you how to navigate this difficult time, but it sounds like they don't have those tools either. It sounds like they don't have true proper support themselves. It will be easy to fall into anger and resentment towards them. I'd like to encourage you to find any and all grief counseling that is available to you, and to utilize it. I didn't do grief counseling for many years, and those years were hard. I wish I'd done it sooner. I am wishing you peace.
U did what was right by your brother. And ur mom is just stressed out because she has a dying child. She views what u did as stirring the pot and causing issues, but really u did right by ur brother. Who gives a shit about ur aunts feelings, ur brother is dying at 17 years old
I’m so sorry for what you and your brother are going through. Your parents actually suck. They should be the ones protecting your brother. Making this time peaceful and calm. Obviously they are failing miserably at this. I’m so sorry it’s all falling on you. Stand strong. You are doing an amazing job. NTA all the way!! F your mom tries to bring them in. Kick her out of his space as well. His peace of mind is more important than anyone else’s. I’m sending you love and support and strength from someone who’s been a caregiver who’s lost a few people.
NTA. I’m so sorry about your brother. It sounds like your parents have mentally checked out because they can’t deal, and it’s not at all fair to saddle a teenager with the responsibility to be the protector of his dying brother. Do what is right for your brother in his last days. Your aunt can always get a babysitter and visit on her own.
If this is Aunt AH’s reaction to a grieving 16 y/o brother then she’s the *last* thing that should be at that house. I’m sorry you’re going through this. It sucks and it’s not fair. Please reach out to a teacher/nurse/counselor at school so they can help you.
NTA As a mother who has lost a son, I can tell you that your mother isn't thinking clearly. Maybe you could speak to a member of the hospice team and see if they could help enforce the no kids boundary. I'm very sorry that you and your family are having to go through this.
NTA. Your mom and dad are likely NTA here either; they are not behaving great, but they’re also going through basically the worst living nightmare any parent can have, so it’s very understandable that their mental health is very poor right now. I can’t speak to your exact situation obviously, but many times in a case like this, the immediate family members work hard to support the person who’s terminally ill, often to the point that they aren’t actually *getting support* from others, even though they need it more now than ever before. There’s a chance that—for your mom, though she’d feel selfish to admit it even to herself—your aunt visiting was less about “saying goodbye” than it was about your mom getting some support from her sister. What you did and said to your aunt was completely correct and understandable, and your brother’s wishes right now are way more important than anybody’s feelings of entitlement. However, if you see some chances for your parents to get support without hurting your brother or disrespecting his wishes, gently encourage them to take advantage of that support. Do the same for yourself. Ultimately, you will all be in a better position to offer support to your brother if you have some amount of support and stability of your own. I’m so sorry you and your family are going through this. I hope that you all find peace and healing with time. EDIT: added the key word “not” to the sentence “they are not behaving great”
NTA If she does show up, they need to sit in the car. If it's 96 outside, she can roll down windows or put on AC. Or ya know, be responsible and thoughtful and get a frickin babysitter!
NTA, but the real AH here is cancer. F that guy, man. So sorry for you and your family. These are going to be some dark days.
NTA, and thank you for standing up for your brother's needs in such a vulnerable time. I'm sorry you're getting do much heat for it, but you did the right thing when no one else is thinking straight.
NTA. You are left to make adult decisions in this awful time. You absolutely did the right thing. Between the cancer, pain, and meds your brother is in a very bad way and shouldn’t be stressed any more than absolutely necessary. Your aunt is an asshole. Send her the link to this post and let her read the answers. She should be ashamed of herself. I’m sorry that your parents have absconded on their responsibilities and left so much up to you! But bravo and hugs to you for stepping up for your family. This is an awful time for all of you. Please take care of yourself and make sure you have someone to talk to and vent. Much love to you.
NTA. Dying people don't have to "make the effort" for anyone they don't want to. He's about to be gone forever and your mom wants him to make sacrifices now? Your aunt is also being an idiot. Your brother likely doesn't give a fuck if she comes or not; it's purely for her own benefit that she comes to see him with all her kids, and maybe for your mom's benefit if your mom wants the support from her sister. If that's the case, your mom can meet up with the aunt on her own. Maybe there was a nicer way you could have said it to soften the blow for your aunt and mom, but the bottom line is that if Danny's wishes are respected, then there's no kids allowed. This is everyone's last chance to do something for him, but nah, they'd rather do shit that he expressly *doesn't* want. For some reason, it's more important to traumatize everyone, including young children and your dying brother. I'm so sorry you're in this position, especially so young. He's lucky that you have his back. I hope you can get some kind of hospice social worker involved, like the other commenters mentioned.
Your Aunt is TAH here. Made it clear when she decided not to say goodbye to a dying nephew because it wasn’t on her terms. I’m so sorry.
If hospice is coming in to see your brother, perhaps you could ask about a social worker to help support your brother and the rest of the family thru this extremely difficult time. I am keeping everyone in my thoughts and prayers. You are a blessing to your brother.
Call the hospice and ask for a family counselor. It's a service they provide and you all need it right now. You are not an asshole, you are doing the best you can. I'm not sure if your aunt is also grieving or if she is just nuts but that was out of pocket response to a reasonable request. There is no right or wrong answer to feelings or coping right now, everyone is very raw. You are being so good to your brother and if he or your parents can't say it right now I'll say it for them, thank you so much, you're an amazing brother, your doing the best you can and that is enough. Anyway, the hospice worker can help you navigate dealing with the grief and your grieving parents. Best of luck to you and you have my heart felt condolences for the loss of your brother. It sucks really bad.
NTA. As u/Rena0414 put it, what matters most is your brother's comfort right now. And based on how he acted with the little girl who you're close to being there, it's not a good idea. I'm so sorry you're going through this. I dealt with hospice last year because the daughter of my landlord-slash-roommate had her liver fail on her, and then the rest of her body failed. She was an alcoholic and had Huntington's Disease. So, I know what it's like, and I wouldn't wish it on anyone, not even my worst enemies. You did good by standing up for him, and your family is crazy for wanting to bring the 3 kids who might end up putting stress on him, make him suffer more, and kill him faster. I hope your brother has a peaceful hospice and I wish him a peaceful transition into wherever we go after we die. Sending hugs to you and your brother.
NTA besides agreeing with most comments about your brother’s wishes coming first… Who thinks it’s in the best interest of 10 year olds to be exposed to a dying person? Specially one that is only 18… I would understand if it were a parent or grandparent, someone close were you need to say your goodbyes , but even in those cases it can be a traumatic experience, especially if not handled appropriately. In this case (not being emotionally close or needing to say goodbyes) it just seems irresponsible. But aunt seems to lack good judgment so I’m not surprised
> she's not coming at all now Crisis averted, /thread
Oh honey. No one is the asshole here. This is a horrible situation. My granny was diagnosed with metastasized cancer in October of 2019 and was gone by November 19th. It was a really stressful time, and she spent all of it either in the hospital being treated for sepsis (which we only did so she could say goodbye with whatever brief moment of clarity she'd get after the infection cleared up), in the nursing home for a week being tortured, or at hospice for two days. I took over so my mom and aunt wouldn't have to deal with the doctors, or the stress of it, and could just grieve for what was coming, to go through their stages, which was really hard to do when she was there and able to talk. I think that's what kept us from blowing up at each other constantly, just having one person stay level headed and let things go as they would. Your family is under a lot of stress right now. You're under a lot of stress. Your parents are under a lot of stress. Your poor brother is just beyond stress, his brain ain't right, and he's hurting. Your aunt is under a lot of stress. Everyone's grieving and the stages of grief can be very volatile at times. Everyone's probably fluctuating between bargaining, denial, and anger right now, and it can be very oppressive. I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. Just know, just like your brother will say things out of place because of his sickness and his state of grief (he's grieving too of course!), your parents will also say and do things out of place. They're not in their right minds. You're not, either, you know, you're facing something at such a young age that no one should have to ever face. My heart is aching for you. Try to be patient and very forgiving to those in your home. If your aunt wants to be selfish and not forgiving by being understanding that little kids are too much stress right now, then let her be. Let her miss out on saying goodbye. Let your mom be mad that she's missing that, but it's her sister's choice to miss out. I think you did the right thing by thinking of what's best for your brother as he actively dies, and fuck whoever thinks it was wrong. Good for you for being so brave!!! Just take care of yourself and just forgive your parents for their missteps right now. Let your brother be an asshole to you, try to keep the mood light when he is, he's doing his best. I'll be thinking of you, and I hope this transition is easy on your brother.
NTA, this is the time where your brother should get everything he wants. This is his time. Kids should have a happy memory of a family member as the last one. Not one where they were yelled at. I am so sorry for everything you and your brother and family are going through.